# Brooks Brothers shoes v. Allen Edmonds



## Guyute82 (Nov 20, 2009)

I can get 25% off during friends and family sale at Brooks Brothers. I was thinking about buying these:
https://www.brooksbrothers.com/IWCa...r=Walnut&sort_by=&sectioncolor=&sectionsize=#

Which would come down to $261 after 25% off.

Is the difference in price worth the difference in quality between BB and AE? Have people had good experiences with shoes from BB?

Thanks!


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## firedancer (Jan 11, 2011)

The shoes in question are allen edmonds. They are the strand model with a different sole and a dovetail heel. $261 is a great price. Buy them. You also may be able to snag some seconds with the leather sole and rubber heel from the shoe bank in that price range. You just missed the Nordstrom sale where they were $199.


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## WouldaShoulda (Aug 5, 2009)

I find that the English made BB/Peal offerings fit my foot better.

Try them on.


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## Guyute82 (Nov 20, 2009)

Will it be easy for me to have the sole/heel replaced? I'm looking for these shoes to last me a while.

I know AE does the refurbising. Does BB offer a similar service, could I bring them to AE, or would a cobbler be able to do the repairs?

Thanks for the help so far. AAAC proves useful as always.


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## blue suede shoes (Mar 22, 2010)

A talented cobbler should be able to do any repairs including a complete refurbishment. Try www.bnelsonshoes.com in NYC. The owner is a contributor to this forum and should be able to meet your needs.


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## firedancer (Jan 11, 2011)

I may be mistaken, but I don't think you could have this particular pair of AE recrafted by the factory since they are labeled for someone else. This was the case with a pair of my PRL. 

But, as it's been noted, talented cobblers do exist to recraft these for you.


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## firedancer (Jan 11, 2011)

WouldaShoulda said:


> I find that the English made BB/Peal offerings fit my foot better.
> 
> Try them on.


That's not a peal shoe.


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## WouldaShoulda (Aug 5, 2009)

Sorry for the confusion, I realize the like was to an AE shoe, that's why I suggested he broaden his search to include the Peals.


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## joenobody0 (Jun 30, 2009)

firedancer said:


> I may be mistaken, but I don't think you could have this particular pair of AE recrafted by the factory since they are labeled for someone else. This was the case with a pair of my PRL.
> 
> But, as it's been noted, talented cobblers do exist to recraft these for you.


If this is the case, this would be one instance where AE could improve. If Alden, who is known to have customer service issues, is willing to recraft the BB shoes then AE should too. I'm not interested in any of these shoes, but it would be nice to get a final word on this from AE.


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## 127.72 MHz (Feb 16, 2007)

^^ It's been three or four years since I asked why Allen Edmonds would not re-craft a pair of Church's. (I was told they used to.)

But then someone wanted them to re-craft a pair of John Lobb's. The customer was not happy with the result and they made a big issue of it going so far as to demand the full purchase price of the John Lobbs to make them whole. 

I was told this story by a long time employee of Allen Edmonds.

It might be a good idea to check back with Allen Edmonds to confirm.


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## joenobody0 (Jun 30, 2009)

127.72 MHz said:


> ^^ It's been three or four years since I asked why Allen Edmonds would not re-craft a pair of Church's. (I was told they used to.)
> 
> But then someone wanted them to re-craft a pair of John Lobb's. The customer was not happy with the result and they made a big issue of it going so far as to demand the full purchase price of the John Lobbs to make them whole.
> 
> ...


I think they'd be crazy to recraft another manufacturer's shoes. I took the comment I quoted as being in regards to a pair of AE for PRL shoes. If I was mistaken then I can 100% understand why they wouldn't want to recraft his pair.


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## Starch (Jun 28, 2010)

I don't know if it's _crazy_ to recraft shoes made by someone else (cobblers do it), but it's not crazy to refuse to do so either. AE is primarily in the business of making shoes, not general cobblery services.

Not recrafting shoes that AE actually _made_, just because they put someone else's brand name on them, on the other hand, seems weird. To me.


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## Angeland (Aug 24, 2011)

The respondent right below the original post hits the nail on the head. A great price, but before you buy it is worth boning up on the (all too) few excellent shoe makers ot there. As BB does not make their own shoes but stocks specially modified versions of various venerable makers, you want to know what the real shoe behind the BB label is.


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## Petrus (Sep 17, 2011)

Guyute82 said:


> I can get 25% off during friends and family sale at Brooks Brothers. I was thinking about buying these:
> https://www.brooksbrothers.com/IWCa...r=Walnut&sort_by=&sectioncolor=&sectionsize=#
> 
> Which would come down to $261 after 25% off.
> ...


BB has all sorts of shoes from their Peal brand to their cheaper casual shoes and they are all good. The new AE shoes sold by BB are just shoes styled to their specifications and are probably the same AE level of quality.
One thing you should never do is buy 2nds because there is some defect that is not always visible or they would sell them at regular price.
I'd stay away from Nordstrom rack and outlet type places too. Some of these are 2nds or have been laying out in the open collecting dust or with people handling them and getting oils from their hands or dirt on them. They're like used shoes, another thing you should never buy.
If you're buying AE shoes always buy them at an AE store of directly from the website. Sometimes they have sales or put overstocked shoes on clearance and you can save a little money but at least you know you're getting 1st quality AE's.


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## arkirshner (May 10, 2005)

Petrus said:


> BB has all sorts of shoes from their Peal brand to their cheaper casual shoes and they are all good. The new AE shoes sold by BB are just shoes styled to their specifications and are probably the same AE level of quality.
> One thing you should never do is buy 2nds because there is some defect that is not always visible or they would sell them at regular price.
> I'd stay away from Nordstrom rack and outlet type places too. Some of these are 2nds or have been laying out in the open collecting dust or with people handling them and getting oils from their hands or dirt on them. They're like used shoes, another thing you should never buy.
> If you're buying AE shoes always buy them at an AE store of directly from the website. Sometimes they have sales or put overstocked shoes on clearance and you can save a little money but at least you know you're getting 1st quality AE's.


The "defect" in AE seconds is almost always something so minor (eg. a slipped stitch in the welt) as to be unnoticeable in appearance as well as function. If purchased from AE they can be returned. They don't sell "thirds".


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## Starch (Jun 28, 2010)

Just a small note in defense of what is, after all, a local (to me) company (plus, I went to high school with some Nordstroms):



Petrus said:


> I'd stay away from Nordstrom rack and outlet type places too. Some of these are 2nds or have been laying out in the open collecting dust or with people handling them and getting oils from their hands or dirt on them.


The shoes in Nordstrom Rack are typically discontinued models that didn't sell.* They're generally not seconds. While I suppose some may be shopworn, most are pretty much straight out of the box, except for the time they've spent (the _right_ shoe has, anyway) on the shelf at the Rack. And - of course - you can actually inspect them and determine if they're in any way "used" or defective.

It's one of a number of ways to buy shoes. Just to compare it to two other options, it's not that much different from buying shoes:

- in an ordinary shoe store - where the pair you buy very well may have been handled or tried on by someone else before you - except that the options are limited and probably discontinued models, but you pay a lot less.

- from AE on clearance - where the options are limited, and usually discontinued models, but at a discounted price - except that you get to see the shoes and try them on before buying them.



> If you're buying AE shoes always buy them at an AE store or directly from the website.


Hmm. So you wouldn't buy them from a Nordstrom store? Or any brick-and-mortar retailer other than AE?

If you (like me) are hesitant about buying shoes sight unseen, for some of us, this rule would amount to "don't buy AE shoes at all," as there doesn't seem to be an AE store within 800 miles of me. While I'm not privy to any figures, I suspect that Nordstrom sells quite a few AE shoes, and that AE is very happy to encourage them to continue to do so.

*The clothes, on the other hand, are often items that they - like many other outlets - have made up specially for the discount sales channel.


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## Uncle Bill (May 4, 2010)

Guyute82 said:


> I can get 25% off during friends and family sale at Brooks Brothers. I was thinking about buying these:
> https://www.brooksbrothers.com/IWCa...r=Walnut&sort_by=&sectioncolor=&sectionsize=#
> 
> Which would come down to $261 after 25% off.
> ...


Bought the exact same pair at the Spring Friends and Family Sale and they are the same as AE save for the heel. I love these shoes and I plan to get the penny loafers at some point.


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## Petrus (Sep 17, 2011)

arkirshner said:


> The "defect" in AE seconds is almost always something so minor (eg. a slipped stitch in the welt) as to be unnoticeable in appearance as well as function. If purchased from AE they can be returned. They don't sell "thirds".


If it were that minor they would just be sold at full price. The people who inspect these shoes as they come off the assembly line look at 1000's of shoes a day and can spot certain defects by eye and by the devices they use which the average amateur shoe buyer cannot. They can spot a shoe where the leather grain doesn't match and it's like two different shoes. Sometimes this isn't apparent to the amateur until he waers the shoe under different natural and artificial lighting conditions(they use lights at the factory) They can also tell if a worker forgot to add the cork between the inner and outer sole or if a lining wasn't sewn in perfectly which will cause the outside leather to wrinkle once you start wearing the shoe and it goes through the expanding and contracting cycle. All you have to do is look on SF of some of the pictures these kids post to see that they're buying 2nds and "discount" shoes because in my 40+ years of wearing AE I've never seen these sorts of defects.
Well, at least AE is honest and is telling you upfront that you're buying a 2nd.
Sure, you can return them to the store (and perhaps get another 2nd) but who wants to go to all of this trouble over a minor article. It's not like it's a $100k car and you got a lemmon.


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## Petrus (Sep 17, 2011)

Uncle Bill said:


> Bought the exact same pair at the Spring Friends and Family Sale and they are the same as AE save for the heel. I love these shoes and I plan to get the penny loafers at some point.


Yes, the BB sales are worthwhile. In fact, I've never bought anything from BB that I had any complaints about. However, I'm not familiar with any of their outlet type places or the stores outside of their main one or the ones they have in wealthier suburbs nearby.
Places like Off 5th or Last Call may be owned by Saks or NM but the stock is different and you really can't even put it in the same class. I'm not sure if this is how the BB outlets are though.


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## arkirshner (May 10, 2005)

Petrus said:


> If it were that minor they would just be sold at full price. The people who inspect these shoes as they come off the assembly line look at 1000's of shoes a day and can spot certain defects by eye and by the devices they use which the average amateur shoe buyer cannot. They can spot a shoe where the leather grain doesn't match and it's like two different shoes. Sometimes this isn't apparent to the amateur until he waers the shoe under different natural and artificial lighting conditions(they use lights at the factory) They can also tell if a worker forgot to add the cork between the inner and outer sole or if a lining wasn't sewn in perfectly which will cause the outside leather to wrinkle once you start wearing the shoe and it goes through the expanding and contracting cycle. All you have to do is look on SF of some of the pictures these kids post to see that they're buying 2nds and "discount" shoes because in my 40+ years of wearing AE I've never seen these sorts of defects.
> Well, at least AE is honest and is telling you upfront that you're buying a 2nd.
> Sure, you can return them to the store (and perhaps get another 2nd) but who wants to go to all of this trouble over a minor article. It's not like it's a $100k car and you got a lemmon.


You certainly have a point. I'm only an amateur. I have about 30 pair of AEs, some going back to the 80s, around 10 pair are seconds and I can't remember which ones they are. I have not looked at the defects posted on SF but will. Maybe I have just been lucky. Perhaps Mr. Grangaard or someone on his staff will post the parameters they use. If he doesn't spot this in a few days I will email him and ask.


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## Petrus (Sep 17, 2011)

arkirshner said:


> You certainly have a point. I'm only an amateur. I have about 30 pair of AEs, some going back to the 80s, around 10 pair are seconds and I can't remember which ones they are. I have not looked at the defects posted on SF but will. Maybe I have just been lucky. Perhaps Mr. Grangaard or someone on his staff will post the parameters they use. If he doesn't spot this in a few days I will email him and ask.


I've never bought a 2nd so I don't know and didn't realise they even existed. Perhaps your 2nd's just had some sort of cosmetic defect that you either didn't notice or didn't really care about. I don't know all of the criteria they use to determine which are 2nds but obviously as I said, no one sells something at 1/2 price if they can get full price. For all I know it may or may not be based on something relatively minor and perhaps people buying $300 shoes are not as tolerant of defects as someone buying an $80 pair (avg price for men's shoes in the US)


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## arkirshner (May 10, 2005)

AE Park Ave seconds from company stores are around $250 depending on the time of year. The less popular styles are less expensive. Still not cheap.


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## TheGreatTwizz (Oct 27, 2010)

Petrus said:


> no one sells something at 1/2 price if they can get full price. For all I know it may or may not be based on something relatively minor and perhaps people buying $300 shoes are not as tolerant of defects as someone buying an $80 pair (avg price for men's shoes in the US)


Actually, they do. Allen Edmonds does a great job at quality control, and if they deem something a defect, they'll offer the shoe at a substantial discount instead of scrapping it so that those who are tolerant of defects can get a great discounts. I have a number of pairs of seconds, and cannot find the flaws.

Can you cite your source for the average price of men's shoes?


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