# How much toe space is too much toe space?



## MBrando

Hi all,

Posted this in fashion, but now thinking maybe it should be here.

I got a great deal on a pair of Bally Newlands, only available in size 10 1/2 (American). I have on occasion needed a 10 1/2, but more commonly wear a 10, sometimes even a 9 1/2, depending on the shoe.

The shoes more or less fit, in that my feet don't slide around much at all - I think this is mainly because I have a very high instep so the top of the shoe holds my foot back toward the heel of the shoe, sort of like having natural tongue pads. But I have nearly an inch and a half of space between my toe and the end of the shoe.

How much space is too much? As the shoe breaks in (and the vamp stretches out), I wonder whether my foot will start sliding around more and if it's a mistake to keep these. I know the general advice is always to get shoes that fit properly in the first place, but I'm not sure what that would be in this case, as in a smaller size I might not even be able to properly close the lacing. And again, these were a really good deal.

Any advice? Cheers, all.


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## dparm

Do not buy shoes unless they fit right from day one. Period.


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## MBrando

Well, thanks but that doesn't really answer the question, which is about whether or not they DO fit (and will fit in the future). Basically:

1) Do you think they don't 'fit right' based on what I've described? Currently they feel as comfortable as any of my other shoes. 

2) Even if/though they do fit on day one, as you say, how real is the concern they won't fit in the future?


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## phyrpowr

Too long. With no support in the shoe, it will start to bend there with each step, and create a crease, which your toenail will bump as you walk. Very bothersome after awhile.


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## [email protected]

I think it depends on the shape of the last. Ie. if that extra space in the toe is "useable space" or just goes to a pointed end.


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## Jovan

You should be able to flex on the ball of your foot without experiencing discomfort. Shoes (at least any worth their salt) are built to have some room in the toe for this. If it pinches, take it back.


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## Orsini

Approximately 1/2 inch minimum. 

As the others have pointed out, what you have described is likely to be too much.


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## MBrando

Yes, I wondered that. Some very pointy shoes must have at least that much space between the toe and the end. These are somewhat pointed: https://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41jv1c1euZL._SS424_.jpg.


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## eagle2250

MBrando said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Posted this in fashion, but now thinking maybe it should be here.
> 
> I got a great deal on a pair of Bally Newlands, only available in size 10 1/2 (American). I have on occasion needed a 10 1/2, but more commonly wear a 10, sometimes even a 9 1/2, depending on the shoe.
> 
> The shoes more or less fit, in that my feet don't slide around much at all - I think this is mainly because I have a very high instep so the top of the shoe holds my foot back toward the heel of the shoe, sort of like having natural tongue pads. But I have nearly an inch and a half of space between my toe and the end of the shoe.
> 
> How much space is too much? As the shoe breaks in (and the vamp stretches out), I wonder whether my foot will start sliding around more and if it's a mistake to keep these. I know the general advice is always to get shoes that fit properly in the first place, but I'm not sure what that would be in this case, as in a smaller size I might not even be able to properly close the lacing. And again, these were a really good deal.
> 
> Any advice? Cheers, all.


LOL. You're babling-on like an expectant father of a newborn, in the waiting area of of a local hospital labor and delivery room. From what you tell us, your shoes, in all probability, fit fine. Wear them; enjoy them and give us a glowing update of your love for them in about six months. Have a great day! :biggrin:


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## Jovan

Sorry, I realised my reply didn't really address your question, MBrando.

FWIW, all my shoes have more or less a half-inch of room in front of my big toe. But this can differ depending on the last. As you pointed out (no pun intended) pointier toed shoes will have a little more since real feet aren't remotely in that configuration.


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## pweller

What I have done to measure 'toe room' is to mash my foot forward in the shoe, and then measure the room behind my heel. I think this is a way to measure what you want more accurately, as it eliminates any unuseable space forward of your toes. I don't think measuring the distance from your toes to the front of the shoe tells you anything at all, because a lot of shoes have elongated (i.e. non-fuctional) fronts.


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## Jovan

A good point, pweller. I'll keep that in mind.


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## Georgetown08

pweller said:


> What I have done to measure 'toe room' is to mash my foot forward in the shoe, and then measure the room behind my heel. I think this is a way to measure what you want more accurately, as it eliminates any unuseable space forward of your toes. I don't think measuring the distance from your toes to the front of the shoe tells you anything at all, because a lot of shoes have elongated (i.e. non-fuctional) fronts.


That sounds like a good method. How much space should there be behind the heel?


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## msphotog

If I remember correctly, I was taught early in my history with Allen Edmonds shoes that it's more important to have the ball of your foot at the widest part of the shoe, and not really any extra space in the heel. The space in front of the big toe, as long as you had at least 1/2" of space wasn't critical. I bought a pair of Park Avenues in 1980, and I thought the toes were much too long, so I bought two pairs of shoes on the #4 last. Back then, the #4last had a slightly squared off toe, that I thought looked better... I've since learned to appreciate the more pointed toe, and my Wilberts as well as the Sanfords I just bought have about 1-1/2" of toe space. BTW, I measure a size 11, but 11-1/2 shoes fit better(more toe room)...


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## DoghouseReilly

msphotog said:


> If I remember correctly, I was taught early in my history with Allen Edmonds shoes that it's more important to have the ball of your foot at the widest part of the shoe, and not really any extra space in the heel. The space in front of the big toe, as long as you had at least 1/2" of space wasn't critical.


+1. Well put.


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