# Why are men portrayed as Complete Idiots in the Media?



## jasonbourne (Dec 10, 2007)

This question is really starting to gnaw at me. When did this begin? I see commercial after commercial depicting men as powerless, incompetent, Minutemen (if you know what I mean), and idiots. When did this begin? I saw a commercial for dominoes and the guy says the pizza will be here in 30 minutes, and the woman asks, "what will we do with the other 28". That is just awful on several levels. When did men become the whipping boy du jour, and why do we not stop these terrible statements from happening through boycotts etc? Both men and women have their faults as INDIVIDUALS, but it seems to me that there is an emerging stereo-type that men are losers, which should be nipped in the bud before it becomes wide spread. Already boys do worse in school than girls and are going to college in lower numbers. I don't know if they are correlated, but as a product of the post-feminist movement, I was subject to programs that targeted girls to get involved in math and science...what about boys in English? Somehow it is now appropriate the say the nastiest and most sexist things against men, how is that an improvement? 

there was a time where there were distinct gender roles that bound both men and women into tight fitting boxes. Men would work, and women would cook, clean and raise the kids. Fortunately that is all behind us, and men can enjoy making dinner or playing with their children just as much as women. But somewhere I feel that we lost something that was good about masculinity in general. Women can say that they are proud to be a woman, but what do men have to be proud of? The box that we were put in was just as constraining as the one put around women. But women left their box, and took many if all of the things that defined being male plus keeping what it meant to be female. for us men, the box burn around us and we were left homeless. If anything masculinity is defined only as a negative: not female. 

I will say it, I am proud to be a male. But I am not sure why. In this post industrial, post feminist age. What defines being a man? It is not the jobs we do or providing for a family, as women do all the jobs that men to and also provide. Women have the ability to give childbirth which distinctly defines them. Men can almost be excluded from that equation, with a visit to a sperm bank. But the fact remains that men and women are different (not in 100% of the time, but on average). 

Maybe this is a lost cause, and gender is but an illusion to be masked in a grey fog for the rest of time. But I would argue that redefining gender roles for men is a worthy enterprise, as the virtues of being male need not exclude women. Instead characteristics like brotherhood, responsibility, and fashion can all help rebuild the cult of masculinity for a new age.


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

I don't know, it doesn't seem that far off the mark these days. I know guys who can't even cook rice. Most guys I know don't know how to iron either (this is how they put it, I didn't realize there was something to know). At the same time, the modern man has lost the manly qualities and most don't know how to shoot a gun or change their car's oil either.


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## Laxplayer (Apr 26, 2006)

I do almost all of our cooking and ironing. I can change my tires and shoot a gun accurately. I don't change my own oil, though I could if I wanted to. I can also fix just about anything in our home, except for the plumbing (I'd rather not have water all over the place). I can sit through "chick flix" without complaint, and don't mind running to Walgreens for my wife's "products". I love all sports and still play hockey and lacrosse. I also enjoy art museums and theatre. I like to drink beer as well as wine and enjoy gourmet foods as well as hot wings. I play poker and smoke cigars with the guys on Friday night and help my wife and son bake cookies on Saturday. Are these "manly" things? I don't know, and I don't put much thought into it.


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## jpeirpont (Mar 16, 2004)

Laxplayer said:


> I do almost all of our cooking and ironing. I can change my tires and shoot a gun accurately. I don't change my own oil, though I could if I wanted to. I can also fix just about anything in our home, except for the plumbing (I'd rather not have water all over the place). I can sit through "chick flix" without complaint, and don't mind running to Walgreens for my wife's "products". I love all sports and still play hockey and lacrosse. I also enjoy art museums and theatre. I like to drink beer as well as wine and enjoy gourmet foods as well as hot wings. I play poker and smoke cigars with the guys on Friday night and help my wife and son bake cookies on Saturday. Are these "manly" things? I don't know, and I don't put much thought into it.


Supporting and making your family happy is the ultimate mark of a man.


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## Rossini (Oct 7, 2007)

marlinspike said:


> I don't know, it doesn't seem that far off the mark these days. I know guys who can't even cook rice. Most guys I know don't know how to iron either (this is how they put it, I didn't realize there was something to know). At the same time, the modern man has lost the manly qualities and most don't know how to shoot a gun or change their car's oil either.


True enough, though I don't know many people of either sex who actually know how to cook rice properly.


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## RSS (Dec 30, 2003)

jasonbourne said:


> I see commercial after commercial depicting men as powerless, incompetent, Minutemen (if you know what I mean), and idiots.


Jasonbourne, perhaps you watch too much television. Pick up a book ... read a bit ... you won't be bothered by commercials ... and your mind will be active ... not passive.

Laxplayer, I'm impressed! You are indeed a good man.


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## Lawson (Dec 2, 2007)

Laxplayer said:


> I play poker and smoke cigars with the guys on Friday night and help my wife and son bake cookies on Saturday.


What kind of a father lets his son bake cookies? 

My facetious question captures one reason why men are lagging behind. Any effort to improve one's appearance or cultural and culinary knowledge is dismissed as homosexual by much of male society.


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## jasonbourne (Dec 10, 2007)

Lawson said:


> What kind of a father lets his son bake cookies?
> 
> My facetious question captures one reason why men are lagging behind. Any effort to improve one's appearance or cultural and culinary knowledge is dismissed as homosexual by much of male society.


That is exactly part of the problem. Men do things like cook no a days, but media still portray men as being helpless in the kitchen. I was fortunate to have a father that cooked, cleaned and dressed well. Unfortunately, uncouth relatives of mine didnt think that he was very manly compared to their drunken twit husbands. It was interesting that these women thought these things made him less of a man, when in actuality I think my father is more of a man than anyone I have ever known.


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

Rossini said:


> True enough, though I don't know many people of either sex who actually know how to cook rice properly.


Do it like they do in Asia:


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## Kav (Jun 19, 2005)

Dominos is mentioned by a presidential candidate as one of the big business deals he managed. If a man can only perform for two minutes, and the only empirical information we have is his indulgance in Pizza-well....? Real men don't each quiche, Dominos and should vote accordingly. These people have addresses. They want our money and our vote. Don't be a girly man. Make them earn it.


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## Laxplayer (Apr 26, 2006)

jasonbourne said:


> That is exactly part of the problem. Men do things like cook no a days, but media still portray men as being helpless in the kitchen. I was fortunate to have a father that cooked, cleaned and dressed well. Unfortunately, uncouth relatives of mine didnt think that he was very manly compared to their drunken twit husbands. It was interesting that these women thought these things made him less of a man, when in actuality I think my father is more of a man than anyone I have ever known.


Yeah, I have never understood why some guys think it is so weird for a guy to know how to cook. I mean, firefighters are thought to be pretty manly guys, and they cook, and most chefs are men. So, what's the big deal? I'd much rather prepare a nice meal than have to eat chili from a can, or order pizza all the time. My roommates in college loved that I knew how to cook. It sure beat eating Ramen noodles. 
btw, it's also not that my wife can't cook, she's a very good cook, I just let her grade her class papers and spend time with our son while I cook. She then helps me with the dishes. My son is 20 months old, and he already knows the names of quite a few items in our kitchen and their location. He also pushes in the drawers, places the detergent cube in the dishwasher and then closes the door for us....sorry, just had to brag about him a little bit! :icon_smile:


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## whomewhat (Nov 11, 2006)

Rossini said:


> True enough, though I don't know many people of either sex who actually know how to cook rice properly.


Rinse 2 cups of white rice until water turns clear. Melt 2 tablespooons of butter in a pan. Lightly saute 2 cups of white rice with the butter. Add 3 cups of water and 1 teaspooon of salt. Bring to a full boil. Cover, reduce heat to low and cook 20 minutes. Remove from heat, leaving rice covered, for five minutes. PERFECT rice every time! You can't live in Brasil for two years without learning how to cook perfect rice. :icon_smile:


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## Beresford (Mar 30, 2006)

The answer is here:


"Is Matriarchy the Shape of the Future?"


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

whomewhat said:


> Rinse 2 cups of white rice until water turns clear. Melt 2 tablespooons of butter in a pan. Lightly saute 2 cups of white rice with the butter. Add 3 cups of water and 1 teaspooon of salt. Bring to a full boil. Cover, reduce heat to low and cook 20 minutes. Remove from heat, leaving rice covered, for five minutes. PERFECT rice every time! You can't live in Brasil for two years without learning how to cook perfect rice. :icon_smile:


First, the only rice worth cooking is Basmati (for which your cooking times and water amounts would be too much, also the butter is for the end with basmati...yogurt is involved).
Second, you'll find you get better rice if after the rinsing you then fill the pot with rice in it up with cold water and let it soak at least 1 hour and then rinse a couple more times.
Finally, you can only claim the title to perfect rice if you know how to make Tahdiq (google it, it's delicious, and hard to make perfect...if the recipe involves potatoes or anything else beyond water, salt, yogurt, and butter/oil, it's a cheater's recipe and makes substandard Tahdiq...always put a capital T, it's that good).


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## Kav (Jun 19, 2005)

I believe it was in Grapes of Wrath Steinbeck mentions rice in the radiator as an emergency sealant along with sawdust in the axle and transmition to hide worn gears.A well rounded man also knows not to put rice down a apartment garbage disposal. There is also American Indian rice from the north. Rice and red beans is perhaps the greatest and most delicious poorman's survival food ever invented. In my religious studies an early indicator of cults was the idiotic macrobiotic rice diet. Anyone with half a brain knows eastern religions are quite clear on rice as a meal. It comes in ceremonial white boxes with red lettering and an aluminum bail and the ancient and most sacred fortune cookie. these are things all manly men should know.


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## BertieW (Jan 17, 2006)

Could the answer to the OP's question have something to do with the fact that women have historically done the majority of household shopping? As such, ads that make women feel empowered, even at, or especially at, the expence of their male mates, may appeal to this target, inducing them to buy more.

I'm sure there must be tons of research out there on this topic if the OP is interested, though I lack the time to pursue. Here are two quick hits:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in_article_id=488270&in_page_id=1879
https://www.springerlink.com/content/n085v5t4120l3364/


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## Lawson (Dec 2, 2007)

Kav said:


> I believe it was in Grapes of Wrath Steinbeck mentions rice in the radiator as an emergency sealant along with sawdust in the axle and transmition to hide worn gears.A well rounded man also knows not to put rice down a apartment garbage disposal. There is also American Indian rice from the north. Rice and red beans is perhaps the greatest and most delicious poorman's survival food ever invented. In my religious studies an early indicator of cults was the idiotic macrobiotic rice diet. Anyone with half a brain knows eastern religions are quite clear on rice as a meal. It comes in ceremonial white boxes with red lettering and an aluminum bail and the ancient and most sacred fortune cookie. these are things all manly men should know.


Thanks, Kav. I needed a chuckle.


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## In Mufti (Jan 28, 2005)

Some of my answers to your question about when did men become so goofy:

1.	The explosion of electronic media gave the “entertainment class” a disproportionate influence on our cultural icons. Those who run the media are not exactly the most manly guys and therefore heavily promote unflattering male stereotypes (the brute, the numbskull, the sexual philanderer etc.) while making the gay man the perennial good guy in most movies and TV. They own the electronic stage so they are going to promote the images that they feel comfortable with. 
2.	The feminist movement. While there were some important adjustments to our culture that were long overdue (principally in the area of employment and financial matters.) There was a significant segment of the feminists who just had a real chip on their shoulder about all things male. These are the nitwits who decided that we should spell the word “women” as “womyn.” They were and are kooks, but they have been successful at slowly grinding down the acceptance of traditional manliness in our culture.
3.	Much of the shift started during the Vietnam War. Being a “man” meant doing your duty and that meant going to Vietnam. Those who stayed behind had to start redefining manliness to fit the path they chose to take. Being a soldier is about the most masculine thing a man can do in his life. Once the American culture attacked that standard, it was the proverbial slippery slope. In less than ten years we went form American soldiers being depicted as Sgt Saunders, a pretty responsible combat leader to Alan Alda’s obnoxious smart alacky doctor in MASH. Likewise, fathers went from Father Knows Best to the idiots we are cursed with now. The image of the American man started to deteriorate in 1965—the same year we went into Vietnam.
4.	Ironically, the biggest losers in this feminization of the American male are the American women. They are being told to eschew strong men in favor of the perpetual twit who is still living at home and playing video games in his 30’s. They end up all stressed out because they are trying to have a family with a boy who they can’t rely upon when the going gets tough.
5.	Unfortunately, as the culture scrapped John Wayne, much of the old-fashioned “strong and silent manliness” has been replaced by mindless brutality. For example Gangster Rap is the mutation and perversion of masculinity into a “thug culture” where women are treated far worse than they ever were before.
6.	As far as what to do: Ignore all this silly media nonsense. I have noticed as I get older that the media class is forever locked in adolescence. There isn’t anything you can do about it. It would be the epitome of “unmanliness” to try to stage some type of protest against how a bunch of wimps in Hollywood portray men. Of course it’s good sense not to pay to be insulted by their dopey shows and movies but leave the “movements” to the legions of the perpetually aggrieved. Your best revenge is to be a strong gentlemanly man people can trust and depend upon. Most American man are quietly taking care of business and doing a good job with their responsibilities. Just be a good man—people notice.

That’s enough of the dissertation for now….


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## JRR (Feb 11, 2006)

In Mufti said:


> Some of my answers to your question about when did men become so goofy:
> 
> 1.	The explosion of electronic media gave the "entertainment class" a disproportionate influence on our cultural icons. Those who run the media are not exactly the most manly guys and therefore heavily promote unflattering male stereotypes (the brute, the numbskull, the sexual philanderer etc.) while making the gay man the perennial good guy in most movies and TV. They own the electronic stage so they are going to promote the images that they feel comfortable with.
> 2.	The feminist movement. While there were some important adjustments to our culture that were long overdue (principally in the area of employment and financial matters.) There was a significant segment of the feminists who just had a real chip on their shoulder about all things male. These are the nitwits who decided that we should spell the word "women" as "womyn." They were and are kooks, but they have been successful at slowly grinding down the acceptance of traditional manliness in our culture.
> ...


Great post.

https://www.city-journal.org/2008/18_1_single_young_men.html


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## Howard (Dec 7, 2004)

I think in today's world the man and woman work both full time jobs with a 40 hour week and a nice decent salary.back then you had the man work and the woman just stay home and take care of the kids but today both of them work to take care of the expenses they have.


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## Leather man (Mar 11, 2007)

It been going on here in the UK for decades now - we started noticing the " women outwits man, woman overpowers man, women is smart man is dumb" mantra through late 70s sitcoms and soon after in the Ads.

There are two commercials on UK TV at the moment for Car Insurance only for Women - one is called "Sheila' Wheels". No one bats an eyelid in the media - yet can you imagine an Ad for "Bruce's Wheels - the car insurance for men only" being allowed to even get air time , never mind being taken off.

My other half says " don't take it so seriously its only a joke" but I say to her " you wouldn't feel that way if it were the other way round". My two boys, 18 and 15 both feel that the world at large and the world of education favours the female of our species over the male - and both have no axe to grind, both are high acheiving, intelligent young men.


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## 16128 (Feb 8, 2005)

I do think it's a horrible double standard to pick on men for comedic effect, when if the tables were turned, women would claim offense. The only way you can make jokes about dumb women is if you add the word "blonde" to them.

My husband can iron, of course, and is a better cook than I am. On Sunday he made moroccan lamb with eggplant and couscous. He makes bread. He makes pizza from scratch. He does all of the Thanksgiving meal. I burned FROZEN SHRIMP yesterday.

I find that having a husband that's skilled like this makes other women really, really envious. 

I was also raised by a stay-at-home dad, so maybe that colors my view of "men's work" and "women's work"/gender roles.


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## Mike Petrik (Jul 5, 2005)

Laxplayer said:


> I do almost all of our cooking and ironing. I can change my tires and shoot a gun accurately. I don't change my own oil, though I could if I wanted to. I can also fix just about anything in our home, except for the plumbing (I'd rather not have water all over the place). I can sit through "chick flix" without complaint, and don't mind running to Walgreens for my wife's "products". I love all sports and still play hockey and lacrosse. I also enjoy art museums and theatre. I like to drink beer as well as wine and enjoy gourmet foods as well as hot wings. I play poker and smoke cigars with the guys on Friday night and help my wife and son bake cookies on Saturday. Are these "manly" things? I don't know, and I don't put much thought into it.


+1
And in my case -- take the family to Mass on Sunday. And while I'd certainly run to Walgreens to buy my wife's products without complaint, I'm grateful that she would never consider asking me.


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## whomewhat (Nov 11, 2006)

Howard said:


> I think in today's world the man and woman work both full time jobs with a 40 hour week and a nice decent salary.back then you had the man work and the woman just stay home and take care of the kids but today both of them work to take care of the expenses they have.


Howard, you know I love you man and when others were calling for your head I was right there defending you, but WHAT?! Did you really say "the woman just stay home and take care of the kids?" Prior to my early retirement, I worked 12-16 hours a day, 6 days a week for the privilege of having my wife stay at home to raise our children. I earned the money, but she molded our 5 children into the good men they are today, or at least the oldest three since I am now home to help with the younger two. She has taken a job now since it seemed crazy to her that we would both stay home and I have to tell you that trying to fill her shoes is the most difficult thing I have ever done. Motherhood is the greatest calling on earth, IMHO, and the most difficult 24-hour job one can perform.


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## tabasco (Jul 17, 2006)

BertieW said:


> Could the answer to the OP's question have something to do with the fact that women have historically done the majority of household shopping? As such, ads that make women feel empowered, even at, or especially at, the expence of their male mates, may appeal to this target, inducing them to buy more.


BertieW's got it right. Women make most of the buying decisions in a household, and buy far more consumer disposable items. Observation: My local Walgreens has 4-1 ratio of women to men, ANY time of the day.

Popular media advertising is targeted to women, though why advertisers think it's necessary/appropriate/productive to show men as incompetant buffons is beyond me. It's like they take lessons from Rodney Dangerfield.

-former chef


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## Beresford (Mar 30, 2006)

Men make the money. Women spend it.


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## yachtie (May 11, 2006)

whomewhat said:


> Howard, you know I love you man and when others were calling for your head I was right there defending you, but WHAT?! Did you really say "the woman just stay home and take care of the kids?" Prior to my early retirement, I worked 12-16 hours a day, 6 days a week for the privilege of having my wife stay at home to raise our children. I earned the money, but she molded our 5 children into the good men they are today, or at least the oldest three since I am now home to help with the younger two. She has taken a job now since it seemed crazy to her that we would both stay home and I have to tell you that trying to fill her shoes is the most difficult thing I have ever done. Motherhood is the greatest calling on earth, *IMHO, and the most difficult 24-hour job one can perform.*


With 5 as well, it just couldn't be done if my wife didn't stay at home. Raising a family as one's vocation is seriously underrated these days. What I think women forget, or are taught away from, is the old saying that's as true today as it's ever been:
"The hand that rocks the cradle, rules the world".

+1!

The media has been complicit in playing up the eternal adolescent as a valid mode of life for the male. Just gotta remember that these days there are, unfortunately, alot of people that can personally identify with these oversized "boys".


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## Phinn (Apr 18, 2006)

There is , subtitled: "Today's single young men hang out in a hormonal limbo between adolescence and adulthood." 

Of course, this is not completely new. Ernest Hemingway was rather critical of the "American boy-man" epitomized by the cuckolded Francis Macomber, who reportedly led a short and happy life, right up to the point where his wife "accidentally" shot him in the head.


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## Laxplayer (Apr 26, 2006)

Mike Petrik said:


> +1
> And in my case -- take the family to Mass on Sunday. And while I'd certainly run to Walgreens to buy my wife's products without complaint, I'm grateful that she would never consider asking me.


Oops, I left out Sunday. I also attend church with my wife and son each week.


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## Leather man (Mar 11, 2007)

VS said:


> I do think it's a horrible double standard to pick on men for comedic effect, when if the tables were turned, women would claim offense. The only way you can make jokes about dumb women is if you add the word "blonde" to them.
> 
> My husband can iron, of course, and is a better cook than I am. On Sunday he made moroccan lamb with eggplant and couscous. He makes bread. He makes pizza from scratch. He does all of the Thanksgiving meal. I burned FROZEN SHRIMP yesterday.
> 
> ...


Thank you for this post VS - it is very encouraging to read your thoughts and hear a woman's perspective. I am a husband who cooks too - in fact I do most of the cooking as well as many domestic chores. My wife has a full time career nowadays ( she went back to work once our youngest child was 7 - her decision to wait until then - no pressure from me) and I support her fully in that. What I would like to see is both genders respecting each other instead of making fun of each other and pulling each other to bits. We are stronger united than divided!


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## KenR (Jun 22, 2005)

Phinn said:


> There is , subtitled: "Today's single young men hang out in a hormonal limbo between adolescence and adulthood."
> 
> Of course, this is not completely new. Ernest Hemingway was rather critical of the "American boy-man" epitomized by the cuckolded Francis Macomber, who reportedly led a short and happy life, right up to the point where his wife "accidentally" shot him in the head.


Phinn,

That was an excellent article.


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## 16128 (Feb 8, 2005)

Leather man said:


> Thank you for this post VS - it is very encouraging to read your thoughts and hear a woman's perspective. I am a husband who cooks too - in fact I do most of the cooking as well as many domestic chores. My wife has a full time career nowadays ( she went back to work once our youngest child was 7 - her decision to wait until then - no pressure from me) and I support her fully in that. What I would like to see is both genders respecting each other instead of making fun of each other and pulling each other to bits. We are stronger united than divided!


Thanks, and I agree.

This "battle of the sexes" stuff is rubbish. When you're married, the point is that you're on the same team and someone has your back.


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## Howard (Dec 7, 2004)

whomewhat said:


> Howard, you know I love you man and when others were calling for your head I was right there defending you, but WHAT?! Did you really say "the woman just stay home and take care of the kids?" Prior to my early retirement, I worked 12-16 hours a day, 6 days a week for the privilege of having my wife stay at home to raise our children. I earned the money, but she molded our 5 children into the good men they are today, or at least the oldest three since I am now home to help with the younger two. She has taken a job now since it seemed crazy to her that we would both stay home and I have to tell you that trying to fill her shoes is the most difficult thing I have ever done. Motherhood is the greatest calling on earth, IMHO, and the most difficult 24-hour job one can perform.


Sorry,I guess I was thinking about the 1950's where you had a stay-at-home Mother taking care of the kids while the man worked and came home.Sorry if I offended you.

The man and woman should work to create a life together and buy things like a home,car,and big or small expenses.


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## mrkleen (Sep 21, 2007)

Beresford said:


> Men make the money. Women spend it.


This is a perfect quote considering the subject matter in this thread. It is EXACLTY this kind of antiquated idea, which was perpetuated for too long, and now has caused the pendulum to swing in the opposite direction. Unfortunately it has now swung so far that men are portrayed as helpless, hapless, buffoons - mere characateurs for the world to laugh at.

As was said earlier, I don't worry about such trivial things as a Dominoes commercial, or what Vogue says about men this week.

My father was a great roll model and taught me to be sturdy, independent, creative and fair. He taught me to be empathetic to women and a gentleman at all times. As I took this attitude into adolescence and young adulthood, this "always be the nice guy" attitude caused me a great deal of heartache and pain. Through those experiences, I learned to temper my demeanor, and now treat people well - but I don't go overboard until they have proven themselves.

I don't yet have children, and can only imagine that these kinds of media images make it hard to be a young man these days. At the same time, there are myriad opportunities and possibilities for anyone that wants to work hard to learn and better themselves.

And no matter what pop culture says, a self assured, intelligent, strong, masculine, man will always be in demand, both in the board room and in the bed room.


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## eagle2250 (Mar 24, 2006)

It is probably due, in some measure, to the fact we have earned the image! I've spent most of my adult life living life as one of those "manly" men. My primary purpose in attending college was to get a military commission; I was one of those that volunteered for Southeast Asia (Vietnam), I suppose on some level, secretely hoping to prove my mettle in combat (what an idiot!); after 12 years of wearing a uniform full time, I did the military thing part time and went into law enforcement, as a Federal civil servant, full time and spent five to seven months a year living out of a suitcase. When my daughters were babies I almost never changed diapers (real men just didn't do that) and, through the years, I managed to miss most of the important milestones in their lives, while I did my "manly" job. Thankfully God blessed me with very forgiving daughters and a beautiful wife, willing to live with my bullsh*t...and still love me! 

These days I spend as much time as I can with my grandkids, doing many of the things I never seemed to have time to do (you see, I was a manly man), with their mothers...I can change diapers with the best of them; I spend as much time in the kitchen, as my wife (maybe more)...I enjoy cooking and am a pretty good one; one of my favorite wall hangings (on my "I love me wall" in my study) is a picture my grandson drew in pre-school, of him helping his Papa cook the family Sunday dinner...he's my official taste tester! I hope my grandsons make better choices in their lives than I seem to have made.

JasonBourne, perhaps we are portrayed the way we are in the media, because we have worked real hard to earn that image. Don't take things too seriously, it's all in fun and there are more important things in life. Focus on what is really important!


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## Laxplayer (Apr 26, 2006)

eagle2250 said:


> It is probably due, in some measure, to the fact we have earned the image! I've spent most of my adult life living life as one of those "manly" men. My primary purpose in attending college was to get a military commission; I was one of those that volunteered for Southeast Asia (Vietnam), I suppose on some level, secretely hoping to prove my mettle in combat (what an idiot!); after 12 years of wearing a uniform full time, I did the military thing part time and went into law enforcement, as a Federal civil servant, full time and spent five to seven months a year living out of a suitcase. When my daughters were babies I almost never changed diapers (real men just didn't do that) and, through the years, I managed to miss most of the important milestones in their lives, while I did my "manly" job. Thankfully God blessed me with very forgiving daughters and a beautiful wife, willing to live with my bullsh*t...and still love me!
> 
> These days I spend as much time as I can with my grandkids, doing many of the things I never seemed to have time to do (you see, I was a manly man), with their mothers...I can change diapers with the best of them; I spend as much time in the kitchen, as my wife (maybe more)...I enjoy cooking and am a pretty good one; one of my favorite wall hangings (on my "I love me wall" in my study) is a picture my grandson drew in pre-school, of him helping his Papa cook the family Sunday dinner...he's my official taste tester! I hope my grandsons make better choices in their lives than I seem to have made.
> 
> JasonBourne, perhaps we are portrayed the way we are in the media, because we have worked real hard to earn that image. Don't take things too seriously, it's all in fun and there are more important things in life. Focus on what is really important!


Being a grandpa changes things, eagle. My dad never changed diapers either (according to mom) and the only cooking he did was grilling. Now that he is retired, he cooks and jumps right up when my son needs a diaper change. He makes me laugh because every time we visit, he has been out shopping for diapers, wipes, my son's favorite foods and usually has a little toy or "cool new outfit" for his grandson. I kid him and tell him that being a Papa has made him a "softie". :icon_smile_big:


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## eagle2250 (Mar 24, 2006)

Laxplayer said:


> Being a grandpa changes things, eagle. My dad never changed diapers either (according to mom) and the only cooking he did was grilling. Now that he is retired, he cooks and jumps right up when my son needs a diaper change. He makes me laugh because every time we visit, he has been out shopping for diapers, wipes, my son's favorite foods and usually has a little toy or "cool new outfit" for his grandson. I kid him and tell him that being a Papa has made him a "softie". :icon_smile_big:


Lax: Your Dad sounds like the sort of fellow I would like to know...a good father and a "great" Granpa. Callin him a softie huh? My daughters keep pointing out to me, as I do things with the little guys, "hey, why didn't you let us get away with that when we were kids?" As a Dad, I think you have been a faster learner than your dad and I! (winks) Have a great day!


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## Laxplayer (Apr 26, 2006)

eagle2250 said:


> Lax: Your Dad sounds like the sort of fellow I would like to know...a good father and a "great" Granpa. Callin him a softie huh? My daughters keep pointing out to me, as I do things with the little guys, "hey, why didn't you let us get away with that when we were kids?" As a Dad, I think you have been a faster learner than your dad and I! (winks) Have a great day!


Yeah, he was a good dad, and he is a great Grandpa to our son. My dad used to get upset with my brother and me if we got fingerprints on the windows. My parents were babysitting our son one weekend, and when my wife and I returned, I noticed that the glass on their French doors was covered with hand prints from the little guy. "What gives? You would have had a fit if we had done that." My dad said, "Oh, it's ok. He was just watching the birds in the backyard." Another time, I caught him allowing his "little buddy" to jump on the bed. My dad, smiling and knowing exactly what I was thinking, said, "What? He's just having fun." :icon_smile_big:


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## whomewhat (Nov 11, 2006)

I remember many years ago when my father took my oldest son to a SF Giants ballgame. I gave my son some money and told him not to expect grandpa to buy him anything. I said he would likely have a bag lunch and then offer to buy him a soda. No hot dogs, peanuts, a nice souvenir, no, a bag sandwich and a soda. Mind you, my dad is not poor, just the opposite, but he is tight fisted and that is how we always went to ballgames. The money I gave him was for the things I never got when he took me to games.

My son came home from the game with a big smile on his face and loaded with goodies. He said I did not know what I was talking about. He said grandpa, my dad, had bought him two hot dogs, a soda, peanuts, a chocolate malt, and several souvenirs! I wondered who this impostor was that had taken my son to a ballgame because it sure was not my dad!

A recent study I saw states that both men and women go through stages in their lives where hormonal changes make them either happy or sad. For men, the sadness seems to hit in the 40's and does not start to improve until the mid-fifties. My dad was 41 when I was born. Maybe their is something to that? Or maybe being a grandpa is just a whole different experience than being a father. In any event, it is something I look forward to.


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## eg1 (Jan 17, 2007)

The OP brings up a trope at least as old as "Bringing Up Father": 

But I recall becoming aware of the issue as a little boy in the early 70s with television ads, the general pattern for which was: idiot father cannot solve problem; wise wife or female neighbour then rescues said idiot with product in question.

For me, 'twas ever thus ...


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## Laxplayer (Apr 26, 2006)

whomewhat said:


> I remember many years ago when my father took my oldest son to a SF Giants ballgame. I gave my son some money and told him not to expect grandpa to buy him anything. I said he would likely have a bag lunch and then offer to buy him a soda. No hot dogs, peanuts, a nice souvenir, no, a bag sandwich and a soda. Mind you, my dad is not poor, just the opposite, but he is tight fisted and that is how we always went to ballgames. The money I gave him was for the things I never got when he took me to games.
> 
> My son came home from the game with a big smile on his face and loaded with goodies. He said I did not know what I was talking about. He said grandpa, my dad, had bought him two hot dogs, a soda, peanuts, a chocolate malt, and several souvenirs! I wondered who this impostor was that had taken my son to a ballgame because it sure was not my dad!
> 
> A recent study I saw states that both men and women go through stages in their lives where hormonal changes make them either happy or sad. For men, the sadness seems to hit in the 40's and does not start to improve until the mid-fifties. My dad was 41 when I was born. Maybe their is something to that? Or maybe being a grandpa is just a whole different experience than being a father. In any event, it is something I look forward to.


Well, my dad and my father-in-law, and I'm sure eagle would agree, say that being a grandpa is the greatest thing in the world. I'm sure you will be a "great" grandpa too and enjoy it as much as they do when the time comes. You'll probably end up being a big "softie" too. :icon_smile_wink:


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