# Carmina (Albaladejo) Shoes



## Roger (Feb 18, 2005)

References have been made to these shoes from time to time, and the impression I've got is that they're of pretty basic design and very high quality. I know that Sky Valet in Washington, DC stocks them. Can some of you with knowledge of this line provide some information regarding:

1. Who else stocks them, and whether or not they are available yet from any online supplier.

2. Their relative quality when compared with RTW from EG, JLobb Paris, Vass, Santoni fatte a mano, etc.

3. Whether it is possible to add some special-order features the way you can with EG and their special-order program, for example--such as a medallion added, etc.

4. Whether they provide bespoke as well as RTW.

5. What they can provide better than others--or, perhaps, what they can provide that others can't (e.g., shell cordovan).

Thanks!

Vancouver


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## kabert (Feb 6, 2004)

I thought Franco's in Richmond, VA, was going to carry them too but I don't see mention of it on the francos.com website.

I recall someone posting that a store in Philadelphia, PA, carries them too.

I've checked out the shoes at Sky in DC and they are extremely nice. The ones carried by Sky are cordovan and alligator; Sky decided not to stock calfskin (although I assume they'll do an order for you). The gator loafers are some of the best-looking shoes I've ever seen. The cordovan shoes are superb too -- not only are they of classic design (and channelled sole) but they are priced just $85 or so more than the far-clunkier-looking Alden cordovan shoes.


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## KenCPollock (Dec 20, 2003)

For some pictures of a pair I got in Paris in November 2004, look here (at the heavier brogue; the captoe is an Aubercy which cost nearly 2 1/2 times as much).
https://styleforum.net./showthread.php?t=6386&highlight=pollock


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## Roger (Feb 18, 2005)

Mr. Pollock, as one of the true shoe connoiseurs on these fora and owner of more shoes than the Canadian army, how do you feel the Carmina shoes stack up against the usual RTW high-end suspects--EG, JLobb, Vass, et al.? I guess I'm wondering about quality of leather, quality of workmanship, style, comfort, handwork touches, etc.

Vancouver


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## KenCPollock (Dec 20, 2003)

I think I would rate basic Carminas pictured herein just a 1/2 notch below C&J handgrades and Grenson Masterpieces and about a 1/2 notch above Alden, Peal and C&J benchmades. The high toecap is similiar to Vass.
However, the "naked" Carmina I bought last November, with the one-week long "special" antiquing thereafter applied thereto by the shop, was as unique and thrilling a Parisian experience as was eight days of shopping and dining with Ernest and Katia-really unique and well worth twice the 350 Euro price. The leather and construction may not quite be up to EG or J&M Handmade quality, but the finish is so spectacular that owing a pair should be a forum requirement to be a member of the "super forum" league. I know that AlanC posted pictures of them for me on one of the forums for me, but I cannot find them.


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## Roger (Feb 18, 2005)

As many AAAC forumers know, the London Lounge has commissioned what Michael Alden refers to as a "derby/chukka" boot in shell cordovan from Carmina. Here's a picture and some commentary:

Mr. Pollick, thanks for your comparative evaluation. This is really helpful since most of us on this Forum have--via many threads--come to know something about the shoes with which you've compared Carmina. I wonder whether it could be asserted that Carmina's _shell cordovan _ shoes are at the top of the cordovan heap. And Kabert, would you perhaps agree with that from what you've seen and noted above (and in your earlier thread on AAAC when Carmina first came to Sky Valet)?

And just as a final thought now that this information from the London Lounge is fresh in my mind, I wonder whether this forum might consider commissioning the occasional article of clothing from a noted source. I realize that we've sort of done this with the Forum tie, but I guess I'm thinking on a somewhat larger scale.

As just one example, consider a Forum order (with people signing up beforehand) of some _semi-bespoke _ Crockett & Jones Handgrade shoes. Normally, these shoes run just about exactly twice the price of RTW C&Js, but with six or twelve (depending on whom you talk to) orders, they could be ordered in widths other than the standard D (US), and in non-standard colors, and could, perhaps, have some custom features--all for the regular RTW price. Perhaps we could do even better with a larger Forum order. There are lots of items that might be approached this way; Carmina shoes would seem to be another example. A while back the London Lounge did a LL-commissioned Edward Green shoe. Others may have some ideas about other clothing items that would be appropriate for a large group order. (BTW, I do know something about the history of these efforts, but still think it could work very well with the right item.) Just a thought! 

Vancouver


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## AlanC (Oct 28, 2003)

> quote:_Originally posted by kencpollock_
> 
> I know that AlanC posted pictures of them for me on one of the forums for me, but I cannot find them.


I think those were posted in a thread on Style Forum that was lost in the recent crash. The pictures themselves are in my Imageshack file, though, and can easily be reposted. I'll try to do that tomorrow.


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## AlanC (Oct 28, 2003)

Here are Ken's pictures from his trip to the Carmina store in Paris:

https://img497.imageshack.us/my.php?image=paris20052230aw.jpg

https://img497.imageshack.us/my.php?image=paris20052216xg.jpg

https://img497.imageshack.us/my.php?image=paris20052170am.jpg

https://img497.imageshack.us/my.php?image=paris20052167ro.jpg

https://img497.imageshack.us/my.php?image=paris20052150hu.jpg

https://img497.imageshack.us/my.php?image=paris20050160wo.jpg

https://img497.imageshack.us/my.php?image=paris20050153du.jpg

https://img497.imageshack.us/my.php?image=paris20050134yf.jpg

https://img497.imageshack.us/my.php?image=paris20050123eu.jpg

https://img497.imageshack.us/my.php?image=paris20050110oe.jpg

https://img497.imageshack.us/my.php?image=paris20050104qb.jpg

https://img497.imageshack.us/my.php?image=paris20050093vf.jpg


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## Roger (Feb 18, 2005)

Alan, thanks for these great pictures! Good grief, those are beautiful shoes--particularly the antiqued balmorals, both the ones with the medallion and the (extreme) austerity brogue. I assume they're calfskin, since shell cordovan can't be antiqued that way, can it?

_Edit:_ From the second picture, it seems as though the Carmina shoes have a very well-defined waist, with greater narrowing there than found on most RTW shoes. Is there any beveling or fiddleback effect underneath?

Vancouver


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## von Rothbart (May 17, 2005)

> quote:_Originally posted by Roger_
> 
> 1. Who else stocks them, and whether or not they are available yet from any online supplier.


Peter Elliot Soles in Manhattan sells them, in both calf and cordovan models.



> quote:_Originally posted by kabert_
> 
> I recall someone posting that a store in Philadelphia, PA, carries them too.


I believe it's Boyd's.


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## bobbyball (Jul 20, 2005)

I have 3 pairs of Carmina (Albaladejo) shoes:

A calf split toe hand-stitched apron lace-up, the same in black cordovan and a full-brogue in a tan cordovan with double-sole.

These are fabulous shoes and I personally would rate them higher than C&J for fit and styling. The cordovan is higher quality than C&J use and for the price, they are much better value.

There is a store in Germany that has them for 450 euros in a selection of 4 cordovan styles. They are more waisted than C&Js I have and I would even rate some of their models up there with Edward Green.

Bobbyball


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## mialpa (Feb 1, 2004)

> quote:_Originally posted by kabert_
> 
> I thought Franco's in Richmond, VA, was going to carry them too but I don't see mention of it on the francos.com website.
> 
> ...


hi! I have the pleasure to announce that since this week you can find them at Bergdorf Goodman in NY.
regards


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## jcusey (Apr 19, 2003)

I am reliably informed (ie, Tom Park told me) that will be carrying Carmina starting this spring. I don't know which models he will stock initially, but past experience with his EG and Alden offerings lead me to believe that they will be interesting. Good times!


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## Jimmy G (Mar 23, 2006)

Seriously good shoes @ you-gotta-be-kidding-me low price. Particularly when contrasted against all that top dollar commanding half-baked stuff floating on the market. The samples I've seen send C&J benchgrades, Peal, Cole Haan packing.

https://imageshack.ushttps://imageshack.us
https://imageshack.ushttps://imageshack.us
https://imageshack.ushttps://imageshack.us
https://imageshack.ushttps://imageshack.us


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## aportnoy (Sep 12, 2005)

jcusey said:


> I don't know which models he will stock initially, but past experience with his EG and Alden offerings lead me to believe that they will be interesting. Good times!


John, a little bird told me it might be these...

947 in Cognac
954 in Rubi
868 in *****
531 in Whiskey Cordovan
797 in Burgandy Cordovan
(no #) Wholecut in Burgandy Cordovan

Further details on these models can be found here:


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## william76 (Aug 11, 2006)

aportnoy said:


> John, a little bird told me it might be these...
> 
> 947 in Cognac
> 954 in Rubi
> ...


aportnoy,

Did I recall you saying that you got these Carmina boots at Peter Eliot? Also, what is the model/last? Thanks.

https://imageshack.us


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## yachtie (May 11, 2006)

Looks like I'll be making calls to Hawaii:icon_smile_big: Nice boots aportnoy!


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## manton (Jul 26, 2003)

The last and model of that boot is "Forrest."

Their best lasts, in my opinion, are Robert (round toe) and Rain (square).


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## asaffi (Jun 14, 2005)

Unfortunately, I didn't find any of those finishings over his website, just "normal" shoes.


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## william76 (Aug 11, 2006)

manton said:


> The last and model of that boot is "Forrest."
> 
> Their best lasts, in my opinion, are Robert (round toe) and Rain (square).


Thanks manton. Am I right that Peter Eliot and Bergdorf are the only places in NYC that carry Carmina?


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## manton (Jul 26, 2003)

Not sure. Rumor has it that PE dropped them. I have yet to see them in BG, but I haven't checked in a while. Portnoy will know.


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## meister (Oct 29, 2005)

*Albaladejo - los dos tonos son la muerte!*

Are these specs the best you have seen for a while? The colour, the positioning of the two colour pieces in the traditional style - not too much white on the vamp etc.

Muy bonitos - todos los zapatos!

Viva Espana!


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## grimslade (Aug 3, 2006)

manton said:


> Not sure. Rumor has it that PE dropped them. I have yet to see them in BG, but I haven't checked in a while. Portnoy will know.


BG had them last time I was in there.


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## jcusey (Apr 19, 2003)

grimslade said:


> BG had them last time I was in there.


Which models?


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## indylion (Feb 28, 2005)

*Carmina @ Drinkwaters?*

__________________________
www.drinkwaterscambridge.com

At one time, he had some on sale.


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## meister (Oct 29, 2005)

*Spanish shoes*

I have been buying some Spanish Goodyear welted shoes from Josephs in Sydney for years. They started at AUD250 and are now about AUD350 but for value a welted shoe at this price is unbelievable in Sydney.


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## septiembre (Mar 17, 2006)

I have a big problem with Carmina. Calfskin shoes are nice and not so expensive, I think they are a good deal.

My problem comes with my favourites, that are the Cordovan shoes. They are too expensive! They cost €430 and never have sales in their shop. That-s not so good value.

I work in Madrid, really near the shop, and the prices have been increasing until they got completely crazy. The brand in not so old, in the shop, the sellers don-t know much about lasts. For example, shoe trees cost €50, which is too much. In casa Exerez (in the same bloc) you can haver them for €25.
The quality of the shoe is good, and they look very good, but that price is more expensive than Alden cordoban or C&J Handgrade through Plal, for example.

I really want to get one of them, but each time I think at the end that they are too expensive. I really need someone to convince me.


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## In medio stat virtus (Jan 3, 2006)

I have two pairs of Carmina. One has poor upper leather: much too rigid and developing unsightly "bumps" of sort. However, the most disappointing aspect has been sole resistance. I kept them only a year before getting holes in the sole. That's approximately three times faster then for the C&J handgrades I have.

The styling is very good and price is nice (around 350€ in the shop in Paris). But for the same price I can get C&J handgrade subs during sales period and I prefer that. Carmina never does any sales.


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## septiembre (Mar 17, 2006)

That price is for regular or cordovan shoes? Regular calfskin shoes cost here around 200-250


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## In medio stat virtus (Jan 3, 2006)

Calfskin in Paris is between 250 and 350. They have several grades in calfskin. 
Cordovan is around 450-500 I think.


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## horton (Feb 8, 2006)

Drinkwaters carries Carmina. I've only seen calfskin (scotch grain) and suede.


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## william76 (Aug 11, 2006)

In medio stat virtus said:


> I have two pairs of Carmina. One has poor upper leather: much too rigid and developing unsightly "bumps" of sort. However, the most disappointing aspect has been sole resistance. I kept them only a year before getting holes in the sole. That's approximately three times faster then for the C&J handgrades I have.
> 
> The styling is very good and price is nice (around 350€ in the shop in Paris). But for the same price I can get C&J handgrade subs during sales period and I prefer that. Carmina never does any sales.


Has anyone else had an experience like this with Carmina shoes?


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## RunningBeagle (Sep 25, 2006)

Chris Rimby said:


> Has anyone else had an experience like this with Carmina shoes?


I have one of the pairs from Sky Valet, the split-toed penny loafer, which I've loved since I got it in let's say November 06. The sole has been very hard wearing, and I got them accidentally soaking wet last saturday and had to slosh about in the rain for about 20 minutes before getting them home, drying them off, and putting them on trees. Incidentally, my feet remained completely dry.

By its nature, cordovan gets little bumps when wet, but these go away, as they did in this instance. I was most worried about the sole; I'm wearing the shoes today, and there is no evidence of disfiguration and the soles look and feel like they did before they got wet.

I take this as evidence of an adequately hardy shoe, and I plan on purchasing many more pairs as they become available to me.


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## william76 (Aug 11, 2006)

Ok thanks RunningBeagle. That's what I wanted to hear. I really like the understated elegance of several of the Carmina lasts. I hope to be able to order a pair sometime this year.


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## pinchi22 (Sep 30, 2004)

Chris Rimby said:


> Has anyone else had an experience like this with Carmina shoes?


My 5-year old Carminas - both soles and tops - have held up just as well as my handgrade C&Js.

It may be better to buy now than later, though. Carmina is moving it flagship store in Madrid to an even more prime zone (next to Cartier). Could be a harbinger of higher prices?


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## william76 (Aug 11, 2006)

Thanks for the response. I'll probably place a Carmina order once Leather Sole starts to carry them.


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## LeatherSOUL (May 8, 2005)

Chris Rimby said:


> Thanks for the response. I'll probably place a Carmina order once Leather Sole starts to carry them.


Sorry Chris, looks like we won't be carrying them for a while...they seem to be too swamped with orders and production at the moment. I'm soooo bummed!


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## rnoldh (Apr 22, 2006)

LeatherSOUL said:


> Sorry Chris, looks like we won't be carrying them for a while...they seem to be too swamped with orders and production at the moment. I'm soooo bummed!


Tom,
This is probably an unfair or impossible question. But how would you compare Alden Cordovan to Carmina.

As a point of reference, let's say. Value for the $$? Construction quality? Styling (obviously subjective)? Comfort? Durability?

I know this will be very subjective, but you are certainly qualified to give an expert opinion!

Regards and Thanks,
rnoldh

BTW: Would you consider Alden and Carmina the # 1 and #2 sources of fine Cordovan shoes?


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## yachtie (May 11, 2006)

rnoldh said:


> Tom,
> This is probably an unfair or impossible question. But how would you compare Alden Cordovan to Carmina.
> 
> As a point of reference, let's say. Value for the $$? Construction quality? Styling (obviously subjective)? Comfort? Durability?
> ...


I'm dying to know as well. I hate to say it but I'm considering cashing in my miles to go see Mr.Font. (Carmina Paris)


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## LeatherSOUL (May 8, 2005)

I only have experience with one pair of Carmina shell shoes, they were not mine, just a pair I was able to get for a customer...beautiful in every aspect and very well made. Price point is higher than Alden shells.

Hard to compare the two because they are obviously so different. I would think they appeal to different buyers as well. 

My best advice, buy both. You'll be happy. They are both very nice shoes.


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## Mr. Magoo (Dec 23, 2003)

rnoldh said:


> This is probably an unfair or impossible question. But how would you compare Alden Cordovan to Carmina.


I have never bought Alden, so I cannot compare quality with the Carmina cordovan I have. I will say the styling is quite different though.

Alden are more typical "no-nonsense" American styed shoe. Not to say they are unattractive, just that they have the look of a shoe my grandfather would have worn. Some would say "clod-hopper", and some would say "traditional."

Carmina have a more European styling. The "Rain" last in particular is a more chiseled toe than an Edward Green but with a similarly slim profile. I find that it does with the slimmer-cut trouser I prefer.

Really, I believe both are fine shoes but they have different appearances. Of course, since Carmina is becoming a high end import, it's now become more expensive than Alden too.


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## pkincy (Feb 9, 2006)

And I actually got to wear my shoes outside the home for the first time today. (Thank you, Tom!! And my extreme condolences that Carmina doesn't think it can support US sales as of yet.)

They may become my favorite shoes of my collection. Not a gunboat like my AE cordovans, beautiful fit and finish, elegant last, and extremely comfortable. Also the cordovan leather doesn't seem as thick or stiff as my old Florsheim Imperials or my AE Leeds.

All in all an absolutely wonderful pair of shoes as well as a most elegant wearing experience. Easily fits in a rotation with your JL, EG, Vass, et al.

https://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m248/pkincy/Carmina1.jpg

or:









For those of you that can get to the shops in Europe, I find the 7.5 E a perfect fit for my 9D US sized foot.

Perry


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## LeatherSOUL (May 8, 2005)

pkincy said:


> And I actually got to wear my shoes outside the home for the first time today. (Thank you, Tom!! And my extreme condolences that Carmina doesn't think it can support US sales as of yet.)
> 
> They may become my favorite shoes of my collection. Not a gunboat like my AE cordovans, beautiful fit and finish, elegant last, and extremely comfortable. Also the cordovan leather doesn't seem as thick or stiff as my old Florsheim Imperials or my AE Leeds.
> 
> ...


Perry,

Very glad you like them! They are BEAUTIFUL shoes, even MORE beautiful in person!

Aloha,

Tom


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## chobochobo (May 5, 2006)

pkincy said:


> https://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m248/pkincy/Carmina1.jpg
> 
> or:
> 
> ...


Wow. That has to be one of the nicest pairs of shoes I've seen in a while, and frequenting both here and SF, I've seen quite a few recently 

Pity the USD is in the pits at the moment.


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## meister (Oct 29, 2005)

*Carmina sizing*

Do they use the basic Euro numbers eg 42 43 44? or are they made using UK sizes? The LL pair seemed to indicate that they were made big if a guy that wore a 12 wore a 10.5D Carmina.


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## thinman (Jan 21, 2005)

At one time, there was a move afoot to try to arrange a group buy of shell cordovan wholecuts. What ever happened to that effort?


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## yachtie (May 11, 2006)

Alden SF had a calf wholecut listed on their clearance section. I'd think that if we got 12 orders together, they could do it in shell.


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## ltontheqt (Aug 9, 2005)

As I recall, a recent poster (might have been on Style Forum, I don't remember) said he visited Sky Valet in Washington and purchased three pairs of Carmina shoes. The store will no longer carry and is clearing them out at 20 percent discount. That's not a huge discount but better than paying full retail. For those so inclined, this might be a good time to give them a call.


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## well dressed europe (May 13, 2007)

*Carmina outlet*

Some of you already have visited the Carmina flagship stores at Paris or Madrid. Visiting Europe there is another great opportunity: On the Spanish island of Majorca (which is the home of Carmina Shoemaker) there are two shops offering nothing else but Carmina's. Another flagship store at the island's capital Palma de Mallorca and a factory outlet at a small town called Inca. Prices are somewhat lower than at the Paris or Madrid stores and at Inca mainly seconds are offered.


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## Gabriel (Feb 8, 2008)

*Carmina Shoes*



meister said:


> Do they use the basic Euro numbers eg 42 43 44? or are they made using UK sizes? The LL pair seemed to indicate that they were made big if a guy that wore a 12 wore a 10.5D Carmina.


Maybe it's a little late to enter this thread, but answering to the question of sizing of CARMINA, I can tell you they use the UK sizes. I live in Spain and I have a lot of pairs of CARMINA shoes (maybe 12 or more), so I have some experience with these nice shoes.

Well, talking about sizing, I think you can compare Carmina sizes with C&J sizes; at least in my case they are usually the same. But you have to be a little careful with the Cordovan ones, cause they size a little more: I mean, if you use an 8 size in Calf ordinary shoes, try a 7,5 for the Cordovan ones. It'll be enough.

About quality, if you use them as what they are (important and great shoes), and so, you don't wear them two consecutive days, use trees and take good care of them, you'll be able to enjoy them a lot of years. In my experience with both trades, they are as good as the C&J ordinary or handgrade. Maybe the soles suffer a little, but just the same that happens with C&J or Church's. Anyway, they are so comfortable that you have the risk of wearning them many consecutive days, but in that case, they will last a little less, so you can buy another pair...

CARMINA's designs are really very wonderful, mixing classic and modern style, but always with an elegant touch of class. Some designs may remind the ones of Dimitri Gomez, Bottier of C&J Paris, but not as modern (in my opinion, sometimes Dimitri is a little too modern).

For your information, here in Spain, the prices of CARMINA shoes go now from (+/-) 280 euros for the regular Calf ones, to 475 euros the Cordovan ones, and over 550 euros for the made to order models (only in Cordovan shell).

Well, in resume, great and beautiful shoes for all of you who are able to get them, here in Spain, in Paris, or wherever they sell them.


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## RunningBeagle (Sep 25, 2006)

Gabriel said:


> Maybe it's a little late to enter this thread, but answering to the question of sizing of CARMINA, I can tell you they use the UK sizes. I live in Spain and I have a lot of pairs of CARMINA shoes (maybe 12 or more), so I have some experience with these nice shoes.
> 
> Well, talking about sizing, I think you can compare Carmina sizes with C&J sizes; at least in my case they are usually the same. But you have to be a little careful with the Cordovan ones, cause they size a little more: I mean, if you use an 8 size in Calf ordinary shoes, try a 7,5 for the Cordovan ones. It'll be enough.
> 
> ...


Would you be willing to buy and ship some pairs to members here if we covered all your costs plus a little extra?


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## Gabriel (Feb 8, 2008)

RunningBeagle said:


> Would you be willing to buy and ship some pairs to members here if we covered all your costs plus a little extra?


I'm afraid but the answer must be no, I cannot. I don't want to assume any responsibility sending items as expensive as these, and not only for the risk that they can be lost in the way. Apart from that, for example, in the USA you have different taxes, and your Customs could stop the parcels and increase highly the prices with taxes. That is what happens in the other direction, and what has recently happened to me with some shoes I bought online to USA resellers. I after had to pay 40% more of the initial prices plus delivery charges, in taxes and similar concepts, so it is not worth it.

Sending shoes parcels by Spanish Ordinary Postal Service, which could be the only (and I'm not sure) way to avoid Customs, is similar to send a message in a bottle. It's not difficult that they lost the parcel, and after they only indemnify you with a maximum of 35 euros! It has happened to me, I sent a pair of C&J shoes to England two months ago, and they haven't still arrived there&#8230;so I'm making a claim, etc...

So, in its case, they'll have to be sent by UPS or DHL Express Services, and that is not only very dear (more than 50 or 60 euros), but also guarantees you that you will have to pay all the taxes you have to pay there with no exception, because these companies have to make an insurance to the merchandise in its real value. I think your Carmina Shoes will be costing you more than two pairs of ALDEN or C&J Cordovan together.


What I can do is to ask directly in Carmina's Shop if they can send shoes to an American friend, and if they are willing to do so, how could they do it, and then I tell you something. OK?


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## RunningBeagle (Sep 25, 2006)

Gabriel, I understand completely. I've no experience shipping overseas, but I can imagine it's a huge hassle/risk. But your generous offer to talk to someone at the shop would be a great help, as I know many people who frequent these boards love the shoes but have no point of contact, myself included. I've tried emailing Carmina multiple times, including Miguel Font at Carmina Paris, to no avail.

I look forward to hearing what they have to say.

Thanks again!


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## Gabriel (Feb 8, 2008)

RunningBeagle said:


> Gabriel, I understand completely. I've no experience shipping overseas, but I can imagine it's a huge hassle/risk. But your generous offer to talk to someone at the shop would be a great help, as I know many people who frequent these boards love the shoes but have no point of contact, myself included. I've tried emailing Carmina multiple times, including Miguel Font at Carmina Paris, to no avail.
> 
> I look forward to hearing what they have to say.
> 
> Thanks again!


To RunningBeagle:

I have gone to Carmina's Shop this morning, and I'm sorry to tell you that they cannot send shoes to USA. Making an exception, they sometimes send a pair of shoes to countries in the European Community (Germany or France), but the USA is a great trouble for them. They say "because of many causes", like big taxes, possible problems with sizing and returns, expensive delivery charges for sending and returning items...

Anyway, they have told me that in NYC, in the Fifth Avenue, there is a shop that sells their shoes. I think they said Bergdorf Goodman, but I'm not sure. In fact in the store web they don't appear, but maybe in the shop there are some models. Though they've told me that in that store they only sell Cordovan ones and they think the prices are high. They have also told me that their shoes are more expensive in Paris than in Madrid: 350 euros there against 290 euros here, the ordinary ones, and 550 euros there in front of 475 euros here for the Cordovan.

I think I've read in this blog about some other places in which they sell Carmina in the State (Skyvalet maybe).

I asked them if they have any catalogue, and they say that they don't have written catalogues, only some photos in internet, because they are continuisly creating new models, so there are too many to enter in a catalogue...

So then, if you go to New York you may have a chance.

Well, friend, that's all what I can tell you at this moment. Anyway, as I am a good client of them, I usually visit the shop once or twice a month to see the new models, so I'll keep asking about this item in the future, for if they change their mind or have another more retailer in USA.

Best regards.


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## RunningBeagle (Sep 25, 2006)

Thanks, Gabriel, for the valuable information and for your time conversing with Carmina. Many retailers here have carried or considered carrying the brand; however, most if not all have dropped it (though from your information it sounds like Bergdorf might still have them - they didn't the last time I was there...).

I can't say that's entirely bad news, that they won't ship here, as I can now look forward to a shopping trip in Madrid!

Thanks again, and enjoy the easy access to what I consider to be one of the greatest values in men's shoes in the world.


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## epl0517 (Apr 7, 2005)

It's truly tragic that Carmina is so little available in the US. 

I have been interested in these shoes ever since I learned about them on this forum.

I have browsed Bergdorf's shoe section several times and have never seen a single pair of Carmina. (Incidently, the shoe section is, I feel, the most disappointing section of the store.) However, I will look next time I have the chance. 

From time to time I have visited the Carmina web site. It appears that it has not changed in years. I have often wondered whether the set of shoes represented on the web site, which is quite small, is the whole collection, or whether other models are sold in stores. Does anyone know?


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## RunningBeagle (Sep 25, 2006)

Pictures in many threads here and on SF indictate the only a very small portion of their line is actually on the website. They've things like Ruby, Blue shell cordovan, chukkas, wholecuts... anything you can imagine. Also, the waistwork on these shoes is much more refined than anything you see in this price range, and they have great lasts. Sizing, like all great southern european shoemakers, is completely arbitrary. For example, I'm today wearing a 13 in one of the pairs that made it to the states. I also have a shell penny loafer that is an 11.5 and fits well.

It really is worth a trip to Madrid.


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## dopey (Jan 17, 2005)

Saks in NY is selling them at 40% off list, which is generally $495 for most models. There were a few pairs with dainite soles, including a pair of boots that looked to be black shell. Also, a nice pair of suede bluchers and also some brown wingtips.


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## epl0517 (Apr 7, 2005)

Thanks for the tip, dopey. I stopped by Saks, and saw the limited remaining selection that you describe. I almost purchased the black boot. The display piece was my size, but the salesperson couldn't find the mate. I'm not sure that these were shell though. They did look somewhat like shell, but there was no indication of such anywhere on the piece.

Curious to learn more about Carmina, I have some questions:

Do they have a printed catalog? Do they have a MTO program? I am craving the 942, the brown partial wingtip (for want of a better name), but I would like to know more about their range before I seek to obtain any particular shoe. 

I'm also very curious about the shell models. Do their hides come from Horween, or elsewhere? I have read various claims on these fora and others. It has been claimed that their cordovan is higher quality than Alden's. It also has been suggested that their burgundy cordovan is brighter than the Alden/Horween #8. But I also understand that #8 is the only burgundy currently produced by Horween, and also that Horween does not sell various grades of cordovan. So it would appear that their hides do not come from Horween (even if it is also true, as has been claimed, that Alden modifies the burgundy hides after it receives them). Does anyone know for sure what their source of shells is?

Also, are their corodovan shoes single sole or double, or does it vary by model? (I suppose it doesn't matter much, as any welted shoe can be and will be resoled eventually.)


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