# Ardbeg, nectar of the gods, or old ashtray water?



## MichaelS (Nov 14, 2005)

You vote!

An uncontroversial topic, I hope! I love the stuff, especially the 10 yr old cask strength I got from the Scotch Malt Whiskey Society, sadly almost gone now and no longer available (they sold all of the bottles). The 17 yr old was pretty good too.



MichaelS


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

As much as it pains me to admit this, I can offer no legit input on this. I have tried and tried to like good Scotch, but the best I can do is a Johnny Walker Black or better. I have yet to taste a single malt I can drink. I keep hoping to find one, as this deficiency in my character pains me to no end. I guess that's what comes of being born in the Colonies and raised in Canadian rye 

Warmest regards


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## shoefetish (Jan 15, 2006)

My first Ardbeg was a bottle of the pre1981 stock. Very peaty like Laphroaig (which Ardbeg also runs). Was new to malts then and used to listen to the "experts". Malt lovers only drink the peaty stuff, puts hair on your chest, so on and so forth.

Along came the revival of the distillery and the new 10 yr old at 46% is less peaty. Guess what - I prefer the new bottling. Less peat means the other flavours have a fairer playing field and a better taste spectrum. 

Ardbeg is a very good whisky, definitely no ashtray water, but there are other equally good malts. As an example a very good one is the Connemara Irish malt. Beautiful honeyed flavours. Opened one on Saturday with a friend to watch the World Cup matches with. Ended up finishing the bottle.

Guess mine would be a spoilt vote - love the new Ardbeg but won't place it over other worthy brands.


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## MichaelS (Nov 14, 2005)

shoefetish said:


> My first Ardbeg was a bottle of the pre1981 stock. Very peaty like Laphroaig (which Ardbeg also runs). Was new to malts then and used to listen to the "experts". Malt lovers only drink the peaty stuff, puts hair on your chest, so on and so forth.
> 
> Along came the revival of the distillery and the new 10 yr old at 46% is less peaty. Guess what - I prefer the new bottling. Less peat means the other flavours have a fairer playing field and a better taste spectrum.
> 
> ...


I Love the Connemara too. You should try the Cask Strength Connemara, it has a really incredible full flavor, more leaty and less smokey (in my opinion) than either Ardbeg or Laphroaig (which I also really like).

One note, Laphroaig is owned by Penrod-Ricard (through Allied Domecq and Fortune Brands, in the same family as Jameson, Makers Mark, and The Glenlivit among others.) Ardbeg is owned by Glenmorangie which was bought in 2005 (?) by the LVMH Group makers of Dom Pérignon, Louis Vuitton and other luxury goods. Diego is still the owner of the most scotch distileries, but a lot are now onwed by none Scottish companies. interesting to watch.

MichaelS


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## Tyto (Sep 22, 2004)

Nectar of the gods. I really liked Ardbeg's pre-1981 malts, and I don't feel, as Shoefetish does, that the increased peat (and it was something) necessarily overpowers the other flavors. But then, I really--really-like peat, so I might be more inclined to overlook the other flavors.


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## jcusey (Apr 19, 2003)

shoefetish said:


> My first Ardbeg was a bottle of the pre1981 stock. Very peaty like Laphroaig (which Ardbeg also runs). Was new to malts then and used to listen to the "experts". Malt lovers only drink the peaty stuff, puts hair on your chest, so on and so forth.


If I may derail the topic a bit, you see this sort of attitude frequently. If it isn't single malt, it's crap. If it isn't peaty, it's crap. If it isn't at least 18 years old, it's crap. And so on and so on. It's all very silly. The point of whisky connoisseurship is, or ought to be, the enjoyment of the drink, not an attempt to outman and outsnob your companions.

Anyway, I've never had the pleasure of trying any pre-'81 Ardbeg, but I do like the recent stuff. I can't say that it's my favorite Islay (I like Caol Ila and Laphroaig better), but I do enjoy it from time to time. But I like plenty of whiskies that aren't nearly so peaty, too.


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## shoefetish (Jan 15, 2006)

jcusey said:


> If I may derail the topic a bit, you see this sort of attitude frequently. If it isn't single malt, it's crap. If it isn't peaty, it's crap. If it isn't at least 18 years old, it's crap. And so on and so on. It's all very silly. The point of whisky connoisseurship is, or ought to be, the enjoyment of the drink, not an attempt to outman and outsnob your companions.


If I may expand on this, the present single malt craze is similar to the cigar situation of the 90s. If you smoke a Churchill then it's a Dbl Corona for me. And all the while the coronas and petite coronas were languishing with decade old box ages and discounted prices. Now the craze has died but the big cigars of that era are not moving quickly because the long time smokers are avoiding them. Some of the worst rolled and terrible tobacco out there (I am speaking of Cuban cigars).

Today at most Asian DFS the 18 and above year old malts are, more often than not, out of stock - while there is an abundance of the 10 and 12 yrs olds (also holds true for the more popular blends). Frankly there is no time llike the present to stock up on the younger whiskies. And when the smoke has settled we can pick up the older bottles for lower prices
Also bottlers are having a field day at the expense of the DFS consumer. More and more malts are bottled at 70cl instead of the traditional 1 liter but prices are getting higher.

What with the whisky snobs infilterating the ranks and excalating prices its a sad day indeed for the true whisky lover. But with the help of John Barleycorn we will prevail


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## shoefetish (Jan 15, 2006)

MichaelS said:


> I Love the Connemara too. You should try the Cask Strength Connemara, it has a really incredible full flavor, more leaty and less smokey (in my opinion) than either Ardbeg or Laphroaig (which I also really like).


Thanks for the tip Michael. I am trying to get my hands on the Cask Strength as well as the 12 yrs old. Rather hard in Singapore though unless through DFS.

As an aside has anyone tried the Johnnie Walker Excelsior? 
Someone is trying to sell me a bottle but I am on 2 minds as the price is outrageous.
Don't mean to hijack your thread Michael but didn't want to start a new thread just for this. Many thanks.


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## JBZ (Mar 28, 2005)

jcusey said:


> If I may derail the topic a bit, you see this sort of attitude frequently. If it isn't single malt, it's crap. If it isn't peaty, it's crap. If it isn't at least 18 years old, it's crap. And so on and so on. It's all very silly. The point of whisky connoisseurship is, or ought to be, the enjoyment of the drink, not an attempt to outman and outsnob your companions.


Hear, hear!


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## MichaelS (Nov 14, 2005)

jcusey said:


> If I may derail the topic a bit, you see this sort of attitude frequently. If it isn't single malt, it's crap. If it isn't peaty, it's crap. If it isn't at least 18 years old, it's crap. And so on and so on. It's all very silly. The point of whisky connoisseurship is, or ought to be, the enjoyment of the drink, not an attempt to outman and outsnob your companions.
> 
> Anyway, I've never had the pleasure of trying any pre-'81 Ardbeg, but I do like the recent stuff. I can't say that it's my favorite Islay (I like Caol Ila and Laphroaig better), but I do enjoy it from time to time. But I like plenty of whiskies that aren't nearly so peaty, too.


I agree completely, but that said, what I love about single malts is the great variety. This is especially true if you get the single cask scotches available sometimes. The difference from one cask to another of the same whisky can be fascinating. I do find blends good, but without the pure variety of the single malts. For blends I more like Irish whiskey, both Jameson 12 yr old and Middleton Very Rare are good, with the 12 yr Jameson old best for my tastes. (The 18 yr old Jameson is good but as with the Middleton Very Rare, almost too smooth).

I also agree with the issue that age does not necessarily make whiskey good. Old scotch is not necessarily good scotch. Some, like Talisker are (for my tastes) best at 10 years. For some others however, age really does make a difference. There is no comparing the Glenlivet 18 or 21 to the Glenlivet 12 or no age specified bottle. The older have a much better, fuller and developed taste. If you read published reviews of scotch from such people a Michael Jackson or Jim Murray, it is interesting to see how the score for many whiskies actually goes down for the really old bottles.

A couple of really good and relatively cheap scotches include Glenfarclas 12 yr old and Laphroaig 10 yr old. Both are good, one peated and one more sherried. (Irish whiskies such as Redbreast are also really great and under priced, but don't tell anyone, we don't want the price to go up.

Michael


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## Tyto (Sep 22, 2004)

JCusey/Howard Johnson is right. And at the risk of sounding defensive, I prefer highly peated malts not out of snobbery, but because I just really like the punch, particularly after heavy meals. I also enjoy sweeter varieties, but find that if I want sweetness, I tend to go with Bourbon.

On the age statement, Mr. Cusey is also right. So many nice malts are aged for fewer than 15-20 years, and I think that within the 10- to 12-year range is where the real values are found, particularly when the older stuff commands such a ridiculous premium for so little gain--or, in some cases, for a loss. The classic example of this, I think, is Johnny Walker Blue. It's not a single malt, and it has no age statement (the youngest scotch in it is something like 6 years), but it is a classic example of what happens when the character is aged out of the scotch, but the cost of aging the primary component of the blend must be recouped.

Lastly, as Mr. Cusey noted, many "connossieurs" do overlook blends, generally for reasons of snobbery. Johnny Walker Black and Haig and Haig's Pinch may be the best values in scotch: each is well under $30 and delivers a consistent and very enjoyable experience. And I think Johnny Walker Gold is easily competitive with single malts in the $50 range. A good--and consistent--blend is at least as much a work of art and a tribute
to the whiskeymaking craft as its single-malt brethren.


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## BPH (Mar 19, 2007)

I love Ardbeg, though my dear wife complains that I smell like I've been chewing a camp fire when I have had a dram or two.


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## A Questionable Gentleman (Jun 16, 2006)

Talisker has long been my favorite. Hard to say why, it just does it for me. Alas, the thrice-cursed PA state store system refuses to carry it, though they offer every one of United Distillers' other major bottlings. Fortunately, I get to Maryland frequently.


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

This was an old thread that re-appeared! I see at the time, I was still in my state of funk over not enjoying any single malts. Well, that is over, I finally found a few I like. In fact, I finally found a whole area I tend to like; Speyside. No, save the shovel fulls of peat for another camper, no iodine to sterilize my innards, give me the lighter, sweeter Speyside please. I first found Balvennie 12 y/o double cask aged. I then moved onto the 21 y/o port wood aged, about $130 here in Arizona. Then a 12 y/o Macallan. Lastly, Craiggenmore Distillery Edition for about $60.

You know what? For me, the $60 Craiggenmore is far better than the $130 Balvennie. Cost and years in oak =! better whisky per se.


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## yachtie (May 11, 2006)

Laphroaig is still my "go to" scotch. It's nice because I don't have to share it with my friends (wimps!) Haven't tried Ardbeg but I'd like a cask strength Laphroaig so I'd probably like this too. and no, my wife doesn't understand how I can drink this stuff either.


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## A Questionable Gentleman (Jun 16, 2006)

Wayfarer said:


> . No, save the shovel fulls of peat for another camper, no iodine to sterilize my innards, give me the lighter, sweeter Speyside please.


You might try Dalmore, Wayfarer. It's a very mellow malt and, at least in PA, is rather a bargain at just under $30 a bottle.


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## Blackadder (Apr 3, 2004)

On the single malt side, my favourite part of Scotland is Islay, particularly the Lagavulin 16 and the Laphroiag 15 and 21. The Laph 15 is good value. Talisker and Oban, though quite different, make a nice change of pace.

I've also rediscovered blends through Johnnie Walker Gold Label, which might very well be my favourite scotch at present.


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

AQG, thanks for the tip on Dalmore. I am headed to my scotch and stogie bar at 3 pm today (perfect way to spend Friday afternoon!) and will try a Dalmore if they have it on the menu.

Blackadder, I had an Oban at the Burns' Dinner back in January. It was drinkable, although I was washing down a faux haggis patte with it


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## A Questionable Gentleman (Jun 16, 2006)

Wayfarer,

Dalmore makes a bottling called Cigar Malt. It's alright, but not as mellow as the standard bottling. Steer that way if given the choice. Enjoy your afternoon!


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

A Questionable Gentleman said:


> Wayfarer,
> 
> Dalmore makes a bottling called Cigar Malt. It's alright, but not as mellow as the standard bottling. Steer that way if given the choice. Enjoy your afternoon!


AQG,

Just got in. No Dalmore. Tried a Johnny Walker Blue though. Very tasty but just lacked a certain sort of character one gets in a single malt IMO.


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## A Questionable Gentleman (Jun 16, 2006)

One of the primary malts blended in Johnny Walker is my favorite, Talisker. Skip the blend and go full bore with the real thing!


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## donk93953 (Feb 8, 2007)

Ahhhh, the Ardberg....wonderful stuff. Of course, I also like Laphroiag. In the same breath, I'm a fan of the Glenmorangie Port & Sherry wood casks.
My favorite scotch.....?...easy, Sheep Dip...easy to drink, lovely flavors, definitely the other end of the scale from Laphroig...The problem I have is living in Mexico, I have to ask amigos to bring it in when they visit, or when I make my trips to Gringolandia and the UK. Heck, Ok I'll admit it. Yes, Yes, I like scotch. My dos centavos...


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## Copper (Mar 25, 2007)

Ardbeg is a beautiful whisky indeed; I like it best though as a solitary dram. Talisker and Laphroaig are both wonderfully paired with a dark English Tobacco in my pipe - Lagavulin too, come to think of it. I like pairing sweeter whiskies with lighter pipe blend like a Virginia or a mild aromatic - say Aberlour with Erinmore Flake, or Glenmorangie Port wood with a Dunhill Night Cap. 

Right now I am enjoying a Finlaggan Old Reserve, which is a remarkably good value in single malt.


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