# I want to ride my bicycle!



## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Three images from last week of my freewheel SS (single speed) 1930s style "path racer" conversion. It's a conversion from a 2002 Kronan which I completed last year, like I said I modelled it on British path racers of the 1930s. Finding the right parts was the most fun. I couldn't believe the combined weight of all the steel parts I removed prior to rebuilding: heavy metal mudguards, heavy metal rear carrier with pump holder, rear number plate, rear light in metal cage, front dynamo, steel lamp holder, steel handlebars, heavy padded plastic saddle on steel frame, steel chainguard, heavy steel stand - combined weight 14 pounds!!! FOURTEEN pounds! 

Note the clean look due to the absence of brake and gear cables and levers, reflectors and lights. I put an old fashioned bell on the bar stem, believe me it's needed nowadays. It has a hub brake operated by pedaling backwards. The bars are alloy from a 1960s Italian racer. The leather racing saddle is a French Ideale 80 from the 1950s. The balloon tyres are 26" x 2" x 1½", which makes for a very smooth ride. The ultralight plastic mudguards I removed last week, hence these photos before removal for the summer. Riding it is a dream due to the purity of the ride, just peddle. My next rebuild will go a step further in that I'm going to convert a 1980s racer to a fixed wheel.





























This is one of the four bikes in my stable. Now lets see yours!
Forgot to say, this bike now, stripped of unnecessaries, even with its steel frame is lighter than most modern city bikes. 
By the way the thing on the frame by the rear wheel rim is the frame mounted lock, I fitted it myself. The steel bar just goes through the spokes & into the receiver on the other side of the frame . Very handy, very strong, very common in Sweden. And you avoid having to carry a separate heavy look with you when out cycling.


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## ZachGranstrom (Mar 11, 2010)

I'm sorry, but I can't resist:


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Thank you Zach, that was the reference. A little musical accompaniment from one of the best rock bands ever while we enjoy the photos.


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## Phenom (Apr 10, 2010)

Very cool!

I need to rebuild my bikes, but dread removing the old glue from the rims. Maybe this will provide the impetus to get to work on them.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Phenom said:


> Very cool!
> 
> I need to rebuild my bikes, but dread removing the old glue from the rims. Maybe this will provide the impetus to get to work on them.


Recently helped a friend with that on one of his racers that he last rode in the 80s. Man, that tube tyre glue is like concrete even almost 30 years later. He's going to put bead rim tyres on now instead.


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## Phenom (Apr 10, 2010)

Is the saddle as comfortable as a broken-in Brooks leather saddle?


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

That saddle is about a quarter inch thick leather with a few vent holes in the middle, but although hard to the touch even after about 40 years, it is well broken in, so supple and gives so much. The reason they look uncomfortable is exactly the reason they aren't i.e. there is plenty of room for it to give between the rails. A cheap modern wide padded saddle on a plastic base is uncomfortable because there is no room or air under your backside & the saddle can't give more than down to the plastic base, so after only a short time in the saddle they became sweaty & uncomfortable
I bought it secondhand on the net in Sweden for about £20. I then looked around on the net in the US and UK & as I always do with the bike part I buy and found others, same model, same age going for up to about £100. Very comfortable, very collectable, very attractive, lots of patina.


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## andy b. (Mar 18, 2010)

Earl,

Nice looking ride! Very clean layout. No photos of my bikes but all I have at present is a bright yellow Cannondale Super V 900 that is about 13 years old and a blue GT Tequesta that is about 18 years old. 

Andy B.


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## Phenom (Apr 10, 2010)

Just like the Brooks saddles.. thought it may have been one when I first looked at the pics. Not only are the comfortable, but they look good too.

Will take a couple of pics of my bikes. They are late 80's frames which I bought and then built the bike from components.

One is an Italian Pinarello Prologo timetrial bike. This is the same frame, Prologo, but not my bike. I am a little more aggressive with the rear wheel spoke lacing. That bike looks like a 2 cross on both sides. I went with one cross on the drive side and radial on the other. I had the Campy water bottle shown on that bike on mine as well for a while but it was a PITA to put back in its cage.. so I dumped it.

My standard road bike I built using a Bob Jackson road frame from Leeds, England. Love that frame. Lightest steel frame of its day and super stiff. Both have first generation Dura Ace hyperglide 8 speed gruppos.


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## Centaur (Feb 2, 2010)

I posted this on another thread a while ago - not such a lightweight as yours, but I find the more upright position very comfortable, and it certainly goes downhill quickly. Note the frame-mounted semaphore gear lever (Sturmey-Archer) and the hub brakes.









It's a 1930s Raleigh - I also have a 1950s roadster.


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## MikeDT (Aug 22, 2009)

Centaur said:


> View attachment 1306
> 
> 
> It's a 1930s Raleigh - I also have a 1950s roadster.












It's a 2009 Flying Pigeon PA-02. Tried and trusted design, how can one go wrong riding these?


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## Centaur (Feb 2, 2010)

MikeDT said:


> It's a 2009 Flying Pigeon PA-02. Tried and trusted design, how can one go wrong riding these?


I believe these are copies of my Raleigh. Do they still make copies of 1930s BMW motorbikes in C|hina, do you know? I think they are called Chiang Jiangs.


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## MikeDT (Aug 22, 2009)

Centaur said:


> I believe these are copies of my Raleigh. Do they still make copies of 1930s BMW motorbikes in C|hina, do you know? I think they are called Chiang Jiangs.


Exactly right, the Flying Pigeon is based on that Raleigh of yours. As is the Phoenix SPB10 and the Forever 'Traditional Bicycle'.

https://www.phoenix-bicycle.com/phoenixie/page/showProduct.asp?id=111
https://www.forever-bicycle.com/product.asp?ClassID=72

...still all been made by the tens-of-thousands every year. I was having a conversation last week with a Chinese friend during a sports cycling weekend, and they reckoned all the 'old fashioned' bicycles will be history in about 5 years. I said, it probably wont happen for a very long time.

I've not seen any of the Chang Jiang 'BMW's here, but I believe they're been made somewhere here in Hangzhou.

The thing with the Flying Pigeon, Forever and Phoenix, is that they're very versatile. To most people in the west they're just a bicycle... but here..

Taxis.

















Trucks.


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## WouldaShoulda (Aug 5, 2009)

Best bike ever!!









Sears 1969


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Centaur said:


> I posted this on another thread a while ago - not such a lightweight as yours, but I find the more upright position very comfortable, and it certainly goes downhill quickly. Note the frame-mounted semaphore gear lever (Sturmey-Archer) and the hub brakes.
> 
> View attachment 1306
> 
> ...


Very nice. I especially like old bikes with rod brakes like those. Have parts of it been painted though (handlebars ans stem) or is it all original? Yes, I was wondering what that was on the crossbar. Does it give you three gears or only 2 like some of the very early SA hubs?


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

This by the way is exactly what my Kronan looked like when I bought it in 2002. A real old fashioned sit-up-and-beg. 
Kronan is a huge success story both in Sweden and overseas. Based on the green M42 military bicycle of the Swedish Army. These modern versions though use quality parts from Holland, Czech Republic, Germany and Sweden. That said I have no idea where the frames are made, probably in China or Taiwan, as are the frames for many quality bikes nowadays: Specialized, Giant, Merida, Cannondale. I read an article about this in a cycle magazine just 2 months ago. Apparently, the Chinese and Taiwanese now have the most advanced frame building factories. Final assembly though for those US makes is still in the US. There was one great photo form a paintshop that showed loads of quality US bikes from several ofl those names all hanging up together to dry. Also many of the best names around the world have their frames built in these amazing factories.

And this is what my first changes to it looked like (only about a year after I'd bought it) The first thing to go was the heavy metla number plate, then I added a Brooks saddle, raised the bars a lot & added brown handgrips. And an Irish flag on the seat post! :icon_smile: You can see all the heavy metal I then had to remove before final conversion









Before I did the complete conversion job on it earlier this year (I sad last year in my orignal post, but when I thought back I realised it was only a few months ago. The converison I did last year was on another bicycle). A photo again for quick comparison purposes


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## Centaur (Feb 2, 2010)

Centaur said:


> It's a 1930s Raleigh - I also have a 1950s roadster.


I bought them on E-bay, some time ago. I was commuting to London then, and my plan was to leave one permanently at the railway station to complete each end of my journey (the 1930s one at home and the 1950s one (which has better brakes) at Euston), on the rather naive assumption that being old, they would be safe from theft. Unfortunately there seems to be a healthy trade in vintage parts, and first the Brooks saddle went, then the Miller lights, then other bits and pieces, even the rod brakes. Eventually I had to buy a third bike (I won it for 99p - plus £35 postage), cannibalising it to make good the losses to theft. I ended up having to walk to my office from Euston.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Phenom said:


> My standard road bike I built using a Bob Jackson road frame from Leeds, England. Love that frame. Lightest steel frame of its day and super stiff. Both have first generation Dura Ace hyperglide 8 speed gruppos.


Of course Bob Jackson. A very well respected name. My current proper racer (as opposed to a sports racer-style bike), which I'll be competing on on Sunday is a mid-80s Japanese made Miyata -14 gears- 23mm wheels. Goes like a dream. With a lovely Vetta Italian saddle, Vetta no longer being made. And sadly Miyata French owned since the 90s! Photos later.

My hybrid tourer is a late 80s Claude Butler - hand built in England.

My "round the block" cruiser is my wife's old 5-gear Dawes Londoner converted to a single speed.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Centaur said:


> I bought them on E-bay, some time ago. I was commuting to London then, and my plan was to leave one permanently at the railway station to complete each end of my journey (the 1930s one at home and the 1950s one (which has better brakes) at Euston), on the rather naive assumption that being old, they would be safe from theft. Unfortunately there seems to be a healthy trade in vintage parts, and first the Brooks saddle went, then the Miller lights, then other bits and pieces, even the rod brakes. Eventually I had to buy a third bike (I won it for 99p - plus £35 postage), cannibalising it to make good the losses to theft. I ended up having to walk to my office from Euston.


Bastards...people who steal or vandalise bikes are scum in my opinion! I say that as a cycle fanatic; of course there are worse problems in the world & more serious crimes. But bicylce crime attacks the owner on so many levels: transportation, property, sport, exericse and hobby are all affected.


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## Centaur (Feb 2, 2010)

Bastard thieving bastard bastards indeed.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Here now are three images of my racer mentioned earlier, The Black Irish as I call it. You will recall that the first bike I showed is also black with red Fizik bar-tape. Those are my stable colours red & black.
Japanese built, mid-80s, 14 gear Miyata, Spline Cr-Mo frame, which is very large 60cm (24") as you can see from the long head tube. Shimano set all-round. Rare Italian Vetta saddle. French toe clips. German tyres. Irish flag. I've included a rider's view photo so you can see the unobtrusive little bell and the narrowness of the 23mm road slicks I'm running on.
I'll be competing on Sunday. 
Unlike many riders I don't have my brake cables all the way under the bar tape, I find it uncomfortable & a bugger to work on when it comes to changing cables.
I like the Eddie Mercyx style, brake cables out in the open. However, along the length of the bike the rear cable goes through the crossbar.

Note also the 2 gear changers on the down tube; and toe clips, rather than cleat receiver pedals. I prefer toe clips, not just for the retro look, I just feel more comfortable and safer with them.


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## Centaur (Feb 2, 2010)

It's very nice, you've clearly gone to a lot of trouble in many ways. It reminds me a little of the Carlton I once had. I notice the front brake is operated by the left lever- why is that? Are you left-handed?


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Centaur said:


> It's very nice, you've clearly gone to a lot of trouble in many ways. It reminds me a little of the Carlton I once had. I notice the front brake is operated by the left lever- why is that? Are you left-handed?


Thanks, I'm proud of it. Would you believe I found it in a second hand cycle shop just 3 months ago & only paid £25 for it. My friends who know about bikes can't believe I got so lucky in getting a proper Japanese built Miyata racer for that price. I've seen this actual model on e-bay & other sites for up to £300. I changed the tubes, tyres, saddle, brake cables, bartape, bottle carrier, (80s metallic purple looked awful) and toeclip straps (the new ones are nylon, the orignal leather ones had rotted) and adjusted/fixed the gears and brakes. And did some work on the paint job, removing tatty transfers and so on. I was orignally going to convert it to a fixed wheel, but after I rode it just once, I knew this beauty had to remain as the brilliant 80s racer that it is. Total outlay, including purchase and the new parts (saddle, tyres, tubes, bartape, bottle carrier, toe clip straps) just £80!!! Eighty quid & I've now got a great smooth racer, that is very light, very comfy, very fast and great fun to ride.

As regards the front brake, you're right I hadn't noticed that. Either it came like that from Japan or the previous owner did it. As it happens I am left handed but only in writing & using a spoon. Otherwise I'm ambidextrous. I just went out to check my other bikes, those with rim brakes, and those are standard with the right hand lever controlling the front brake.


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## JJR512 (May 18, 2010)

I want to get a Trek Police Bike:

https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes/mountain_hardtail/police_bike/policebike/


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## VictorRomeo (Sep 11, 2009)

What a great bike, Earl. Actually, my main ride is a newer Koga Miyata(now Dutch). Biking and mountain biking in particular is my favourite way to excercise. I've a pretty massive collection of but - frames, groupsets wheels and so on... and a lot vintage.... I'll tell more again....

Splined tubing was/is very expensive and Miyata were renouned for making their own tubing.... Rare stuff! BTW, I've an old Bridgestone frame knocking about somewhere - my old workshop at my Mum's house I think...

Trying to make out your groupset - mid 80's 600/600 Ultegra? Years since I've seen....

Would suggest that if you can get used to egg beater pedals,it's really worth the effort! I have on all my bikes....


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

JJR512 said:


> I want to get a Trek Police Bike:
> 
> https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes/mountain_hardtail/police_bike/policebike/


Looks good, black of course, well need I say more as the owner of 2 black beauties  
But man, that is one hell of a long chain hanger at the back. I can imagine that clouting some rocks and logs going over terrain, ironic really as I can see the pedals have got good ground clearance.
Lightweight MTBs can be a lot of fun, much more so than the heavy old MTBs that were being pumped out in the 80s.

Crossbikes are very versatile & great fun too, either as roadbikes, racers or for green laning/light terrain.
I've had my eye on the very high quality German Focus cross bikes for a while, but they're too pricey for my wallet! 
The reason Focus are cheaper in Europe than the US Big 5 names has nothing to do with quality, it's because we don't have to pay import tax on bikes shipped within the EU.

I'm waiting for my local contact to drop the price on his 2009 Focus cross bikes to at least £600 before I start haggling with him 

My next bike though might be a Specialized Langster fixed wheel, with a flip-flop hub (fixed wheel on one side, freewheel on the other) I mean how gorgeous is this?

But, knowing my need to build ,convert & fix bikes, I'd put money on my next bike being another second-hand fixer-upper for fixed wheel conversion.


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## VictorRomeo (Sep 11, 2009)

The law here use those Trek Bikes for the city beat.... 

Earl, treat yourself - buy a gorgeous Cinelli Supercorsa handbuilt frame and build from there....


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

VictorRomeo said:


> The law here use those Trek Bikes for the city beat....
> 
> Earl, treat yourself - buy a gorgeous Cinelli Supercorsa handbuilt frame and build from there....


Stop tempting me! And you're making me hungry with all this talk of egg beaters & Italian names. Right I'm off to the kitchen. 
I'll get back to you tomorrow regarding the group set on my Miyata because to be honest I can't remember, even though I have read the names on the brakes and gears.

A major, major problem I have though in Sweden is that there is no bike culture here like there is in the UK, US, Ireland and so on. So it means sourcing bikes, frames and parts takes a long time, but that in itself, the hunt, is a lot of fun.

Bikes in Sweden are for the vast majority simply hunks of transport metal to take them from A to B -home to work and back -5 days a week.


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## VictorRomeo (Sep 11, 2009)

Cool.... Y'see, I'm a bigger bike nerd than most anything else.... well perhaps apart from HiFi.....


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

VictorRomeo said:


> What a great bike, Earl. Actually, my main ride is a newer Koga Miyata(now Dutch). Biking and mountain biking in particular is my favourite way to excercise. I've a pretty massive collection of but - frames, groupsets wheels and so on... and a lot vintage.... I'll tell more again....
> 
> Splined tubing was/is very expensive and Miyata were renouned for making their own tubing.... Rare stuff! BTW, I've an old Bridgestone frame knocking about somewhere - my old workshop at my Mum's house I think...
> 
> ...


Thanks, I like it. Dutch ok, I thought they were French.

Regarding their frames, this from Wiki "Miyata claims to have been the first Japanese manufacturer of _flash-butt welded_ frame tubes (1946) and the first to use electrostatic painting (1950)" Founded in 1892!


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

VictorRomeo said:


> Cool.... Y'see, I'm a bigger bike nerd than most anything else.... well perhaps apart from HiFi.....


Are you my long lost twin? Bikes, hi fi,  What else?


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## VictorRomeo (Sep 11, 2009)

Earl of Ormonde said:


> Are you my long lost twin? Bikes, hi fi,  What else?


I'm a total computer nerd - a PC gamer and gadget freak.... Then there's the whole subject of Home Theater..., finally there's nice watches and of course fancy duds and footwear.... I've a genuine interest in architecture, interior design and desegn in general too.... Have I lost you, brother?!


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## Centaur (Feb 2, 2010)

Earl of Ormonde said:


> Very nice. I especially like old bikes with rod brakes like those. Have parts of it been painted though (handlebars ans stem) or is it all original? Yes, I was wondering what that was on the crossbar. Does it give you three gears or only 2 like some of the very early SA hubs?


Just to respond to your additional questions, the handlebars and stem are painted black - I don't know whether that is original, that's just how it was, although I believe Raleighs were made like that for a while due to wartime shortages of chromium, so it could be. But I resprayed it in any case, and had the frame shotblasted and stove enamelled when it came into my possession. Some bike collectors frown on such tinkering with originality, but what the hell. The gear hub is a 3-speed SA, combined with a hub brake.


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## VictorRomeo (Sep 11, 2009)

Over here those bikes were/are known as a 'High Nelly'.... great term!


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## Centaur (Feb 2, 2010)

Hmmm - not sure I like that! I do find the upright position much more comfortable though, and there is the advantage of facing forwards rather than having to peer upwards with your backside in the air. I have a Navigator for cross-country - mostly around lakes, reservoirs and disused railway lines, there are few mountains in this part of England.


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## JJR512 (May 18, 2010)

VictorRomeo said:


> I'm a total computer nerd - a PC gamer and gadget freak.... Then there's the whole subject of Home Theater..., finally there's nice watches and of course fancy duds and footwear.... I've a genuine interest in architecture, interior design and desegn in general too.... Have I lost you, brother?!


Oh no...You two aren't just twins, you're two-thirds of a set of triplets! :smile:

I count ALL those same interests on my list of interests as well. Some I have not studied and don't actually know much about, but am very interested in learning more.

VictorRomeo, have you ever visited or participated in the forums at www.hometheaterforum.com? I've been a member there (as JustinR) since Dec. 1999, although not a very active poster (~600 posts). I'm not sure how relevant they are anymore, but HTF used to be big, especially in the early years of DVD. Back then, DVDs were still the new thing for movie and home theater aficionados, when Joe Sixpack was still watching VHS. In fact, it was largely through the efforts of HTF that Warner Brothers decided to release the old _Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory_ in a widescreen format. They originally thought it was just a kids' movie and kids' didn't care, but HTF played a large role in an organized effort to teach WB otherwise.


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## VictorRomeo (Sep 11, 2009)

Been there but no, I play here...

https://www.htguide.com/forum/


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## JJR512 (May 18, 2010)

Earl of Ormonde said:


> Looks good, black of course, well need I say more as the owner of 2 black beauties
> But man, that is one hell of a long chain hanger at the back. I can imagine that clouting some rocks and logs going over terrain, ironic really as I can see the pedals have got good ground clearance.


It also comes in white.

Many of Trek's mountain bikes look like they have a similarly-long chain hanger in the back, and some look a bit shorter. I didn't take the time to look at each model to see what hardware is being used when it looks long vs. when it looks shorter or what the design philosophy is for the various models are in correlation to the chain hanger length. However, for the police model, I don't think it will be a problem. I most commonly see it being used by mall security inside malls, although lately they've mostly changed to Segways. I forget why Trek decided to use a mountain bike frame for the police model instead of an urban frame, but I recall that there was a good reason for it, and that the design goals of this bike (can move fast, light, comfortable on long rides, durable) were exactly what I was looking for.


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## VictorRomeo (Sep 11, 2009)

A "long cage" rear mechanism is essential when using a triple chainset. The extra length is needed to take up the chain extra slack when using the shorter gears - predominantly found on mountain and touring bikes.


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## JJR512 (May 18, 2010)

So they are predominantly found on mountain bikes, which are exactly the kind of bikes that are most likely going to encounter rocks and logs, as Earl of Ormonde was worried about. How much of an actual danger is there? Is he needlessly concerned, or is this a real problem?


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## VictorRomeo (Sep 11, 2009)

It depends... Most mountain bikes are used on very light trails and canal paths.... seldom used for more advanced X/C and as such rarely experience rocks and logs.... Bikers that do ride rough will buy more expensive components that are far, far more durable. Shimano XTR is top of the range. But yes, damage is possible and common. I can't tell you how many derailleurs I've replaced down the years.... I raced MTB at a very competetive level until about 14 years ago when I had a very bad accident.

Now, to combat this problem, a German company called Rolhoff developed a fully integrated(sealed gearbox) 14 speed hub that replaced the need for derailleurs - something akin to the old 3 speed Sturmy Archer hub.



The downside is they're very expensive and heavy - it can take a lot of getting used to having such weight at the rear - especially with a rear suspension bike.

Should note that I put one on my Ellsworth build a couple of years back and really like it.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

JJR512 said:


> So they are predominantly found on mountain bikes, which are exactly the kind of bikes that are most likely going to encounter rocks and logs, as Earl of Ormonde was worried about. How much of an actual danger is there? Is he needlessly concerned, or is this a real problem?


I've clouted mine a couple of times on ground obsatcles. Being on a hybrid though it's not as long as the one on that Trek. And bearing in mind that it moves quite freely when it hits something the only damage is scratches and the odd dent, but what it more irritating is when a bang makes the chain jump a cog.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

VictorRomeo said:


> I'm a total computer nerd - a PC gamer and gadget freak.... Then there's the whole subject of Home Theater..., finally there's nice watches and of course fancy duds and footwear.... I've a genuine interest in architecture, interior design and desegn in general too.... Have I lost you, brother?!


Well bro, you lost me with "I'm a total computer nerd - a PC gamer and gadget freak" computers & all related stuff has been more of a phobia for me than an interest  But you totally got me again with "Home Theater...,nice watches and of course fancy duds and footwear.... I've a genuine interest in architecture...interior design and desegn " 

I've a nice growing watch collection, love architecture -several books on various aspects, especailly churches and early 20th century housing. And of course shoes, clothes and accessories. 

My home "theatre" is only in its infancy, I bought a Panasonic 42" plasa just a year ago. The next tiem on my shopping list will be a better DVD player or hard disc recorder. Speaker system, not yet, but the smallness of the room where I watch really means I'd have problems with placement and using a system to good effect.


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## VictorRomeo (Sep 11, 2009)

Well as I mentioned elsewhere, if you want good advice when planning to upgrade visit www.HTGuide.com/forum

It's the best and friendliest HT & HiFi forum out there....


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## Douglas Brisbane Gray (Jun 7, 2010)

Centaur said:


> I believe these are copies of my Raleigh. Do they still make copies of 1930s BMW motorbikes in C|hina, do you know? I think they are called Chiang Jiangs.


Chiang Jiangs are copies of Urals a Russian bike based on rather than copied from a 1930s BMW.


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## culverwood (Feb 13, 2006)

Picture of my tourer


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## JJR512 (May 18, 2010)

VictorRomeo said:


> Well as I mentioned elsewhere, if you want good advice when planning to upgrade visit www.HTGuide.com/forum
> 
> It's the best and friendliest HT & HiFi forum out there....


...aside from HTF.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

VictorRomeo said:


> Trying to make out your groupset - mid 80's 600/600 Ultegra? Years since I've seen....


Right then, your question suddenly made me realise I could date my bike better by looking up the groupset on the net.
Well I did, and I was pleasantly surprised to find out that my mid- to late 80s guesstimate based on old Miyata catalogues on the net was a few years out in that the bike is a few years newer..yippeee!!!!
My groupset is the Exage 400 EX on gears, crank, bottom bracket, gear levers. And Exage Motion on the brakes. So having consulted a very detailed Shimano page I found out that the Exage 400 EX was fitted to road bikes between 1990 and 1992.
This page was so detailed thta it actually had model Nos.for all sorts of parts, so if I want to be more exact than 90-92 I can
look up the crank number and find out the exact year. 
The only thing is that my 14 gear cassette is not mentioned in any of the Miyata catalogues of 90-92. Perhaps an upgrade & perhaps at the same time as the brake levers were reversed with the front now operated by the left lever. So 2 peculiarities form the norm....hhhmm interesting.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Right, sore bum, bones not muscles or skin. Just got back from a road race on my Black Irish miyata. Not anywhere near as fast as the elite club cyclists, and I didn't expect to be.I mean this is my first race in about 35 years. But I came in about 40th out of 90 plus riders. Beautiful day for it as well. I stayed with the pack for the first 3 or 4 Klicks but then I couldn't keep up and once they hit the main road, they were off! Bloody youngters  Killer hill 2 km from the goal. Lowest gear, struggling, legs on fire,a few people out on the road watching, as I went past one grourp of spectators, I was close to the crest & thus the steepest part, focusing so much on cycling that I lost the ability to speak Swedish and shouted out while laughing "Fvking 'ell, why do I do this to myself" which got a good laugh from the spectators. Well, got my plaque and drove home. Bum a bit better now.


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## MikeDT (Aug 22, 2009)

Only the best of the best for me this week. Shining chrome, beautiful paintwork, good brakes and well lubricated.


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## ZachGranstrom (Mar 11, 2010)

^^^^
nice bike. I especially like the plastic bag on the seat and the tape that holds part of the bike together.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

MikeDT said:


> Only the best of the best for me this week. Shining chrome, beautiful paintwork, good brakes and well lubricated.


 What a beaut! Hope you've got it insured against theft!


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## andy b. (Mar 18, 2010)

JJR512 said:


> So they are predominantly found on mountain bikes, which are exactly the kind of bikes that are most likely going to encounter rocks and logs, as Earl of Ormonde was worried about. How much of an actual danger is there? Is he needlessly concerned, or is this a real problem?


When I used to ride regularly, I bet over the course of 8 years I only broke a rear derailleur once. One time I did bend one a little, but tweaked it back into shape when I got home. And we used to ride very technical trails. I have a few puncture wounds in elbows and calves from such rides.  You would be surprised what you can hit and not do any damage (to the bike anyway). Mountain bikes are after-all designed for such use.

Andy B.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

andy b. said:


> Mountain bikes are after-all designed for such use.
> 
> Andy B.


True enough but it shows when you see the conditions of the vast majority of mountain bikes for sale second-hand. Also, when you look at mountain bikes parked up anywhere, a large proportion look like junk, having lead tough lives.


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## Centaur (Feb 2, 2010)

To my mind, most mountain bikes have every appearance of being over-engineered and over-specified for the jobs that most of them do most of the time. Rather like the notorious school-run 'Chelsea tractor' Range-Rovers, most mountain bikes are used in circumstances where their designed-in abilities are entirely redundant. Over 30 years ago I belonged to the rather quaintly named 'Rough Stuff Fellowship' - we specialised in cross-country trail riding, but using the ordinary road-going bikes and tourers that were all that was available then, adapted only to the extent of removing the mudguards. 99% of the time they were fine.


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## VictorRomeo (Sep 11, 2009)

Approach a even a mildly tough XC trail on even a middle priced bike (sub £1000stg) and it will disintegrate before your very eyes within a few runs if not cared for. Even a high end bike needs a lot of mechanical attention. Suspension and brake hydraulic/pneumatics in particular are high maintenance. But as I said earlier most mountain bikes are not used for their intended purpose.

And talking of war wounds - I spent three weeks in hospital and the same again in rehabilitation after damaging my spine in a particularly bad accident - it ended a fledgling career was emerging into a professional sport this side of the Atlantic. I raced with the Orange Bikes works team. Check them out - they make some of the best mountain bikes in the business.

https://www.orangebikes.co.uk/bikes/


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## mjc (Nov 11, 2009)

Bicycles are for chumps! :wink2: Here's what I made during my summer vacation:

https://img716.imageshack.us/i/dscf2400y.jpg/

- Mike


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

mjc said:


> Bicycles are for chumps! :wink2: Here's what I made during my summer vacation:
> 
> https://img716.imageshack.us/i/dscf2400y.jpg/
> 
> - Mike


Come to my part of Sweden Mike, we've got some very fancy rafts on the rivers here.

This is the river running north-south through my county

And these are the common tent-rigged rafts (called "flotte" in Swedish) on the river

We also have fancy houseboat rafts that chug along at a sedate pace with an outboard motor https://www.konst.org/media/bilder/gasttyckare/genberg/flotte.jpg

And here's the photo album from a Swedish company website that sells various mdoels https://www.floattech.se/sv/bryggbilder/flottar.aspx


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Specialized Langster Steel. 

On Friday I took a test ride on the Specialized Langster Steel with flip-flop hub, straight crossbar, lovely looking and comfortable Brooks style saddle and racing handlebars. The shop had it on freewheel however not on fixed. 

But I just wanted to get a sense of the ratio. Result: far too easy to peddle for my racing legs, much easier than my old fashioned single speed bikes and light years easier than my racers. 
This wouldn't be any good for training or anything approaching the speeds I usually cycle at.
Great for posing around town, that's about it. With a tougher ratio it might be useful but not with the current ratio fitted.


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## VictorRomeo (Sep 11, 2009)

Earl, buy the frame and build! You won't regret it!


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## mjc (Nov 11, 2009)

Earl of Ormonde said:


> Come to my part of Sweden Mike, we've got some very fancy rafts on the rivers here.


Cool stuff! Why is rafting popular in Sweden? Just history? Or are motorboats tightly regulated?

- Mike


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

mjc said:


> Cool stuff! Why is rafting popular in Sweden? Just history? Or are motorboats tightly regulated?
> 
> - Mike


Yes just cultural history. This river especially (the Klarälven) has a very long history of logging. Up until the 1980s, they were still sending logs down the river from the timber,pulp and paper company forests to the main harbour in Karlstad for collection by lorries and trains and on to either sawmills or paper products factories. My county Värmland is in industry known globally as the Paper Province. And up until the 80s you would still occasionally see a logger out on the huge free floating log rafts drawing them together with a long log hook and binding them and directing them in the right direction for later collection.


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