# What's the point of Dainite soles?



## Trimmer

Well, what is the point of them? In my experience they slip like leather soles and don't give any of the traction of heavier 'commando' style rubber ones.


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## Tonyp

Supposedly for the wet weather. The slipping issue is probably going to be the problem with this sole. But if you need or like to wear leather dress shoes in winter in wet or snow then the danite will protect the bottom and it looks better than a lug sole. You can't really see the danite sole when you are standing. They do sell overshoes to wear with leather soled shoes.


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## Flanderian

Other members have mentioned that the traction is no better than leather, and that they're no softer either, which are two of the common advantages of other rubber soles on shoes that I've worn. However, I've done a good bit of walking in heavier weather and have found that any rubber sole will be drier than leather, even leather soles with a cork filling.


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## Finian McLonergan

Dainite soles will wear much longer than leather, do not require toe taps for those who find their leather soles wear out quickly at the toes, can be resoled just as easily as leather, provide additional insulation during cold weather, and of course provide much better grip on wet and snow/ice while limiting water penetration into the shoe thus extending shoe life. The natural elasticity of the the rubber sole also reduces upper creasing. A wet leather sole will very rapidly be abraded by hard surfaces, since the moisture causes the fibres to swell.

There is a trade off between rubber traction on wet vs snow/ice, i.e., the better the wet performance, the poorer the grip in snow and ice, so a good rubber formulation will seek to balance these two attributes.



So they are ideal for business shoes designed to be worn in winter conditions.


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## WouldaShoulda

I like mine.

They seem less slippery on hardwood and stone/slate surfaces than leather.

They are as pliable as leather also.


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## Leather man

I concur with all that Finian has said. Added to that I have found that Dainite soles last approximately three times as long as double leather soles ( non-oak bark tanned). Therefore for companies like Crockett and Jones and Church's who will only guarrantee to repair your shoes twice, Dainite soles dramatically extend the life of your shoes. Topy fans please don't chime in here, I realise using Topys will do the same, but for those of us that prefer to go by the manufacturer's advice Dainite provides a long wearing alternative to leather soles.


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## Jake Genezen

Trimmer said:


> In my experience they slip like leather soles and don't give any of the traction of heavier 'commando' style rubber ones.


I was going to buy a pair of dress shoes with dainite soles for the up-and-coming weather; I may well not now: there seems to be a consensus that they may be good in snowy condition, but not in icy conditions?

I have to commute by public transport and by foot, so I really have no alternative but to have my shoe's soles replaced with rubber ones (the ones with grips). 

So, shall I keep doing this, rather than get dainite-sole shoes? (Sorry, Trimmer, for interjecting with a question of my own.)


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## Trimmer

I have worn mine a bit more since I first posed the question and in more conditions. I still think they are preferable to leather when it is wet (for the sake of the leather that is), but they don't offer much more grip on slippery surfaces.


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## dwebber18

I've never owned a pair of dainite soles, but I did try on a pair of Church's Ryder boots with them and didn't particularly care for it. They felt like I was walking around on baseball cleats with all those knobs. Thats just me though


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## Marcellionheart

Dainite soles are sort of the equivalent of double leather soles in thickness as well. I think they more durable than leather soles, but they are definitely slippery. I almost did a faceplant at my new school wearing dainite chukkas since there was a bit of a spill near the cafeteria. They're great outdoors for wetness, but not indoors. If you're going for snow boots, though, then you're going to need the commando sole, not the dainite. Unless you're just going to be in London.


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## Nick V

The Dainite customer is very loyal to the brand. It's extremely rare that a customer will request a conversion from Dainite to leather. However, converting leather to Dainite is very, very common. Customers with worn out Dainite soles always stick with Dainite when they need re-crafting. Also, customers buying leather soled shoes like the opportunity of being able to convert leather to Dainite on models or brands that don't offer the option. That's also very popular in the shop.
I have had shoe company execs tell me that they prefer to sell leather soled shoes over Dainite because it can be years before they see Dainite soled shoes come back to the factory for re-crafting.


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## Anon 18th Cent.

Just for clarity, Dainite the manufacturer makes three kinds of soles: studded (which is what I think everyone here is referring to), Ridgeway, and Medway. I have owned all three styles and like them all.


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## cdavant

I'm still looking for the ultimate winter sole. Vibram makes a "Fire and Ice" sole for firefighters boots but I can't find a resoler who can put them on an ageing Alden Footbalance or Country Walker shoe. I don't want to resole/recraft with something that will wear down to smooth and slippery rubber. I have days I need a topy with suction cups for wet floors ad icy walks. Suggestions?


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## BPH

Leather is great in the dry, Commando soles are great for grip in the country but collect stones and mud and then distribute it steadily everywhere you go much to my wife's displeasure. I have a few pairs of shoes with Dainite soles that grip and stay dry better in the wet but don't collect the stones etc. Certainly not for offroading though.


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## eagle2250

Having only two pair of shoes/boots set-up with Dainite soles, I cannot claim the experience with them that so many others can but, they are very durable and provide me with reasonably sure footing on wet pavement or grass. However, as others have attested, on indoor wet, smooth flooring, dainite soles can be treacherous!


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## emptym

Jake Genezen said:


> I was going to buy a pair of dress shoes with dainite soles for the up-and-coming weather; I may well not now: there seems to be a consensus that they may be good in snowy condition, but not in icy conditions?
> 
> I have to commute by public transport and by foot, so I really have no alternative but to have my shoe's soles replaced with rubber ones (the ones with grips).
> 
> So, shall I keep doing this, rather than get dainite-sole shoes? (Sorry, Trimmer, for interjecting with a question of my own.)


I don't think any rubber or leather sole is ideal for icy conditions. For ice, you really need metal spikes. The same is true for really smooth, wet surfaces, like waxed linoleum or polished granite.

But for pretty much all other purposes, I really like Dainite soles. They're durable and the grip is great. I prefer them for bicycle commutes (metal pedals can tear leather) and motorcycling (leather soles are more likely to slip when you put your feet down at an intersection).

I like leather soles, but often when I'm running late, which is normal, I find that I slip with leather soles, particularly when running down a carpeted staircase.


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## Solomander

Nick, et al:

Any opinions on Dainite soles on cordovan shoes? Good idea? Bad idea?

Joel


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## Joe Beamish

eagle2250 said:


> Having only two pair of shoes/boots set-up with Dainite soles, I cannot claim the experience with them that so many others can but, they are very durable and provide me with reasonably sure footing on wet pavement or grass. However, as others have attested, on indoor wet, smooth flooring, dainite soles can be treacherous!


I had my formerly dangerous vintage gunboats resoled with Dainite and have experienced no treachery since. I love them. They are handsome and durable.

They were resoled by a shop in NYC whose proprietor posts here occasionally, and whose name is Nick V. and whose posting on the general subject can be found in this very thread at #11.

I admit I'm surprised at other people's slippery experiences on smooth flooring with Dainite, because I haven't myself. It must be a relative thing.


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## well-kept

Joe Beamish said:


> I admit I'm surprised at other people's slippery experiences on smooth flooring with Dainite, because I haven't myself. It must be a relative thing.


I agree. I have several pair of Dainite-soled shoes and I find they provide great traction in all circumstances - ice and snow included. I'm surprised to hear that others find them slippery. I mean... really surprised.


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## Nick V

Solomander said:


> Nick, et al:
> 
> Any opinions on Dainite soles on cordovan shoes? Good idea? Bad idea?
> 
> Joel


I wouldn't carry a product that I wasn't fond of. As mentioned we do lots of conversions.
Name the brand chances are we've done them. Cords are popular because they are worn more often during the fall and winter months. That's why I feel Dainite is appropriate.
Although I read that they tend to be slippery my customers don't complain about them. We service many college professors nationwide. Their routine requires them to trudge across campuses in all sorts of wintry conditions. They swear by the sole. Although I have read that some feel they can be slippery. I haven't experienced any complaints from my customers. So, I'll chalk it up to personal preference/experience.
Something I'd like to share...A few months ago an old customer mailed me a pair of Alden 986's. They were new out of the box. He wanted me to convert the JR sole to Dainite and add a mid sole. I contacted him and cautioned him of a concern I had. I explained that Dainite is a bit more rigid than leather on top of that adding a mid-sole would make the shoe even less flexible. Therefore, my concern was he would experience significant heel slippage since they were mocs. He thought about it and told me he really liked his custom idea and was willing to take the chance. The job came out looking really sharp but I still had my reservations. We shipped them out and I asked him to let me know about the heel. A few weeks later he contacted me and told me that he was thrilled about both the look and feel. No slippage.
That impressed me about Dainite.
A few weeks later he sent me a pair of 987's, Norwegian Oxfords and, Long wings for the same process. All brand new Alden's never worn, out of the box.


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## Marcellionheart

Nick, as a history teacher who does a fair bit of trudging, I have to say, it's not that Dainite is slippery outside, is that on wet indoor floors it can be fairly slippery. But I've only walked in one puddle this school year by the cafeteria, so it's not that big of a deal, to be honest. Otherwise, I totally agree with what you've said. They're great.


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## chotzo

I absolutely love my Dainite soled shoes. I have a few pair of Crockett and Jones with the Dainite shoes and they have basically replaced my nice leather soled shoes as my go to daily shoe. 

I work in an environment with a hard slippery floor surface. Not only do the Dainite soles offer more cushion and walking comfort on the hard floor, they offer significantly better grip than a leather soled shoe.

I have found that not all Dainite soles are the same. I have a pair of Sanders chukka boots and their Dainite soles are much harder and slippier than the C&J's. It depends on the manufacturer's spec and cost I assume.


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## Kingstonian

emptym said:


> I don't think any rubber or leather sole is ideal for icy conditions. For ice, you really need metal spikes. The same is true for really smooth, wet surfaces, like waxed linoleum or polished granite.


Skiers manage to walk across icy surfaces in plastic ski boots without falling over too often. Around ski resorts, walking boots are fine.

Crampons are only required for mountaineering. I do not think igents need to add them to their rotation along with galoshes and overshoes.


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## emptym

^Good point. Hard plastic will function a lot like metal -- biting into the ice. I also agree that igents don't need crampons for city life or even, as you say, resorts. My point is that if one needs to walk on ice a lot, no rubber or leather sole will be adequate, regardless of the tread type. At least this seems true as I've slipped on ice and wet polished surfaces many times while wearing commando soled dress shoes, hiking boots, or motorcycle boots.


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## Jake Genezen

Years ago I thought golf shoes - well, dress shoes with the golf shoe soles - might provide an answer. I guess those small spikes would scratch the floor of most foyers. I'm unsure.


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## Flanderian

Marcellionheart said:


> it's not that Dainite is slippery outside, is that on wet indoor floors it can be fairly slippery.


When a boy, my middle school was only 1 year old. The halls were highly polsihed stone. I recall coming in from a damp asphalt playground during gym class and going flying. Wet rubber and polished stone is very slippery. And the transition from good traction outside to virtually none inside is what makes it most problematic.


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## Flanderian

Jake Genezen said:


> I'm unsure.


You need not be unless they're soft rubber.


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## Doctor Damage

Leather Man said:


> Added to that I have found that Dainite soles last approximately three times as long as double leather soles ( non-oak bark tanned).


That sort of added longevity is really appealing to me. I will definitely consider dainite soles the next time I buy a pair of shoes.


Nick V said:


> A few weeks later he sent me a pair of 987's, Norwegian Oxfords and, Long wings for the same process. All brand new Alden's never worn, out of the box.


It sounds like Alden is missing a sales opportunity.


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## Holdfast

Dainite's a pretty versatile sole I think: thin and discreet like leather but with better grip in the damp. That's good in a climate like the UK which is frequently wet but not as frequently icy (where Dainite loses its edge over leather and neither does particularly well). Plus, I don't mind walking in a bit of mud in Dainite whereas leather soles take an age to dry out and clean up afterwards. I prefer leather soles generally, but I find it's good to have a few Dainite pairs in the wardrobe too.


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## Trimmer

Holdfast said:


> Dainite's a pretty versatile sole I think: thin and discreet like leather but with better grip in the damp. That's good in a climate like the UK which is frequently wet but not as frequently icy (where Dainite loses its edge over leather and neither does particularly well). Plus, I don't mind walking in a bit of mud in Dainite whereas leather soles take an age to dry out and clean up afterwards. I prefer leather soles generally, but I find it's good to have a few Dainite pairs in the wardrobe too.


I agree with all of this. I suppose what I was asking was what is the point of the Dainite _studded_ sole as opposed to more conventional rubber soles. Dainite make these themselves: https://www.dainite.com (for example the Medway).


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## kev'n

I’ve just purchased my first pair of AE McAllister’s (Dark Chili) w/ Danite soles. After reading all that has been said of them here it was a “no brainer” as the winter weather has appeared. Thanks for all the great advice gents.


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## iam.mike

@kev'n - Congrats! Hope the current version is as good as the ones our members were talking about when this thread was originated.

Care to share some photos?


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## peterc

If your body temp. runs hot, as mine does, it needs to be at freezing or below, for your feet not feel like they are on fire when you wear shoes with danite soles.


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## RogerP

I have naturally warm feet - I couldn't even stand to wear fur-lined boots. I have never had the slightest issue wearing Dainite soles even in mid-summer. Not a lot of "breathing" happens through the soles of your shoes regardless of material.


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## mhj

For snow and ice, nothing beats YakTracks. They are like a tire chain that will slip on over any shoe and should be removed when indoors as they are treacherous on smooth surfaces and not good for your carpeting.

Google for more information, I got mine on Amazon.


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## Oldsarge

mhj said:


> For snow and ice, nothing beats YakTracks. They are like a tire chain that will slip on over any shoe and should be removed when indoors as they are treacherous on smooth surfaces and not good for your carpeting.
> 
> Google for more information, I got mine on Amazon.


The first winter I moved to Oregon we got three snow storms and streets so icy if you didn't have all-wheel drive you couldn't leave the neighborhood. I give YakTracks credit for my not breaking any bones that winter. It hasn't gotten that bad since but there is no doubt in my mind that it will some time in the future so I keep them in the shoe closet at all times . . . just in case.


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## Flanderian

RogerP said:


> I have naturally warm feet - I couldn't even stand to wear fur-lined boots. I have never had the slightest issue wearing Dainite soles even in mid-summer. Not a lot of "breathing" happens through the soles of your shoes regardless of material.


Contrary to them being too hot, I'd think they might even offer an advantage. My boyhood environs were typified by slate sidewalks. And in the summer sun, the dark grey slate would absorb and store enough solar energy to turn them into griddles. Hot enough to be uncomfortable to walk on even though shod. One summer resoling of a pair of formerly leather soled shoes replaced them with rubber. Ah, delightful! No more singed soles!

:happy:


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## AndynottheAndy

I have a three of shoes and boots with Dainite soles. They are better in wet weather of outdoors and on roads than leather, except on wet tiled surfaces like those in public buildings. While not quite as grippy as lugged soles, you wouldn't use lugged soles on a dressier shoe. Most people cannot tell your shoes have dainite soles when you are walking/standing.

I think the reason people think they are as slippery as leather is based on walking on tiled surfaces in wet weather. But unless you have an SRB or SRC standard safety boot sole, most soles will be slippery on wet tiles though - even my virbam hiking boot soles slip. 

They are definitely still a better grip than leather and on roads in wet weather they cope much better and give better insulation/ watertightness to the shoe. They are just all round a tougher sole and give the foot more comfort from hard surfaces.


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## cdavant

+1 on YakTracks. Used them on ice this morning. Still not enough experience with the Vibram "Artic Ice" resole NuShoe did on my Alden 403s. I wouldn't trust them walking a mile on real ice, but I hope they will serve for the patches of parking lot ice I seem to have a talent for locating.


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## challer

People tend to like them because they are easier on your joints without looking like comfort shoes. And they wear exceptionally well. Grip was not a consideration. I've nearly been killed by more than one pair of leather shoes on work brick, granite and other smooth surfaces.


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## Color 8

I have a few pairs of shoes with Dainite soles. I work downtown and I wear them when there's sloppy winter weather in the forecast, specifically because of the crazy amount of rock salt used on the sidewalks.


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## RogerP

Color 8 said:


> I have a few pairs of shoes with Dainite soles. I work downtown and I wear them when there's sloppy winter weather in the forecast, specifically because of the crazy amount of rock salt used on the sidewalks.


Rock salt chews up wet leather quite effectively.


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## Doctor Damage

Trimmer said:


> Well, what is the point of them? In my experience they slip like leather soles and don't give any of the traction of heavier 'commando' style rubber ones.


... and that's where you lost me. It never ceases to amaze me how bizarre and alternate-universe the "experiences" that people in the clothing forums have had with their gear. Some seem incapable of doing normal things in normal ways, or experiencing normal experiences.


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## Doctor Damage

RogerP said:


> I have naturally warm feet - I couldn't even stand to wear fur-lined boots. I have never had the slightest issue wearing Dainite soles even in mid-summer. Not a lot of "breathing" happens through the soles of your shoes regardless of material.


Thank you for posting this important point about leather not breathing (one of those commonly held mis-beliefs). It doesn't breathe. Does a leather jacket breathe? No. And the leather used on the soles of shoes is thicker and denser than that used on a leather jacket, plus it's been soaked in various chemicals and glued on and has a layer of cork and a leather insole between it and one's feet.


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## Color 8

RogerP said:


> Rock salt chews up wet leather quite effectively.


Exactly, and makes salt stains, etc . I have shoes with soles like Dainite specifically to avoid wearing leather-soled shoes during rock salt season


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