# Best Quality Tie Brands



## JohnnySuits

Looking to build a collection of nice, high end ties, and would love some options here. I hear Kiton is up there. Any other brands to build around? I prefer a nice, thick, heavy tie.


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## UPennHaberdasher

I have yet to find nicer ties than Carlo Franco's seven folds. I haven't tried too many seven folds, but they are beautiful and tie wonderfully.


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## jjgold

Itallo Ferretti, Dolcepunta 7fold and 11fold, Borrelli 7fold


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## Roger

Here are my nominations for (a) Tier 1 ties (great ties): Kiton, Borrelli, Attolini, Isaia, Bulgari, Charvet, Marinella, Hermes, Carlo Franco, Sam Hober. Depending on choice of construction, the Kiton, Borrelli, Attolini, Isaia, Bulgari, Carlo Franco, and Sam Hober ties (particularly the lined sevenfolds) are hefty and tie a big knot. I've seen very, very few sevenfold Marinellas and none from Charvet and Hermes. These latter are of lighter construction, more delicate, but made of gorgeous silk and are of the highest quality. Two other makers, Barba and Barbera make ties that are very likely in this class, but I haven't seen them.

One step down, my nominations for (b) Tier 2 ties (very good ties): Brioni, Stefano Ricci, Nicky of Milan, Drake (their 50-oz. model is hefty), Holliday & Brown, Turnbull & Asser, Massimo Bizzocchi, Breuer, Robert Talbott (the sevenfolds and Best of Class lines), Four in Hand, Zegna (but not the Villa Bolgheri line), Canali. Faberge and Ferragamo may be in this class, I'm not sure.

Then dropping to (c) Tier 3 ties (decent to good ties, some at very reasonable prices): Altea, Pucci, Dolce & Gabbana (I have one which is probably more properly of Tier 2 quality), Zegna Villa Bolgheri line, Versace and Armani (both cheap but expensive, if you know what I mean), Hugo Boss, Faconnable, a trio of British ties: Duchamp, Ted Baker, and Paul Smith (all somewhat gaudy), Ralph Lauren Purple Label (purportedly made by Altea), Robert Talbott lower lines like the Chelsea line, Brooks Brothers, Jhane Barnes.

After that, there are ties branded by Hickey-Freeman, RL Polo, Hart, Schaffer & Marx, Ike Behar, Dormeuil, Yves St. Laurent, Christian Dior (the latter two undoubtedly on license), and numerous house brands for retailers like Nordstrom, Harry Rosen, Holt Renfrew (the last two in Canada)--really too many to mention. I have very little acquaintance with any of these, except for the Rosen, Holt-Renfrew, and Dormeuil but wouldn't see these as generally really good ties, although you may find some exceptions.

Just my opinions on the subject. Others will rank-order these brands differently, I'm sure. And I've omitted many brands--either because I forgot them or have no experience with them--that others can comment on. :icon_smile:

_Edit:_ Forgot about Brooks Brothers--nice (particularly their repps) and reasonably-priced. Put in Tier 3, but maybe really 2.5.


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## Brian13

where would you place the cashmere/silk ties of pal zileri gruppo that i got from EL72? 
they to my untrained eye and touch are swell.
what level would you place them?


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## JohnnySuits

Are there any good sites online that sell all or a variety of these high end tie brands, preferably at a discount?


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## tmack3

Drakes is one of my favorites and the price is reasonable. They have great patterns. Kiton ties are quality, but i think are absurdly overpriced. I also find them boring. Isaia ties are priced less obnoxiously than Kiton and have more interersting patterns. I rarely purchase any of these ties at full retail because the vast majority of what you see today can be had at substantial discounts in a few months when places like barneys/saks/n-m have their end of the season sales.

Sam Hober/Mulberrywood makes a great tie and the process of selecting your own pattern and working with David Hober is fun. The quality of his silks is second to none and the pricing is very fair. He has a nice selection of patterns (although not as interesting as drakes). I have two Carlo Franco ties and they are great, but prefer Hober's. 

The rest of the ties Roger listed are all quality brands. Therefore, your choice will be based on your preference for pattern, width and length. It's difficult to say that the style of a Zegna tie to is superior/inferior to that of Drakes because the styles tend to be different. Same with Armani vs Paul Smith.


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## [email protected]

throw in another plug for Chuck and his Carlo Francos (if you can find him - seems to have vanished).

I love my Nicky's, which from time to time can be had at great prices from Lance


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## smr

Roger said:


> Here are my nominations for (a) Tier 1 ties (great ties): Kiton, Borrelli, Attolini, Isaia, Bulgari, Charvet, Marinella, Hermes, Carlo Franco, Sam Hober. Depending on choice of construction, the Kiton, Borrelli, Attolini, Isaia, Bulgari, Carlo Franco, and Sam Hober ties (particularly the lined sevenfolds) are hefty and tie a big knot. I've seen very, very few sevenfold Marinellas and none from Charvet and Hermes. These latter are of lighter construction, more delicate, but made of gorgeous silk and of the highest quality. Two other makers, Barba and Barbera make ties that are very likely in this class, but I haven't seen them.
> 
> One step down, my nominations for (b) Tier 2 ties (very good ties): Brioni, Stefano Ricci, Nicky of Milan, Drake (their 50-oz. model is hefty), Holliday & Brown, Turnbull & Asser, Massimo Bizzocchi, Breuer, Robert Talbott (the sevenfolds and Best of Class lines), Four in Hand, Zegna (but not the Villa Bolgheri line), Canali. Faberge and Ferragamo may be in this class, I'm not sure.
> 
> Then dropping to (c) Tier 3 ties (decent to good ties): Altea, Pucci, Dolce & Gabbana (I have one which is probably more properly of Tier 2 quality), Zegna Villa Bolgheri line, Versace and Armani (both cheap but expensive, if you know what I mean), Hugo Boss, Faconnable, a series of British ties: Duchamp, Ted Baker, and Paul Smith (all somewhat gaudy), Ralph Lauren Purple Label (purportedly made by Altea), Robert Talbott lower lines like the Chelsea line.
> 
> After that, there are ties branded by Hickey-Freeman, RL Polo, Hart, Shaffer & Marx, Ike Behar, Dormeuil, Yves St. Laurent, Christian Dior (the latter two undoubtedly on license), and numerous house brands for retailers like Nordstrom, Harry Rosen, Holt Renfrew (the last two in Canada)--too many to mention. I have very little acquaintance with any of these, except for the Rosen, Holt-Renfrew, and Dormeuil but wouldn't see these as generally good ties, although you may find some exceptions.
> 
> Just my opinions on the subject. Others will rank-order these brands differently, I'm sure. :icon_smile:


Great list, Roger! As you suggested, I might move a few between categories, (for example, I love Turnbull and Asser ties, and Stefano Ricci and Massimo Bizzocchi make some amazing ties, and for me, I think I'd bump up RLPL, Altea, and perhaps Facconable--wouldn't surpise me if Altea made for RLPL), but nice job!

I also like many of the Luciano Barbera ties I've had for a few years, house brand Bergdoff Goodman Italian-made ties, and $69 Brooks Brothers ties (with the self-fabric keeper--good value, too, if you like very conservative ties) are very good (nice heft). I'd probably put these in the "very good" category.


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## Vintage Gent

Roger's list is wonderfully comprehensive, and an excellent place to start. A few observations, based only on my experience.

(1) Borrelli ties are overrated. I have two, and the others I've seen only confirm my observation.

(2) The Ike Behar ties I've seen recently have impressed me; they're at least the equal of the Altea ties I own, if not a little nicer. On the four tier list, I'd probably bump them up a notch.

(3) Sam Hober makes a heck of a tie, at an outstanding price.


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## [email protected]

hmm, i may have to toss some money Hober's way one of these days. 

Keep hearing good things about them, and David is a helluva nice guy.


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## JohnnySuits

Just visited the Hober site and their non custom ties, priced around $75, seem to be 3 fold ties. Is it worth the additional expense of going 7 fold?


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## jcusey

JohnnySuits said:


> Just visited the Hober site and their non custom ties, priced around $75, seem to be 3 fold ties. Is it worth the additional expense of going 7 fold?


Well, it depends on the fabric and how you like your ties to tie. David can do a variety of constructions, not just 3-fold and 7-fold, depending on the client's preferences and requirements.

For myself, although I like the idea of a 7-fold tie, I find that a lined tie usually ties and drapes better than a 7-fold.


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## JLibourel

I have only one Kiton tie, but I fail to see what the fuss is about, except for the name "Kiton." I would not rate it ahead of the Charvet, Canali, Battistoni, Brioni or Bizzochi ties I own (to name some of my favorites in approximate order of preference).


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## Spence

Vintage Gent said:


> The Ike Behar ties I've seen recently have impressed me; they're at least the equal of the Altea ties I own, if not a little nicer. On the four tier list, I'd probably bump them up a notch.


I agree, especially the self tipped Behar ties. Not only do they tie a nice knot the patterns are very interesting as well. That they can be had for cheap doesn't hurt much either...

-specne


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## Roger

jcusey said:


> Well, it depends on the fabric and how you like your ties to tie. David can do a variety of constructions, not just 3-fold and 7-fold, depending on the client's preferences and requirements.
> 
> For myself, although I like the idea of a 7-fold tie, I find that a lined tie usually ties and drapes better than a 7-fold.


But, there is, of course, the lined version of a 7-fold. Many of what the Italians call a 7-fold are, rather, lined 4-folds (maybe like Chuck's "double fourfold")--information I obtained from Jonathan Fischer of FIHTies. David will make you a 4, 5, 6, or 7-fold that is either unlined or lined, so I think you can have your cake and eat it too.


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## Rollo Tomasi

JLibourel said:


> I have only one Kiton tie, but I fail to see what the fuss is about, except for the name "Kiton." I would not rate it ahead of the Charvet, Canali, Battistoni, Brioni or Bizzochi ties I own (to name some of my favorites in approximate order of preference).


I would somewhat agree with this observation. I have 3 Kiton ties and I purchased them more for their pattern and brand. But the width is slightly narrower than I'd like and the fabric does not seem as luxurious as a Stefano Ricci or even Charvet. My favorite ties in order are Brioni, Stefano Ricci, and Charvet.


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## Financier

Which of these makers put out an extra long tie? I'm well over 6 foot, and the standard 57" tie just doesn't work. Talbott is the only one I find with any regularity.


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## Brian13

JLibourel said:


> I have only one Kiton tie, but I fail to see what the fuss is about, except for the name "Kiton." I would not rate it ahead of the Charvet, Canali, Battistoni, Brioni or Bizzochi ties I own (to name some of my favorites in approximate order of preference).


i see your point as well, but there are a few kitons that are so lush and so beautiful (almost to the point of garishness) like this recent one sold on ebay 7 fold:


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## Roger

JLibourel said:


> I have only one Kiton tie, but I fail to see what the fuss is about, except for the name "Kiton." I would not rate it ahead of the Charvet, Canali, Battistoni, Brioni or Bizzochi ties I own (to name some of my favorites in approximate order of preference).


I think that one thing people really like about Kiton ties is that--in addition to being exquisitely-made of phenomenally beautiful silk, and featuring lovely patterns--they have a heftiness (although falling a little short of a Carlo Franco in this respect) that quite surpasses that of Charvet, Canali, Brioni, and Bizzocchi ties. I don't know about your Kiton tie, but those I have are quite thick and hefty, which allows them to drape well and produce a robust knot.


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## JohnnySuits

I know most of you guys on here HATE paying full retail and most of these good ties go for $150 and up at full retail ($200+ on some brands like Kiton). Most of them, including Kiton, can be had at a discount (just surfing virtualclothesehorse.com and saw a bunch of Kitons, etc). Any recomendations on the MOST I should really be paying for a GREAT tie like these?

Any other great sites carrying brand name ties below retail?


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## jcusey

Financier said:


> Which of these makers put out an extra long tie? I'm well over 6 foot, and the standard 57" tie just doesn't work. Talbott is the only one I find with any regularity.


Jonathan Fischer at Four In Hand has a number of ties in , and David Hober at Sam Hober will make you ties in whatever length you want.


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## Roger

JohnnySuits said:


> Are there any good sites online that sell all or a variety of these high end tie brands, preferably at a discount?


Definitely. Let me list some eBay sellers (and the name I'm giving is their eBay ID, not necessarily their store name) that seem to be good sources (about half of which I've purchased from), with fairly large inventories of high-end ties, good prices, and an eBay positive-feedback rating of at least 99%: *Europeansilkcompany* (lots of great ties, with probably the best supply of Charvet on eBay--all for BIN prices of around $80), *Fauzia1*, *Bigheadmonkeyfashions*, *Jacobben*, *Jordenboom*, *Andyinternational* (lots of Hermes, which seems to be his speciality), *Honest*goods* (great source for Brioni in general), *Cranko*, *Wtang*, *Dolceuomo*. There's also a store in Naples (eBay ID:Napoli_store; positive-feedback 98.8%) with access to a lot of Borrelli ties and shirts. I've purchased two Borrelli ties from him, but they haven't arrived yet, so I can't offer an evaluation.

There are other very good sources too. Ian Daniels at World's Finest (and Shop the Finest) has tons of great ties, and his prices are very good. Many forumers have had good experiences buying from Ian. Another great source for very reasonably-priced ties is our own Jonathan Fischer at FIHTies. Jonathan has really very nice ties in the $35 to $50 range, and some sevenfolds for around $90. Anyone who has ever bought from Jonathan can attest to his wonderful customer service. Both David Hober (Sam Hober ties, where you can have a hand in designing your tie) and Chuck Franke (Carlo Franco ties) supply truly great ties, but you may pay slightly more (perhaps something on the order of $120 for a sevenfold) than you would on auction on eBay with discounted prices.

Incidentally, there has been some discussion over the last little while (mainly on Style Forum, I think) about some sellers of high-end ties (particularly Brioni) in the middle East. Although I have not seen strong evidence one way or the other, there is some feeling that the ties may be fakes. Perhaps we'll get more about this later in this thread.

Finally, it is worth noting that purchasing something as dependent on color and sheen as ties sight-unseen, so to speak (except for pictures, which can vary greatly in quality), has some risks. Many eBay sellers do provide very good pictures, but with monitors differing in their ability to pick up nuances in color and design, even good pictures can't really tell you exactly what to expect. I've had good success in asking sellers for more pictures (the European Silk Company, for one, has done this) or for a more detailed description, in words, of the colors and design. Still, even with your best efforts, it's just not the same as seeing the tie in the flesh.

_Edit:_ As for the question about reasonable online prices for top-of-the-line ties, I would say that most, if not all, can be had for something south of $100 (plus shipping). As I mentioned above, Charvet is regularly available at $80. I've purchased Kiton for well under $100. Marinella, since there are far fewer of them out there, tend to go a little higher. I seem to recall that Ian has the very best in ties for under $100. For Tier 2 ties (by my little classification scheme earlier), expect to pay something on the order of $40 - $60. Occasionally, you might encounter the most beautiful tie you've ever seen--a true masterpiece of design, color, etc. (I just saw a sevenfold Marinella that was just fabulous, for example, starting at $150.) These will go for more. On eBay, of course, the ties are being auctioned, which means that you might wind up with a fabulous Kiton for $60!

Oh, one last thing: I wouldn't buy a used tie. Even though the seller will describe it with encouraging words such as "like new," "mint," or, my favorite, "_gently_-used," the tie may have had gravy spilled on it, be slightly threadbare, or, more likely, have some snags or pulls. Unless you actually have the tie in your hands so that you can check for these defects, I'd insist on brand new.

Good luck! :icon_smile:


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## JohnnySuits

Roger, you are amazing. Your willingness to share information (and you have vast amounts of information) is what makes these forums wonderful, for someone just getting into higher end fashion, such as myself, and, frankly, I can't thank you enough.

With your permission, I would like to copy and paste your FIRST post and your LAST post, into another thread that I started, as a way of building a nice list of sellers of high end ties, online.

I would love your permission to do this.


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## rip

[email protected] said:


> throw in another plug for Chuck and his Carlo Francos (if you can find him - seems to have vanished).


Bunches of his ties on Ebay right now.


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## Roger

JohnnySuits said:


> I would love your permission to do this.


Certainly, go ahead. You're more than welcome. :icon_smile:


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## Sam Hober

JohnnySuits said:


> Just visited the Hober site and their non custom ties, priced around $75, seem to be 3 fold ties. Is it worth the additional expense of going 7 fold?


Johnny,

I think that I need to improve my website so that it will be clearer, all our ties are 100% custom made and take about a month after ordering to be finished - unless you have a special event like a wedding to attend.

Our $75 English woven silk ties will be made very slowly by hand with many small details and services that you will never get in a comparably priced tie. Not even on eBay.

We will make the tie in the length, width and shape that you request. If you would like a swatch I will be happy to cut swatches for you.

Once you have a pattern that you like we will keep it on file for you.

I am neutral on constructions as we make them all. So here are my thoughts:

A standard three-fold construction works very well. With a custom made / bespoke tie you can adjust the length, width, shape and interlining.

With that said there is something very interesting and elegant about a tie with complex folds.

Unlined seven-folds are for those who love them, I suspect that many of those gentlemen also love mechanical watches and a have a love for elegance and complexity.

A lined six-fold (called seven-folds in error at times) is perhaps the best of both worlds. as you have the elegance and complexity of a multi-fold tie with the draping of a lined tie.

The best ties use pure wool with an occasional extra layer of cotton. when you buy a luxury tie you should be able to ask the seller or maker exactly what type of interlining they are using. As well as exactly how many folds the tie has. If they can't tell you then you should wonder....

So in the end I would not advise you to buy a seven-fold if you are price sensitive unless you have always wanted one. Then buy one as an experiment.

But first as always get your fit right first: length, width etc..


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## EL72

Roger said:


> Oh, one last thing: I wouldn't buy a used tie. Even though the seller will describe it with encouraging words such as "like new," "mint," or, my favorite, "_gently_-used," the tie may have had gravy spilled on it, be slightly threadbare, or, more likely, have some snags or pulls. Unless you actually have the tie in your hands so that you can check for these defects, I'd insist on brand new.
> 
> Good luck! :icon_smile:


With some minor quibbles, I agree with most of your classification Roger. I would add however that there can be quite a bit of variance on some dimensions within one brand's ties, especially with respect to the heft of the silk used, such that there is often more variance within than between brands in the top tier category (wanna run the model Professor? :icon_smile: ). I have some Brionis with better silks than many Borrellis. Some Isaias are beautiful, others are forgettable. Like most things, past a certain level of quality, one's personal taste and the silks used for that particular tie diminish your ability to generalize further. I prefer Brioni and Nicky to most Kitons and Charvets.

I disagree with your last point too. In addition to cufflinks, ties are probably the only thing I buy used on eBay and my experience has been overwhelmingly positive. Given that a tie is not a garment per se but an accessory, I am far more willing to wear someone else's used tie than a shirt, shoes or suit. Just like anything on eBay, honest sellers with high feedback will stand behind their goods and resolve any unforseen issues that may arise with a damaged or defective product. I once bought a Canali that had a minor run in the silk not seen in the auction and the seller promptly refunded my money and urged me to keep the tie. Many new ties have lots of snags and pulls because sellers buy them from outlets where they've been mistreated many times along the way.


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## Roger

EL72 said:


> With some minor quibbles, I agree with most of your classification Roger. I would add however that there can be quite a bit of variance on some dimensions within one brand's ties, especially with respect to the heft of the silk used, such that there is often more variance within than between brands in the top tier category (wanna run the model Professor? :icon_smile: ). I have some Brionis with better silks than many Borrellis. Some Isaias are beautiful, others are forgettable. Like most things, past a certain level of quality, one's personal taste and the silks used for that particular tie diminish your ability to generalize further. I prefer Brioni and Nicky to most Kitons and Charvets.


Sure, there will be within-brand variance, and it is important for everyone to understand that--that when one points to a characteristic of one's own ties or those seen in shops (say Kitons' heft), it is indeed based on a small sample and may not be true of the whole population of that brand's ties. However, some features would, I believe, show significant brand differences (if we were to fit the model! :icon_smile: ):Carlo Franco heft, for example (not so true of the unlined sevenfolds), Kiton, Charvet, Hermes (and others) silk quality, Hermes unique printed patterns. I agree with you about Brioni (I have several and love them) and I also agree with smr regarding Stefano Ricci--lovely silk, lively colors and patterns, and usually a very good price (often around $50).



EL72 said:


> I disagree with your last point too. In addition to cufflinks, ties are probably the only thing I buy used on eBay and my experience has been overwhelmingly positive. Given that a tie is not a garment per se but an accessory, I am far more willing to wear someone else's used tie than a shirt, shoes or suit. Just like anything on eBay, honest sellers with high feedback will stand behind their goods and resolve any unforseen issues that may arise with a damaged or defective product. I once bought a Canali that had a minor run in the silk not seen in the auction and the seller promptly refunded my money and urged me to keep the tie. Many new ties have lots of snags and pulls because sellers buy them from outlets where they've been mistreated many times along the way.


For me, the fact that a tie is an accessory, rather than a garment worn next to the body, is not the issue. It's that, being made of a delicate fabric, ties can easily be damaged. Your experiences with eBay sellers have been, I think, very fortunate. I think that when an item is listed as used, the seller assumes that potential buyers will be prepared for some flaws, and that it could be very difficult to get your money back from many sellers because you discovered some snags that weren't apparent in the pictures. Many sellers would tell you, I believe, that "used" means having some flaws, and would refuse to refund your money. With a tie listed as either NWT or NWOT, however, I think you'd be in a much stronger position--if the tie arrived with such defects--to recover your money or negotiate a price reduction.


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## zegnamtl

Roger wrote:

Sure, there will be within-brand variance, and it is important for everyone to understand that--that when one points to a characteristic of one's own ties or those seen in shops (say Kitons' heft), it is indeed based on a small sample and may not be true of the whole population of that brand's ties.


~~~~

Very true, Uomo has some Kiton ties that I would never consider for a split second, narrow, thin weight, basic construction and non self tipped. 

Right next to them are 7 or double four folded, self tipped stunning ties that hardly look like they come from the same house!


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## dprof

I have a Luciano Barbera that is excellent IMO.
I also like Duchamp.


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## rkipperman

Vintage Gent said:


> (1) Borrelli ties are overrated. I have two, and the others I've seen only confirm my observation.


Agree. My borelli tie does not bounce back into shape after wearing only a few hours. I do not have this problem with Brioni, Ferragamo, Canali, T&A, or Andrews Ties.


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## JLibourel

I buy most of my ties at the nearby Saks Off-5th. They peg most of their good ties around $60, but they are constantly having 25% or 30% off sales for cardholders. Thus, I quite commonly pay around $43.50 or so for Canali, Charvet, Brioni and Zegna. I don't rate Zegna up with the preceding three, but some are quite nice. I note that the inventory of "my" Off-5th has not been as enticing in the recent past as it was in previous years.

My most recent coup was at Carroll & Co.'s clearance sale. I got two nice house-brand wollen ties and a Talbott for $25 apiece. Had I not been pretty well stocked with ties, I might have been tempted to buy more at this great price.


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## msgathof

Sam Hober said:


> Johnny,
> 
> I think that I need to improve my website so that it will be clearer, all our ties are 100% custom made and take about a month after ordering to be finished - unless you have a special event like a wedding to attend.
> 
> Our $75 English woven silk ties will be made very slowly by hand with many small details and services that you will never get in a comparably priced tie. Not even on eBay.
> 
> We will make the tie in the length, width and shape that you request. If you would like a swatch I will be happy to cut swatches for you.
> 
> Once you have a pattern that you like we will keep it on file for you.
> 
> I am neutral on constructions as we make them all. So here are my thoughts:
> 
> A standard three-fold construction works very well. With a custom made / bespoke tie you can adjust the length, width, shape and interlining.
> 
> With that said there is something very interesting and elegant about a tie with complex folds.
> 
> Unlined seven-folds are for those who love them, I suspect that many of those gentlemen also love mechanical watches and a have a love for elegance and complexity.
> 
> A lined six-fold (called seven-folds in error at times) is perhaps the best of both worlds. as you have the elegance and complexity of a multi-fold tie with the draping of a lined tie.
> 
> The best ties use pure wool with an occasional extra layer of cotton. when you buy a luxury tie you should be able to ask the seller or maker exactly what type of interlining they are using. As well as exactly how many folds the tie has. If they can't tell you then you should wonder....
> 
> So in the end I would not advise you to buy a seven-fold if you are price sensitive unless you have always wanted one. Then buy one as an experiment.
> 
> But first as always get your fit right first: length, width etc..


David is an excellent businessman. I look foward to my red grenadine 59" lined six-fold.


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## miamimike

great info :icon_smile:


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## alphadelta

Leonard is one of my favorites along with Serica Elite (out of business for some time, I believe). Leonard has some of the most incredible printing on any tie I have seen.

AD


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## jrandyv

I've heard no mention of Dolcepunta's 11 fold. It is certainly a most luxurious tie. I also have Charvet, Isaia 7fold, et all.


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## trolperft

Is there any difference in durability between a multi-fold tie(4 or more fold) and a lined tie(standard 3 fold), provided both ties are made of the same silk?


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## Zubberah

As to "best quality" this is very subjective if not nonsensical - eg. Zegna make some very cheap ones but their Courture line is 1st rate; similarly Versace make cheap twill ties but their woven line is in the 1st tier. I have several Kiton 7-folds and I hate the knots they tie and how they hand (thin blade is too wide).

IMO Richard James of Savile Row make the most beautiful ties of all (i now have over 80!) ...but, warning, they snag and pull too damn easily (and quickly) where they rub against the belt buckle. Wish they were more durable. Richard James are closest to Charvet in style but a little more colourful.


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## Sam Hober

trolperft said:


> Is there any difference in durability between a multi-fold tie(4 or more fold) and a lined tie(standard 3 fold), provided both ties are made of the same silk?


*Trolperft,*

All things being equal in terms of the silk there will not be a difference in terms of durability.

Soft loosely woven silks do not last as long as tightly woven reppe weave silks.

Lined ties will wrinkle a lot less.

*Zubberah,

*For the top tier of ties there will not be a large difference in quality and the difference that is there will not be noticed by most gentlemen.

The differences will be in the small details, but they are there....


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## cdavant

It's Easter, not Christmas. But by highlighting Roger's list of the top tier, clicking edit, copy, going to eBay typing "( control v) tie" in the search box it returns 652 tier 1s at auction and over 250 "buy-it-nows." Going to advanced search you can specify new only and a -china and -Hong Kong eliminates a few knock-offs.
Lots of first rate ties starting at well under $100. Happy hunting.


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## RJman

Zubberah said:


> IMO Richard James of Savile Row make the most beautiful ties of all (i now have over 80!) ...but, warning, they snag and pull too damn easily (and quickly) where they rub against the belt buckle. Wish they were more durable. Richard James are closest to Charvet in style but a little more colourful.


Yes, Mademoiselle Colban was very interested in my RJ tie (multicolored daisies on navy blue).

RJ's tie designs have gotten a bit more pedestrian lately, sadly.


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## miamimike

humm...


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## smlaz

My compliments to Roger - great posts. I'll add Battistoni to the list as well...
Cheers,
Steve


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## Zubberah

RJman said:


> Yes, Mademoiselle Colban was very interested in my RJ tie (multicolored daisies on navy blue).
> 
> RJ's tie designs have gotten a bit more pedestrian lately, sadly.


True. Haven't bought one post 2004 season.


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## miamimike

*What about Paul Stuart?*

Great info and it has been a great in helping me pick out high quality ties for my collection. But what about Paul Stuart ties? Where do they rannk? I have heard good comments on their clothing and quality. Who are they on par with?


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## john parker

Came across some nice looking Altea ties while looking at Sierra Trading Post. Any opinion as to quality?


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## DukeGrad

*Ties*

Gentlemen,

My favorites over my 56 years is an old Sulka to date.
Then:
Rubinacci, Marinella, Battistoni, Luciano Barberra, Drakes, Thomas Hill.
The nicest ties on the web and I need to check them out is Sam Hobers ties.
I apologize for not doing this, but will.

It is ones own opinion gentlemen, my old Sulkas are elegant ties, soft silks, classic patterns. I lucked out during the Sulka era.
I take care of my ties, they will outlive me, just like my fly gear.

Nice day my friends


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## cvac

I have 3 of them. Quality is very good for the price - nice medium weight silk, 360 degree sewn in self fabric keeper, slipstitch, etc. Recommended.



john parker said:


> Came across some nice looking Altea ties while looking at Sierra Trading Post. Any opinion as to quality?


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## tiealign

trolperft said:


> Is there any difference in durability between a multi-fold tie(4 or more fold) and a lined tie(standard 3 fold), provided both ties are made of the same silk?


As far as durability is concerned there isnt much of a difference. How the silk is woven and the lining that is used will be the biggest factors in durability. However, IMO the lined six-fold construction we use creates the nicest looking tie with most silks.


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## miamimike

*why not for suits?*

With Rogers great Tier 1,2,3 info all we need now is to have the exact same structure but in suit brands. Someone who knows their stuff should make one for us members. Then shirts, and shoes. :icon_smile_big:


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## tiealign

cvac said:


> I have 3 of them. Quality is very good for the price - nice medium weight silk, 360 degree sewn in self fabric keeper, slipstitch, etc. Recommended.


Just an FYI...when looking for the details that denote quality in a necktie you should also beware of attempts to forge these details. I have seen several ties that have claimed to be 7-folds or 6-folds but are only folded 6 times at the tip and the tail so the folds dont span the entire length of the necktie.


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## miamimike

Has anyone delt with Charvet and Brioni neckties? What are some of the characteristics of them as far as thickness, delicate, softness, weight, construction? 

Also what do you all prefer for ties (thin or thick)? Is one more eligant that the other?


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## baloogafish

miamimike said:


> Has anyone delt with Charvet and Brioni neckties? What are some of the characteristics of them as far as thickness, delicate, softness, weight, construction?
> 
> Also what do you all prefer for ties (thin or thick)? Is one more eligant that the other?


The Brioni ties I have are thick, a bit heavy, very well constructed and are my "beater ties". I've actualy never had a snag in my Brioni ties, which is amazing since I wear them fairly often (once per month, I believe). I've had them for ~ 2 yrs, and they're still some of my favorite ties. I can get a very thick knot out of them.


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## baloogafish

miamimike said:


> Has anyone delt with Charvet and Brioni neckties? What are some of the characteristics of them as far as thickness, delicate, softness, weight, construction?
> 
> Also what do you all prefer for ties (thin or thick)? Is one more eligant that the other?


As for the Charvet ties, I'm incredibly cautious whenever I wear them. I've had ~10 Charvet's over the last 2 years and several have been snagged terribly after minimal use. While they are very elegant, they are also incredibly delicate. The Charvet ties I have range in thickness, but are pretty thin, for the most part.

Charvet ties are my go-to ties for formal occasions (client meetings, big nights out, etc.)


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## Rossini

miamimike said:


> Has anyone delt with Charvet and Brioni neckties? What are some of the characteristics of them as far as thickness, delicate, softness, weight, construction?


Unfortunately, there is no answer to this question. Charvet and Brioni both make a significant range of ties from thick plush woven silks to medium loose woolen mix weaves, some reminiscent of Grenadine. I've seen thin weaves, too, and prints. So, generally speaking the quality is good but as far as thickness, delicateness, softness, weight, construction goes... that varies enormously. The reality with these brands is... if you like the tie, buy it.


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## CharlesAlexander

Besides my own, I love Robert Talbott's ties. He designs are unique and classy.


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## LeonS

CharlesAlexander said:


> Besides my own, I love Robert Talbott's ties. He designs are unique and classy.


 CharlesAlexander, thank you for bumping this thread. Very useful information. For some reason I did not see it before.


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## baloogafish

Rossini said:


> Unfortunately, there is no answer to this question. Charvet and Brioni both make a significant range of ties from thick plush woven silks to medium loose woolen mix weaves, some reminiscent of Grenadine. I've seen thin weaves, too, and prints. So, generally speaking the quality is good but as far as thickness, delicateness, softness, weight, construction goes... that varies enormously. The reality with these brands is... if you like the tie, buy it.


It's good to hear that there aren't any generalizations about either brand. It may have just been the Charvet's that I picked out. I agree, though - If you like it, definitely go for it.


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## Rossini

baloogafish said:


> It's good to hear that there aren't any generalizations about either brand. It may have just been the Charvet's that I picked out. I agree, though - If you like it, definitely go for it.


Yes - of a season, in a particular store, they might be similar but that's just going to be the tip of the iceberg.


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## miamimike

Im looking into getting some robert Talbott ties best of class series. Does anyone know if these (robert talbott best of class) ties are printed or woven? Also does it really matter quality wise if a tie is printed or woven?


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## Rossini

miamimike said:


> Im looking into getting some robert Talbott ties best of class series. Does anyone know if these (robert talbott best of class) ties are printed or woven? Also does it really matter quality wise if a tie is printed or woven?


Nothing wrong with printed though woven is a more intensive process which produces a more 'complex' product which aesthetically offers more to appreciate. At the same time, depending on the quality of the manufacture, some printed ties can be made better than some woven ties. Woven ties offer texture that might, for example, hold the knot better but that also depends on the silk itself and the weave. Woven ties by their nature can look 'classier' because of the detail of the weave, the texture, the construction - the downside being that they can snag more easily. But you can sometimes get more complex designs on a printed tie because it's easier to do so (think Hermes).

As far as RT BIC goes, I would assume that most are woven but, if some are printed, they are probably pretty good too.


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## Beachcomber

My two cents,

Marinella, Kiton, Brioni, Hermes, Talbott, Brooks, and Press.

Make sure you mix it up and get some wovens, prints, geometics, polka dots, paisleys, rep stripes, knits, grenadines, seven folds, etc.

Also, its nice to have some bowties as well for variety - get some butterflys, straigts, point tips, etc. These should all be self-tie, of course.

For fabrics try silk, raw silk, ancient madder silk, wool, linen, madras, seersucker, etc.

For better effect, offset the texture of the tie and the pocket square. For example linen square with silk tie. Or silk square with wool tie.


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## gusvs

Does anyone have any experience with Angelo Fusco ties? I saw this 12-fold (!) last time I was in Japan, and it looked quite amazing. Very expensive though (I think it was more than 60.000 JPY!).

https://www.angelofusco.com/english/dodici.html


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## video2

gusvs said:


> Does anyone have any experience with Angelo Fusco ties? I saw this 12-fold (!) last time I was in Japan, and it looked quite amazing. Very expensive though (I think it was more than 60.000 JPY!).
> 
> https://www.angelofusco.com/english/dodici.html


Wow:icon_smile_big:


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## FIHTies

gusvs said:


> Does anyone have any experience with Angelo Fusco ties? I saw this 12-fold (!) last time I was in Japan, and it looked quite amazing. Very expensive though (I think it was more than 60.000 JPY!).
> 
> https://www.angelofusco.com/english/dodici.html


For some reason 12 fold ties remind me of the paper planes we used to make as kids. The more bends you could bend in the wings that "fancier" a jet you believed it was, despite it not at all assisting the flight of the plane.

I mean technically you can do 12, 24, 48 "folds" by bending the inside flap this way and that way. But does it fly any better?


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## video2

FIHTies said:


> For some reason 12 fold ties remind me of the paper planes we used to make as kids. The more bends you could bend in the wings that "fancier" a jet you believed it was, despite it not at all assisting the flight of the plane.
> 
> I mean technically you can do 12, 24, 48 "folds" by bending the inside flap this way and that way. But does it fly any better?


No :icon_smile_big:


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## CharlesAlexander

12 fold ties are overkill. I think not only are they folded 12 times, but they are also padded. What is the point of adding padding if you have 12 folds? That is just way too thick.


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## gusvs

CharlesAlexander said:


> 12 fold ties are overkill. I think not only are they folded 12 times, but they are also padded. What is the point of adding padding if you have 12 folds? That is just way too thick.


The Fusco I saw in Japan was unlined, and did not seem too thick. I do not see the point though with 12 folds.


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## gusvs

FIHTies said:


> For some reason 12 fold ties remind me of the paper planes we used to make as kids. The more bends you could bend in the wings that "fancier" a jet you believed it was, despite it not at all assisting the flight of the plane.
> 
> I mean technically you can do 12, 24, 48 "folds" by bending the inside flap this way and that way. But does it fly any better?


I agree, it seems to be too much of a marketing thing. I must say the ties looked beautiful though.


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## CharlesAlexander

gusvs said:


> The Fusco I saw in Japan was unlined, and did not seem too thick. I do not see the point though with 12 folds.


Really? The ones I've seen were all lined. I would have to see a lined 12 fold before I pass judgment then. But it still seem unnecessary.

And that's not just because I sell seven folds, either.


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## FIHTies

The ties on the site seem to be unlined as is (seemingly) evident from the backing of the tie.


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## CharlesAlexander

Which site is that?


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## FIHTies

CharlesAlexander said:


> Which site is that?





gusvs said:


> Does anyone have any experience with Angelo Fusco ties? I saw this 12-fold (!) last time I was in Japan, and it looked quite amazing. Very expensive though (I think it was more than 60.000 JPY!).
> 
> https://www.angelofusco.com/english/dodici.html


The one posted above


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## CharlesAlexander

FIHTies said:


> The one posted above


thanks. He has some beautiful neckties!

The 10 folds and up are a little weird. It looks like it's a lined seven fold, without the lining and an extra fold. I'd be interested to see that in person. That lined seven fold method seems suited for lining, and the folds are going down the middle mostly as opposed to being spread across the entire tie like a traditional seven fold.

Has anyone ever brought one? I'd be interested in the feel and quality.


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## tiealign

Every 12-fold I have ever seen has been unlined. I thought they were pretty unique and I felt they tied a pretty nice knot...not too small or too large IMO.


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## bluesmobile_440

I know I'll get crucified for saying this, but I really don't notice much of a difference between high end ties and the stuff at the department store. Is it quality? Do they last longer than 10 years?


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## dfloyd

*If you can't tell the difference....*

from a yarn dyed tie such as Isaia, Duchamp, or Robert Talbott to a cheap department store tie, you should just keep buying the cheap ones. Quality ties are like many other things you encounter in life: cavier, champagne, or fine dining. They are an acquired taste, and not something you look up in Consumer's Digest.


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## CharlesAlexander

dfloyd said:


> from a yarn dyed tie such as Isaia, Duchamp, or Robert Talbott to a cheap department store tie, you should just keep buying the cheap ones. Quality ties are like many other things you encounter in life: cavier, champagne, or fine dining. They are an acquired taste, and not something you look up in Consumer's Digest.


Exactly. It's like going out to The Palm as opposed to McDonald's. Depends what your taste are. If your happy with Micky D's, then by all means stick with that. :icon_smile_big:


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## msphotog

Charles- I detest McD's, but I sure enjoyed The Palm in Ceaser's Palace. BTW, don't bet on whether or not you'll see Elvis in the men's room, he's the attendant!
To add my 2 cents worth, I've never owned any really high end ties(Charvet, Brioni, Kiton ect.) but I'm probably better of not seeing them at all. I think Brooks are really good everyday ties, my Carlo Franco ties are magnificent, tie a great knot-four-in-hand, and I have a Dolce Punta that's very nice. I also like RT BIC, but the ties that surprised me with their quality is Daniel Cremieux from Dillard's. They have self keepers, and really hefty silk. I can even tie a half-windsor knot and it's long enough for me. In addition ot all of the above, they are fairly cheap!
Mark

P.S. I looked at some Hermes ties in the Bellagio shop a couple of month ago, and for $160 I thought they were short and flimsey...Not worth it!


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## CharlesAlexander

msphotog said:


> Charles- I detest McD's, but I sure enjoyed The Palm in Ceaser's Palace. BTW, don't bet on whether or not you'll see Elvis in the men's room, he's the attendant!


This is a man of class right here!

I must admit though, I do get a craving from Mcnuggets ever once in a while...


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## ilikeyourstyle

baloogafish said:


> The Brioni ties I have are thick, a bit heavy, very well constructed and are my "beater ties". I've actually never had a snag in my Brioni ties, which is amazing since I wear them fairly often (once per month, I believe). I've had them for ~ 2 yrs, and they're still some of my favorite ties. I can get a very thick knot out of them.


I love how Brioni is a "beater tie" for you. It would probably be reserved for special occasions in my wardrobe.

By the way, this is one of the most helpful threads I've seen in this forum. Thanks to all for their contributions to making a complete list of desirable ties.


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## Jozsika

Let me try to revive this old thread.
From those of you who have experience with *any *of the following tie brands, I would love to have an opinion on their overall quality:

Aquascutum
Burberry
Bvlgari
Cerutti 1881
Dior
Dolce &Gabbana
Edsor Kronen
Egon von Fürstenberg
Gant
Gianfranco Ferre
Gucci
Joop!
Kenzo
Lands End
Lanvin
Marks & Spencer
Monti
Next
Olymp
Paul Smith
Pierre Balmain
Pierre Cardin
Pucci 
Renato Balestra
Roccobarocco
Thomas Pink
Tommy Hilfiger
Trussardi
Versace
Yves Saint Laurent
Zadi / Andrew's


(These are the brands that I have read rather contradictory reviews on.) :icon_scratch:

You may use the rating introduced by Roger; Tier 1 being Kiton, Borrelli or Marinella, Tier 3 being Hugo Boss or Armani, and let's rate the cheapest Asian tie brands Tier 10. Or just give your opinion, plain and simple.

Also, if you feel like updating the original list because the quality of some of the brands have changed, that would also be great for me to know.

(Please do not base your rating on the colors or patterns of the ties, rather on the „more objective" qualities, such as *material, durability, workmanship *etc. Price or value / price ratio are not relevant.)

It is kind of important for me to know this, so I would be grateful for any meaningful response. :icon_cheers:


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## appleboom

Top brands, sartorial quality (hand made in Napoli): Best:
Kiton, Luigi Borrelli, Battisti Napoli, Marinella, Charvet.
Note: Kiton ties are always sevenfolds. Borrelli, Battisti and Marinella of regular fold and sevenfold ties.


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## MaxBuck

I've got some beautiful ties in my collection with the following labels:

Jerry Garcia
Peter Max
Christian Dior
Charles Tyrwhitt
Nature Conservancy (!)
Brooks Brothers

It's possible to buy excellent ties with a wide variety of labels. You shouldn't get too fixated on the back of the tie; much better to concern yourself with its front.


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## Youthful Repp-robate

MaxBuck said:


> I've got some beautiful ties in my collection with the following labels:
> 
> Jerry Garcia
> Peter Max
> Christian Dior
> Charles Tyrwhitt
> Nature Conservancy (!)
> Brooks Brothers
> *
> It's possible to buy excellent ties with a wide variety of labels. You shouldn't get too fixated on the back of the tie; much better to concern yourself with its front.*


Bingo, though I think I have much more boring taste in ties than you. :icon_viking:


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## MaxBuck

Youthful Repp-robate said:


> Bingo, though I think I have much more boring taste in ties than you. :icon_viking:


Nearly everyone does. As to the Peter Max, it never fails to get comments. :biggrin2:


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## tonyanthony1970

*Tie Rankings*

I would add Fendi, Hermes,Drakes, Ike Behar, Stefano Ricci, Brioni, E. Zegna, Canali, Salvatore Ferragamo, Robert Talbott (seven fold, best of class), Prada, Hickey Freeman (Current Line),Massimo Bizzocchi, Italo Ferretti (makers of Brioni Ties),Charvet, Paul Smith, M. Bastin, Ted Baker, J.Z. Richards, Daniel Figureedo (hard to find), Duchamp, Daniel Cremiuex, and there are more. I just can remember all the brands I've owned or sold.


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## tonyanthony1970

*Additional Tie Brands*

I would add Fendi, Hermes,Drakes, Ike Behar, Stefano Ricci, Brioni, E. Zegna, Canali, Salvatore Ferragamo, Robert Talbott (seven fold, best of class), Prada, Hickey Freeman (Current Line),Massimo Bizzocchi, Italo Ferretti (makers of Brioni Ties),Charvet, Paul Smith, M. Bastin, Ted Baker, J.Z. Richards, Daniel Figureedo (hard to find), Duchamp, Daniel Cremiuex, and there are more, Loewe of Spain, New & Lingwood, Moschino, Leonard,Lavin,Holland & Holland, Huntsman, Gitman Bros., Sam Hober, Garrick Anderson,Faconnable, Emilio Pucci, Dunhill,Celine,BVGARIE,RVR, Dolcepunta, E&G Cappelli,Hackett, Huntsman,Leonard,Lavin,Paul Smith, Tom Browne, Purdey, Garrick Anderson, Rubinacci, Moschino,Stefano Ricci,Ted Baker, Thomas Pink, Turnbull & Asser,Valentino, Vitaliano Pancaldi, Vivienne Westwood, Trussardi,Passagio Cravatte,Daniel Cremiuex, daniel figueredo, and more I just can't remember that I've owned or sold at some point in my life.


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## drlivingston

Many people fall victim to the name recognition issue. There are some phenomenal ties out there that hardly get any attention. Yes, I admit to owning Hermes, Kiton, etc.etc. But, they are not my go-to ties when I want to dress to impress. Instead of Hermes, try an Alain Figaret. Also handmade in France, they have remarkable craftsmanship (and a bit more variety). Many people are familiar with Loro Piana fabric as it pertains to the tailoring of a suit or sport coat. Piana also make some very nice ties. I own a couple of their cashmere/silk offerings that are nothing short of sublime. Seaward and Stearn is also one of my favorites. I sold several of them here and they were very well received. And a couple of others in my collection that are worth mentioning are Pineider and Wilhelm Jungmann & Neffe. Not all nice ties need be as expensive as the ones that I listed. Makers like Richel, XMI, and Alexandre make great ties that will fit most budgets. Don't let anyone decide your personal tie preferences for you. Experiment and have fun.


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## em2013

Excellent thread, especially with where to get discounts on ebay! :icon_smile:


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## SlideGuitarist

I've seen some English and Irish names mentioned favorably here: Atkinson, Drake, Benson & Clegg, et al. I'm not qualified to recommend any of these, but perhaps someone else can comment. Cast a wider net on EBay, then look up the manufacturer's site and see what you can learn. Even used Kiton neckties are going to cost me more than I can spend right now.


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## Tilton

I have basically culled out everything that isn't BB, Ferragamo, Hermes, Vineyard Vines (mostly for novelty) or MIA (JZR, CG, etc). That's not to say I ever had any Kiton, etc. to begin with, though.


----------



## Barry_432

What a great list which is so informative - I would have thought E Marinella would have been in Tier 1. The bulk of mine are T&A which whilst Tier 2 I am very happy with.


----------



## drlivingston

I wish that people would categorize ties by quality of material and craftsmanship rather than by price tag.


----------



## ESilver

This was a very informative thread!

Rankings in my closet are:

*First: Brioni; Sulka *
(Butter-soft silk and terrific knots.)

*Second: Ermenegildo Zegna; Leonard; Borelli, Massimo Bizzochi *
(Nice patterns; good quality. Concur with earlier comment(s) about Leonard's stunning print quality.)

*Third: Jos A Bank *Signature Gold*; Isaia *
(JAB has nice 7-fold patterns but can readily snag/fuzz. Isaia is too soft; not very crisp; behaves like a wool tie.)

*Unknown/Never Worn: Hermes; Versace
*(Gifts from my girlfriend in patterns she likes but I don't. Build quality of both seems thin and fragile.)


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## M Go Crimson

Kiton and Brioni 7 fold silk is of incredible quality.

The one Canali I own is showing signs of wear much faster than it should.


----------



## SlideGuitarist

Tilton said:


> I have basically culled out everything that isn't BB, Ferragamo, Hermes, Vineyard Vines (mostly for novelty) or MIA (JZR, CG, etc). That's not to say I ever had any Kiton, etc. to begin with, though.


J. Z. Richards? I couldn't figure out "CG."


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## Tilton

Collard Greens. I don't know how popular they are here, but they're made in America and make some good, conservative designs that work well for me. I wouldn't know where to buy them around DC, but the men's store in my college town started stocking them while I was living there.


----------



## SlideGuitarist

Tilton said:


> Collard Greens. I don't know how popular they are here, but they're made in America and make some good, conservative designs that work well for me. I wouldn't know where to buy them around DC, but the men's store in my college town started stocking them while I was living there.


Ah, Southern trad; I get it: https://www.collaredgreens.com/. Worth a look.


----------



## Reuben

SlideGuitarist said:


> Ah, Southern trad; I get it: https://www.collaredgreens.com/. Worth a look.


Also great southern trad (bow) tie makers: high cotton and southern proper

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## immanuelrx

Roger said:


> Here are my nominations for (a) Tier 1 ties (great ties): Kiton, Borrelli, Attolini, Isaia, Bulgari, Charvet, Marinella, Hermes, Carlo Franco, Sam Hober. Depending on choice of construction, the Kiton, Borrelli, Attolini, Isaia, Bulgari, Carlo Franco, and Sam Hober ties (particularly the lined sevenfolds) are hefty and tie a big knot. I've seen very, very few sevenfold Marinellas and none from Charvet and Hermes. These latter are of lighter construction, more delicate, but made of gorgeous silk and are of the highest quality. Two other makers, Barba and Barbera make ties that are very likely in this class, but I haven't seen them.
> 
> One step down, my nominations for (b) Tier 2 ties (very good ties): Brioni, Stefano Ricci, Nicky of Milan, Drake (their 50-oz. model is hefty), Holliday & Brown, Turnbull & Asser, Massimo Bizzocchi, Breuer, Robert Talbott (the sevenfolds and Best of Class lines), Four in Hand, Zegna (but not the Villa Bolgheri line), Canali. Faberge and Ferragamo may be in this class, I'm not sure.
> 
> Then dropping to (c) Tier 3 ties (decent to good ties, some at very reasonable prices): Altea, Pucci, Dolce & Gabbana (I have one which is probably more properly of Tier 2 quality), Zegna Villa Bolgheri line, Versace and Armani (both cheap but expensive, if you know what I mean), Hugo Boss, Faconnable, a trio of British ties: Duchamp, Ted Baker, and Paul Smith (all somewhat gaudy), Ralph Lauren Purple Label (purportedly made by Altea), Robert Talbott lower lines like the Chelsea line, Brooks Brothers, Jhane Barnes.
> 
> After that, there are ties branded by Hickey-Freeman, RL Polo, Hart, Schaffer & Marx, Ike Behar, Dormeuil, Yves St. Laurent, Christian Dior (the latter two undoubtedly on license), and numerous house brands for retailers like Nordstrom, Harry Rosen, Holt Renfrew (the last two in Canada)--really too many to mention. I have very little acquaintance with any of these, except for the Rosen, Holt-Renfrew, and Dormeuil but wouldn't see these as generally really good ties, although you may find some exceptions.
> 
> Just my opinions on the subject. Others will rank-order these brands differently, I'm sure. And I've omitted many brands--either because I forgot them or have no experience with them--that others can comment on. :icon_smile:
> 
> _Edit:_ Forgot about Brooks Brothers--nice (particularly their repps) and reasonably-priced. Put in Tier 3, but maybe really 2.5.


This list is exactly what I was looking for. I know this posting is a few years old, but thanks for the info!


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## Tilton

Reuben said:


> Also great southern trad (bow) tie makers: high cotton and southern proper
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I don't think SP is MIA any longer, though. My vote goes to CG - best of the "southern" trend brands as far as ties go.


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## mcfrankshc

I'm sure they aren't the highest quality, but Harry Rosen is my to-go for ties.


----------



## johwal

*Ties*



JohnnySuits said:


> Looking to build a collection of nice, high end ties, and would love some options here. I hear Kiton is up there. Any other brands to build around? I prefer a nice, thick, heavy tie.


For ties that knot beautifully, I'd recommend Hermes and Charvet.

Twain52


----------



## StephenRG

johwal said:


> For ties that knot beautifully, I'd recommend Hermes and Charvet.


But one can never describe Hermes ties as thick and heavy.


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## owlish

I find this thread extremely intriguing. Gentlemen, thank you for your insights. I've been around the block a time or two on neckwear. For the way I'm hard-wired, I distill my favorite brands down to the following: 1). Zegna (the Quindici line has some astonishing, retina-popping patterns), 2). Brioni (their wovens are especially amazing), and 3). Italo Ferretti (consistently beautiful designs and color combinations). I have a few Kiton 7-fold pieces (paisley). I do find their monochromes and regimental stripes a bit on the bland side. I also have a few gorgeous Dolcepunta ties that are perfectly weighted and tie a killer knot. I've been on the fence with Ike Behar. Used to have quite a few before a big pare-down several years ago.


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## gctoto11

Hi all! Newcomer here and know nothing much about finer details of ties (except knowing that I want to get grenadines lol) and came across this thread ...which provides great info! I saw there's a person who seems to sells ties on another forum and the company is named "spazioartigianale" : https://www.styleforum.net/buyandse...lled-bespoke-tie-service-3-4-and-5-fold.2187/ To my untrained eye the ties seemed to look quite nice - but tie experts here - what do you think? I know it's hard to tell from the pics alone but not sure if it looks legit. Thank you all!


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## Vecchio Vespa

gctoto11 said:


> Hi all! Newcomer here and know nothing much about finer details of ties (except knowing that I want to get grenadines lol) and came across this thread ...which provides great info! I saw there's a person who seems to sells ties on another forum and the company is named "spazioartigianale" : https://www.styleforum.net/buyandse...lled-bespoke-tie-service-3-4-and-5-fold.2187/ To my untrained eye the ties seemed to look quite nice - but tie experts here - what do you think? I know it's hard to tell from the pics alone but not sure if it looks legit. Thank you all!


Not familiar with that name, but I love the two ties I just got from Chipp. I'm pretty sure they offer grenadines, but my two new ones are challis.


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## gctoto11

Flanderian said:


> made





TKI67 said:


> Not familiar with that name, but I love the two ties I just got from Chipp. I'm pretty sure they offer grenadines, but my two new ones are challis.


Thanks TK! I checked Chipp and they do have grenadines but not in the grossa weave that I'm looking for. The price of Chipp is not too expensive too.... any other brands that you may suggest with grossa weave for just a simple grenadine navy silk at around Chipp's price?


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## smmrfld

gctoto11 said:


> Thanks TK! I checked Chipp and they do have grenadines but not in the grossa weave that I'm looking for. The price of Chipp is not too expensive too.... any other brands that you may suggest with grossa weave for just a simple grenadine navy silk at around Chipp's price?


Cannot beat samhober.com. Customized, great quality, outstanding customer service. Highly recommend.


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## gctoto11

smmrfld said:


> Cannot beat samhober.com. Customized, great quality, outstanding customer service. Highly recommend.


Agreed that their ties look fantastic and seem to worth what the price they are asking for. However, as I cannot spend that much on a single tie (albiet knowing that it will last long), my range is around 70 - 90 USD (and I have take into account shipping to Hong Kong too)... Will definitely want to own one by sam hober some day.. thanks for the kind suggestions!


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## cmoore

A basic sam hober is about $90 before shipping. Not too far out of your price range if you want to skip lunch a couple of days or whatever to cover the shipping from Thailand to HK. I just looked on their site and DHL express shipping to Hong Kong is $4.

So, yeah. In your range. Or pretty darned close.

The alternative if you really want quality cheaper is to prowl Ebay for used. Be patient and you may find something nice there. But really, Chipp is actually cheap for _quality_ grenadine, and good quality grenadine grossa is going to cost you that or more new no matter where you search.


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## gctoto11

cmoore said:


> A basic sam hober is about $90 before shipping. Not too far out of your price range if you want to skip lunch a couple of days or whatever to cover the shipping from Thailand to HK. I just looked on their site and DHL express shipping to Hong Kong is $4.
> 
> So, yeah. In your range. Or pretty darned close.
> 
> The alternative if you really want quality cheaper is to prowl Ebay for used. Be patient and you may find something nice there. But really, Chipp is actually cheap for _quality_ grenadine, and good quality grenadine grossa is going to cost you that or more new no matter where you search.


Thanks Cmoore! Seems I will go for sam hober then! Thanks a lot for your recommendation!


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## cmoore

gctoto11 said:


> Thanks Cmoore! Seems I will go for sam hober then! Thanks a lot for your recommendation!


Yeah, it's going to cost me. You see, now I've been looking at the site.

I have a shantung grenadine fina SH tie, which is perfect for my sport coat. I also have a shantung and a wool/silk blend. All three for specific coats, and the fabric is just lovely in all of them. I brag about ebay cheapies, but I get about one Sam Hober each year.

I don't NEED a new tie. But I have a charcoal suit coming and am thinking of dark navy or black grenadine for that James Bond look. Chipps is a little narrow for my physique.


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## gctoto11

cmoore said:


> Yeah, it's going to cost me. You see, now I've been looking at the site.
> 
> I have a shantung grenadine fina SH tie, which is perfect for my sport coat. I also have a shantung and a wool/silk blend. All three for specific coats, and the fabric is just lovely in all of them. I brag about ebay cheapies, but I get about one Sam Hober each year.
> 
> I don't NEED a new tie. But I have a charcoal suit coming and am thinking of dark navy or black grenadine for that James Bond look. Chipps is a little narrow for my physique.


Hahahha It's a good "cost" to have! Seems like you have a tie addiction ...must .. resist... to become cmoore. I also don't want the tie to be too thin, I've got some berg and berg ties and whilst their 8cm ones are nice I prefer it to be 9 cm (just the wide width imo)


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## cmoore

gctoto11 said:


> Seems like you have a tie addiction ...must .. resist...


Nah, it's not like that at all! I am pretty focused with ties anymore.

I do have a lot of ties, but many of them I don't wear. I got them cheaply while learning some things, like what length I like and what texture really works for me, and colors I really like. They were great, and most were cheap. But if I'm not going to wear again them I'll pass them along. I have been selling or giving them away and adding only ties that I think I will wear more often, that don't duplicate what I have.

And, yeah, sometimes I'm whimsical -- I bought the Hermes Gliders in the Sky tie because it had gliders on it, not because it was Hermes, though it's a great color and I've worn it several times. So I have enough printed silk ties in a good selection of colors. Most of what I wear regularly is on the tier-2 of this thread -- Zegna, Dormieul, Robert Talbot 7 fold, Massimo Bizzocchi, etc. Plus two Hermes and the Sam Hobers.

What I do NOT have is much grenadine. All I have is a shantung fina grenadine Sam Hober (which is a little too flashy in some ways), and a really nice but too short striped grenadine grossa tie I got from a thrift store.

That thrift store grenadine is awesome. It's like a universal texture, I can wear it up or down, with a 3 piece or a sport coat, day or night, and be comfortable. A navy grenadine grossa a couple inches longer will go with literally every suit and coat I own and be a great complement. And do the Bond thing with my grey suit.

And I agree, 9cm is a great size. I normally go for something from 9 to 9.5cm. 8cm is too skinny for my taste and physique.

Anyway, fabric samples have been ordered.


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## gctoto11

cmoore said:


> Nah, it's not like that at all! I am pretty focused with ties anymore.
> 
> I do have a lot of ties, but many of them I don't wear. I got them cheaply while learning some things, like what length I like and what texture really works for me, and colors I really like. They were great, and most were cheap. But if I'm not going to wear again them I'll pass them along. I have been selling or giving them away and adding only ties that I think I will wear more often, that don't duplicate what I have.
> 
> And, yeah, sometimes I'm whimsical -- I bought the Hermes Gliders in the Sky tie because it had gliders on it, not because it was Hermes, though it's a great color and I've worn it several times. So I have enough printed silk ties in a good selection of colors. Most of what I wear regularly is on the tier-2 of this thread -- Zegna, Dormieul, Robert Talbot 7 fold, Massimo Bizzocchi, etc. Plus two Hermes and the Sam Hobers.
> 
> What I do NOT have is much grenadine. All I have is a shantung fina grenadine Sam Hober (which is a little too flashy in some ways), and a really nice but too short striped grenadine grossa tie I got from a thrift store.
> 
> That thrift store grenadine is awesome. It's like a universal texture, I can wear it up or down, with a 3 piece or a sport coat, day or night, and be comfortable. A navy grenadine grossa a couple inches longer will go with literally every suit and coat I own and be a great complement. And do the Bond thing with my grey suit.
> 
> And I agree, 9cm is a great size. I normally go for something from 9 to 9.5cm. 8cm is too skinny for my taste and physique.
> 
> Anyway, fabric samples have been ordered.


Lol to the last sentence. For me I don't have much budget to spend on ties as I don't wear ties often anyways (let's face it -beautiful as ties can be, sometimes its hard to spend 70 to 90 US on a small piece of cloth lol), then I discovered grenadine ties (yes I know very noobish). Then I found out that grenadine ties are so versatile and can work with most of everything, with the subtlety that I like without it being boring. The downside is people will just think it's a common knit tie unless such person is also into menswear. But whatever, I wear what I like anyways so that doesn't bother me.

Hope the fabric samples will inspire you to get some nice ties!


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## CLTesquire

@cmoore what grenadine samples did you order from Hober? I'm a big fan of his grenadines. It's hard to beat the midnight navy grossa.


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## cmoore

I got a selection. Thinking about more than just this order -- might get a friend a christmas gift too, and maybe my next year's order will include one in red. I wear red with navy often.

But for this Grenadine tie:
I got the cashmere and silk grenadine grossa samples. I haven't seen the cashmere, so what the heck

dark charcoal and midnight blue
black and midnight blue
midnight blue
Then normal silk grenadine

Midnight blue fina
dark navy piccola
dark navy prometeo
I already have a sample of Midnight Grossa all silk on hand from when I ordered last summer, so I wanted to compare it to the dark navy, and I also wanted to see the similar options around those.

I also got samples of the stuff like mogador, faille silk, some red grenadine, and the red wool silk blend. Just to see the colors and hand feel. This tie will be a dark blue grenadine, but I like non grenadine fabrics as well. The wool/silk from SH is so amazingly soft I can't tell you. Lovely touch. I want pajamas made out of it.

I have decided each time to get a sample of some of the other fabric offerings when I order. It costs more to ship than for the swatches, and I like to have something in hand to understand the fabric so, as I said, what the heck. Might as well take a look.


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## CLTesquire

I have two of the cashmere/silk grenadines (the charcoal one and the midnight one) and they are spendid. I also have 3 different navy grenadines in different weaves/shades. I find that you eventually find a place for all of them. 

If you like red, I really think the burgundy grenadine is a great tie and I wear it fairly often. The dark red is good as well. Get that over the straight "red" variety.

The wool/silk are excellent ties as well. I have a couple and they get a lot of wear in the fall/winter. Quite luxurious and the texture is great. I'd also recommend the sold wool challis ties. They are drier to the touch but have their place. I wear my forest green challis often.


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## cmoore

Dark red is the sample color I have on the way. 

I don't know that I'd wear a wool challis just because I pretty much have new ties for every event I'll be going to this fall. But I do like the texture a lot. I didn't look at them this time.

Samples are due in tomorrow. One thing about SH, they're remarkably responsive for coming to the US from east Asia.


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## cmoore

Got a look at the samples today. Dark navy was definitely the color I had in mind. Midnight is too dark, I do want the tonal blue. 

Alas, they don't have it in Grossa or Fina. So it's either go lighter with Navy, or try Piccola or Prometeo. I'm leaning toward the prometeo, I really like the way the sample looks. 

The cashmere blend grenadine is awesome too. Really nice hand. Alas, they don't have the color I want right now, but maybe another order I'll come back to this.


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## GastonMonescu

cmoore said:


> Got a look at the samples today. Dark navy was definitely the color I had in mind. Midnight is too dark, I do want the tonal blue.
> 
> Alas, they don't have it in Grossa or Fina. So it's either go lighter with Navy, or try Piccola or Prometeo. I'm leaning toward the prometeo, I really like the way the sample looks.
> 
> The cashmere blend grenadine is awesome too. Really nice hand. Alas, they don't have the color I want right now, but maybe another order I'll come back to this.


I just ordered the prometeo in dark navy and burgundy! Really looking forward to these.


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## cmoore

GastonMonescu said:


> I just ordered the prometeo in dark navy and burgundy! Really looking forward to these.


I went with the dark navy Prometeo, too. Did a dark red Fina grenadine too. I didn't have a lot of solid color ties before my first SH order last year. I got a lighter blue shantung fina then, so this makes for a pretty good selection of grenadine in my closet.


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## GastonMonescu

cmoore said:


> I went with the dark navy Prometeo, too. Did a dark red Fina grenadine too. I didn't have a lot of solid color ties before my first SH order last year. I got a lighter blue shantung fina then, so this makes for a pretty good selection of grenadine in my closet.


My first grenadine was the dark red fina. Most of my Hobers are diamond weave, so I'll be glad to have more grenadines. How's the shantung? Looks like an interesting option.


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## cmoore

GastonMonescu said:


> My first grenadine was the dark red fina. Most of my Hobers are diamond weave, so I'll be glad to have more grenadines. How's the shantung? Looks like an interesting option.


I love the Shantung. It's slubbier than I expected from the site, but I got a sample and expected that. I got sky blue:









The shantung is done on a midnight background, like they do for their cashmere blends. With the lighter blue it gives a lot of texture and darkens the perceived color. I specifically got this to go with a grey and navy guncheck sport coat, but I have worn it with a navy and blue windowpane 3 piece a couple of times.

It's kind of a dog whistle tie, though. I was literally stopped in the street and asked about it by a plain clothes cop -- who also has a beard and wears a tie every day. Another time by someone in an elevator when visiting my work HQ and again last month by a bartender at a concert. I guess internet sartorialists notice shantung.


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## GastonMonescu

cmoore said:


> I love the Shantung. It's slubbier than I expected from the site, but I got a sample and expected that. I got sky blue:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The shantung is done on a midnight background, like they do for their cashmere blends. With the lighter blue it gives a lot of texture and darkens the perceived color. I specifically got this to go with a grey and navy guncheck sport coat, but I have worn it with a navy and blue windowpane 3 piece a couple of times.
> 
> It's kind of a dog whistle tie, though. I was literally stopped in the street and asked about it by a plain clothes cop -- who also has a beard and wears a tie every day. Another time by someone in an elevator when visiting my work HQ and again last month by a bartender at a concert. I guess internet sartorialists notice shantung.


I'll have to check out some shantung weaves. I ordered a couple of the cashmere/silk grossa swatches, which also look to have interesting texture.


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## burnedandfrozen

I'm certainly not an expert on ties since my job does not require me to wear them, but I do love looking through them at my local thrifts and in the past couple of months I've found a handful of woven Ike Behar ties in great condition that have gorgeous designs and with good heft. At $2 a tie how could I say no?


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## GastonMonescu

burnedandfrozen said:


> I'm certainly not an expert on ties since my job does not require me to wear them, but I do love looking through them at my local thrifts and in the past couple of months I've found a handful of woven Ike Behar ties in great condition that have gorgeous designs and with good heft. At $2 a tie how could I say no?


Ike Behar makes some great ties, but of course they're usually a lot more than that! Nice find.


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## Cassadine

GastonMonescu said:


> Ike Behar makes some great ties, but of course they're usually a lot more than that! Nice find.


My Ike Behar ties are well constructed, tie a fairly beefy knot, and I can create a nice dimple out of them. If you shop with care you can find them at affordable prices; I've never paid more than $40 for NWT.


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