# Kiwi Polish



## brokencycle (Jan 11, 2008)

I have a question about Kiwi polish. I personally have only used them, and this thread isn't really about comparing Kiwi polish to other polishes.

I have Kiwi Parade Gloss in black, standard Kiwi polish in cordovan, and Kiwi Select in brown. I know the Parade Gloss is far better (in terms of getting a shine) than standard black. My question is: is there any real difference between the standard and the "select." I mean if there is I will certainly buy the select from now on, there might be a dollar difference for a standard tin. Kiwi's website says this about the Parade Gloss: 

For ultimate shine while nourishing and protecting your shoes, KIWI offers Parade Gloss. Parade gloss offers a premium blend of wax, with more carnuba wax than regular paste for a higher gloss shine.

Also, is it worth it to invest in some leather lotion, and if so how often should I use that?


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## TMMKC (Aug 2, 2007)

I suggest you read the piece Andy wrote on this site about shining shoes. In my experience, Kiwi dries out leather because of its high alcohol content. Cream and paste polishes are better at preserving leather. However, nothing gives a better shine than Kiwi. 

Also, do a Search. There have been several excellent threads on AAAC on this topic.


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## brokencycle (Jan 11, 2008)

Will you link me to Andy's article? I searched and could not find it.

Also, I found threads that asked the same question of whether their standard line is different than their select line; however, there never was an answer on that question.


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## Bishop of Briggs (Sep 7, 2007)

I purchase wax shoe polish, in the same shade as the shoes, from the manufacturer/retailer, mainly C&J and Trickers.


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## jmr (Mar 6, 2006)

Is there any reason not to use liquid polish regularly? It is so much easier to use. Thanks.


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

Don't use Kiwi, and especially don't use Kiwi Parade Gloss (usually you have to struggle to make sure the stuff you're putting on your leather doesn't have silicon in it. Kiwi comes right out and says it has extra silicon on the tin of parade gloss). A cobbler told me that Sara Lee spends more time on their cakes than on their sheo polish, and I'm inclined to believe him. I'd look into Tarrago or Kelly's.

Liquid polish is murder on your shoes.


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## Cordovan (Feb 1, 2008)

jmr said:


> Is there any reason not to use liquid polish regularly? It is so much easier to use. Thanks.


Absolutely never use liquid. It will dry out and crack. I personally find that cream polish works the best and I even get a better shine with it than with Kiwi. I get comments regularly on my shoes' sheen. That said, perhaps you may not like such a sheen.

Cordovan


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## TMMKC (Aug 2, 2007)

brokencycle said:


> Will you link me to Andy's article? I searched and could not find it.
> 
> Also, I found threads that asked the same question of whether their standard line is different than their select line; however, there never was an answer on that question.


https://askandyaboutclothes.com/Clothes Articles/perfect_shoeshine.htm


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## cgc (Jan 27, 2007)

Link to Andy's article:

https://askandyaboutclothes.com/Clothes Articles/perfect_shoeshine.htm

I use the tubes of cream from Allen Edmonds on my shoes as they make less of mess.


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## Haruspex (Nov 23, 2007)

*AE tube polish?*

Any opinions on Allen Edmonds' brand of polish? It seems to be a mix of both cream and polish, and I like that it applies well, compared to can polishes I've tried.


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## TMMKC (Aug 2, 2007)

cgc said:


> Link to Andy's article:
> 
> https://askandyaboutclothes.com/Clothes Articles/perfect_shoeshine.htm
> 
> I use the tubes of cream from Allen Edmonds on my shoes as they make less of mess.


I've used those before (as well as the similar product from J&M) and like them. You're right...less mess.


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## Andy (Aug 25, 2002)

brokencycle said:


> Will you link me to Andy's article? I searched and could not find it.


Yes, brokencycle, there is a *Home Page* on this website!!!! Read down the left column for articles and check out the Tutorials section for fantastic information.

And support the sponsors!! :icon_smile_big:


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## brokencycle (Jan 11, 2008)

The Kiwi Select tin says it is a paste. If I clean my shoes regularly, I don't see what is so bad about the wax. I haven't had any problems yet, and all my buddies use them on their combat boots and they still look as good as they did the day we were issued them.


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## brokencycle (Jan 11, 2008)

Andy said:


> Yes, brokencycle, there is a *Home Page* on this website!!!! Read down the left column for articles and check out the Tutorials section for fantastic information.
> 
> And support the sponsors!! :icon_smile_big:


I did check the home page. I must have just missed it.

Also, I do support the sponsers, when I have money to spend. =P


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## Concordia (Sep 30, 2004)

It has been reported either here or on LL that Edward Green produces their antique colors on crust leather using... Kiwi. Tons of it.

That's pretty much what Cleverley recommends for their bespoke, as well. Actually I don't think they're that fussy one way or the other, as long as you polish a lot and make sure to force it down into the welt.


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

brokencycle said:


> The Kiwi Select tin says it is a paste. If I clean my shoes regularly, I don't see what is so bad about the wax. I haven't had any problems yet, and all my buddies use them on their combat boots and they still look as good as they did the day we were issued them.


Combat boots are made from a very stiff leather (well, the old combat boots from the pre-desert days). Stiff leather is what those wax polishes are for. One should use cream polishes on soft leather.


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

Here's what leatherique (well respected name in automotive circles) has to say about silicon and leather

"Another myth about leather care involves the Silicon based and "sealer type" family of products, including wax. These products do nothing but cause a seal on your leather, vinyl, and rubber, which may provide an attractive finish, if you want shinny, upon initial application, as all the dried pores are now filled in with the sealer and the surface has a more uniform, glossy appearance. Silicon products applied to leather do not allow the leather fibers to breathe or receive any nourishment. Would your skin benefit from wearing rubber gloves perpetually or wrapping yourself from head to toe in an air tight coating? Avoid all raw silicone oil based products. The silicone oil will dissolve out the leather's natural oils and tend to make the leather sticky. Silicone oil's high electrostatic attraction will attract dust, grime, and air pollution to your tack. We absolutely do not recommend these products for any type of leather application."


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## SpookyTurtle (Nov 4, 2007)

marlinspike said:


> Don't use Kiwi, and especially don't use Kiwi Parade Gloss (usually you have to struggle to make sure the stuff you're putting on your leather doesn't have silicon in it. Kiwi comes right out and says it has extra silicon on the tin of parade gloss). A cobbler told me that Sara Lee spends more time on their cakes than on their sheo polish, and I'm inclined to believe him. I'd look into Tarrago or Kelly's.
> 
> Liquid polish is murder on your shoes.


Odd, I had a cobbler tell me that Kiwi was fine, it was a matter of personal preference to use wax or cream polish. And he is well regarded in my area.

And here is another thread that contains information about Kiwi.
https://askandyaboutclothes.com/com...679042&highlight=Edward+green+Kiwi#post679042

It is mentioned in the above link that Edward Green reccomends Kiwi. Fact or myth? Who knows? But it seems a bit extreme to tell someone not to use Kiwi when there is plenty of information to support its use. I can see saying so as a matter of opinion and personal preference and I think that if you talked to several cobblers you would get a variety of responses. But Kiwi being no good? Personally I disagree.


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## brokencycle (Jan 11, 2008)

Well, I don't think I'll be tossing all my Kiwi away anytime soon. But the question still remains, which was the original question: is there a difference between Kiwi Select and the standard Kiwi? Is it just a name thing to charge a bit more or is it legitimately different?


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

SpookyTurtle said:


> It is mentioned in the above link that Edward Green reccomends Kiwi. Fact or myth? Who knows? But it seems a bit extreme to tell someone not to use Kiwi when there is plenty of information to support its use. I can see saying so as a matter of opinion and personal preference and I think that if you talked to several cobblers you would get a variety of responses. But Kiwi being no good? Personally I disagree.


NB: I was saying never to use Kiwi Parade Gloss, but I was simply saying that I prefer other brands to Kiwi in general. The parade gloss says right on it that it has extra silicon, and anybody who knows anything about leather knows that the two should never touch.


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## brokencycle (Jan 11, 2008)

marlinspike said:


> NB: I was saying never to use Kiwi Parade Gloss, but I was simply saying that I prefer other brands to Kiwi in general. The parade gloss says right on it that it has extra silicon, and anybody who knows anything about leather knows that the two should never touch.


Never is a bit extreme.


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## Conrad Poohs (Feb 1, 2006)

Wasn't there some discussion here a while ago about the Parade Gloss available in the UK being different from that available in the US, ie having no silicon in it?


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## trolperft (Feb 7, 2007)

https://askandyaboutclothes.com/community/showthread.php?t=45683&highlight=kiwi+parade+gloss


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## SpookyTurtle (Nov 4, 2007)

marlinspike said:


> NB: I was saying never to use Kiwi Parade Gloss, but I was simply saying that I prefer other brands to Kiwi in general. The parade gloss says right on it that it has extra silicon, and anybody who knows anything about leather knows that the two should never touch.


What does NB stand for? Thanks.


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## trolperft (Feb 7, 2007)

NB=Very important thing
https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=nb


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

SpookyTurtle said:


> What does NB stand for? Thanks.


Note bene, which means Note well. I guess I should have written N.B. to avoid people thinking it's an internet abbreviation.


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## NavyNick (Nov 21, 2007)

Cordovan said:


> Absolutely never use liquid. It will dry out and crack.


+1

Kiwi polish is great overall - I will say this, unless you are spit polishing your shoes, in other words, using a rag and water or saliva to get a mirror shine (hence the need for silicone), there is no advantage to parade gloss. Parade gloss is meant for (ready? big secret coming...) . . . Parades! If you're buffing leathers to a high shine that needs to be seen from 30 yards away, it's great, I've used it many times. But if you are brush shining shoes, and choose to use a paste polish, the regular Kiwi will do a fine job. As mentioned above, although no silicone means a "shallower" shine it will last much longer since it doesn't attrack dust and dirt as easily.

It is true that creams do a better job of moisturizing the leather, but are harder to buff to a shine. Personally, I use paste polish, and cream every 5 or 6 times to revitalize the leather. Does a great job. Hope that helps,
Cheers,
Nick


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## mafoofan (May 16, 2005)

I've _seen_ one of Edward Green's workers polishing shoes with Kiwi polish at Sky Valet in D.C. during an Edward Green trunk show. However, I've also experienced the described drying effect on my own shoes. I don't know _what_ to think.


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## cvac (Aug 6, 2006)

Maybe ultra shiny shoes look better on display and sell better. That could have something to do with it.



mafoofan said:


> I've _seen_ one of Edward Green's workers polishing shoes with Kiwi polish at Sky Valet in D.C. during an Edward Green trunk show. However, I've also experienced the described drying effect on my own shoes. I don't know _what_ to think.


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## brokencycle (Jan 11, 2008)

I'm pretty sure this whole discussion has evaded my fundamental question. I have a tin of Kiwi "Select" and a tin of Kiwi standard stuff. The "Select" is not the same as "Parade Gloss." I simply want to know if there is a difference or if it is simply a different name to justify a higher price.


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## SpookyTurtle (Nov 4, 2007)

mafoofan said:


> I've _seen_ one of Edward Green's workers polishing shoes with Kiwi polish at Sky Valet in D.C. during an Edward Green trunk show. However, I've also experienced the described drying effect on my own shoes. I don't know _what_ to think.


Maybe using a leather conditioner would help to offset the drying effect. I have used many brands of polish over the years and I haven't had any problems with the leather drying or cracking. I have used creams and wax based polish. I prefer a wax base in New England in the winter time, especially on casual or "beater" shoes.


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## NavyNick (Nov 21, 2007)

brokencycle said:


> I'm pretty sure this whole discussion has evaded my fundamental question. I have a tin of Kiwi "Select" and a tin of Kiwi standard stuff. The "Select" is not the same as "Parade Gloss." I simply want to know if there is a difference or if it is simply a different name to justify a higher price.


If the can says you're getting more carnuba wax then in theory it will shine up better. Same thing applies to car wax. The only negative I can think of is higher price, and it may be a little harder to "work" into the leather. A good way to fix that problem is heat the can just a bit before you start. Not so much that it gets mushy or anything, just a little above room temperature.


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## SpookyTurtle (Nov 4, 2007)

brokencycle said:


> I'm pretty sure this whole discussion has evaded my fundamental question. I have a tin of Kiwi "Select" and a tin of Kiwi standard stuff. The "Select" is not the same as "Parade Gloss." I simply want to know if there is a difference or if it is simply a different name to justify a higher price.


Alas, your thread has been hijacked. Not much info about Select, I don't think it's even on the US site. Parade Gloss supposedly contains more carnauba wax along with silicon. Perhaps the Select is a slightly different blend than the regular Kiwi?


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## brokencycle (Jan 11, 2008)

SpookyTurtle said:


> Alas, your thread has been hijacked. Not much info about Select, I don't think it's even on the US site. Parade Gloss supposedly contains more carnauba wax along with silicon. Perhaps the Select is a slightly different blend than the regular Kiwi?


I agree with you Spookey. I will email Kiwi and ask them and post their response here.


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## SpookyTurtle (Nov 4, 2007)

I think I need to make some changes in my life. I never would have imagined that one day I would be discussing the merits of various types of shoe polish and finding it interesting. Perhaps for excitement some Saturday night we could discuss shoe laces. Help.....


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## brokencycle (Jan 11, 2008)

Oh Spooky, we are all doomed aren't we?


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## rip (Jul 13, 2005)

SpookyTurtle said:


> What does NB stand for? Thanks.


from the Latin, Nota Bene = Note Well... in other words, pay attention to this. Somewhat less overused than exclamation points!


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

rip said:


> from the Latin, Nota Bene = Note Well... in other words, pay attention to this. Somewhat less overused than exclamation points!


As a product of Jesuit education, it peppers my high school notes.


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## Leather man (Mar 11, 2007)

*True!*

It is absolutely true that Edward Green uses Kiwi in their factory to colour their crust leathers. I've had the conversation with them!

However that in itself wouldn't endorse the use of Kiwi long term. The Edward Green London shop does say that Kiwi is " a perfectly acceptable polish, but don't use the Parade Gloss sir".

I prefer to use either Church's own brand ( beeswax polish) or Edward Green own brand which is a little more creamy ( both wax in tins) and is also beeswax polish.


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## fullgrain (Jan 5, 2007)

trolperft said:


> NB=Very important thing
> https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=nb


No insult to the urbandictionary intended, but I'd go w/ Marlinspike, rip, and the Jesuits. NB=note well. It can also be glossed as "word to the wise."



> Perhaps for excitement some Saturday night we could discuss shoe laces.


Spooky, there was actually a thread on variations in shoelace tying not long ago. It changed my life. :icon_smile:


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## Simon Myerson (Nov 8, 2007)

I Kiwi select as a cream as well as a polish. The cream is easier to use and seems to produce a reasonable shine if left before brushing for about an hour.


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## brokencycle (Jan 11, 2008)

'Kiwi' and 'Kiwi Select' products are the same. 'Kiwi Select' products are just found in high-end stores like:
JcPenny's
Sears
Nordstrom's

While our 'Kiwi' line products can be found at:
Wal-Mart
Target
K Mart
Sporting Good Stores
Most Grocery and Drug Stores

Thanks

Consumer Affairs Department
Sara Lee Household and Body Care-USA


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## SpookyTurtle (Nov 4, 2007)

brokencycle said:


> 'Kiwi' and 'Kiwi Select' products are the same. 'Kiwi Select' products are just found in high-end stores like:
> JcPenny's
> Sears
> Nordstrom's
> ...


LMAO! High end stores like Sears and JCP? And it is the same product. Good research job brokencycle and they did reply very fast.

Now onto shoe lace material and construction......


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## Brooksfan (Jan 25, 2005)

FWIW both the gentlemen from whom I buy my Aldens (all calfskin) and the owner of Brooks Shoe Service who rebuilds them when needed, advised me not to use the Alden Shoe Cream and specifically recommended basic Kiwi black polish. Again, won't debate but I have to think if the guy who can sell me Alden products foregoes that revenue when he doesn't even sell the Kiwi product, there has to be some merit to his (their) advice.


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## brokencycle (Jan 11, 2008)

I would always strongly heed the advice of a salesman who will lose money from you taking their advice.


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

Well, it looks like different people will tell you different things, but I think one should ask oneself if one cares to support a company that would 1 - repackage the exact same item to charge more for it and 2 - sell a protect for putting on leather that contains silicon. When I buy a product, any product, it's important to me that the company cares about what they're putting their name on.


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## tkteo (Feb 12, 2008)

Hello everyone. I joined this AAAC forum not long ago, and find this discussing interesting. Perhaps some of you will be able to provide clarifications to my questions. I will mention some products I find available in Singapore as examples, if this helps my future purchase decisions.

1) This discussion about Kiwi brand Parade Gloss shoe polish has centered on its silicon content. So high silicon content is bad for the leather. Now what about shoe creams containing beeswax? (Example, Dasco's shoe polish.) If silicon-based and beeswax are both waxes, then what makes beeswax "better"?

2) What is the difference between shoe polishes and creams? One comes in jars and the other in tubes? The amount of silicon or wax in the composition?

3) I note that Johnston & Murphy's shoe cream contains waxes, while Ecco's shoe cream is "water-based". So is the Ecco type of shoe cream safer for the leather, but i should expect less shine from using it?

4) Seems to me that there is a tradeoff between shine in the short run and caring for the leather in the longer run. How important is shine anyway? Personally I tend to notice it more when a pair of shoes has not been maintained with shoe cream, than whether it is very shiny.

Sincerely,
Kwang


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

Beeswax gets somewhat absorbed into the leather and makes a shine by making every tiny spot on the shoe smooth. Silicon sits on top of the leather completely and makes a shine by clogging all of the pores to make the leather smooth on the grand scale. This creates a higher shine, but leather does not like to have its pores clogged.

The only shoes you should be using the paste waxes on are the kind made from a stiff leather. On soft leather, wax polishes won't get absorbed and it'd be bad for the same reasons that silicon is bad for all leather (to a lesser extent, but still bad), so on soft leather you should use cream polishes.


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## eagle2250 (Mar 24, 2006)

Haruspex said:


> Any opinions on Allen Edmonds' brand of polish? It seems to be a mix of both cream and polish, and I like that it applies well, compared to can polishes I've tried.


Personally, I don't think you will find anything better!


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## dcjacobson (Jun 25, 2007)

I like a high shine on my shoes, and the best polish I've ever used is Lincoln Stain Wax. Kiwi is a close second. When I get a new pair of shoes, it takes about an hour to get that shine. But once it's there, subsequent shines take no time at all.

I've worn dress shoes on the job since 1980 and I've never had a "drying out" problem of any kind. Several pairs of shoes I've had have lasted twenty years.

Good luck,
Don


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## cobblestone (Feb 13, 2007)

*HIGH SHINES*



TMMKC said:


> I suggest you read the piece Andy wrote on this site about shining shoes. In my experience, Kiwi dries out leather because of its high alcohol content. Cream and paste polishes are better at preserving leather. However, nothing gives a better shine than Kiwi.
> 
> Also, do a Search. There have been several excellent threads on AAAC on this topic.


Angelus paste polish shines much higher than kiwi. Try it. you will see.


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## eagle2250 (Mar 24, 2006)

cobblestone said:


> Angelus paste polish shines much higher than kiwi. Try it. you will see.


...and where might one purchase Angelus polish and in what tones is it offered?


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

Black, Brown, Lt. Brown, Dark Brown, Tan, Cordovan, Grey, Mahogany, Navy Blue, Midnight Green, Neutral, Oxblood, Red, and White

You could google it.
Their own website is https://www.angelusshoepolish.com/


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