# A visit to Rajawongse



## Newton (Oct 6, 2006)

So I'm visiting Rajawongse in Bangkok next week.

Does anyone have any tips? I will be buying a suit and several shirts.

Do they use MOP buttons?


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## Newton (Oct 6, 2006)

Uh-oh, might have to wing this one alone it seems! 

Anyone?


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## bodominiums (May 14, 2005)

How did the trip to Rajawongse turn out? Any comments? I'm quite curious, as I'm a bangkok resident these days, but not a Rajawongse customer. Should I become one?

--chuck


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## maxnharry (Dec 3, 2004)

Am interested as well. Had them execute a blazer via remote control. Came out nicely.


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## Newton (Oct 6, 2006)

Hey there

Finally some interest

I guess you guys used the search function? Well, on with it...

Firstly, for all persons interested, Rajawongse is not the same level as Savile Row in terms of fabric quality and selection, or style etc but they make a great fitting suit at good prices.

Bodominiums, I would at least suggest you try them out. I have done many, many hours research into the tailoring scene of Bangkok and the story of the wandering soul settling on Rajawongse is definitely the most common. They also come recommended by the US Embassy which has really been a god-send to them. The Embassy is huge (600+) and basically loves them to bits, which means that Rajawongse has a very high proportion of foreign customers to Thais (I didn't see one Thai buyer and I did spend a fair amount of time there.)

They have a steady stream of business, 100% word of mouth (either organic or because newspapers write articles about them). Overall it is quite impressive but I regret insisting that my sleeves were slightly too long on the suit. Otherwise, very good. After the second fitting I pointed out a bunch of little changes I wanted and they came to the party on them which was good.

The suit was a super 180s, and I'm fairly sure it was an Italian fabric. Victor recommended it to me after I asked him for a navy. It is luxurious, I almost feel guilty wearing it.

If you have certain styles you are enamoured with just bring a picture to give them an idea.

The shirts are 100% Egyptian cotton 2x2 80s. You'll have to decide for yourself whether 80s is enough for you, but I am wearing my shirts a lot, attracting a lot of compliments. I'm not an expert in tailoring (yet) but the workmanship just feels second to none.

Fabric choices. I felt like there could be more than there was for the suits, especially if you are departing from the blue/black/charcoal solid/pinstripe model.


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## jpop (Jul 14, 2005)

Prices?


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## LeicaLad (Nov 5, 2006)

I’ve maintained a residence in Bangkok since 1981. Even tho’ I’m stationed along the Afghan-Pak border, my family still resides in Bkk in my absence. 

There’s some fast and loose talk about Thai tailors here. Indeed, there is a wide range of quality. Sukhumvit Road has both quick and dirty tourist fare, and some very fine craftsmen. Rajawongse and even the son, Raja’s, are at the upper end of that tourist trade, although I’m not sure I would agree about their bespoke status. 

My take on the client list is that once you fall into the rice bin (hitch onto the gravy train) of the AmCham (American Chamber of Commerce) and the Embassy, it becomes a self-fulfilling legacy. CoDel (Congressional Delegations) are a dime-a-dozen coming through Bangkok, and all of them want a good tailor. With a decent selection of material, practically any tailored suit will be better than the usual sacks worn by arriving civil servants -- even the famous names. The reasonable costs for excellent suiting and decent tailoring brings them in. That does not necessarily mean that the workmanship is truly fine, even if they look much better than they did when they arrived.

My suggestion for a Bangkok tailor better than that lot would be the original Art’s Tailors (bypass the several outlets) on Thaniya Road (which runs between Silom and Suriwongse). Extensive Japanese patronage has allowed them to raise prices over the years, but the workman ship here is still well above Rajawongse, Pinky’s and that ilk. 

Still, these guys are also great value. Also included in that group would be Milano’s (further up Sukhumvit near Soi 47), and Perry’s (also a long AmCham favorite) on upper Silom Road (just north of Thaniya). There’s another excellent tailor that several of my pals swear by inside the Peninsula Plaza (just south of the Grand Hyatt) opposite the E. Zegna shop (can’t think of his name).

Whereas years ago it was the Hong Kong tailor, today it is Bangkok. Other than the obviously crappy tourist rip joints posing as tailors around the cheap bar zones, good value can be had. 

It is also important to remember that the time you invest in selecting the fabric, in the fitting sessions, and the attention you devote throughout, will lend a great deal to the quality of the final product. With your own care and attention, you can come away very satisfied.

Cheers


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## Newton (Oct 6, 2006)

Rajwongse - Suits US$300 shirts US$25 don't believe anyone else because these prices are fairly new.


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## acidicboy (Feb 17, 2006)

If I may ask, is the quality produced by the Bangkok tailors catching up on the decent-quality Hongkong tailors?


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## watts (Oct 27, 2006)

in actual fact, I think it may have overtaken hongkong. A few shops around Sukhumvit that do do good work. Don't know if they're better or worse then the ones mentioned above (arts, milano etc), but for sure it's good work.


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## bodominiums (May 14, 2005)

I am extremely happy with my standard bangkok tailor, Pinky's, on Sukhumvit road about 2 blocks from Raja's and Rajawongse. Same price range, less hassles and probably more low-key all around. Right now I have a Pinky making me some trousers and a suit. He is also working on a dress and some shirts for my wife. 

There is definitely some crap here but there are also some diamonds in the rough. I was just talking with my wife yesterday that I think I'm done buying clothes off the peg. It's just not worth it living in Bangkok. 

The guy who made my tuxedo is a true master and works with the creme de la creme of Thai society. Foreigners simply don't shop here. His prices are 2x - 3x more than Rajawongse or Pinky's. I'm giving him another special commission soon. His shop is July Tailor on Saladaeng road, a mile or two from Sukhumvit. 

I've found fabric choices to be limited, especially at the top end. If you can bring your own cloth then I think it will truly be the best of both worlds here.


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## jadren0s (Mar 2, 2007)

I just had a suit made at Rajawongse. Overall very impressive: I also chose 180 Italian fabric (I think all their cloth claims to be wool/cashmere), and it's very luxurious; the service is good and the suit fits very well.
One thing I would say if you plan to go there is that their 'house style' as much as there is one (they do ask you about details and fit) is very slightly on the 'Italian' side of things (for example, my suit has a slightly slanted breast pocket, and the lapel is somewhere between Emporio Armani and Savile Row). The finishing is good, with lots of pockets in the right places, and good buttons; unfortunately they didn't do sleeve (fake) buttonholes, just buttons. I'm sure they would allow for such improvements in the future. 
I plan to get another suit soon (either by post or on my next visit to Bangkok), and will be sure to give even more precise instructions. I paid a bit more than 300 dollars, but I did get three piece. Also, I think the cloth chosen may affect price.

Does anybody have experience of Rajawonse online?


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## Gong Tao Jai (Jul 7, 2005)

I find it hard to believe that there is any suit made of Italian super 180s that be profitably sold for for $300 US.


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## bodominiums (May 14, 2005)

I've seen some pretty interesting selvage here in Bangkok. A Vicuna and Mink combination, for example. It's all fiction. 

Thailand's labor costs are low but its fabric costs are nothing special on the low end and are atrocious on the high end. Real high-end cloth - dormeuil, holland & sherry, scabal, etc. - has a luxury import duty in Thailand and costs about 2x more than it does in the USA or the UK. The thai baht has also been appreciating against the dollar, up 20% in the last year or so.

The truly high end places stock very little cloth. It's too pricey to warehouse. If you are buying Super 180's cloth off a bolt longer than 5 meters in Bangkok then it's almost certainly bogus. Both of the higher-end tailors I frequent carry their highend cloths in single suit lengths or more likely just as samples. 

That being said, Bangkok is a great place to have clothing made if you plan ahead. Drop me a line if you will be in town and I can guide you to some of
the better tailors here, at least the ones I've used in the year or so I've lived here.

The bang for the buck here is amazing, providing you do your homework and go in with your eyes open. Spending some time on the ground, at least a week in my mind, will also go a long way to getting the best fit. Quality can sometimes be expedited but it really should not be rushed. 

--chuck


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## David Bresch (Apr 11, 2004)

If your tailor July is 2-3 times the less expensive ones, and they cost $300, then where is the savings over Hong Kong?


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## gordy (Jan 12, 2007)

Gong Tao Jai said:


> I find it hard to believe that there is any suit made of Italian super 180s that be profitably sold for for $300 US.


Exactly. The fabric you get from Rajawongse and the other cheap tailors is horrible and nothing but a waste of money.


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## bodominiums (May 14, 2005)

*July doesn't compete on price...*

I've never bought a suit in Hong Kong. For me, the savings come from the fact that I live here. All of these guys are a $2 taxi ride from my office.

In Bangkok, you can pay $100 for a suit or you can pay $1000. If you pay $1000 at the right place it will be world-class. If you pay $100 anywhere it will be crap. Labor is cheap here but the master tailors don't work cheap anywhere.

How much does the best tailor in HK charge? July is probably the best tailor in Bangkok. Another forum member suggested him to me and I have been extremely impressed with his work. I don't have a Savile Row suit but it's hard for me to see much room for improvement beyond his work. My other tailors freely admit they aren't in his league.

July is a tiny operation who doesn't make clothing for tourists. His suit making process takes 3 fittings over the better part of a month. Upper class Thais who can go to any tailor they want regularly choose him.

I know from the forum that there are great tailors in Hong Kong. There are also great tailors in Bangkok. The top end guys (July, Art's, Perry's) in Bangkok cost more than even the best sukhumvit toursit-focused tailors. They fill a different niche, so that is not unexpected.

--chuck


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## David Bresch (Apr 11, 2004)

Is that price with or without fabric? What is the price without fabric?


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## gordy (Jan 12, 2007)

bodominiums said:


> The top end guys (July, Art's, Perry's) in Bangkok cost more than even the best sukhumvit toursit-focused tailors.


I wouldn't put Perry's in the same class as July and Art's based on my experience. They were just as bad as the typical Sukhumvit tailors, but with more expensive prices. Maybe it was just me, but I'd never give them any business. I think they do a lot of business from US Embassy staff, but so does Raja's and Rajawongse, which just goes to show that the typical US Embassy staff don't know much about quality custom clothes.

A $1000 suit at July includes the fabric - their least expensive fabrics or maybe even one notch up. Their most expensive fabrics will run you well over $1000.


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## bodominiums (May 14, 2005)

It's $1000 with cloth at July. He said that he'd make me a suit for 16,000 thai baht ($450USD) if I brought my own. I am going to take him up on that offer soon.

FYI I've had very good luck at Perry's. I think he gets more tourist business than the other 2 I mentioned but I've been happy with him, especially in his shirtings which IMHO are excellent in fit and in cloth options.



David Bresch said:


> Is that price with or without fabric? What is the price without fabric?


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## David Bresch (Apr 11, 2004)

The above posts are probably amongst the most important on AAAC, for a variety of reasons, and this thread should be sticky-ed in the travel section by the moderator is possible.


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## bodominiums (May 14, 2005)

*Now that it's worthy of being archived*

Since there's talk that this thread is worthy of immortality via sticky, here's some useful contact info for the Bangkok tailors I've noted in the thread:

All 3 of these guys are within a block or two of each other at the BTS Sala Daeng / Silom MRT station on silom road, near the Patpong 
'entertainment' area.

By Taxi, tell the guy to take you to 'Bee Tee Esss, Salla Dang' and you'll be all set. I imagine if you call that these tailors can arrange to pick you up at your hotel.

Art's Tailor Thaniya
62/15-6 Soi Thaniya Silom Road, Bangkok. 
Tel.: +66 2 236 7966

July Tailor
30/6 Saladaeng Road Silom
+66 2 233 0171

Perry Tailor
60/2 Silom Road
+66 2 2339235

I'm not sure if Art's makes shirts but July and Perry do. July shirts are great but fabrics on hand are limited. Perry has a very good selection of shirtings (especially for bangkok) in the showroom . I think Perry's shirts are as good as July. In both cases, make sure to specifically ask for MoP buttons if you want them.

If you go there, please tell me your experience. I'm always interested in a different perspective.


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## schanop (May 17, 2007)

Hi there,

I just came back from my three weeks vacation in Bangkok and Hong Kong. I went to see Mr. Sompop, July tailor in the beginning of my trip, checked out fabric selection and work. Finishing on the outside of finished coats are very nice, button holes, stitching, collars, etc. Unfortunately he didn't have (probably did not want to show) a half made jacket so that I could check the construction. I roughly asked that a jacket is fully canvassed, and the answer was yes, so I didn't bother trying to check further.

Knowing the price is quite significantly cheaper compared with Adamo, Leichard, Sydney, and somewhat cheaper with WW Chan -- whom I later visited and commission a linen shirt -- I commissioned a winter jacket with his fabric and two suits with my own cloths. The first fitting came three days after with coats cut and loosely sewed together and a layer of canvas fully line on the front for which I was happy to see that. However the hand padded lapel was missing, but I thought that it could be because of the rush. Trousers were made up the same way. Some adjustments were made and eight more days for the second fitting, which during this time I was visiting Hong Kong.

At the second fitting, the coats are almost finished, so do the trousers. They all have a very good fit and good finishing. Only minor alterations were made. I asked for a smaller amount of shoulder padding, and right arm sleeve length to be lengthen a little due to my asymmetry. At this stage, I however detected the fusing inside, and the chest piece canvas. This is unfortunate for me despite all the good work for the rest of the coats. It's my own fault that I didn't check more carefully in the fist place. I inquired why the fusing is there and if it is possible to get a coat with no fusing. The answer was no, because it has to be there for some reasons.

I picked up the finished suits and coat on my last day in Bangkok. That's just two weeks and a bit for a quick service. The coat and the suits look lovely, despite my disappointment with the fusing.

Personally, I however will stick with Adamo -- who already made me a beautiful Spring/Autumn sport coat which is really soft both in construction and look -- for the time being since I live in Australia, or perhaps commission something from WW Chan if I have a chance to visit and stay in Hong Kong more frequently.

Ciao, C.


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## spectre (May 12, 2007)

I emailed July Tailor a few weeks ago and they said they could not do fully canvassed jackets, only half-canvassed. If their price is comparable to Chan, which is fully canvassed, I'm not sure why anyone would choose them if they knew their limitations.


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## Svenn (Sep 10, 2009)

Resurrecting this thread, I want to ask: is it possible to get fully-canvassed suits ANYWHERE in Bangkok? 

Also, can anyone summarize for me the benefit of full-canvassing so I can make sure it's really worth finding? From what I recall, it is most useful in creating a divot-less surface on the jacket, making it appear stiffer and fuller, is that correct?


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## Matt S (Jun 15, 2006)

Svenn said:


> Also, can anyone summarize for me the benefit of full-canvassing so I can make sure it's really worth finding? From what I recall, it is most useful in creating a divot-less surface on the jacket, making it appear stiffer and fuller, is that correct?


Canvassed suits will NOT be as stiff as fused suits. Fused suits are stiff because the wool is glued to another piece of fabric that acts as a substitute for the canvas. In a canvassed suit the fabric is more relaxed and can drape better. Canvassed suits usually appear fuller through the chest. A canvassed suit lasts longer than a fused suit


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## Svenn (Sep 10, 2009)

Matt S said:


> Canvassed suits will NOT be as stiff as fused suits. Fused suits are stiff because the wool is glued to another piece of fabric that acts as a substitute for the canvas. In a canvassed suit the fabric is more relaxed and can drape better. Canvassed suits usually appear fuller through the chest. A canvassed suit lasts longer than a fused suit


Thanks Matt. Can I get some of that "fuller" appearance you describe just by choosing a heavier, thicker wool for the fabric of the jacket?


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## CuffDaddy (Feb 26, 2009)

One of the primary advantages to a hand-stitched chest versus a fused chest is that the fusing is likely to break down over time, eventually becoming misshapen... a jacket with a true canvas can always be pressed back into shape. It is also my strong impression that more subtle curves and complex geometry (more closely matching the human body) can be achieved with a canvas chest piece. I suppose this could lead to a perception of "fullness," but it's really just a more 3-dimensional shape. Finally, a fused jacket is always going to have more of a "mind of its own" than a canvassed garment of otherwise equally-good fit... it won't look as completely organic.

That's not to say that a fused garment is necessarily bad, but the best hand-stitched jacket will always be better than the best fused one.


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## Matt S (Jun 15, 2006)

Svenn said:


> Thanks Matt. Can I get some of that "fuller" appearance you describe just by choosing a heavier, thicker wool for the fabric of the jacket?


The canvas is what is needed to shape the coat, not the weight of the wool. Canvas is what give the shape and fullness to a jacket. Fusing just stiffens the fabric.


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## tda003 (Aug 16, 2009)

Actually, this post was before my time. I have in fact used Rajawongse and have had 3 suits with 2 pr. slacks each, blazer & 2 pr. slacks and dj/trousers as well as 1/2 doz. shirts. Raj has made suits for a considerable number of well known folks incl. the senior bush and most of the US Embassy folks and the MSG (Marine Security Guards). The price is excellent and the material almost exclusively imported wool/cashmere, tho' I don't remember the name of the mill. The selection was somewhat limited. I came in under USD 2K - 4 coats, 8 pr trousers, black tie outfit including shirt, tie & cumberbund and several ties. The fit was good. That said, this is NOT canvassed - at least not fully, and is NOT bespoke in the way most commonly considered to be bespoke. By that I mean that the detail work just isn't there. However, if you're going to get clothing made in Bangkok, this si probably as good as it gets.

Just in passing, I would highly recommend a trip to WW Chan, Hong Kong for really good work.


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## Svenn (Sep 10, 2009)

CuffDaddy said:


> One of the primary advantages to a hand-stitched chest versus a fused chest is that the fusing is likely to break down over time, eventually becoming misshapen... a jacket with a true canvas can always be pressed back into shape. It is also my strong impression that more subtle curves and complex geometry (more closely matching the human body) can be achieved with a canvas chest piece. I suppose this could lead to a perception of "fullness," but it's really just a more 3-dimensional shape. Finally, a fused jacket is always going to have more of a "mind of its own" than a canvassed garment of otherwise equally-good fit... it won't look as completely organic.
> 
> That's not to say that a fused garment is necessarily bad, but the best hand-stitched jacket will always be better than the best fused one.


Thanks for the description. I've heard comments similar to this, but cannot visualize what it would look like- could you or anyone post a pic of full canvassed compared along side to half? Or is it something one only perceives when the jacket is moving?

Is this an example of full canvassing?: https://www.mensflair.com/ns/media/inspiration-clot-hor.jpg The jacket on the far right has a very hard, shaped appearance... I really like it; is that full canvassing?


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## CuffDaddy (Feb 26, 2009)

Svenn, it's very difficult to tell from still photos; it's possible to use all sorts of tricks, such as pinning the garment, to create illusions in a manequin photo. But those do look like they have a pronounced roll to the lapels, as opposed to the flatter fold that you typically get with a fused garment. No way to be sure without examining them in person, or asking the maker/merchant (if they are honest and knowledgeable).


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## hellomarty (May 9, 2009)

I'm Thai, from Bangkok. I never had a suit made in Thailand. Even I'm extremely suspicious of what goes on around Sukhumvit and Silom.

I talked to a sales person at Nordstrom awhile back. I was told she had a customer bring a suit from Thailand in for some tailoring. I guess the guy was in a rush, so no time.

The tailor found newspaper inside the suit.

I guess his bargain was too good to be true.

Good luck.


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## Svenn (Sep 10, 2009)

hellomarty said:


> I'm Thai, from Bangkok. I never had a suit made in Thailand. Even I'm extremely suspicious of what goes on around Sukhumvit and Silom.
> 
> I talked to a sales person at Nordstrom awhile back. I was told she had a customer bring a suit from Thailand in for some tailoring. I guess the guy was in a rush, so no time.
> 
> ...


sabaidee baw kohn thai! Obviously most tailors in bkk are scammers... but even July's, which is supposedly "not tourist" and 'sophisticated', lied to a patron saying his jacket was fully canvassed when it wasn't (can't remember if I read that story on AAAC or somewhere else). I'm considering Chan's in Hongkong instead if I really want to get full canvassing....


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## bodominiums (May 14, 2005)

*Narin Couture in Bangkok will do fully canvassed*

Narin Couture, a Chinese tailor on Sukhumvit between soi 8 and 10, will make a fully canvassed suit. He charges an extra 9 or 10k baht (about $300) for full canvassing. He may well be the only tailor in town willing to do so.

www.narin-couture.com

Narin is about 3 blocks up the street from Rajawongse. Just head east on Sukhumvit toward the Nana BTS station, cross soi 8 and then Narin is about 100 meters up the road, directly on Sukhumvit. His shop is all dark wood from the outside. There is presently a man's formal morning coat in the window.

I've now had 2 suits made by him (1 fully canvassed, one not) and both extremely well fitting. I had 3 fittings over about 3 weeks before the suit was ready. I brought my own cloth (Minnis Rangoon) and was very happy with the results. He also has his own very nice cloths from Scabal and Dormeuil.

I'd rank Narin pretty high in the bkk league standings. Definitely up there with July (who made me an absolutely exquisite tuxedo).


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## Svenn (Sep 10, 2009)

bodominiums said:


> Narin Couture, a Chinese tailor on Sukhumvit between soi 8 and 10, will make a fully canvassed suit. He charges an extra 9 or 10k baht (about $300) for full canvassing. He may well be the only tailor in town willing to do so.
> 
> www.narin-couture.com
> 
> ...


Wow thanks, so does Narin speak good English? Could you describe your experience somewhat? I'd mostly like to know if he can copy Savile Row silhouettes (or any suit style I provide in a picture.) So what's the overall total for full canvassing?


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## jadren0s (Mar 2, 2007)

Going back way upthread, and just for public-service reasons, I would like to follow up on my experience with Rajawongse. A couple of years on, the suit fits well and is solidly constructed, but the cloth is showing itself to be far from great (getting a bit shiny after only about three cleans...). I would conclude that Rajawongse makes an ok suit for the price, but for the price.... If good cloth is a concern, and fit not too much of an issue, I expect a better result could be obtained from M&S, or whatever local equivalent. 

I am interested in checking out Narin, however, on a future visit to BKK.


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## Titom (May 12, 2007)

*My opinion about Rajawongse*

Hello everybody,

I was at Rajawongse this summer and would like to share my opnion about this.

Rajawongse located an n° 130 of Sukhumvit Road (just next to the famous soi Nana). 
Prices
- about 250 € for a suit with on pair of trousers
- 20-25 € for a shirt

First time there: 
- Many police and army insignias pinned at the walls showing the gratefulness of all the people who came there. 
- They told me to look around the room for the materials I liked. They did not pay much attention until I told them I had finished. This sounded still normal as it was near the rush hour
- I had to precise everything I wanted. They did not have a full check list to fill as I saw in good tailors I had visited before. For instance, they did not ask me what kind of sewing I wanted at the back of my shirt (side pleats, box pleat, etc&#8230. I thought they were used to make standards shirts as they had a lot of clients, maybe not used to deal with tailors. I had to ask to choose for the material inside of the jacket. 
- I also tried to ask for a different collar for a shirt that I had seen on the internet. I saw them the picture. I've been told that they did not want to make it was not in their patterns.

The fittings
- I arrived on time for the appointment but had to wait for half an hour before they told me I could try everything
- When I put the shirt on myself, they told me to put the cufflinks. I told them that I was surprised and it would definitely not help in order to ensure the sleeves were at the good length. The father smiled at me and told me it was normal to put them. I had then to try the jacket. I asked to modify the length of the sleeves of the jacket. The father smiled at me again saying that I had strange ideas and that he had made thousand of jackets before he knew better than me. The tone and the arrogance really annoyed me. When they told me I could go back to my regular clothes, we did not have any word about the shirts and he did not even had a look at the size of the shoulders!
- When I came back on the second time, as I asked them to enlarge the cuffs, it was funny to see that the cufflinks did not retain the sleeves on my wrists anymore and the taylor had to admit that they were too long&#8230;
Finally
- The overall is average. The cotton quality of the shirts doesn't seem really good to me. 
- I have a problem with all my shirt as it make some creases for something they did not really want to fix when I told them about my problem (in comparison, WW Chan in Hong Kong fixed it without I had to ask about anything as they detected it at first sight&#8230
- as a result, I feel pretty unhappy as they did not make the communication easy as I really felt they were looking down at me when I wanted something. I had the feeling that I needed to fight in order to obtain something and I did not dare ask too many things. 
I would not really recommend this place and I think that you could find some good tailors in Bangkok for that price.


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