# Sizing down to fit into the Allen Edmonds #5 last?



## tocqueville (Nov 15, 2009)

This issue cropped up in an earlier thread:

My 8.5D #8 last shoes fit great. My #5 last 8.5 D shoes--all balmorals-- are quite tight in the middle part of the foot, and the lacing doesn't close as much as they should. Do I try an E? Do I size down to an 8D? An 8E?

A trip to an AE store would resolve these things, but that's astonishingly difficult given my schedule.


----------



## shorty (Oct 5, 2009)

I'm an 8D in the #8. In #5, I tried 7.5D but it was too short. 8E in the #5 was too wide. I had to go up 1/2 a size and down a width: 8.5C. Placing the sole of my #8 Del-Ray against the sole of my #5 PA, they were basically the same except the PA was slightly slimmer. What will be difficult for you is trying to determine whether you should just go for a wider shoe or do what I did. Other folks have luck going down 1/2 a size but up in the width which seems like the general recommendation. YMMV.

https://askandyaboutclothes.com/com...icorn-caught-AE-Park-Avenue&highlight=unicorn
https://askandyaboutclothes.com/community/showthread.php?110543-Fitting-AE-s-5-last

I guess this doesn't help you at all. In the end, you'll have to take an educated guess since you can't get to the store.


----------



## jwa_jwa_jwa (Jul 13, 2010)

I'm normally an 8EE and I can wear a 8.5D

In the AE #5 last for my Strands, I had to go with an 8EEE and they fit me perfectly.


----------



## tocqueville (Nov 15, 2009)

I've decided to avoid #5 shoes until I have the time/money to go buy a pair at the AE store, where I'll be able to try on different sizes.

Meanwhile, I'm on the hunt for balmorals on the #8 last...if you see any Hales for sale, please let me know!


----------



## jwa_jwa_jwa (Jul 13, 2010)

I ordered mine online during a sale at Nordstrom's last year. The 8.5d I ordered fit me tight so I took them and exchanged them at one of their stores where I was able to assess which size fit me better.


----------



## peterc (Oct 25, 2007)

That #5 Last is a real quandry. When I was placing my order for the Fifth Street Boot (Sept. 2010), Paul advised me to go into the AE shop here in SF and try on some shoes in the #5 Last. Normally, I wear a 10D in AE shoes: Sanford, Fairfax, Greenwich, Mondavio. (On the Weybridge, I had to go to a 10.5D and on the Randolph, I went with a 9.5E.)

So, I tried on some Fifth Aves. and Park Aves. and the 9.5E fit me best. So, that is what I ordered for the Fifth Street Boot. I get it and it is great.

A week or so ago, I try on a Strawfut and there was no 9.5E, so I try on a 10D and lo and behold, it fit just fine, not at all like the Fifth Aves. and Park Aves I tried on 6 months ago. Those were way too tight in a 10D.

I think all of us are going to have a unique experience in this pesky #5 Last.


----------



## appraiser (Mar 28, 2009)

I tried to get a proper fit with the Park Avenues. I went up a width and down a half size. This was before I read the "Understanding Lasts" section on the Allen Edmonds website. In retrospect I would not buy any shoe with the #5 last without trying on the actual shoe I would be purchasing. My foot is better suited to the #1 and #8 lasts.


----------



## Broadus (Jan 6, 2011)

It seems that the particular style of shoe in the last 5 also affects fit. Both my PA's and Strands are 9D, but the PA's are a little tighter on the base of the 5th metatarsal bone, at first fairly uncomfortably so, than the Strand. The PA's are becoming more comfortable as they stretch ever so incrementally through wearing them, but the Strands were perfect out of the box. The leather on the outside of the Strand is sewn together just a bit farther toward the front than on the PA, and that seems to make the difference in my case.


----------



## TheGreatTwizz (Oct 27, 2010)

peterc said:


> That #5 Last is a real quandry. When I was placing my order for the Fifth Street Boot (Sept. 2010), Paul advised me to go into the AE shop here in SF and try on some shoes in the #5 Last. Normally, I wear a 10D in AE shoes: Sanford, Fairfax, Greenwich, Mondavio. (On the Weybridge, I had to go to a 10.5D and on the Randolph, I went with a 9.5E.)
> 
> So, I tried on some Fifth Aves. and Park Aves. and the 9.5E fit me best. So, that is what I ordered for the Fifth Street Boot. I get it and it is great.
> 
> ...


Interesting enough Peter, the Fairfax is a #5 last shoe. I find it a bit wider but shorter than other #5 last shoes, probably due to its construction.


----------



## ajo (Oct 22, 2007)

Has anyone bought a pair of Cambridge in particular in a 10EE? I am curious to see how the 5 last issue affected your purchase.


----------



## peterc (Oct 25, 2007)

TheGreatTwizz said:


> Interesting enough Peter, the Fairfax is a #5 last shoe. I find it a bit wider but shorter than other #5 last shoes, probably due to its construction.


I did not know that and I appreciate the info. The Fairfax is probably the single most comfortable pair of shoes I own. Best $200.00 I ever spent shoe-wise. By the way, the Fairfax is BACK, at least at the SF AE shop.

Also, now that you call my attention to it, I see/feel that the Fairfax is indeed wider and shorter due to its construction. Good to keep in mind.


----------



## TheGreatTwizz (Oct 27, 2010)

ajo said:


> Has anyone bought a pair of Cambridge in particular in a 10EE? I am curious to see how the 5 last issue affected your purchase.


They do not produce a 10EE on the 5 last. It goes from E to EEE.



peterc said:


> I did not know that and I appreciate the info. The Fairfax is probably the single most comfortable pair of shoes I own. Best $200.00 I ever spent shoe-wise. By the way, the Fairfax is BACK, at least at the SF AE shop.
> 
> Also, now that you call my attention to it, I see/feel that the Fairfax is indeed wider and shorter due to its construction. Good to keep in mind.


You're welcome Peter. I picked mine up at Nordstrom. They had to go into the Nordstrom Rack system as they're on closeout for $199 in chestnut (which is beautifully lighter than the walnut on the mcallister). Shoebank mentioned they have them in Black, but for chestnut, you have to go through Nordstrom. I tried on like 6 pair of Strand, and my 10-3E was a guess. Works on the Fairfax, but I think 9.5EEE is what I need to go to for the length. The strands and mcallisters I have are comfortable, but I'd like them a bit more snug.


----------



## Chico (Apr 22, 2010)

I agree that the 5 last is a tough nut to crack. I usually wear a 9.5D in Allen Edmonds. But it was too narrow in 5 last. I tried on a 9.5E and the width was fine, but the ball of my foot was as far forward as it should of been. It just didn't fit the shape of my foot right so I gave up and bought something else. I would try that last on first.


----------



## Claus (Apr 8, 2010)

Reading all this, one may get the impression Allen Edmonds' 5 (65) last is almost impossible to get right.

Then, I checked the ratings on my site, and 6 out of 19 ratings for this last have 4 stars (ie. really comfortable). That's about 30% which doesn't seem that bad.

Of course, it's not a true random sample but still.


----------



## tocqueville (Nov 15, 2009)

Claus said:


> Reading all this, one may get the impression Allen Edmonds' 5 (65) last is almost impossible to get right.
> 
> Then, I checked the ratings on my site, and 6 out of 19 ratings for this last have 4 stars (ie. really comfortable). That's about 30% which doesn't seem that bad.
> 
> Of course, it's not a true random sample but still.


What's "your site"?

I'm sure a doctor could tell us--and AE already knows--the statistics for how many people's feet are a given size/shape. The #5 must work fine for a lot of people, otherwise AE wouldn't bother. That said, I'd love to see whatever AE has been able to compile.


----------



## ndlutz (Apr 23, 2013)

I wanted to resurrect this thread rather than start a new one, but I've got a bit of an issue with the #5 last right now that I hope to resolve. 

I first bought a pair of PAs in 9.5E based on the recommendation of the AE sizing guide from the website. This sounded right to me as in most shoes I wear a 9.5 or a 10 and know that my foot is a little wide. The 9.5 seemed to be a spot on choice. Unfortunately when the shoes arrived they just didn't fit right. They had a large topline bulge that cause the shoe to crease all the way down to the sole which made it almost look like they were dented, my heel didn't fit right in the left shoe, and there was too much room in the toe box despite the shoe being kind of tight on the sides.

I was able to return the PAs to an AE store. When I was there, I got sized and the 9E PAs actually fit me quite well. I essentially exchanged my PAs for the new size. In addition, I bought a pair of Strands in 9E. They had to be shipped to me because they didn't have them in stock at the store and the sales associate told me that they'd fit the same way the PAs did because they're made on the same last. Knowing that they were both #5 last shoes, I didn't think I'd have an issue. 

The shoes came yesterday and interestingly the PAs fit me but the Strands are too tight. In fact, the leather is quite far apart at the top of the laces. The 9EEE wasn't my best fit in the PAs when I was at the AE store, however, I'm thinking that's the size I need to get on my Strands. 

Has anybody else noticed that the strands and PAs fit differently? How does the McAllister play into this?


----------



## TheGreatTwizz (Oct 27, 2010)

PAs are, by far, the narrowest and longest of the #5 shoes. I am unable to buy a pair, as my normal size (10 3E) is still too narrow in a PA. 

If you still have quite the gap on laces (I'll assume you're straight lacing them), step up to the 3E. Once you're comfortable in the Strand, the McAllister should fit well in the same size; mine do. 

Curiously, which store are you going to for these?


----------



## ndlutz (Apr 23, 2013)

Well, getting to the store is problematic for me. I went to the one in Short Hills, NJ at the Short Hills Mall. 

I live in Hazleton, PA so the nearest store to me is approximately 2 hours regardless of how you slice it. It's either a trip to NJ or a trip to Philadelphia. 

My plan was just to send back the 9E strands and get 9EEE. I think I'll keep the PAs, though, because for some reason the 9E in them fits.


----------

