# Aston Martin DB11: Most Beautiful Auto?



## Flanderian (Apr 30, 2008)

I love grand touring automobiles, and Aston Martin has been making beautiful touring cars for a long time. And recent Astons haven't exactly been ugly. But they've not been "Wow!" either. Often more a collection of design gimicks that were sort of less than the sum of their parts, sort of a little blah. Lovely designs, but just a little lacking for perfection.

Enter the DB11. I dislike the hyper aggressive aesthetic just for the sake of being hyper aggressive (Unless it's Italian because then it has historic precedent and they carry it off so well.) and the DB 11 is a hyper aggressive design. And I dislike design gimicks, and the DB11 is chock full of them. But what should have been kitsch and cliche is instead a symphony of perfect flowing harmony. And while full of dramatic contemporary design elements, its proportion is a return to classic sport/grand touring proportions. Not a line of this auto should be changed, Nothing would improve it, only detract.




























Darn thing even has a trunk -


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## Tempest (Aug 16, 2012)

Good shape overall, but it is plagued by issues affecting most modern cars. The beltline is too high so the greenhouse and visibility are lacking. This leads to the squashed bug look of the roof/cabin. 
I'm not sure if they are trying to emulate sportbikes or introduce dynamicism, but the tail has an "ass in the air" look to it.
I want to like the fastback, but it is so straight and stark that it has no charm. The (awful LED string) taillights is lacking. Designers want to shrink lights because they can, and for a racy look, but these are the eyes of the vehicle, the window of the soul. Making them slitty and shrunken is not good.
Does anyone know why recent cars (Jaguar, Nissan, Aston, maybe more) have given up on blending the roof to the body at the rear pillar? I have to imagine this is some cost saving thing like the old vinyl landau roofs.


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## Flanderian (Apr 30, 2008)

Tempest said:


> Good shape overall, but it is plagued by issues affecting most modern cars. The beltline is too high so the greenhouse and visibility are lacking. This leads to the squashed bug look of the roof/cabin.
> I'm not sure if they are trying to emulate sportbikes or introduce dynamicism, but the tail has an "ass in the air" look to it.
> I want to like the fastback, but it is so straight and stark that it has no charm. The (awful LED string) taillights is lacking. Designers want to shrink lights because they can, and for a racy look, but these are the eyes of the vehicle, the window of the soul. Making them slitty and shrunken is not good.
> Does anyone know why recent cars (Jaguar, Nissan, Aston, maybe more) have given up on blending the roof to the body at the rear pillar? I have to imagine this is some cost saving thing like the old vinyl landau roofs.


You are free to love it or hate it, but the arch formed by the strake from the A pillar to the C pillar is a specific design element and on more exuberant paint choices is available and intended to contrast with the body. On the car I featured it appears to be brushed aluminum. But the one thing it isn't is a "cost saving thing."



















And you do realize that again, while you're free to love them or hate them, most of the other design elements you criticized are classic elements of the sports/touring car design vernacular?


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## Flanderian (Apr 30, 2008)

Watch the video -






Edit: And another video. A detailed description of the DB11.






Additional Edit: Why you practice lane discipline on the autobahn. (Hint: It has to do with avoiding an automotive suppository. :thumbs-up

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LprycYJNUF4#t=1.322663

Another Edit: First drive with a lot of additional design detail.


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## Tempest (Aug 16, 2012)

I just feel that it is more striking than classically beautiful, and that is rather the game these days given the customer base. The top comment in that gushing Graham whatshisname video echoes the sentiment. 
That highway video makes it look like the taillights flicker a la KITT.
Exposed structural elements didn't help the Smart fortwo or the Audi R8 or whatever their mid-engined V10 thing is called. Mismatched body panels still look wonky.
But the thing is remarkably true to heritage despite the modern ugliness. I still think exactly what I do when I see that Camarao every morning- "drop the fenders and beltline three or four inches and this would look much better. Stupid gun slit windows up at your shoulders."


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## Flanderian (Apr 30, 2008)

Tempest said:


> That highway video makes it look like the taillights flicker a la KITT.


That's a standard modification done for *all* high performance cars driven on the Autobahn. And the headlights do something similar. It alerts other drivers that they are being overtaken at speed by a high performance auto. And rather than being a sign of aggression, flicking your high beams is actually the standard international signal that you wish to pass.

Having logged many hours on the Autobahn, I can attest that it's very helpful, particularly at night when you're puttering along in an ancient VW at 80mph to know that there's a Mercedes coming up behind you going 40 or 50mph faster. The Autobahnen are great roads on which to drive. And despite much higher speeds, they're safer than the Interstates. They're designed for high speed with well-built and maintained smooth pavement, rather than resembling an area recently shelled. They have long gradual curves with substantial banking and wide lanes. Entrance and exit ramps are about three timed longer than those of an Interstate. It's simple, really, you stay right unless you're passing someone. You don't just pick a lane you feel like driving in.


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## Langham (Nov 7, 2012)

I've decided to give this one a miss (...as if...).

Seriously though, if I did have an Aston Martin, I think it would be a much older one (DB5), with only six cylinders. Twelve seems needlessly complex.

Another grouse with modern AMs is that some parts of the body are made from what is essentially plastic. Not long ago, someone's dog was in trouble for chewing away half the front wing of his owner's AM.


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## Tempest (Aug 16, 2012)

Well, I'd be more on board with a DB8 myself. The reality of classics of a certain age is that they end up performing notably worse in many ways than modern econoboxes, as noted in this review. 
I presume they are doing the maintenance hell V-12 purely for bragging rights, as I am unsure what else it delivers better than a blown buzzin half dozen. I guess some sonic quality?


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## Flanderian (Apr 30, 2008)

Tempest said:


> Well, I'd be more on board with a DB8 myself. The reality of classics of a certain age is that they end up performing notably worse in many ways than modern econoboxes, as noted in this review.
> I presume they are doing the maintenance hell V-12 purely for bragging rights, as I am unsure what else it delivers better than a blown buzzin half dozen. I guess some sonic quality?


But if your DB11 is having work done, why wouldn't simply drive one of your other cars instead?


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

Wouldn't a V12 give a smoother ride at cruising speed? Of course, so does a V8. 

I'm sure some of it is to justify the price and to keep with the trend of the modern super car.

I've always liked Astons. Of all of the super cars, it seems to me the most functional.


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## Tempest (Aug 16, 2012)

Flanderian said:


> But if your DB11 is having work done, why wouldn't simply drive one of your other cars instead?


I did see a dealer "courtesy vehicle" Porsche Cayenne on the road a few days ago, which made me snicker. 
I remember a BMW mechanic cursing the V12 he was working on. Twice the work in half the space. 
So wait, like watch makers and movements, Aston is still making their own engines? Unlike ahem some other makers?


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## Dhaller (Jan 20, 2008)

SG_67 said:


> Wouldn't a V12 give a smoother ride at cruising speed? Of course, so does a V8.
> 
> I'm sure some of it is to justify the price and to keep with the trend of the modern super car.
> 
> I've always liked Astons. Of all of the super cars, it seems to me the most functional.


I'll vote for the Porsche 911 Turbo S (991 version, post 2012) as the most functional supercar - perfectly serviceable as a daily driver, civilized enough to work as a GT, yet it can still tear up a track on a race day (0-60 in 2.6 seconds? yes!) Add in 4 wheel drive and it remains glued to the road (not like the old 911s, like the one I terrifyingly spun down a mountain road when I was 17). It's just an absurdly good car in every way, and so far shows bulletproof reliability (for a Porsche!)

I am counting the days until my daughter is old enough to legally ride like a human being (front seat, fiddling with the stereo and enjoying the view) - I guess that's 2020, when she'll be 8 - and then I'm buying a Porsche 911 Turbo S Cabriolet (Oryx pearl)... assuming the 2020 is as good a car. The whine of the twin turbos and roar of wind can drown out her Taylor Swift (or whatever) 

As for the Astons, I'm too much a James Bond fan not to automatically love them, though I'd probably lean toward the V8 Vantage roadster, and just treat it as something fun to take out to the mountains on weekends (though the Porsche would actually be much better for this). And while they're pretty cars, I actually feel like the new Jaguar roadsters are more "Aston" than the Astons are; the Jag is a *pretty* car indeed (and in a way the Porsche - with its brutalist functionality - is not).

The problem I have with beautiful cars is that, if you look at all the cars from all the eras, modern cars are simply no longer "beautiful" - cool, yes; pretty, sometimes; startling, occasionally. But never actually beautiful.

DH


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## irish95 (Sep 27, 2011)

All of the opinions expressed are correct in their own way. I love the new Aston, but I agree with Tempest's opinion on the car. The new cars don't seem to be as "beautiful" as the older designs. Ian Callum was behind the design of the AM Vanquish in 2001 and the AM DB9 in 2004. Both those cars had extraordinary lines. He went to work for Jaguar and did the design on the XK, which by the way I believed looked better than the AM. I'm biased as I have a black 2004 XKR coupe. I still believe it is one of the better looking cars ever designed. It has the long hood/bonnet reminiscent of the older XKEs. Having said that, how do you beat a 911 Cabriolet on a sunny fall day. 

Thanks for the thread. The new cars are nice, but the classic lines from the earlier cars are almost works of art.


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## Flanderian (Apr 30, 2008)

SG_67 said:


> Wouldn't a V12 give a smoother ride at cruising speed? Of course, so does a V8.
> 
> I'm sure some of it is to justify the price and to keep with the trend of the modern super car.
> 
> I've always liked Astons. Of all of the super cars, it seems to me the most functional.


The generic characteristics of a V12 are several. Yes, they tend to be innately smooth running compared to some other configurations, but modern computer managed engine technologies have improved that characteristic in all engines. In naturally aspirated form they tend to have both a high redline and a broad torque curve. Turbo or supercharging improves the torque curve in most engine configurations, and certainly won't hurt it in a V12. And they have a lovely and unmistakable sound! My first wife had a Ferrari 330GTB with a V12 when I met her. When started in the garage of our home, there was a deep base bark, followed by a thrumming burble that would resonate throughout the entire home.

The DB11's engine is manufactured in a European Ford plant, and Mercedes supplies its electronics and much of the switch gear. Smaller specialty manufacturers have always used bits from larger ones as this is necessary to make economically viable products, and it is usually beneficial to the quality of the auto. And while English specialty manufacturers in particular have always depended heavily on this practice, the industry as a whole has become truly incestuous. The new Fiat 124 is essentially a Mazda Miata and is manufactured in the Mazda plant.


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

^ whoah, whoah, whoah! Back up to that part about your first wife having a Ferrari.


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## Flanderian (Apr 30, 2008)

SG_67 said:


> ^ whoah, whoah, whoah! Back up to that part about your first wife having a Ferrari.


So? :icon_saint7kg:


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

^ Who ended up keeping the Ferrari?


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## Flanderian (Apr 30, 2008)

SG_67 said:


> ^ Who ended up keeping the Ferrari?


The Ferrari had been long gone by then - long sad story.

If you'd really like to get a good listen to the sound of a V12, this video offers one for the DB11 -






though the Farrari's was more raucous, but at speed the note of a Ferrari V12 was sometimes compared to the sound of ripping silk.

And check out the paint and interior in this video! I had an A6 with a similar interior color scheme once. Loved it!


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## Tempest (Aug 16, 2012)

Speaking of paint, why is AM mentioning paint colors? Are they no longer literally personally mixing paint to your spec like the Home Depot paint match pros? I do applaud real colors though. Despite personally being guilty of owning two vehicles in the graytone scale, the ubiquity of cars devoid of actual color is becoming too noticeable.


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## Hockey Tom (Aug 10, 2016)

AM has used their paint colors in recent years as a means of generating buzz around new products-- such as the V12 Vantage first shown in "Mako Blue". Not sure if that's what they're going for here, but it's been done in the past.


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## Joseph Peter (Mar 26, 2012)

If AM is good enough for 007, it good enough for me. I am purposely ignoring Mr. Bond's experiments with Lotus & BMW.

My personal fav is more Italian; Lambos are always magnificent to behold and joyfully brutish to drive (had a chance to use a Murcielago a while back),,,unless one is a rapper who gets his/hers in purple with an automatic transmission. Sacrilege.


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## Gurdon (Feb 7, 2005)

The DB11 seems to me to be a truly beautiful car. It looks today as good as the XKE did when it came out. 

Thank you for the thread. 

Gurdon


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## Tempest (Aug 16, 2012)

Joseph Peter said:


> I am purposely ignoring Mr. Bond's experiments with Lotus & BMW.
> 
> My personal fav is more Italian; Lambos are always magnificent to behold and joyfully brutish to drive (had a chance to use a Murcielago ...


If you were praising the appeal of a Miura, I'd be with you. Stylistically, I fail to see how some modern wedgy Lambo has more appeal than a 70s Lotus Esprit.

Now the aforementioned Jaguar E-type is actually often cited as the most beautiful car ever, and I'm more inclined to agree, even if the bulbous cockpit of the hardtop is a little odd to modern sensibilities. The car had curves but was not overly swoopy.








I like swoopy, so I would nominate (and I have no special love for the Scuderia or Italian cars at all) the Ferarri Dino.


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

Lamborghini are too "in your face" and while they may possess excellent performance virtues, I could not bring myself to buy one (assuming I had the means to begin with). 

Were I forced to buy an Italian sports car, I would likely opt for a vintage Ferrari.


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## jeffreyc (Apr 8, 2010)

I love the look of the Aston's, nearly bought a DBS years ago after my first marriage but opted for a safe Ford Cortina !!
Personally prefer the Vanquish.


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## Dhaller (Jan 20, 2008)

Tempest said:


> If you were praising the appeal of a Miura, I'd be with you. Stylistically, I fail to see how some modern wedgy Lambo has more appeal than a 70s Lotus Esprit.
> 
> Now the aforementioned Jaguar E-type is actually often cited as the most beautiful car ever, and I'm more inclined to agree, even if the bulbous cockpit of the hardtop is a little odd to modern sensibilities. The car had curves but was not overly swoopy.


My mother drove an E-type roadster when I was little - she got it before I was born, so I assume it was a series 1 (I came along in '66). Her doctor forbade her to drive it while she was carrying me, so my dad drove her in it during that time; otherwise it was HER car! It was red, with a white (or very light tan) interior; funny, since she was always going on about "racing green".

Since I grew up prior to the era of the helmeted-and-bundled child, I used to stand in the front seat (I was 3 or 4) and hold on the the rim of the windshield to enjoy the wind when we drove through town. Early memories!

At some point it developed unsolvable problems, and was garage-bound by the mid-late 70s (I know we couldn't drive in in a bicentennial parade... not that it would have been appropriate), but friends and I used to play in it. She sold in to a collector around 1979-1980.

I still think about tracking it down someday, buying it, and having it properly restored.

DH


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## Dhaller (Jan 20, 2008)

SG_67 said:


> Lamborghini are too "in your face" and while they may possess excellent performance virtues, I could not bring myself to buy one (assuming I had the means to begin with).
> 
> Were I forced to buy an Italian sports car, I would likely opt for a vintage Ferrari.


Yes, a Lamborghini is bought for anything other than performance - we don't even see them at track days in Atlanta (which is all Porsches).

I actually quite like the Ferrari California (though I agree it has an overly plump rear); it's a very "drivable" car. I see it as an upgrade to a Miata, or a good car for an adventuresome wife.

That said, if I ever find myself about to sign off on a Ferrari, I'm going to dash over to Porsche and buy a 911 Turbo S on the spot.

DH


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## culverwood (Feb 13, 2006)

I love the new DB11 and the Dino and the E Type and the Muira and the BB. I would also add to the list the Maserati GranTurismo a grand tourer with a little space for kids and luggage another swoopy design.

Also if I ever bid for another classic car punch me. I have learnt from experience they are slow, smell and can't stop.


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