# Leather soles and wet



## Spence (Feb 28, 2006)

I've never really worn many leather soled shoes, but have been more and more as I've executed on the shoe advice from the members here and have scored some AE's, Santoni and several pairs of Bally shoes from the various discount locations.

It's my understanding that leather soles don't fair well in wet/snow/icy conditions.

So how much moisture does it really take to harm the shoe?

thanks - spence


----------



## Teacher (Mar 14, 2005)

Not a heck of a lot, I'm afraid. When dry, leather's pretty resilient (though, of course, not nearly as wear-proof as synthetics). As soon as leather gets wet, though, it becomes significantly weaker. I (unscientifically) estimate that wet leather wears about five times faster than dry.


----------



## Palerider (Jun 3, 2006)

Teacher is right (of course). After essentially ruining a pair of leather soled shoes in Florida's unpredicatable downpours several years ago. I have adopted the regimen of using over-shoe protectors in the rain, cedar shoe trees and the recomended one day rest between wearings.

Check out zappos.com or a similar site for shoe overprotectors.


----------



## smdew (Mar 10, 2006)

Palerider said:


> I have adopted the regimen of using over-shoe protectors in the rain.


My Dad called those his "rubbers".


----------



## Palerider (Jun 3, 2006)

smdew, where I come from, "rubbers" has a whole different connotation. :icon_smile_big:


----------



## Spence (Feb 28, 2006)

To be honest I didn't know people still used them!

-spence


----------



## bigCat (Jun 10, 2005)

I don't have a problem with leather soles in the rain. I just give the shoes a proper rest and chance to dry out on their own, without direct heat. I do stay away from snow - but mainly because of salt.


----------



## rip (Jul 13, 2005)

I try to keep a pair of Tingleys close-by. They look only half-bad in the rain and they do keep the shoes dry. However, I've worn shoes in the rain many times, with little ill-effect after properly drying them.


----------



## Spence (Feb 28, 2006)

Seems like a good to have. I did buy one pair of AE with a rubber sole that can work with a suit in a pinch, and have used these in the slop last winter.

Any style of the rubbers that people favor? 

-spence


----------



## eagle2250 (Mar 24, 2006)

Spence said:


> To be honest I didn't know people still used them!
> 
> -spence


I use them to protect the leather soles and uppers of my shoes. Last time I bought a pair the retailer was calling them overshoes. BTW, a leather sole will wear very quickly once it is wet and you do much walking on hard surfaces (concrete, blacktop, etc.).


----------



## kabert (Feb 6, 2004)

Leather can be somewhat slippery when wet. I wouldn't worry much about occasionally getting shoes wet though, as long as there's no road salt and as long as they are dried carefully (not put in front of a fire or placed on top of a hot radiator). For really rainy or slushy days, I have a brown pair of AEs and a black pair of Aldens with rubber toppies attached to the soles. Otherwise, I have a pair of galoshes (sounds better than "rubbers"...) that I got years ago at Brooks Brothers. I assume Brooks still sells them.


----------



## a tailor (May 16, 2005)

air lines advice to flight attendants "do not wear leather sole shoes". galley floors are slippery because of spills.


----------



## euroman (Feb 26, 2006)

I have just bought a pair of Church's (the Chetwynd model in dark brown): they have a full leather sole. I suppose I can easily wear them in the rain if I let them dry properly afterwards. After all, these shoes are made in England where it rains quite a lot... 

Also in the leaflet that was in the same box as the shoes, it said that it was best to not change the leather soles (for example by a shoe repair shop) as this would alter the structure of the shoe and they prefer do any repairs themselves at their premises in Northampton, England (you can send your pair of shoes to England through the official Church's shop, mine is located in Brussels, Belgium).


----------



## Buffalo (Nov 19, 2003)

In sloppy wet weather, why not wear a pair of waterproof clunkers which you then remove at work and put on those nice AEs, Aldens etc leather soled which you carried in you bag or kept at work for just such ocassions.


----------



## Teacher (Mar 14, 2005)

euroman said:


> Also in the leaflet that was in the same box as the shoes, it said that it was best to not change the leather soles (for example by a shoe repair shop) as this would alter the structure of the shoe and they prefer do any repairs themselves at their premises in Northampton, England (you can send your pair of shoes to England through the official Church's shop, mine is located in Brussels, Belgium).


That's marketing. It's perfectly safe to have welted shoes resoled by a competent cobbler, as the welt and insole (which are not deconstructed during a resoling) will maintain the shape of the shoes. I've had a good many pairs resoled by the local cobbler and have never noted a change in fit. When I worked at a local shoe store, we sent all our resolings to him, and there was never a problem reported when I worked there that I'm aware of.

This is much like stapler companies saying "for the best results, use only XX brand staples." Staples is staples!


----------



## Will (Jun 15, 2004)

Teacher said:


> That's marketing. It's perfectly safe to have welted shoes resoled by a competent cobbler, as the welt and insole (which are not deconstructed during a resoling) will maintain the shape of the shoes. I've had a good many pairs resoled by the local cobbler and have never noted a change in fit. When I worked at a local shoe store, we sent all our resolings to him, and there was never a problem reported when I worked there that I'm aware of.
> 
> This is much like stapler companies saying "for the best results, use only XX brand staples." Staples is staples!


The counter argument is that if you intend to have the shoes 're-made' after ten or more years of wear, the maker will refuse if the shoes have been re-soled at a local cobbler. Re-making can add greatly to the life of a pair of dress shoes.


----------



## Teacher (Mar 14, 2005)

Will said:


> The counter argument is that if you intend to have the shoes 're-made' after ten or more years of wear, the maker will refuse if the shoes have been re-soled at a local cobbler. Re-making can add greatly to the life of a pair of dress shoes.


Do the British companies do this? I know AE and Alden -- despite such warnings -- always accept previously resoled shoes unless the cobbler has actually damaged them structurally. (And that, of course, is why I stressed _competent_ cobbler in the above post!:icon_smile: )


----------



## About Town (Nov 17, 2004)

*Time/ Overshoes/Galoshes/ Rubbers etc*

Soles do dry. An unexpected downpour has proven that to me. 
But, if I need to wear good shoes, and especially when traveling, I pack a
pair of Tingley overshoes. There's a model called storm that is a classic
and fits over most anything. The moccassin style looks like a venetian loafer.

They only come in black now, but I have a pair of the moccasins in brown,
also. Once a year, or so, I wash them and then spray on some armorall tire
protector. Keeps their color and gives them a bit of a shine. Best to spray them when you don't need them for a few days so the stuff has time to penetrate. The overshoe habit has dropped off considerably in the under
60 set. But a few days of slop, rain and/or slush and a few more pop up.

Shoe repair stores, the Tingley site and ebay and even places like filene's
basement carry Tingleys although Totes seem more prevalent. Guess, it
doesn't reaaly matter but I've been wearing Tingleys (except for a few years in college) since at least first grade and that is now 45 years. So you could say, I am brand loyal


----------



## Will (Jun 15, 2004)

Teacher said:


> Do the British companies do this? I know AE and Alden -- despite such warnings -- always accept previously resoled shoes unless the cobbler has actually damaged them structurally. (And that, of course, is why I stressed _competent_ cobbler in the above post!:icon_smile: )


EG says they can't work on shoes once someone else has re-soled them, but then they may have the same policy as AE and Alden and do their best so long as the cobbler hasn't done something structural.

They did re-make a pair of Brooks Brothers private label for me when I couldn't learn the maker (turned out to be C&J), and that indicates some flexibility.


----------



## WingtipTom (Sep 6, 2006)

Spence said:


> To be honest I didn't know people still used them!
> 
> -spence


If I have to go out in inclement weather, I always put my Totes "rubbers" over my dress shoes. I have the style that covers the entire shoe, as I spit-shine all of my dress shoes and I don't want any salt or other irritants to ruin the shine. :icon_smile_big: A quick buffing brings back any scuffs that the "rubbers" may have put on the uppers when I put them on or took them off. You can find them, very reasonably priced, at just about *any* store.


----------



## Blackadder (Apr 3, 2004)

I used to think overshoes were some ghastly miserly joke until my first winter in NYC destroyed all of my fine English shoes. I now wear overshoes without a second thought. 

Note that in the immediate post-winter months, the rains are washing away lots of accumulated salt, so be wary of wearing plain leather soles during spring wet weather. I resole certain older shoes with topys and I save them for these rainy days.


----------



## epl0517 (Apr 7, 2005)

Palerider said:


> smdew, where I come from, "rubbers" has a whole different connotation. :icon_smile_big:


It's still protection.


----------



## MarkusH (Dec 10, 2004)

About Town said:


> Shoe repair stores, the Tingley site and ebay and even places like filene's
> basement carry Tingleys although Totes seem more prevalent. Guess, it
> doesn't reaaly matter but I've been wearing Tingleys (except for a few years in college) since at least first grade and that is now 45 years.


I prefer Tingleys to Totes. Some shoe creams seem to dissolve the rubber in Totes, leaving rubber residue on the uppers.

A pair of Tingleys is a must in any gentleman's briefcase.


----------



## MarkusH (Dec 10, 2004)

Teacher said:


> I (unscientifically) estimate that wet leather wears about five times faster than dry.


A little brochure that came with either a pair of AEs or a pair of Church's that I bought many years ago stated that wet soles wear ten times as fast as dry soles.


----------



## random102 (Jul 12, 2005)

Wait, I wore my Greens out in the rain and the soles got wet but I let them dry naturally.

Does this mean my soles now in dry weather will wear 5x faster than normal like another posted said?


----------



## odoreater (Feb 27, 2005)

I find something very un-_sprezzatura_-ish and very fussy about worrying about whether your shoes are going to get ruined in the rain. Wearing shoe-condoms on your shoes in the rain is just ridiculous.


----------



## Teacher (Mar 14, 2005)

odoreater said:


> I find something very un-_sprezzatura_-ish and very fussy about worrying about whether your shoes are going to get ruined in the rain. Wearing shoe-condoms on your shoes in the rain is just ridiculous.


But remember, we aren't all Italian.


----------



## Teacher (Mar 14, 2005)

random102 said:


> Wait, I wore my Greens out in the rain and the soles got wet but I let them dry naturally.
> 
> Does this mean my soles now in dry weather will wear 5x faster than normal like another posted said?


That's not at all what I said. _When wet,_ leather becomes structurally much weaker than dry. That's why cobblers always wet leather before they stretch it over a last.


----------



## Will (Jun 15, 2004)

odoreater said:


> I find something very un-_sprezzatura_-ish and very fussy about worrying about whether your shoes are going to get ruined in the rain. Wearing shoe-condoms on your shoes in the rain is just ridiculous.


I wish I could be so nonchalant about $3,000 shoes, but I can't. If I didn't pay attention I could easily wreck more shoes in a year than I could justify replacing.

Though I'm less concerned about rain than snow.


----------



## kitonbrioni (Sep 30, 2004)

I've made sure that I have rubber sole shoes by most makers. Though I got caught in a suprise rain storm tonight in leather sole shoes.


----------



## yachtie (May 11, 2006)

*Anyone else try dressing the soles?*

To reduce the damage from rain/salt/slop I've used Pecard Leather Dressing on the soles of my (mostly Alden) dress shoes. While it's not a substitute for overshoes, it really does preserve the soles from cracking etc. if gotten wet.

N.B. Don't get any on the uppers as it will darken them considerably!


----------



## J.P. Myhre (Mar 2, 2006)

*Wet soles!*

Gentlemen,
If it is good leather, it does not harm the shoe! Just leave them on the side on top of a newspaper to dry. If it is poor quality leather they will eventually crack. Under weather conditions were salt on the road is required, all leather will get ruined, but under normal conditions good leather is not harmed by getting wet. If there is anything that survives for very long time it is sole leather. A few years back I visited a field near by Hadrians Wall in England where archeologists were digging. They found leather shoes and soles in the ground, surrounded by wet clay, dated back to 200 after Christ. It was amazing how fresh the smell was from the leather after so many hundred years. So, no worries guys, unless you wear poor quality!


----------



## Teacher (Mar 14, 2005)

J.P. Myhre said:


> Gentlemen,
> If it is good leather, it does not harm the shoe! Just leave them on the side on top of a newspaper to dry. If it is poor quality leather they will eventually crack. Under weather conditions were salt on the road is required, all leather will get ruined, but under normal conditions good leather is not harmed by getting wet. If there is anything that survives for very long time it is sole leather. A few years back I visited a field near by Hadrians Wall in England where archeologists were digging. They found leather shoes and soles in the ground, surrounded by wet clay, dated back to 200 after Christ. It was amazing how fresh the smell was from the leather after so many hundred years. So, no worries guys, unless you wear poor quality!


Good points about decomposition, JP. However, the question here is about wet leather abrading away (like on concrete), not whether it rots. Good information, though.


----------



## J.P. Myhre (Mar 2, 2006)

*Abrading*

Sorry about that misunderstanding, but to me there is a huge difference on sole leathers and I would claim almost the same thumbrules as when wet, better leather last longer. Am I still off the track here?


----------



## MarkusH (Dec 10, 2004)

J.P. Myhre said:


> Sorry about that misunderstanding, but to me there is a huge difference on sole leathers and I would claim almost the same thumbrules as when wet, better leather last longer. Am I still off the track here?


That is certainly true. Wet low-quality leather soles wear so fast that you can almost see the sole getting thinner by the minute.


----------



## Bob Loblaw (Mar 9, 2006)

In my pre-AAAC days I purchased some Cole Hahn shoes. On a drizzling spring morning after about a month of wearing them, I pivoted my left foot to enter my vehicle and a hole immediately wore right through the sole. I bought better shoes and this has not been an issue since.


----------



## culverwood (Feb 13, 2006)

JP Myhre gives the same advice as the gentleman at Cleverley. When you shoes are wet dry them on the side to allow the sole to dry more quickly, but also do not put your shoe tree inside while they are still wet. Wait till the next day and put it in after they have had time to dry somewhat.


----------



## MarkusH (Dec 10, 2004)

culverwood said:


> JP Myhre give the same advice as the gentleman at Cleverley. When you shoes are wet dry them on the side to allow the sole to dry more quickly, but also do not put your shoe tree inside while they are still wet. Wait till the next day and put it in after they have had time to dry somewhat.


Good one!


----------



## Brideshead (Jan 11, 2006)

MarkusH said:


> Good one!


I do this and stuff them with a little tissue paper while drying to help retain the shape.

Like kitonbrioni I try not to wear a leather sole if the forecast is rain. Or perhaps stay indoors!


----------



## Teacher (Mar 14, 2005)

J.P. Myhre said:


> Sorry about that misunderstanding, but to me there is a huge difference on sole leathers and I would claim almost the same thumbrules as when wet, better leather last longer. Am I still off the track here?


Yes. This is, as I'm sure you know, because the better sole leathers are from the dense spine area of the hide and are vegetable tanned instead of chrome tanned, making for tougher leather.


----------

