# Iphone 4 vs 4s, syncing, etc.



## memphislawyer (Mar 2, 2007)

Well, daughter talked me into using the upgrade on Sprint and 
going from a Blackberry Curve to the new, to me, Iphone 4. $99 but for $100 
more, I can get the 4s. I don't keep a lot of contacts or photos and really 
never store music or anything, so 8 gig is enough for me (that comes with the 4, 
the 4s is 16 gig). 

Was thinking it might be neat to have Siri, cause I 
see that you can dictate emails and texts and just push a send button and that 
would be handy for driving, and also, since I am not used to the on-screen 
keyboard, faster and more accurate. But is there an app, like Dragon Naturally 
Speaking, that is free or cheap that would do that? I don't really need voice 
directions around town, and out of town, we usually printout mapquest or know 
how to get where we are going. 

I did try the Samsung Nexxus while I was 
waiting on them to cut the phone on and put it in the bigger Otter Box. Nicer, 
nicer graphics, and loved how it vibrated, but daughter has the Iphone 4 and 
that is pretty much why I went with it. 

I have Gmail, and I dont think 
it pushes my email instantaneously as it did with the Blackberry - in fact, 
sometimes an email would hit my Blackberry before the computer. I am just now 
recharging the battery a second time (first time after having it drain all the 
way down). 

I use Outlook on my Blackberry for my calendar, and have it 
backed up on a Palm Pilot that is synced via cord, and then I get it synced to 
the Blackberry. I want to transfer that all to my Iphone now. 

I will 
install Itunes on my office computer tomorrow for the first time. Will I be able 
to transfer all my calendar stuff to the Iphone easily? Or will I have to go and 
set up some sort of new calendar and then sync that? I still would like to have 
a third backup on the Palm Pilot that I can push a button once a day and sync it 
up with the computer. 

Oh, I read about some wireless syncing but to save 
battery, my daughter told me turn off wifi (but I guess I can turn it on when I 
need to sync if I have to). 

I am not all that tech savvy, so help?


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## Tilton (Nov 27, 2011)

I have a 4s and the syncing is easy enough. I sync my calendars, notifications, emails, music, and photos with my MBP at home as well as my PC at work on both my personal and work email accounts. It works great. I leave syncing and wifi on all the time. If you turn off wifi you will eat through your data plan very quickly unless it is a truly unlimited plan. To sync calendars, basically set up your email, then go into settings and turn on calendar, contact, etc syncing. As far as pushing is concerned, the iphone 4s will let you set your push times for each email account. I push every 5 minutes (or 10? I can't remember) unless I'm on wifi, in which case it pushes constantly. 

One thing to consider is that the iphone is NOT a good "business tool" phone, despite advertising. It is first and foremost an entertainment device. Prior to this, I have had four Blackberrys and they were significantly better for emails. Siri is good for dictation and it is contextual which is nice, but I don't always want to broadcast to everyone on the metro or the sidewalk or the restaurant what my email will say.


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## Shad0w4life (Dec 23, 2011)

Gmail uses push to get emails instantly, not sure if the iOS supports push and gmail.
Wifi, if you are at home turn ON wifi, it's when you have wifi on and are searching for open networks it eats battery.

Siri is more of a gimmick, there actually was a class action lawsuit over it not being even remotely as functional as commercials portrayed.

As Tilton said, iPhone are not very good business phones, BB is still the best in terms of email and battery life. I am able to sync my work email to my phone(Android Galaxy S2) via my Gmail account using Google Sync on work PC. I'm not sure if the iPhone supports connecting to google calendar but that's how I have my work and personal calendar in sync, due to not being allowed to connect to works exchange server.

Just my opinon: Wait for the Galaxy S3, it's out in a few weeks. I'd kill for the viewing feature; if you're looking at the screen it won't turn the screen off even if you have a 5 second timeout. Also future proof, fastest GPU and CPU on a phone to date.


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## Tilton (Nov 27, 2011)

The iphone 4s does support gmail push, google calendar, and so on. However, on the iphone, you can control how often it pushes ANYTHING, unlike a BB. So, while Google may support constant pushing, you can reign it in to however often you'd like. I get hundreds of emails per day, so when I'm not on wifi, I set the push on my work email account to once per hour so my phone isn't vibrating non-stop. Battery life is actually pretty good unless you play games or watch videos etc. I would say it is comparable to my BB's, especially because I never watched videos or played games on it :tongue2:


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## mrkleen (Sep 21, 2007)

Siri will get better and better over time. People involved in that class action must have a lot of time on their hands, as in general - even with limited abilities - it is amazing.

You can dictate and read text messages and emails - call people - schedule appointments - reminder - and if you work with third party apps like Remember the Milk - you can have the phone remind you based on geographical locations (remind me to buy milk when I reach the supermarket.)

The 4S has it all over BB in every instance IMO...and Siri is much more accurate than Dragon products.


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## Shad0w4life (Dec 23, 2011)

I love seeing that lawsuit though, after all the crap apple has done:

selectively attacking only HTC(the little guy) on bs patents that haven't held up elsewhere, while ignoring other companies, and then complaining when google gives them patents to support android


Mac vs PC commercials that were complete lies

Denying that Mac Defender was a virus and lying to people like my aunt

Stealing ideas and patenting them, multi touch, smartphone design, "number sequence recognition". Hypothetically the equivalent of Allen Edmonds patenting cordovan tommorrow claiming they invented the process to create it.


BB > Iphone for business hands down. 

Heck connecting to an exchange server on Android isn't as good as blackberry.

Yes the hate is strong in me  for many good reasons.


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## MikeDT (Aug 22, 2009)

mrkleen said:


> Siri will get better and better over time. People involved in that class action must have a lot of time on their hands, as in general - even with limited abilities - it is amazing.
> 
> You can dictate and read text messages and emails - call people - schedule appointments - reminder - and if you work with third party apps like Remember the Milk - you can have the phone remind you based on geographical locations (remind me to buy milk when I reach the supermarket.)
> 
> The 4S has it all over BB in every instance IMO...and Siri is much more accurate than Dragon products.


I tried Siri on a friend's iPhone 4S, found it completely useless, didn't understand my voice at all, However I don't have an American dialect, which seems to be the failing with most of these voice recognition things, like Dragon Dictate etc. It's supposed to support Mandarin as well as English, but we couldn't make that work properly either.


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## MikeDT (Aug 22, 2009)

MikeDT said:


> I tried Siri on a friend's iPhone 4S, found it completely useless, didn't understand my voice at all, However I don't have an American dialect, which seems to be the failing with most of these voice recognition things, like Dragon Dictate etc. It's supposed to support Mandarin as well as English, but we couldn't make that work properly either.


Added as quote, as edit seems to be broken at the moment
BTW My current phone of choice is an Android Samsung Galaxy S, does everything I need. I would have an iPhone 4S as I think it's actually a very good phone. However I don't want to be dealing with iTunes on my PC, and it would also mean committing to a very expensive mandatory two year contract.


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## Tilton (Nov 27, 2011)

Shad0w4life said:


> I love seeing that lawsuit though, after all the crap apple has done:
> 
> selectively attacking only HTC(the little guy) on bs patents that haven't held up elsewhere, while ignoring other companies, and then complaining when google gives them patents to support android
> 
> ...


While there is no argument that BB wins out over apple any day of the week when we're talking about business phones, I think you're going a bit overboard. If Wolfram Alpha didn't patent a number sequence recognition software before releasing it, thus giving every other company the same technology, it is basically free pickin's for who ever can get it done fast enough. It's like the guy who patented the paperclip.

The BB commercials ("tools, not toys") get it right in every sense. BB isn't made to browse the internet, play games, stream video/music just like the iphone isn't made to send 500-1000 emails/day. That said, the actual mailbox function (moving things to folders, accessing different folders, different/multiple email accounts) on an iphone is infinitely better than the mailboxes on a BB and very similar to how the mailboxes work on most Androids I have used.


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## mrkleen (Sep 21, 2007)

I dont know what business you guys are in...but in the advertising and marketing world, NO ONE is using a BB any longer.

Why worry about the keyboard when you can DICTATE to your phone and have it get it right 99% of the time, hands free?

You can hate apple all you want...but their products are way out in front in terms of technology.


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## Tilton (Nov 27, 2011)

mrkleen said:


> I dont know what business you guys are in...but in the advertising and marketing world, NO ONE is using a BB any longer.
> 
> Why worry about the keyboard when you can DICTATE to your phone and have it get it right 99% of the time, hands free?
> 
> You can hate apple all you want...but their products are way out in front in terms of technology.


I think you misunderstood (at least) me. I have a 4s and I do like it very much. I use Siri often as well. However, there are times when I'm in public that my emails are not something that should be broadcast aloud and indeed if the wrong person happened to overhear my email dictation, I could be looking for not just a new job but a new industry. It is those times that the touch keyboard really irritates me. Although, the text recognition is incredible.


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## MikeDT (Aug 22, 2009)

mrkleen said:


> Why worry about the keyboard when *you can DICTATE to your phone and have it get it right 99% of the time*, hands free?


Apparently.... provided one speaks with an American accent, or so it seems.



mrkleen said:


> You can hate apple all you want...but their products are way out in front in terms of technology.


I have very good reasons to hate Apple. Due to the fact that their "Made in China" products are stupidly overpriced here. Apple in China charges 6000RMB for a 16GB iPhone 4S, that's like $900 bucks USD!!... the Foxconn workers who make the things are probably only earning $200-$300 a month...ahem... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foxconn_suicides
Also one must commit to a mandatory, extremely expensive, 300RMB a month($45 USD), two year contract.

Also iTunes on PC is just horrible, a total resource hog and PITA to use. I tried it once, never again. Macs are stupidly overpriced as well here, around twice as much as one would pay in the USA for an Apple computer.

Apple in China seems to be pitching itself as very much a designer luxury brand for the brand whores, like Gucci, D&G, Prada, Abercrombie & Fitch, Ralph Lauren, etc. Paying for the name and perceived cachet. Owning an Apple product is very much a symbol of affluence and social status here. Probably why there's so many Apple counterfeits around. There's two knock-off iPhones in our office here. Some peeps even put Apple stickers on their Lenovo, Great Wall and Haier laptops, pretending they're Macbooks.... :crazy: The few who own Macbooks from what I've seen don't even use OS X, they've deleted it and installed Windows XP on them....so much for _"way out in front in terms of technology."_

To be frank, to me Apple is like the Emporio Armani of tech. products.


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## mrkleen (Sep 21, 2007)

MikeDT said:


> The few who own Macbooks from what I've seen don't even use OS X, they've deleted it and installed Windows XP on them....so much for _"way out in front in terms of technology."_


LOL

Yeah, that is the basis by which we judge who is developing quality, innovate products - what people in China and Mongolia are using.


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## Tilton (Nov 27, 2011)

an iphone 4s runs about $600 in the US and I would gladly pay $45/mo for the plan. I pay more than double for mine now. 

Somewhere online there was a breakdown of the parts cost for iphones and ipads (without labor and all other stocking, handling, packaging and shipping costs) and it was darn close to 50% of retail. Virtually all other retail products are double the wholesale cost, so it really isn't ludicrous. If it costs then $250 in parts alone, add in the other associated costs with getting the product to the consumer, and it is no wonder it runs $600 retail in the US. Apple is, after all, as many seem to forget, just an ordinary corporation looking to make a buck. There is no reason the standard retail math should not apply to them.


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## MikeDT (Aug 22, 2009)

Tilton said:


> an iphone 4s runs about $600 in the US and I would gladly pay $45/mo for the plan. I pay more than double for mine now.


I assume you're referring to prices being charged by US carriers like AT&T and Verizon for service, which I believe is probably one of the most expensive in the world, where mandatory two year contracts seem to be the norm as well. Most people here, including myself, pay around 50-150 RMB (about $7-$20) for service, pre-paid, no commitments. That makes the mandatory two year contract for an Apple iPhone in China extremely expensive indeed for most people.

People around here seem to have second hand iPhone 3s and 3GSs, because thee's no way they can afford a new iPhone 4S with it's expensive compulsory two year contract, or they'll just make do with counterfeits. As long as they have an Apple logo, that's good enough.
...ahem...things like.... https://www.gooapple.com/



Tilton said:


> Somewhere online there was a breakdown of the parts cost for iphones and ipads (without labor and all other stocking, handling, packaging and shipping costs) and it was darn close to 50% of retail. Virtually all other retail products are double the wholesale cost, so it really isn't ludicrous. If it costs then $250 in parts alone, add in the other associated costs with getting the product to the consumer, and it is no wonder it runs $600 retail in the US. Apple is, after all, as many seem to forget, just an ordinary corporation looking to make a buck. There is no reason the standard retail math should not apply to them.


Isn't that US retail math? Apple seem to be charging 50%-100% more for their products in China than in the USA. All Apple products are made in China of course. :eek2:

This price gouging is just typical of many foreign lux brands here, like Apple, LV, D&G, A&F, Burberry, etc.

BTW I did read somewhere that the actual bill of materials cost of an iPhone 4S is around $50-60 USD. Assembling the things can't cost that much, after all they're using Chinese cheap labour.

What actually makes an iPhone 4S around 2-3 times more expensive than top-end Android phones like the Samsung Galaxy S2 or HTC Evo 4G?...and why do they charge so much for iPhone carrier service in China? Greed...and because nouveau riche brand whores like the status and prestige that owning a genuine Apple product gives them?


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## MikeDT (Aug 22, 2009)

mrkleen said:


> LOL
> 
> Yeah, that is the basis by which we judge who is developing quality, innovate products - what people in China and *Mongolia* are using.


Because the supposedly technologically advanced OS X does NOT support Mongolian Script and it does NOT work with our classroom interactive whiteboard systems. Even Linux is more technologically advanced in this respect. Basically they bought Apple laptops because of the brand and NOT because of anything that OS X has over Windows.

FYI:
https://www.traceboard.com.cn/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongolian_script

Also because they've installed Windows on their Apple Macs...It proves one thing. that Macs are only PCs anyway, but with a designer logo, perceived brand cachet and premium price tag. So much for Apple's BS Mac vs PC commercials...
Macs are PCs.  The parts used to make an Apple branded computer and ones without the prestigious Apple logo are very much the same. All made in the same Chinese factories as well.

I can buy three good Lenovo PC laptops here for the price of just one Apple Macbook.

BTW used to own a Macbook, I bought it in the UK. The thing died after just three years. It's since I've been in China, I'm now seeing Apple for what they really are. A high profit/high mark-up designer brand, just like Emporio Armani, D&G, etc., that sells on their name and logo rather than actual real quality or technology.

See also this thread...
https://askandyaboutclothes.com/com...65-Brands-you-just-can-t-get-yourself-to-like


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## mrkleen (Sep 21, 2007)

Yeah, thats why nearly every professional who relies on their computer - graphic designers, photographers, musicians all use Mac. Because they are a 'designer' brand.


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## MikeDT (Aug 22, 2009)

mrkleen said:


> Yeah, thats why nearly every professional who relies on their computer - graphic designers, photographers, musicians all use Mac. Because they are a 'designer' brand.


They don't all use Apple computers, some use Lenovo, Asus, Acer, Dell, HP, Haier, Great Wall, Samsung, LG, etc. Most of the professional photographers are using Lenovo computers, from what I've seen, usually Thinkpad laptops. Probably because they want something reliable to get the job done. My Macbook crapped out after just three years, new mainboard required and therefore beyond economic repair, according to the "Genius" at the Apple Store in Beijing. I bought a Japanese Fujitsu laptop to replace it, certainly wouldn't buy another Apple computer.

*Why does Apple charge twice as much for their made in China computers, tablets and cellphones here in China than what they seem to charge for them in the USA?* Because they're pitching it as a designer brand here, and to preserve the exclusivity and prestige of their products. This is just typical designer brand behaviour. A Macbook here is almost $2,000 bucks(USD), a stupid amount of money for a laptop. An iPad is about $1,000 bucks.

Affluent brand whores seem to love the Apple logo on their computers and phones, because it's a status symbol. Probably why there's so many Apple counterfeits around, just like Armani, LV, Abercrombie, D&G, Burberry, Rolex etc.

BTW see a recent Tumblr I posted about Apple in Xilinhot...

Designer logo...fixed with sticky tape.


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## MikeDT (Aug 22, 2009)

Now this is an iPhone I could easily afford, and no mandatory two year contract either...

The iPhone gas stove...

Curious how Apple's venture into kitchen appliances wasn't announced at their Worldwide Developer Conference though.


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## Tilton (Nov 27, 2011)

MikeDT said:


> Now this is an iPhone I could easily afford, and no mandatory two year contract either...
> 
> The iPhone gas stove...
> 
> Curious how Apple's venture into kitchen appliances wasn't announced at their Worldwide Developer Conference though.


Sorry, boss. That is known to be entirely fake. See here: https://kotaku.com/5888445/fake-iphone-gas-stoves-seized-in-chinaAlso, yes, a Mac is a PC, but that is semantics. Of course they use nearly identical parts. Of course they serve the same function. But, PC has been branded by Microsoft as a computer that runs a Microsoft/MS-DOS based system whereas a Mac runs an iOS. You can argue all you'd like about the semantics, but a Windows-based system is universally referred to as PC and an iOS system is a Mac.

Apple is a brand for designers because it has, for lack of better wording, a more "art-friendly" operating system.

I'm not arguing one is better than the other (PC [PC as the world knows it, not as you know it] vs. Mac), but I have had Toshiba, Sony, Dell, HP, and a MacBook Pro in the last seven years. The MBP has been the longest lasting and most reliable. I would like to have a Lenovo as well, but we'll see. Further, if you want and expect a laptop to last longer than 4-5 years, you really don't have a dog in the fight. In three years your machine is outdated and slow compared to new offerings. In 5 years, it is most likely obsolete. While I see the value in keeping a machine until it dies and the "well, it still works" camp has a point, if we're talking about the cutting edge, if you have a 2-3 year old computer, you're not on it.


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## MikeDT (Aug 22, 2009)

Tilton said:


> Sorry, boss. That is known to be entirely fake. See here: https://kotaku.com/5888445/fake-iphone-gas-stoves-seized-in-china


Of course I know it's fake. They seized about 500 iPhone gas stoves apparently. There's probably tens of thousands of the things that they didn't get though. Obviously there's a manufacturer(Apple China Ltd. is what was on them) somewhere that felt there was a demand for Apple gas appliances. They don't run iOS but they'll certainly cook your rice or noodles OK.

Think you'd have to be really gullible to believe Apple Inc. would actually make gas cookers. I bet people would still buy them though, just for the brand. This is China, that's the kind of thing that happens here.

If there was an Emporio Armani branded washing machine, I'm sure someone buy it. After all we have Louis Vuitton pattern houses and surgical appliances in Burberry Nova Check. 





Tilton said:


> Also, yes, a Mac is a PC, but that is semantics. Of course they use nearly identical parts. Of course they serve the same function. But, PC has been branded by Microsoft as a computer that runs a Microsoft/MS-DOS based system whereas a Mac runs an iOS. You can argue all you'd like about the semantics, but a Windows-based system is universally referred to as PC and an iOS system is a Mac.
> 
> Apple is a brand for designers because it has, for lack of better wording, a more "art-friendly" operating system.
> 
> I'm not arguing one is better than the other (PC [PC as the world knows it, not as you know it] vs. Mac), but I have had Toshiba, Sony, Dell, HP, and a MacBook Pro in the last seven years. The MBP has been the longest lasting and most reliable. I would like to have a Lenovo as well, but we'll see. Further, if you want and expect a laptop to last longer than 4-5 years, you really don't have a dog in the fight. In three years your machine is outdated and slow compared to new offerings. *In 5 years, it is most likely obsolete*. While I see the value in keeping a machine until it dies and the "well, it still works" camp has a point, if we're talking about the cutting edge, if you have a 2-3 year old computer, you're not on it.


Suppose depends on what you're using a computer for. If one is into cutting edge gaming or something that's really "on it", a one year old computer might out of date, probably can't run the latest FPS games at their best. Some people are changing their graphic cards every few months, because the old one doesn't do the latest thing.

On the other hand I've got ten year old Founder Pentium 4 desktop PC at my office, still runs XP Pro, MS Office, IE, Chrome and QQ IM just fine, Well except the monitor blew-up last week, but they just changed the monitor for another one and I was back in business. :smile:

The _antique_ PC is good enough for browsing AAAC, doing IMs, making Powerpoint presentations etc... don't really need anything else at the moment for my office. Except when I use my laptop sometimes. Many of our teachers are using 5-10 year old IBM and Lenovo Windows XP laptops, they're fine for PPT presentations in the classrooms. Don't really need anything else here. They're certainly NOT obsolete because Microsoft still supports XP as well as Office 2003/2007. The system requirements for XP are very modest by today's standards

Pentium 233-megahertz (MHz) processor or faster (300 MHz is recommended)
At least 64 megabytes (MB) of RAM (128 MB is recommended)
At least 1.5 gigabytes (GB) of available space on the hard disk
CD-ROM or DVD-ROM drive
Keyboard and a Microsoft Mouse or some other compatible pointing device
Video adapter and monitor with Super VGA (800 x 600) or higher resolution
Sound card
Speakers or headphones
128MB RAM is probably pushing things a bit though, my P4 school desktop PC has 512MB and it's fine.

I originally bought the Macbook in the UK because I didn't really want to be dealing with Windows Vista on a new PC. Well newer is not always better. Windows 7 is OK though. AFAICT Windows Vista has never really taken off with enterprise and corporate users, many of are whom are still using XP.

A new PC might boot quicker and load software faster, but Word isn't going to go any faster than I can type. When something ceases to be useful and/or is no longer supported, that's when I think it's obsolete. We're not doing high-end professional video production or playing Counterstrike here. 

One of the teachers has a white Macbook, that's running Windows. She can't use it for teaching, because we can't make it work with the classroom TRACEboard systems. For some reason Apple's Mac to VGA adapter just doesn't work with the interactive whiteboards. We've even contacted the manufacturer (Beijing Really Sun Co., Ltd) in Beijing about it, no solution so far. They work with every other laptop here, including my own recent Fujitsu machine.

I've got an 80GB Apple iPod I bought in 2006, it still works. Don't use it as an MP3 player now though, I use it as a USB disk drive for storing documents, movies, etc.

In factories you'll sometimes see some really ancient PCs being used everyday. Old Windows 3.1 and Window 95 machines running CNC processes.

BTW I reckon the new Macbook Pro with Retina screen (baseline model) is probably going to be around $3,500(USD), maybe more, Based on Apple's usual product pricing here. That's almost a year's wages for a teacher here. When it eventually goes on sale here in a few months, as Apple always delays the release of their products in the country that they're made in. That's a lot of money for a laptop, and is certainly a luxury product IMO, given that I can buy a good Lenovo or similar for about $600-$800 bucks(USD) People will buy them though, and they'll probably install Windows them, because OS X doesn't run QQ Games or 56.com's streaming movie software or something.

This is an Apple thing I do find disturbing...







That's the Apple Store in Dongcheng, Beijing the day the iPhone 4S finally went on sale here, four months after everywhere else.
That white van on the right is for an *armed Public Security Bureau riot squad. *The same lot that opened fire in Tiananmen Square. Even on a normal day there's always dozens of scalpers outside of any Apple Store, peddling grey imported/smuggled iPhones and iPads at grossly inflated prices, such is the demand for the things from affluent brand whores. There's actually only four official Apple Stores in the whole of China anyway. Dozens of fake ones though, usually selling grey imported/smuggled Apple products at inflated prices. Even at Beijing Airport, the customs there specifically lists smuggling Apple products as contraband items, along with tobacco products, bullion and liquor...WTF!

Here's another thing, that's in my sig...
https://gallery.me.com/gomem
Apple is pulling the plug on this in two weeks time...AFAIK iCloud which is supposed to replace MobileMe, does NOT have a gallery feature for photos, so it's useless to me. What am I supposed to do here? I was using MobileMe gallery because it's one of the only photo hosting services that's not censored in China, and I thought I could trust Apple..apparently that's not the case. There's the fact that Apple is only providing iOS6 on the iPhone 4S, and not the older '4' model. So they've effectively _end-of-lifed_/obsoleted, and are no longer supporting a product that's barely two years old....because they would like you to buy a new one.....hmmm!

Apple is one of those luxury brands that I've come to hate with a passion since I've been here, just like Gucci with it's very expensive _made in China_ handbags....haters gonna hate..as the saying goes.


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