# Professor believes he has "right" to date students



## JRR (Feb 11, 2006)

https://news.aol.com/newsbloggers/2007/08/21/a-right-to-date-students-come-on-professor/


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## Acct2000 (Sep 24, 2005)

I suppose if he can't find sex anyplace else - - -

Obviously, he oblivious to the need for fairness. His case is about half the way to NAMBLA.

He's just another immature person who sees only rights, but not responsibilities for himself. This type of thinking will coorode our society.


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

I think he has every right to date students at the university where he teaches. I also think the university should then be compelled to terminate him for exercising his right as he has created an inherent conflict of interest IMO. I am sure some attorney will come along and explain the error of my thinking, but I am admittedly old fashioned that way.


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## Kav (Jun 19, 2005)

One of the 'perks' of academia is a ready supply of physically attractive females and males with their brains not fully hardwired. It was the one issue that turned me from teaching after witnessing several instances and being the perceived chump in one directly. Abramson needs to join Ward Churchill in the unemployment line.


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## Albert (Feb 15, 2006)

Wayfarer said:


> I think he has every right to date students at the university where he teaches. I also think the university should then be compelled to terminate him for exercising his right as he has created an inherent conflict of interest IMO.


+1

If anyone in my workplace starts a relationship with someone else within his direct line of reporting, he or she has to immediately inform his group head and, if necessary, move to a different department. Otherwise he or she might be terminated. Everything else incentivises buying benevolence by means of sexual favours.


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

Kav said:


> One of the 'perks' of academia is a ready supply of physically attractive females and males with their brains not fully hardwired. *It was the one issue that turned me from teaching* after witnessing several instances and being the perceived chump in one directly. Abramson needs to join Ward Churchill in the unemployment line.


That and the "no peyote" clause?  :icon_smile:


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## Howard (Dec 7, 2004)

I don't think he has a right to date students unless the student is willing to say yes and go out with him.

But doesn't this professor have a wife or somebody that he comes home to?


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## JLibourel (Jun 13, 2004)

I never could see a conflict of interest dating students who were not enrolled in your classes, at least as long as they were over the age of consent!

These categorical prohibitions against any and all student-faculty dating are of fairly recent vintage as part of the highly successful feminist war against men. There was no such prohibition in my day. Many professors did marry students.

Of course an old boy of 57 might have more difficulty hitting on the students than I did when was in my late 20s.


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

Howard said:


> I don't think he has a right to date students unless the student is willing to say yes and go out with him.


You still have moments of your former glory. Frankly though, you've lost your game.


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

JLibourel said:


> I never could see a conflict of interest dating students who were not enrolled in your classes, at least as long as they were over the age of consent!
> 
> These categorical prohibitions against any and all student-faculty dating are of fairly recent vintage as part of the highly successful feminist war against men. *There was no such prohibition in my day.* Many professors did marry students.


But Jan, in your day, were not most schools single sex and marriages arranged? In fact, were women even allowed in post-secondary education at that time?


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## Howard (Dec 7, 2004)

Wayfarer said:


> You still have moments of your former glory. Frankly though, you've lost your game.


What do you mean Wayfar?


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## Laxplayer (Apr 26, 2006)

Howard said:


> What do you mean Wayfar?


He means your humor has dwindled.


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## Howard (Dec 7, 2004)

Laxplayer said:


> He means your humor has dwindled.


Or is it that my words don't make much sense?


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## Laxplayer (Apr 26, 2006)

Howard said:


> Or is it that my words don't make much sense?


That's a nice way to put it.


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## Howard (Dec 7, 2004)

Laxplayer said:


> That's a nice way to put it.


I'm sorry you feel that way but I had my own opinion.


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## Albert (Feb 15, 2006)

Howard said:


> But doesn't this professor have a wife or somebody that he comes home to?




You are so right, Howi.


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## TMMKC (Aug 2, 2007)

Howard said:


> But doesn't this professor have a wife or somebody that he comes home to?


She's probably the reason he's dating students.


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## omairp (Aug 21, 2006)

Whatever happened to "Don't dip your pen in the company (university) ink?"


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## Kav (Jun 19, 2005)

Use of Peyote by the Native American Church has been subject to many legal decisions. As it stood during my studies, the practise was legal if you were A. recognised by ancestry or cultural affiliation with a recognised tribe and B. Doing so as part of initiation or practise within that culture. I was invited with no solicitation on my part after a long academic and social association by a recognised religous leader who also confirmed my eligability with the Choctaw Nation. I did it once, far out in the Anza Borrega desert under a peer system unbroken for at least a few thousand years. I did not operate farm machinery, aircraft, automobiles or combine it's use with other prescribed medications, drugs or alcohol. The actual ingestion of 3 buttons was ancillary to a lengthy 'ceremony' both before and after. I had an assigned guide who fasted and took no peyote. It was rewarding for it's; academic, spiritual, positive psychological experience and physicaly exausting. The alcoholic, womanising, plagarizing and BIRKENSTOCK and no tie clad Doctorate of Anthropology on my graduate comittee wanted a full report of everything. I told him what I tell everyone: It is a confidential trust and private,not always honoured to most and ultimately very sobering. I think that last scared him back to his Vodka and main squeeze ofr the semester's remainder.


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## jackmccullough (May 10, 2006)

You should read the interview at the Journal. He specifically says he isn't interested in sex with students for himself, but he is doing this as a matter of principle. It's fine to disagree with him, but it doesn't help matters to misconstrue his position.


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## Trenditional (Feb 15, 2006)

Kinda like an officer saying he has the "right" to date a hooker he has arrested. Just a bit of a conflict of interest.

Ironically enough, a Utah police chief's (stripper) wife was arrested by Nevada officers recently for selling drugs at the strip joint she worked at. I'd like to know what dinner conversations were like in that house.


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## zegnamtl (Apr 19, 2005)

Trenditional said:


> ....
> Ironically enough, a Utah police chief's (stripper) wife was arrested by Nevada officers recently for selling drugs at the strip joint she worked at. I'd like to know what dinner conversations were like in that house.


What is the old saying about there being only a very thin line between right and wrong?? :-0


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## zegnamtl (Apr 19, 2005)

I was at a very nice wedding last weekend,
outdoors, a perfect day, great setting, really nice people.

The wackiest man there was a Prof from a large university, who told all who would listen how after three divorces, he will only date students.
he was 55 plus, long hair pulled into a pony tail and dressed very oddly, he gave a nasty speech that was not scheduled (read, he just got up and took the mike). But he was there with a very lovely 25 year old student who danced beautifully. His hands were all over her rear end. He was totally out of place and too stupid to realize. It was not the finest hour for aging university Profs!!
Finally she had enough and they left very early in the evening. What she was thinking attending with him in the first place was beyond me.


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## rip (Jul 13, 2005)

Although I married my theatre professor, I don't really think it's a good idea for a prof to date a student who is, or might be, in one of his/her classes. As with doctors and patients, lawyers and clients, there is a serious imbalance of power between the parties that always begs the question of true consent.


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

rip said:


> Although I married my theatre professor, I don't really think it's a good idea for a prof to date a student who is, or might be, in one of his/her classes. As with doctors and patients, lawyers and clients, there is a serious imbalance of power between the parties that always begs the question of true consent.


Damn, on the same side of an issue twice in one week. Did it suddenly start freezing at Hillary's house?


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## Kav (Jun 19, 2005)

Obviously this guy is full of altruistic intentions to further the freedoms of humanity in the grand tradition of Mr Chips. It aint gonna happen dude! Why? The cost of attending college is rediculous. And parents send little Yolanda off, half worried some moron online will seduce her in a chatroom, show up on a bike and Yolanda's femur winds up in a coyote's mouth being chased by 3 other coyotes out by Edwards AFB. Or some freak who 'slipped through the cracks' shoots up the campus and kills 30 + students and faculty. Or a protest gets out of hand and we have another Kent state. Anyone want to mention hazing in fraternities and sororities or the scouts from Girls Gone Wild? And this,what, Psychiatrist! is crazy enough to think University Trustees are going to announce, 'Oh, by the way, the courts have ruled our staff have a right to get in Yolanda's pantys. But don't worry, the student health clinic you also paid x dollars for hands out contraceptive advise and unplanned pregnancy counselling.' And mom and dad wonder, Why do we shell out $150 bucks for this shmuck's authored textbook if Yolanda just has to put out- Which she did, for 8 A's and a Doctorate in pre Columbian Arcaheology with some academic crap about woman's depictions in ceramics, with many illustrations of them in rather familiar poses.


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## rip (Jul 13, 2005)

Wayfarer said:


> Damn, on the same side of an issue twice in one week. Did it suddenly start freezing at Hillary's house?


At the risk of causing a coronary, I would also agree you have a pretty good understanding of the location of the outer reaches of Hell.


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## rip (Jul 13, 2005)

Kav said:


> Obviously this guy is full of altruistic intentions to further the freedoms of humanity in the grand tradition of Mr Chips. It aint gonna happen dude! Why? The cost of attending college is rediculous. And parents send little Yolanda off, half worried some moron online will seduce her in a chatroom, show up on a bike and Yolanda's femur winds up in a coyote's mouth being chased by 3 other coyotes out by Edwards AFB. Or some freak who 'slipped through the cracks' shoots up the campus and kills 30 + students and faculty. Or a protest gets out of hand and we have another Kent state. Anyone want to mention hazing in fraternities and sororities or the scouts from Girls Gone Wild? And this,what, Psychiatrist! is crazy enough to think University Trustees are going to announce, 'Oh, by the way, the courts have ruled our staff have a right to get in Yolanda's pantys. But don't worry, *the student health clinic you also paid x dollars for hands out contraceptive advise and unplanned pregnancy counselling.*' And mom and dad wonder, Why do we shell out $150 bucks for this shmuck's authored textbook if Yolanda just has to put out- Which she did, for 8 A's and a Doctorate in pre Columbian Arcaheology with some academic crap about woman's depictions in ceramics, with many illustrations of them in rather familiar poses.


 Recent news article states that birth control pills, etc., in colleges will have jumped as much as 5 times this coming school year.


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## Albert (Feb 15, 2006)

Kav said:


> And mom and dad wonder, Why do we shell out $150 bucks for this shmuck's authored textbook if Yolanda just has to put out- Which she did, for 8 A's and a Doctorate in pre Columbian Arcaheology with some academic crap about woman's depictions in ceramics, with many illustrations of them in rather familiar poses.


+1000, Kav.

It might sound a bit ridiculous but this is a common and widely visible phenomenon in Germany. Mostly it doesn't even make it to the papers. The only _real_ scandal was when a prof strongly suggested to a junior colleague to favourably grade the PhD thesis of his mistress he was living together with so that he could promote her from TA to junior prof. (The thesis seems to have been a pig's breakfast and all earlier grades were signed for by her lover)

But what else would you expect from a state funded education system?

Cheers,
A.


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## guitone (Mar 20, 2005)

When I was a sophomore in 1970 there was a female professor that was sleeping with one of her male students. We all wanted to be him, she was very beautiful. I think you see this more at the graduate level, why a professor would want to date a young immature woman other than for the obvious reasons is beyond me. Being a father who's daughter is entering her freshman year I cannot even lust after young ladies I see on the street, they need to be mature woman to get my attention. Is this like those that like little girls only a notch removed. I mean what is the difference, ok, little girl/adult man is somewhat different, but the thought of a 50 year old man and a 20 year old woman just seems to be a disconnect for me.


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## android (Dec 8, 2004)

I have so many problems with this whole premise. 

The first is the "balance of power" argument. Get real folks, professors, lawyers and doctors don't have any more "power" over another human than car salesmen and garbage men. It's not like they are vampires and can control minds. No one forces clients or patients to date. I would bet that these professionals are mostly considered "a catch" and probably have to turn away more come ons than they ever dish out. 

Secondly, I getting really tired of the concept of an 18 year old adult attending a university being considered a "child". THEY'RE ALL GROWN UP, MOMMY and DADDY!! You have your chance to instill values for the first 18 years. Get used to the fact that you cannot control their lives any more! (well, unless you've brainwashed or bribed them)

And lastly, grades for sex would obviously violate other cheating or ethics codes at every university on the planet, so I cannot see why additional rules would be necessary. Once again, enforce the rules that exist, rather than make up layers and layers of stupid rules to prevent something that might happen in 2% of the cases.


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## Acct2000 (Sep 24, 2005)

They may be adults legally, but it is totally unethical for adults 30 years older than them who are in a position of power over them to use them for sex.

Besides, appearances are usually just as important as reality. Who is to say that a professor is doing anything fairly when he is mixing his sex life with his academic life. 

A lot of things, like written essays have a lot of subjectivity in grading. Did the girl fail because she did not put out? Was she given an A because she can outdo Monica Lewinsky in the oral sex department?

There is a huge can of worms that need not be opened. There are over 4 billion women in the world. Surely the professor can find a woman that he does not have power over to "do", can't he? If he can't, then the 18 year old women he lusts after probably aren't all that attracted to him, either.


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## rip (Jul 13, 2005)

android said:


> I have so many problems with this whole premise.
> 
> The first is the "balance of power" argument. Get real folks, professors, lawyers and doctors don't have any more "power" over another human than car salesmen and garbage men. It's not like they are vampires and can control minds. No one forces clients or patients to date. I would bet that these professionals are mostly considered "a catch" and probably have to turn away more come ons than they ever dish out.
> 
> ...


Initially, you need to expand your education a bit to include some courses in contemporary psychology; the factor of transference is a well known and documented phenomenon, and occurs not only between a psychologist/psychiatrist and his/her client/patient, but between any two people sharing that level of confidence, or in which one person has a perceptible amount of power over another, which is why the canon of ethics in many professions is absolute about the issue of dating one's client/patient.

Also, study in brain development might be helpful to you. It has been well established over the past 20 years or so that the parts of the brain that control the so-called executive decision such as risk assessment and the understanding of consequences is not fully developed until the early twenties, _

"Neuro scientist Jay Giedd (National Institute of Mental Health) and neurologist Paul Thompson (University of California) found one of the most significant changes to be in the frontal lobes or prefrontal cortex.3 It is these areas, among other things, which control impulses, calm emotions,
provide an understanding of the consequences of behavior and allow reasoned, logical and rational decision making processes. These "executive functions" do not fully develop until the early twenties.4
Jordan Graffman (cognitive neuro scientist) explains "the prefrontal cortex denotes social behavior and knowledge; the ability to infer the mental states of others and to have insight and reflect on your own behavior."5 Daniel Weinberger (Director of the Clinical Brain Disorders Laboratory, National Institute of Health) continues: "It allows us to act on the basis of reason. It
can preclude an overwhelming tendency for action (for example to run from a fire..)because an abstract memory (don't panic)makes more sense. It also allows us to consciously control our tendency to have impulsive behavior. Without a prefrontal cortex, it would be impossible to have societies based on moral and legal codes."_

Unless you set yourself up as more knowledgeable than the National Institutes of Health and the authors of the various canons of ethics in the professions, you might need to rethink your assumption that 18 year olds are adults and can make rational informed decisions about such things as the intent of a professor who wants to date them and the consequences thereof.


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

rip said:


> At the risk of causing a coronary, I would also agree you have a pretty good understanding of the location of the outer reaches of Hell.


Actually we had a monsoon come through, temps are sub-100 which is pretty bearable for this time of year.


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

android said:


> Secondly, I getting really tired of the concept of an 18 year old adult attending a university being considered a "child". THEY'RE ALL GROWN UP, MOMMY and DADDY!! You have your chance to instill values for the first 18 years. Get used to the fact that you cannot control their lives any more! (well, unless you've brainwashed or bribed them)


This is going to sound harsh. The only people that think an 18 year old is all grown up is...an 18 year old.

This issue is not to control their lives, but rather help provide them with a relatively benign environment so they can *finish growing up*. Part of this process is making most of your own decisions but it is certainly not having wiser, more experienced, older figures in authority twist you into having a romantic relationship with them. Most people, by the time they are 40, can easily twist all but the rarest 18 year old into mental knots without even trying.


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## JLibourel (Jun 13, 2004)

I was always against giving 18-year-olds the vote. The rationale was that if we draft them, it's only fair to give them the franchise. Fair enough. Only problem was, the draft was ended almost immediately thereafter. As it is, 18-to-21 year olds are kind of relegated to a second-class citizenship, being denied certain rights even aliens possess. As far as I am concerned, if we entrust them with the vote, then they ought to be able to buy booze and guns and enjoy whatever other perks they are denied until they are 21.

As to the matter of the professors and the students, I think we are all in agreement that dating one's own students is improper.

As for all this feminist-inspired BS about "power relationships," sexy young girls have been telling lecherous older guys to bug off from the beginning of time, I'm sure...unless the girls thought it in their interest to do otherwise.

I'd be very interest to see an experiment conducted in which a number of prominent business leaders, physicians, judges, attorneys and whatnot in their late 50s and early 60s went to a nightclub frequented by 18- and 19-year-old girls to see if they could "score." I'd be willing to bet few if any would get "lucky."

And the student-professor thing isn't all a matter of aging lechers going after sweet young things. I had a strong flirtation with one of my students. We never did the deed since she was married and loyal to her husband. I was 29. She was 43.


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## Trenditional (Feb 15, 2006)

guitone said:


> When I was a sophomore in 1970 there was a female professor that was sleeping with one of her male students. We all wanted to be him, she was very beautiful. I think you see this more at the graduate level, why a professor would want to date a young immature woman other than for the obvious reasons is beyond me. Being a father who's *daughter is entering her freshman year I cannot even lust after young ladies I see on the street,* they need to be mature woman to get my attention. Is this like those that like little girls only a notch removed. I mean what is the difference, ok, little girl/adult man is somewhat different, but the thought of a 50 year old man and a 20 year old woman just seems to be a disconnect for me.


Guitone, adding to your comment, having daughters makes you realize how wrong some thoughts are when you see an attractive young woman. A few weeks ago I was at the river with some friends and of course our attention was drawn to some young ladies a few boats over. The initial "guy" reaction was to gawk, but then my friend (also father to a daughter) and I said, "Some guys are going to be looking at our daughters like we're looking at these young girls" and all of a sudden I felt very guilty.


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## Houstonian (Aug 29, 2006)

JLibourel said:


> There was no such prohibition in my day. Many professors did marry students.
> 
> 
> > While this is much, much different than a college professor-over 18 student situation, I think it is too funny not to mention.
> ...


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## JLibourel (Jun 13, 2004)

Why the hell any man of any age should feel guilty about looking longingly. admiringly and even lustfully at young women in the very flower of their youth and beauty--really, in their breeding prime, I don't know, unless of course the lass in question is his own daughter or another close relative. It's just doing what comes naturally!


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## JLibourel (Jun 13, 2004)

Houstonian said:


> JLibourel said:
> 
> 
> > There was no such prohibition in my day. Many professors did marry students.
> ...


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## Kav (Jun 19, 2005)

Girl watching is an art. Bedroom eyes are rape.


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## rip (Jul 13, 2005)

JLibourel said:


> Why the hell any man of any age should feel guilty about looking longingly. admiringly and even lustfully at young women in the very flower of their youth and beauty--really, in their breeding prime, I don't know, unless of course the lass in question is his own daughter or another close relative. It's just doing what comes naturally!


Absolutely! I'm often reminded of Abraham and Ketura, his second wife whom he married when he was in his mid-hundreds and she was probably in her early twenties. The real question is, other than for money, why any young woman would want to date a man significantly older than she, unless she has some rather serious psychological issues (I don't mean just 10 or 15 years older. Many of the most lecherous professors are more than 50, so I'm talking a 20-30 year age spread). Of course, we older men like to think they would be attracted to us for our wisdom and worldliness. That said, next Tuesday, I have a dinner-date with a young woman in her mid-twenties. Clearly, the capacity for self-delusion knows no age limit. At least she is older than my granddaughter


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## philm (Jun 17, 2007)

If it is hot and stupid there will be trouble. Yet I married a student in one of my classes in 1980. We did not go out until the semester was over. No lie. We have been happily married for 27 years now with three children and a dog.


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## rip (Jul 13, 2005)

philm said:


> If it is hot and stupid there will be trouble. Yet I married a student in one of my classes in 1980. We did not go out until the semester was over. No lie. We have been happily married for 27 years now with three children and a dog.


As I briefly mentioned, I married my college theatre professor with whom, until she passed away in 2001, I shared 43 years of marriage, 3 children and 4 grandchilren. She was 10 years my senior.


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## Kav (Jun 19, 2005)

Well the Dog proves everything! Obviously a great many couples have met under social circumstances that are subject to scrutiny and concern and established healthy relationships. I think the key word is DISCRETE. I was a student worker typing up a test for my Poly Sci professor. I watched this nubile creature wiggle past me for a conference. He uncharacteristicaly left his door half open so I could witness the appointment. It seems the young lady was near to failing and stated she would 'do anything' to pass and did he have any suggestions? She was leaning over showing a good deal of decolatege and thigh. My prof asked " you will do anything?" She replied " yes, anything." He repeated " ANYTHING?" She again said " Yes, what can I do?" He leaned forward as she half pursed her bee-sting lips and with his mouth almost touching her ear said ' STUDY.' She was so clueless. He was in a very longterm gay relationship.


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## philm (Jun 17, 2007)

rip said:


> As I briefly mentioned, I married my college theatre professor with whom, until she passed away in 2001, I shared 43 years of marriage, 3 children and 4 grandchilren. She was 10 years my senior.


I am sorry about your loss. I'm 11 years older than my wife so I'll probably enter the great beyond before her. I know that at that point our mutual loss will be great. Yet, as you've probably found, life goes on, but the meaning of the relationship will never wear off and that is the beauty of life. Ne c'est pas?

Our best wishes to you!


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## rip (Jul 13, 2005)

philm said:


> I am sorry about your loss. I'm 11 years older than my wife so I'll probably enter the great beyond before her. I know that at that point our mutual loss will be great. Yet, as you've probably found, life goes on, but the meaning of the relationship will never wear off and that is the beauty of life. Ne c'est pas?
> 
> Our best wishes to you!


Mais oui!


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## eg1 (Jan 17, 2007)

Kav said:


> Use of Peyote by the Native American Church has been subject to many legal decisions. As it stood during my studies, the practise was legal if you were A. recognised by ancestry or cultural affiliation with a recognised tribe and B. Doing so as part of initiation or practise within that culture. I was invited with no solicitation on my part after a long academic and social association by a recognised religous leader who also confirmed my eligability with the Choctaw Nation. I did it once, far out in the Anza Borrega desert under a peer system unbroken for at least a few thousand years. I did not operate farm machinery, aircraft, automobiles or combine it's use with other prescribed medications, drugs or alcohol. The actual ingestion of 3 buttons was ancillary to a lengthy 'ceremony' both before and after. I had an assigned guide who fasted and took no peyote. It was rewarding for it's; academic, spiritual, positive psychological experience and physicaly exausting. The alcoholic, womanising, plagarizing and BIRKENSTOCK and no tie clad Doctorate of Anthropology on my graduate comittee wanted a full report of everything. I told him what I tell everyone: It is a confidential trust and private,not always honoured to most and ultimately very sobering. I think that last scared him back to his Vodka and main squeeze ofr the semester's remainder.


So much for that old fraud, Carlos Castaneda, eh?


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## Kav (Jun 19, 2005)

Carlos was a peer of three of my professors who graduated from UCLA. His college knickname was Carlos the BSer. Fraud? Don Juan was a well known Yaqui in the anthropological community. He was also a practising Catholic and had a family. Carlos' first book is nothing more than his REJECTED graduate thesis and reads like one with excessive footnotes. Juan Carlos was respected, but about as novel academically as a science fair mouse maze.Publishers regularly trawl colleges for potential manuscripts and somebody stumbled on Carlos. It was a best seller with proper timing and suddently Carlos was awarded his graduate degree and a lucrative publishing contract. The books got progressively more woo woo until Juan Carlos in fact brought suit against Carlos for part royalties. Castaneda died of liver cancer, one of the known longterm effects of jimson weed ingestion. His legacy is an unknown number of people who used his fiction as an ethical excuse to try various hallucinagins, the ones of southwest peoples generally rather nasty and toxic.


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## android (Dec 8, 2004)

rip said:


> Initially, you need to expand your education a bit to include some courses in contemporary psychology;


Psycho-babble crap.... Yes, I really want to waste my time on that. These are the hired guns that testify that murderers are "insane" and don't deserve justice and come up with some lame excuse for everybody that decides to blame their behavior on others. No thanks, I'll stick to personal responsibility and accountability.



rip said:


> Unless you set yourself up as more knowledgeable than the National Institutes of Health and the authors of the various canons of ethics in the professions, you might need to rethink your assumption that 18 year olds are adults and can make rational informed decisions about such things as the intent of a professor who wants to date them and the consequences thereof.


I'm not sure that people that leach off the taxpayers money are a good example here. Of course they have to produce mountains of papers to justify their existence on the public tit, but I hardly consider that validation of the premise.

I'm sorry, but people step up to the responsibility given. The reason young adults act the way they do is because they're too babied. Continuing to baby them until they're 25 doesn't help them grow up.


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## Howard (Dec 7, 2004)

Albert said:


> You are so right, Howi.


Yeah Why date a student if you're a wife and have a husband to come home to or if you're a husband and you have a wife to come home to.


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## Karl89 (Feb 20, 2005)

Howard,

Why do you post when no one cares?

Karl


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## Howard (Dec 7, 2004)

Karl89 said:


> Howard,
> 
> Why do you post when no one cares?
> 
> Karl


Well Karl,I CARE FYI!


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

Howard said:


> Well Karl,I CARE FYI!


Howa: should professors have a right to date trolls? Do trolls have a right to date?


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