# The Buy-It-For-Life thread



## srivats

In theme with what we look for in all things tradly, I decided to start this thread to serve as a compendium for things that are what I call "buy-it-for-life", or in short BIFL. If there is such a thread already, mods please merge this with that thread.

This thread is not limited to just being clothing related; feel free to post other items you think are worthy of BIFL. I'd like to start this with two items that I truly think are BIFL.

The first time is a Leatherman multi tool (supertool 300). I've had one for ~10 years now and it has been so handy in situations that it is impossible for me to leave the house without one.










The second item is from forum favourite Filson. I've looked and looked for the perfect briefcase, purchased a few (made of leather, ballistic nylon, canvas, you name it) but after I got the Filson 258 and used it for a while, I knew I had my BIFL bag.

I tried the 257, but liked the size and the functionality of the 258 far more for my use (that readily accessible external pocket is a big plus over the 257). I replaced the leather strap (too long and not wide enough for me) with a cusom, locally made, fixed-length-strap made of military grade cotton canvas webbing. This strap makes it very comfortable to carry the bag bandolier style.

Here is a pic of my bag after an year or so of constant use, with lots of travel and lots of time outside in the sun. The straps are beginning to break in with a nice change in color from the original dark brown color. I hope to use this bag for many more years.


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## joenobody0

That is a very nice Filson. I hope my 257 looks that nice with some wear. 

I'd say my most BIFL items have been my SAB briefcase, and my collection of mechanical watches. I tend to try to only purchase things I would be glad to own for life, though sometimes practicality prevails.


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## Taken Aback

I'm in agreement on Filson and Leatherman. Like Leatherman, I feel Victorinox is deserving of BIFL status. I always try to have one with me, even if just an SD tool on a keychain. Staying within Helvetic borders, Swatch is my go-to brand as an lower-end affordable gift watch. Both remain Swiss-made.

This has been a BIFL-status item since my teenage years.:

I eventually acquired a ThinkPad in the 90's and my lust was not unrewarded. They are the best laptops in build and design.

It was created by American giant IBM and, in contrast to the Mac, marketed to the American business executive. They soon became a coveted status symbol of quality technology, and I envied the college students that could afford one (or rather, that their _parents_ could). For me, and many others, owning an older ThinkPad was better than trading up to the newest model from another brand. They were just built better, and looked beautiful.

Their preppy status only began to erode in the last decade when IBM sold off their consumer products division to one of their manufacturers in China. Yet, I would sooner buy a current TP than a new model from most other computer manufacturers. The quality of current ThinkPads still exceeds most other brands. Whether it will remain a BIFL staple for me, I don't know, but it certainly was one for me.

Here's a nice old preppy 80's ad that helped sell me and others on them:

:teacha:


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## Jovan

The modern equivalent would be an Asus. Those things are built tough and with quality parts.


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## Trip English

I've only started spending BIFL money on clothes in the last few years, but I assume that I'll be putting elbow patches on my RL suits & sport coats in 10-15 years. I have some shoes that are about to cross the 10 year mark and don't look any different than they did at 2 years. My Barbour coats, Filson briefcase, and Royal Hunter boots also show no signs of slowing down. 

Apart from clothing, I'll second the ThinkPad. I still use X40s for my installers' diagnostic & programming laptops. There's a nearly endless supply on eBay for about $200 and they're indestructible. If I could stomach using Windows as my main OS I'd use one as my daily driver. 

I think I'll probably be buried with my B&O gear. It doesn't die. I still fix units from the 60s.

Not sure how to categorize my Jeep. I'm sure some part of it will remain with me, but with dodgy engines and transmissions who knows how much and which parts.


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## Taken Aback

Jovan said:


> The modern equivalent would be an Asus. Those things are built tough and with quality parts.


I still think the modern equivalent of a TP, _remains_ a TP. That said, an ASUS is a nice machine; certainly in a top five along with Panasonic's ToughBook.


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## Trip English

Agreed. The move to Lenovo hasn't seemed to influence the product. Richard Sapper continued to advise on the ID through the transition.


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## 32rollandrock

My Peugeot PX10.

Rescued it from a basement when I was in high school, paying the exorbitant sum of $175, quite a lot for an unemployed kid back in 1980, and it wasn't new then--I figure it's circa 1971. Rode it from Seattle to Monterey, Calif., and back, full packs, in less than a month that summer (not that I'm proud or anything)--we had no destination or timetable, just meandered south until we woke up to overcast skies one day, which we figured was a signal to head back north. Never did get rained on. Since then, it's taken me more miles than I can count, through Montana and most every road worth riding in western Washington, where I grew up, plus a whole lot of commuting and running around town. I long ago replaced all the Simplex and other crappy French components with full Campy, but the gist remains. With lugwork that looks like something from a middle-school shop class and scratches everywhere, it is perhaps the world's ugliest bicycle--I call it The Pee-You-Yuck--but it has tons of soul. Health problems have not allowed me to ride for the past decade, but I will never part with this bike.


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## The Rambler

re bifl, while it's a great rationale for buying high quality items, a lifetime is a long time. pocket knives eventually get lost, styles change (yes, even traditional styles), accidents happen, one's shape changes, major advances in technology regularly occur, desire for something new and different strikes, things like that. i've bought a lot of things for life, very few survive 25 years.


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## mjo_1

As a lowly law student, I haven't yet purchased many items I intend to keep forever. But the few things I do have include:

1. Browning Shotgun. Belgian made, very nicely built.
2. Red Wing 1155s. Classic southern trad pull on boots, plus they're re-solable (sp?), so they're in it for the long haul.
3. I'll second the Victorinox pocket knives. I'd be lost without the scissors.

Great idea for a thread. I'm curious to see what else you all think makes the cut.


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## 32rollandrock

You raise good points. Not to be a stickler, but you say "very few." Surely, there is something. Enlighten, please--even if it's a sled with Rosebud on it (I'd put an emoticon here, but don't know how).



The Rambler said:


> re bifl, while it's a great rationale for buying high quality items, a lifetime is a long time. pocket knives eventually get lost, styles change (yes, even traditional styles), accidents happen, one's shape changes, major advances in technology regularly occur, desire for something new and different strikes, things like that. i've bought a lot of things for life, very few survive 25 years.


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## Taken Aback

Trip English said:


> The move to Lenovo hasn't seemed to influence the product. Richard Sapper continued to advise on the ID through the transition.


Insofar as the T and X series go, I agree, and the W models are certainly workhorses. However, Lenovo has erred with the _Edge_, and attempting to market a lesser series with the name _Ideapad_ can only threaten TP reputation further. This is why I was hesitant in my appraisal of the future.


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## Saltydog

The Rambler said:


> re bifl, while it's a great rationale for buying high quality items, a lifetime is a long time. pocket knives eventually get lost, styles change (yes, even traditional styles), accidents happen, one's shape changes, major advances in technology regularly occur, desire for something new and different strikes, things like that. i've bought a lot of things for life, very few survive 25 years.


Thank you. I'm glad someone of our generation brought a bit of leavening to the discussion. I fear I'm in danger of being labled a cynic, curmudgeon, or worse for always reminding the younger guys not to assume the things they swear lifetime allegiance to might not make the cut as they transition into older men. As you point out, I've found that almost everything changes or evolves to some degree. Otherwise I'd still be pounding out copy on a manual Royal typewriter and wearing poly/cotton perma press shirts with 14 1/2 necks. And, I've lost more Swiss army knives than I can count. Rare is the oft used item of anykind that will still be around decades later. Never thought I'd tire of my Rolex either...but finding myself very tempted to sell it, buy 2 or three much less expensive but attractive and interesting watches that probably keep better time, don't cost $300+ to clean and put more in the pot for the years when I will really need it. Everything changes--including our tastes and priorities,


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## Jovan

Within reason, of course. Just because your body changes shape doesn't mean your clothes won't be fashionable again in a few decades and fit a son/nephew/fellow AAAC member.


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## Saltydog

^^^
Yeah, and we're gonna rent store rooms to keep them in just in case. Right


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## Wisco

I guess I have three things I would consider BIFL items in my posession, none of them clothing. As others of said, shoes will eventually wear as will clothing.

1) Audio Research VS-50 vacuum tube power amplifier - I bought this amp several years ago and can truly say it has everything and anything I want for reproducing music. It make listening to music a pleasure, is built like a tank, and will be supplied with spare parts and tube by Audio Research... forever. Founder William Zane Johnson is still at the helm of this Minnesota company and has maintained a clear vision for his products.



Buck Folding Hunter knife - I received one of these when I was a Boy Scout.. circa 1980's and it continues to amaze me. A solid folding lock mechanism and quality steel that takes and holds an edge. Buck knifes of that era are going to be around after the cockroaches are gone.



My Chris Kvale Bicycle - Chris is a one man band who does all aspects of custom bicycle building from measuring you, cutting tubes, brazing and painting. My lugged steel Kvale is a BIFL item assuming I don't crash heavily.


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## Steve Smith

Cast iron skillet.


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## Trevor

I love this thread. I am 100% against the throw away society.

Here is my cast iron skillet i use all the time. Its 125 years old already.... it will be 175 by the time im done with it and can pass it onto my children/their children!


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## MacTweed

Trevor said:


> I love this thread. I am 100% against the throw away society.
> 
> Here is my cast iron skillet i use all the time. Its 125 years old already.... it will be 175 by the time im done with it and can pass it onto my children/their children!


I love my cast iron. Although I purchased it new, it will certainly be around forever.

To add my 2-cents... my Saddleback leather bag, shown here in Nassau. No need to be gentle with this bag. Even loaded it up with 6 bottles of premium rum while in Nassau. Was pondering the Cuban cigars, but that nonsensical trade embargo!


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## Himself

Taken Aback said:


> I still think the modern equivalent of a TP, _remains_ a TP.


I agree. I'm still using a t42. Before that a T20 for like 7 years. I use Linux so speed isn't an issue. I'm addicted to the little joystick thingie, and can't type on any other keyboard. If they stop making these I'm a dead man.

I would like a better screen that i can use outdoors, otherwise my machine is fine. I almost bought an X200 or X300, but then... nah.

I actually think the all-metal Macbooks have Thinkpads beat for quality. But I hate trackpads, and having to buy all that software. Mine's free.

7 years is only BIFL in the dog-years of the computerverse.


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## Bjorn

Thinkpads are great. My x model is really sturdy. 

I don't see myself using that same computer in 5 years though. Which rules it out as bifl IMO. We're stuck with windows and performance will be an issue. 

I think bifl sorta rules out electronics, although some stereo equipment and such may be eligible. 

One thing you can b f l is a seiko automatic watch, preferably a diver. It will always tell time well, and parts and service will always be available and cheap. 

A good Seki made veggie knife should last a good long while. 

Simple, double sided, silver cufflinks?


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## Taken Aback

Unless T series quality drops, I expect to own another contemporary T (or W) model 5 years from now. I also expect my current T to remain functional at that time, just as my original 760XD remains so now. Of course, neither model will be of much use then, as any PC has a limited usable lifespan before they become a collectible or paperweight. However, TP's are likely to function when other brands bite the dust, and that's why the _line_ holds BIFL status in my eyes. My antiquated 760XD still looks and feels better than many contemporary laptops.


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## Bucksfan

I'll also echo the cast iron skillet. The four I have, all from the early 1900's, will last my wife and I the rest of our lives. 

On the shoes, with a good rotation and resoling, they can certainly last a good while. A lifetime? Maybe. 

A good auto watch will also maybe get the job done. I have a seiko orange monster that is built like a tank! With proper maintenance, I'm sure my Rolex sub will do it. 

How about a flannel-lined canvas shirt? I have a llbean version that is already 15 years old.


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## eagle2250

Well there's the Buck knife that I took hunting with me back in the early 1960's. As others have mentioned, there is my bicycle; a Schwinn S-10, built back when they were still making them in Colorado and the Schwinn name still meant something! My Sig-Sauer, bolt action, .243 cal. and Browning Lever Action .308 cal. rifles, purchased back in 1972 and 1976, respectively. Several mentioned clothes and shoes, but as others rebutted such conclusions are arguable...even my wellworn and well loved 28 year old shell cordovan Leeds are on their last legs (no pun intended), as the AE recrafting folks said "this would be the last time," two or three years back when they were most recently recrafted (and that was after a fair amount of pleading on my part!). LOL, I am wearing them sparingly and only when the weather cooperates, so they just might outlast me, but does that stand as a true reflection of their longevity? :crazy:


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## Larsd4

Engagement ring.


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## Sartre

The Rambler said:


> re bifl, while it's a great rationale for buying high quality items, a lifetime is a long time. pocket knives eventually get lost, styles change (yes, even traditional styles), accidents happen, one's shape changes, major advances in technology regularly occur, desire for something new and different strikes, things like that. i've bought a lot of things for life, very few survive 25 years.


Shape change is right. A few years after grad school I bought a camel's hair polo coat and an original Burberrys trench that I was going to wear deep into old age. I think I got 10 years out of 'em anyway.

Also sticky fingers. I bought a dark herringbone chesterfield coat that was stolen out of the coat closet of a funeral home while I was at a viewing. My Laguiole corkscrew, a birthday present from my wife, was to be my wine opener for life until it disappeared at a party.


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## The Rambler

32rollandrock said:


> My Peugeot PX10.
> 
> Rescued it from a basement when I was in high school, paying the exorbitant sum of $175, quite a lot for an unemployed kid back in 1980, and it wasn't new then--I figure it's circa 1971. Rode it from Seattle to Monterey, Calif., and back, full packs, in less than a month that summer (not that I'm proud or anything)--we had no destination or timetable, just meandered south until we woke up to overcast skies one day, which we figured was a signal to head back north. Never did get rained on. Since then, it's taken me more miles than I can count, through Montana and most every road worth riding in western Washington, where I grew up, plus a whole lot of commuting and running around town. I long ago replaced all the Simplex and other crappy French components with full Campy, but the gist remains. With lugwork that looks like something from a middle-school shop class and scratches everywhere, it is perhaps the world's ugliest bicycle--I call it The Pee-You-Yuck--but it has tons of soul. Health problems have not allowed me to ride for the past decade, but I will never part with this bike.


Damn, 32, in my garage hangs a PX-10 (ca. 1971) with mostly Campy components. I love that bike, though I haven't ridden it (or any other bike) in a long time..


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## CMDC

Wisco, I love that tube amp.


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## 32rollandrock

See?



The Rambler said:


> Damn, 32, in my garage hangs a PX-10 (ca. 1971) with mostly Campy components. I love that bike, though I haven't ridden it (or any other bike) in a long time..


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## 32rollandrock

And I'm loving that bike. What type of steel is it? I've been out of the game so long I can't say whether Reynolds or Columbus is still in play. If the tubing is on par with the good old days, it'll take most any crash save something involving a semi. Carbon fiber and aluminum, not so much, which is why the lugged steel frame is the way to go unless you're into criteriums or stage racing. Some advice: Get a spare bottom bracket (or two), spare brakes, spare derailleurs, etc. now while they still make them. As a fan of vintage bikes, I'm all too aware how tough it is to find components that fit 40-year-old frames, especially ones with French threads.



CMDC said:


> Wisco, I love that tube amp.


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## The Rambler

Yeah, thinking it over as I rereadad this fun thread, I can name any number of things in the 25+ category that still see regular use, including several cast iron fry pans, 2 inherited watches, several pair of shoes, an overcoat, most of my furniture, any number of paintings and rugs, a zillion books, a few suits and jackets, a cane fly rod and a few reels, a pair of binocs, silver items, etc. 

So I suppose I should restate my proposition: not much actually lasts a lifetime, for a thousand reasons, but it's a fine rationale for buying high quality things.


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## spielerman

32rollandrock said:


> And I'm loving that bike. What type of steel is it? I've been out of the game so long I can't say whether Reynolds or Columbus is still in play. If the tubing is on par with the good old days, it'll take most any crash save something involving a semi. Carbon fiber and aluminum, not so much, which is why the lugged steel frame is the way to go unless you're into criteriums or stage racing. Some advice: Get a spare bottom bracket (or two), spare brakes, spare derailleurs, etc. now while they still make them. As a fan of vintage bikes, I'm all too aware how tough it is to find components that fit 40-year-old frames, especially ones with French threads.


Both are still in play... as they say Steel is Real... I ride a bike made by John Slawta circa 2001 Porsche racing blue in color Campy Chorus 9 speed. Still my ride of choice, refined and even with my classic mavic pro rims, bottle cages, and pedals weighs in a 19 lbs... https://landsharkbicycles.com/what/

Victorinox knives do get lost or destroyed. I had my grandfathers knife, which I remember him picking a lock with to get some stolen goods back while we were on vacation as he hunted down the perp. Unfortunately, it went through the wash in a pair of jeans, and could not be revived...


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## well-kept

I still have the Rawlings baseball glove I got when I was 9 years old. One of the old great Made in USA Heart-of-the-Hide gloves.

A pair of Gokey bullhide boots, made in 1971. I bought them unoworn a few years back. Took two years to break them in but I expect them to outlast me.

Rare Swiss Army Knife with rosewood handles, carried every day for the last 20 years. No reason except TSA and my possible forgetting to pack in in checked luggage, that it should ever leave my possession


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## The Rambler

32rollandrock said:


> And I'm loving that bike. What type of steel is it? I've been out of the game so long I can't say whether Reynolds or Columbus is still in play. If the tubing is on par with the good old days, it'll take most any crash save something involving a semi. Carbon fiber and aluminum, not so much, which is why the lugged steel frame is the way to go unless you're into criteriums or stage racing. Some advice: Get a spare bottom bracket (or two), spare brakes, spare derailleurs, etc. now while they still make them. As a fan of vintage bikes, I'm all too aware how tough it is to find components that fit 40-year-old frames, especially ones with French threads.


I'm thinking Reynolds double-butted 531 tubes. Strong, light, lively.


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## Saltydog

Like Rambler, I guess I can name a lot of stuff I've gotten multiple decades of use out of...and since I'm a packrat, certainly I still have mementos from my childhood. If you take it outside clothing and most technology it's a different story. My wife stills cooks in pots and pans my parents sold during the depression. I still have guns and knives I've hunted with since I was a kid...and others that are well over 30 years old. Tools are another thing that can last. Guess I was thinking of less utilitarian items since this is basically a fashion forum--but it is indeed fun to think back over items one has had--and enjoyed for a very long time. My collection of hardcoverr Ian Fleming James Bond books that I bought in installments in the early 60's for example. My son has dibs on them when I check out. Also, my wife just bought me the 3rd pillow I can ever remember owning. Slept on one my older brother brought home form the Navy and gave me when I was a toddler until I was nearly 40. Not one to quit on a comfortable head rest that you can wad into any shape desired to get comfortable. Record albums and singles (albeit scratchy) from my teen years--check. Okay, I was wrong in my original pontifications...but not completely. Just depends on what one is talking about. Good thread.


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## AncientMadder

acoustic guitar


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## Billax

Allen Edmonds Nassau II Brogues, in Sharkskin with lace tip tassels. Purchased new in 1973. Closing in on 40 years old. Still worn regularly.


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## Bjorn

Billax said:


> Allen Edmonds Nassau II Brogues, in Sharkskin with lace tip tassels. Purchased new in 1973. Closing in on 40 years old. Still worn regularly.


Those are some pretty nifty brogues...


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## TimHardy

Trevor said:


> I love this thread. I am 100% against the throw away society.
> 
> Here is my cast iron skillet i use all the time. Its 125 years old already.... it will be 175 by the time im done with it and can pass it onto my children/their children!


Great Thread and my philosophy entirely - just can't bring myself to make something or buy something if it won't do the time. Keep it up guys.


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## jeffdeist

My 45 pound standard olympic plates. About a buck per pound at most sporting goods stores.


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## Bricktop

Billax said:


> Allen Edmonds Nassau II Brogues, in Sharkskin with lace tip tassels. Purchased new in 1973. Closing in on 40 years old. Still worn regularly.


Effing spectacular!!!


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## The Rambler

well-kept said:


> I still have the Rawlings baseball glove I got when I was 9 years old. One of the old great Made in USA Heart-of-the-Hide gloves.


Wish I still had mine - I loved that thing - I think my longtime fondness for fine light brown shoes can be traced back to my heart of the hide Rawlings.


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## eyedoc2180

2003 Mercedes Benz E500. Black. With this week's professional fix-up of stone chips and scratches, it looks like new. It just won't quit, and has stopped costing me lots of money.


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## P Hudson

I've probably got less than 30 years to go. The only things I own that I expect to last till then are:
wedding ring
Victorinox knives
older Craftsman tools
crystal pieces I bought in what is now Slovakia
Wedgewood China
various fountain pens
family pictures
furniture
books and albums.

I do have some clothes that I bought 30 years ago or more, so they could be added to the list. 

Seems to me that many of the things that will last are made of quality metal, glass or leather. I don't, generally speaking, have much interest in those sorts of things.

I just remembered, I have my grandfather's baseball and glove--probably from the 1940s, maybe '30s. My dad left it for my son, who isn't ready to receive it yet imo.


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## mjo_1

AncientMadder said:


> acoustic guitar


Reminds me of one I forgot - My grandparents gave me a Martin D-18 Golden Era for high school graduation in '05. I plan on keeping it forever.

I've also got an American made Fender Stratocaster. While it's a 'buy it for life' item and would certainly last that long, I've been thinking of selling it in order to fund another Martin with with rosewood back and sides.


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## Himself

Reyn Spooner shirts.

If whitebread WASP Newport Beach is an ethnicity, Spooners are our ethnic costume -- like lederhosen for Germans, kilts for Scots, or Mao jackets for Chinese. Many older gents around here have 20 closet-feet of Spooners (and little else), having been buying them since the 60s.

Spooner cloth is tough and these shirts are hard to kill. Seams unravel before the cloth shows any wear. They're as close to a lifetime garment as you'll find.


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## Wisco

My bike is simple over sized Deda butted steel hand brazed by Mr. Kvale. The beauty of the bike is the solid but simple construction. I appreciate heavily decorated lugs, but the clean brazing and old-school paint design is just beautiful. The bike is mostly Campy Chorus 10-speed.

I also have a carbon fiber Cervelo, but I find myself longing to ride this lugged steel bike. Like a vacuum tube amplifier, a lugged steel bike is about as trad as it gets in those areas. But those discussions are for another forum...



32rollandrock said:


> And I'm loving that bike. What type of steel is it? I've been out of the game so long I can't say whether Reynolds or Columbus is still in play. If the tubing is on par with the good old days, it'll take most any crash save something involving a semi. Carbon fiber and aluminum, not so much, which is why the lugged steel frame is the way to go unless you're into criteriums or stage racing. Some advice: Get a spare bottom bracket (or two), spare brakes, spare derailleurs, etc. now while they still make them. As a fan of vintage bikes, I'm all too aware how tough it is to find components that fit 40-year-old frames, especially ones with French threads.


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## Blackford Oakes

*The Big Green Egg*


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## hookem12387

I'd really like to own one of these for life once I'm in a position to do so. Stuff may not last a life time, but if a few hundred dollars extra gets an extra 20 years of use out of something, then I think it works about the same. I only really have a cast iron roast pot that'll fall into this category, though I have a couple of jackets that are already 25 years old that I can see getting quite awhile out of. Other than than, I just hope the new fiancé lasts a lifetime, God knows that one cost me a few hundred extra.

Oh, and a full on arsenal of firearms with split ownership between me and my father (most are his, a few are mine, all will, sadly, one day be mine). There are easily 15-20 that are going strong at 30+ years right now that will be doing the same 30 years from today.


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## Wisco

If you really want to taste a roasted chicken, find thee a friend with an Egg. Yum....


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## tocqueville

I have a hard time taking seriously the idea of anything technological like a ThinkPad being a "BIFL" item. When I was a kid in the 1970s, my journalist father was very fond of his sleek portable typewriter, an Olivetti. Does that company even still exist? At some point in the 1980s, my father thought his TRS-80 Model 100 was the greatest thing since the invention of fire. Anyone remember that? It was probably the first useful laptop computer ever made. And then there was his TRS-80 III, on which he wrote at least two books...and which he swore by until he discovered the Macintosh, which made the TRS-80 gear about as modern as that Olivetti typewriter....you get my point.

Anyway, it seems that the few items that really qualify are either not-technical (a Filson bag), low tech (a knife, bolt-action rifle, steel bike, or cast-iron pot), or anachronistic in a way that makes them paradoxically more valuable, like a mechanical watch. One reason why I value mechanicals over quartz is the sense that the mechanicals are more likely to find their way to my sons' wrists...

I own few items that would qualify as BIFL. My feet do too much damage for my shoes to last much past 5 years, I reckon. I don't own Filson gear, yet. I've lost all my pocket knives. The Mrs. won't let my buy a firearm, which is exactly the sort of item I'd want to be able to pull out of storage at any point in time between now and the end of days and be able to use right then and there. All I have is my modest watch collection, most of which is inherited from my grandfather. And that Le Creuset dutch oven I'm planning on buying the Mrs.

I think it's a great thing to try to aim for BIFL when making purchases. I'm increasingly impatient with items that are designed to be disposable, such as much of the clothing available in stores today. For that reason I've decided that when my current leather briefcase dies (which won't be that long, since it's not that well made), I'll replace it with a Filson 257. And when my eldest son's new backpack fails at the end of this school year--as I know it will--I'll replace it with a Duluth Pack. He'll be upset because there are no cartoon characters on it, but I'll be satisfied that I'll never have to buy him another one until the day comes when he'll want something bigger. Or be able to pay for one himself.

I wish I could afford BIFL-class furniture. Stuff made from real, solid wood.


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## Mississippi Mud

My wife gave me a Randall knife for our tenth anniversary.


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## 32rollandrock

^^

Tocqueville raises good points about computers, although, full disclosure, I'm in the market for a laptop and found this thread useful in this regard. I remember the TRS-80, aka Trash 80, complete with acoustic couplers (we called them muffs) to send stuff over the phone. I recall trying to send a review of an Aerosmith concert that way in the foyer of the concert hall via pay phone. Suffice to say, the muffs didn't trump the band's amplifiers, and so it ended up being a full-lung dictate to the desk. That said, the Trash 80 probably could qualify as BIFL--they were darn near indestructible, although there was no way to connect to the internet, given that the internet didn't exist.

I would suggest that there is no internal-combustion vehicle on the planet that is BIFL, at least, if it's a vehicle you plan on actually using as opposed to putting in storage and displaying at car shows. Beware all ye who get sentimental over rolling stock. Cars are cruel mistresses, and they will all--from Buicks to Benzes--eventually deteriorate to the point of being bottomless money pits. It is the nature of the beast.

Cast iron skillets are a great call. Mrs. 32 and I have two, one from SA, the other from a garage sale. They are go-to utensils. It is instructive, I think, to consider just how ubiquitous cast iron skillets are, and the reasons why. First, they really do last forever. Secondly, very few people appreciate them or know how to properly care for them. I can't count the times I've had to, as gently as possible, tell folks not to wash my pan with the rest of the dishes. I've seen people put them in dishwashers. So many people prefer cheap Teflon, because it seems so simple and easy--properly seasoned cast iron is just as non-stick, but you can't convince anyone. We are a disposable society.

Finally, I would like to include my record collection as another BIFL. I still have the first record I ever acquired--A Hard Day's Night by the Beatles, given by a relative for Christmas when I was in junior high school--and I have never disposed of an LP that came into my possession. To get rid of a record somehow seemed very wrong, and so I have a lot of stuff, from the near-complete works of Mister Rogers (I'm missing the one with the fake mirror on the cover, if anyone has it, get in touch) to Trout Mask Replica to Hotel California. The late 80s and early 90s were fertile times, as lots of folks were getting rid of their records and you could find pristine Zappa discs for a buck or less at the thrift store. My, how I stocked up. It has come full circle. Folks see a big record collection these days and get nostalgic, pulling out sleeves (DON'T TOUCH THE VINYL!!) and saying play this, and this, and this. I am prepared for the future and have five turntables. Digital may be forever, but LPs are timeless.


----------



## CMDC

^Another vinyl junkie, huh? Good to hear. While I've never thought of my collection strictly in these terms, I'll be damned if I'm ever getting rid of any of them. Moving 2000Lps--not fun. I've been thinking of getting a new deck to replace the vintage Pioneer I've got now.


----------



## Wisco

CMDC said:


> ^Another vinyl junkie, huh? Good to hear. While I've never thought of my collection strictly in these terms, I'll be damned if I'm ever getting rid of any of them. Moving 2000Lps--not fun. I've been thinking of getting a new deck to replace the vintage Pioneer I've got now.


Damn we have a "vinyl sub-group" a brewing here on the Trad board? You think a guy like me with a tube amp would NOT have a turntable? :tongue2:

CM, get thee a Rega P3 and be happy for life. There are lots of high-end audiophile turntables out there, but the Rega is as good a BIFL piece as their is in audio. You could even consider the lower cost Rega RP1 at around the pair of a Alden cordovan shoes (clothing tie in).

I have a straight up 2-channel system consisting of a modified Rega P3 that drive an Audio Research tube pre-amp and amp feeding Magnepan planar magnetic speakers. Old school Minnesota-born audio and the entire system is probably BIFL. There is a CD player in there, but it is for the kids. I'm not anti-digital; I just prefer tubes and vinyl.


----------



## Taken Aback

Wisco said:


> Damn we have a "vinyl sub-group" a brewing here on the Trad board? You think a guy like me with a tube amp would NOT have a turntable? :tongue2:


You know....if someone were to create such a user group on this very board, they might find someone else wishing to join as well. *cough*

Considering how well I take care of my vinyl, I should have also added that my collection consists of many BIFL purchases. There's something about 12x12" cover art that makes vinyl so much more enjoyable a purchase compared to a CD, and certainly more than something through the ether such as a download. Music can be so ephemeral, especially if you listen to radio, but the tangible nature of a recording is a physical anchor for music in our three-dimensional world, and vinyl always offered the most beautiful version. Hell, an artist can't autograph an iTunes download, can they?


----------



## godan

Mississippi Mud said:


> My wife gave me a Randall knife for our tenth anniversary.


Yes, indeed, plus 1 for Randall knives. My two are over twenty years old, both heavily used and still excellent. My other BIFL brands are Glock, Kalashnikov, Ruger (revolvers), Leupold, Rolex, Langlitz, Danner (including those sourced offshore), Arc'Teryx and Subaru. If an item of those brands wears out (and they usually don't) I have it repaired or pretty much buy another of the same brand without shopping elsewhere. The Subaru is replaced every three years with another Subaru. Brief, foolish, indiscretions with a BMW and an Audi TT coupe reminded me of the value of reliability in all things.


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## 32rollandrock

Keep in mind that BIFL can be overrated. I had the fortune of being handed the keys to a Porsche Boxster for a month-and-a-half this past summer. Not at all BIFL--my 1993 Buick Century is going to out-last that car--but big fun, especially since I wasn't responsible for any costs except gasoline.



godan said:


> Yes, indeed, plus 1 for Randall knives. My two are over twenty years old, both heavily used and still excellent. My other BIFL brands are Glock, Kalashnikov, Ruger (revolvers), Leupold, Rolex, Langlitz, Danner (including those sourced offshore), Arc'Teryx and Subaru. If an item of those brands wears out (and they usually don't) I have it repaired or pretty much buy another of the same brand without shopping elsewhere. The Subaru is replaced every three years with another Subaru. Brief, foolish, indiscretions with a BMW and an Audi TT coupe reminded me of the value of reliability in all things.


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## oldominion

Wisco said:


> CM, get thee a Rega P3 and be happy for life. There are lots of high-end audiophile turntables out there, but the Rega is as good a BIFL piece as their is in audio.


Uh-oh. Here we go. Wisco, the Rega is no more BIFL than my VPI Scout, which lives in a second system and which I love dearly. I've heard Regas and have enjoyed them, wonderful decks and I had nothing but respect for Roy Gandy, but when you want to start talking BIFL turntables you absolutely have to go with something far, far more classic than either Rega or my beloved VPI, and to take into account that sound will never alone satisfy an audiophile looking to BIFL. Like clothing or shoes, there has to be some deeper appreciation of the product, some respect that it has stood the test of time, which of course the Rega and VPI have both done...But one must look to Europe, Switzerland specifically, when one begins thinking about BIFL turntables. Yes, sitting proudly on a shelf screwed into a brick wall in my living room sits the mighty Thorens TD124, the king of all turntables, save perhaps the currently overpriced British Garrard 301...This entirely over-engineered beast of a 124 was made in the late fifties of high grade Swiss steel and will certainly outlive me. I've currently got an early sixties Rek-o-Kut arm on it and a Denon 103 cartridge, all of which were in production soon after the Thorens itself was made (I think the 103 was first produced in '61). The Denon cart is low output but is, without question, a BIFL product. My turntable set-up could have existed in '61 but sounds just as good as anything being made today.

My hifi nerdery knows no bounds so I will refrain from boring the rest of you with my fond recollections of all the gear I've loved and lost, but right now I'm thoroughly enjoying my Conrad Johnson amp and preamp (handmade in the Old Dominion!), an Avid phono pre (handmade in jolly olde England!), in addition to a Quad 99 pre and 909 power (made, sadly, "overseas"); speakers switch between Gallo 3.1's and Quad 12ls's, neither of which are, in my opinion, BIFL (although I genuinely love the Gallos)...The CJ is all the way BIFL--my kids will listen to it after I'm gone--but having a mild case of audiophilia nervosa I'm afraid I'd jump at the first chance I got to ditch the Avid and buy a tubed phono pre made by CJ.

I listen to all kinds of music but once it starts getting chilly here in Baltimore I tend to move towards Sinatra, jazz, classical (the last genre of vinyl collection where one can still find absurdly good pressings of brilliant recordings for pennies) and other vocal music...Hey, the Ravens game just started or else I'd go on!


----------



## TimHardy

mjo_1 said:


> Reminds me of one I forgot - My grandparents gave me a Martin D-18 Golden Era for high school graduation in '05. I plan on keeping it forever.
> 
> I've also got an American made Fender Stratocaster. While it's a 'buy it for life' item and would certainly last that long, I've been thinking of selling it in order to fund another Martin with with rosewood back and sides.


Would love to own the Strat! Let me know if you make the decision please.


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## oldominion

Someone start the vinyl sub-group and I'm in like Flynn.


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## 32rollandrock

I'm not opposed, but certainly there must be a pre-existing outlet for that. After all, this isn't Ask Andy About Audio. 


oldominion said:


> Someone start the vinyl sub-group and I'm in like Flynn.


----------



## Bjorn

Kamasa Tools


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## Trip English

He's off getting new belts and a new stylus. I'll snap a pic when he comes back. Long live linear tracking.


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## FLMike

A few of my BIFL items:

Remington 1100 Lightweight 20 ga.
Beretta O/U 12 ga.
Barbour Classic Beaufort
Filson Shelter Cloth Waterfowl/Upland Coat
Gokey Sauvage Hikers
LLB Maine Hunting Shoe
Rolex Datejust
Filson 257 Briefcase


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## Pentheos

Few things will actually last you a lifetime, especially if moving parts or technological advances are involved. Cast iron pans (got three) and Victorinox knives (got two) should come close. Surprised that no one mentioned Volvos. My '02 has a paltry 105K; I expect it to last twice as long. And I'd never purchase another computer but a Thinkpad. My R series from 2006 wasn't doing it for me anymore (not a thing wrong with it besides I couldn't play video games) so I upgraded to a W520, which is an amazing machine.


----------



## The Rambler

^ if only! Cracka, I'd still have my first Beaufort, my Sauvage Hikers, and my Maine hunting shoes. All wore out, for one reason or another, in less than 20 years. I certainly got my money's worth out of all 3, of course, but lifetime, no.


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## Steve Smith

In addition to the cast iron skillet which I mentioned previously, here are a few BIFL items: Two Cold Steel knives, an Oversize Sheaffer Lifetime (that's actually what that white dot on the cap signifies, a lifetime guarantee) brown radite lever filler fountain pen with two-tone 14KT nib (circa 1930's), and a Seiko Black Monster automatic on a custom made military watch bracelet. The Seiko should last a lifetime with some servicing. The bracelet will last for a couple of lifetimes.


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## hookem12387

Steve, that bracelet is interesting. Post a couple more pictures of it sometime, if you wouldn't mind.


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## 32rollandrock

I smell controversy brewing...



Trip English said:


> He's off getting new belts and a new stylus. I'll snap a pic when he comes back. Long live linear tracking.


----------



## Trip English

Don't worry, 32. No one would ever defend radial tracking over linear tracking so there won't be any controversy.


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## Taken Aback

I so wish I had an ELP turntable so I could nip this in the bud.


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## 32rollandrock

For the record, I'm with you on linear tracking, although you're playing on a way different field than me and my beloved Technics SL5.



Trip English said:


> Don't worry, 32. No one would ever defend radial tracking over linear tracking so there won't be any controversy.


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## Trip English

Taken Aback said:


> I so wish I had an ELP turntable so I could nip this in the bud.


I don't trust those lasers.


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## Thom Browne's Schooldays

As if we needed more proof of Wisco's supreme coolness.

I have some BIFL items I guess, books, rugs, prints, paintings, furniture, records.

How about my Stanley no. 7 jointer?
The one I use regularly is probably pre-WWI with a new blade and chipbreaker, easily one of the 5 most used tools in the shop.








(not my picture, just a google image)


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## eagle2250

Trip English said:


> He's off getting new belts and a new stylus. I'll snap a pic when he comes back. Long live linear tracking.


LOL. This strikes me as an audiophile's version of an invitation to a 'dust-up,' sorta like the challenge to a rumble between the "Jets and the Sharks," thrown down during the community dance scene in West Side Story! Don't know if that classic production qualifies as a BIFL example, but it sure qualifies as a 'see it and enjoy the memories for life' experience!


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## Pentheos

Only luddites still listen to vinyl.


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## WouldaShoulda

mjo_1 said:


> 1. Browning Shotgun. Belgian made, very nicely built.


I sold mine due to lack of use, but life was the original intent.

I still have some post war reproduction Lionel Trains I purchased while still made in USA.

I suspect these are Lifers.


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## Semper Jeep

Pentheos said:


> Only luddites still listen to vinyl.


Then consider me a Luddite.

--------------

Most of my BIFL items are things that have been given to me as gifts. Right now I'm wearing Omega Seamaster Chronostop that was purchased by my father-in-law on shore leave in Singapore in 1964... about 14 years before I was born. The watch has never had a professional cleaning but is still running strong. I also have a garage full of hand tools that are probably 80 years old and belonged to my wife's grandfather who used them daily in his heating/cooling and plumbing business.

I see Victorinox pocket knives mentioned quite a bit in this thread and while I don't own one, I've probably given about 10 of them as gifts over the past few years and I still witness them getting used regularly by the recipients.


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## Trip English

I think Luddite is a compliment on the Trad forum.


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## 32rollandrock

I think Aretha Franklin did her best work after 1980.


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## Wisco

Now you sir have my admiration. I just finished working with our 8 year old Son on his Cub Scout project to build a tool box, working entirely with hand wood working tools. The hand plane is one of the coolest hand tools I have ever used... and much easier to get to work compared to the hand drill, hand hole cutter and hand coping saw.

I knew Amish craftmen made beautiful things, but now I have an appreciation for the skill it takes to use these hand tools. A drill press and table saw are such cop outs in comparison.



Thom Browne's Schooldays said:


> As if we needed more proof of Wisco's supreme coolness.
> 
> I have some BIFL items I guess, books, rugs, prints, paintings, furniture, records.
> 
> How about my Stanley no. 7 jointer?
> The one I use regularly is probably pre-WWI with a new blade and chipbreaker, easily one of the 5 most used tools in the shop.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (not my picture, just a google image)


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## Timeisaperception

I can think of a couple of things off the top of my head that'll be passed onto my kids eventually.

- Remington 11-48 (already 50 years old, picked it up on the cheap; should last another 50, easily)
- Buck 110 (as mentioned by Wisco; helluva knife.)
- Akubra Stylemaster fedora
- Brass cased and engraved Zippo lighter.


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## hookem12387

Trip English said:


> I think Luddite is a compliment on the Trad forum.


I think they're may still be some actual Luddites kicking around here . . . assuming the whole internet deal is acceptable.


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## Kreiger

First of all, love the thread. Love the idea of the thread. I think the romance of the BIFL ideal is appealing to those on this forum. Who wouldn't want something so classic, of such great quality, that it lasts for the remainder of one's days? Certainly no one who would consider a tweed suit, or any such thing.

I wrote most of a post about my BIFLs. Then I deleted it. I don't want my stuff to last my lifetime. It's good stuff. It deserves to get used. It deserves to die an honorable death. Sure, a Bark River knife would last my whole life sitting in my pocket, but doesn't it deserve the nicks and gouges of hard use? The rust slowly formed from countless accidental dunkings? My Parker 51 fountain pen is at least twice my age, but I mean to be the one who finally wears away the iridium point. My 2002 Subaru Outback won't last forever anyway, so why treat it as such? My 2009 Macbook Pro won't outlast the Subaru. How's that for romance?

As far as clothes go, all other variables being constant, the ones worn the least, last the longest, and clothes bought NOT to be worn seem silly. So yeah, buy cool stuff, then use the hell out of it till it falls apart. But then, maybe don't take this advice. Reading this post makes me wonder if I secretly like destroying things.

Also, I wonder if I'll ever write something more cliche.


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## Philly Joe

> save perhaps the currently overpriced British Garrard 301 turntable...


I nominate the Garrard 301..if you bought it for life, price isn't the ultimate consideration.

Plus they were quite reasonable until lately. Mine was $20 in 1989.


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## Bjorn

Double or single edge shaving gear. Have an Edwin Jagger I'm expecting to last +25 years. 

Since vintage de shavers are still being used/sold...


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## AlfaNovember

I generally lurk & listen, as I am a clothing novice, but since you've opened the can of worms labelled 'Audio'... My Altec 605A duplexes are BIF2ndL; they're going strong since 1963, albeit in my care for only 5 of those years. At the hot end of the wire, I've got Magnequest Cobalt output transformers that are unlikely to see production again, even if I could muster the scratch for another pair. Similarly, my '68 Pioneer turntable is not as storied as a 301 or EMT, but it continues to serve faultlessly in its' second or third lifetime. The whole lot is going to my son, provided it survives his upcoming toddler & teenage years. (Although he's going to be dismayed to learn dad's hi-fi only does 5 watts...)

Knife-wise, I have a CCK #2 vegetable slicer - a 'cleaver' in the parlance of our time - which is hewn from a plate of undistinguished carbon steel, hastily finished, and sold in Chinatown for under $50. And yet it is the knife I reach for 9 times of 10. 

On the occasion of my twentieth high school reunion, I was looking at my yearbook photo. I realized I still own & wear the tie in that photo. Turns out I selected a rather nice ancient madder paisley by H. Freeman & Son, bought at my hometown traditional clothier when dad decided his boy was ready for a proper set of clothes.

On the idea of buying "For Life" - I'm reminded of an old "Bert & I" comedy routine where the Judge asks an old down-east farmer if he had lived there "all his life"... to which the reply came "....... Not yet."


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## Markus

Well, if we're going to talk vinyl & audio I'll contribute to the controversy by nominating my Linn Sondek LP12, my Naim 82 preamp, hicap and 135 power amps. Probably not as high a resolution as the audio research VT-50, but very much a "set it, forget it" system that has provided many years of satisfaction.

On the clothing front I'll nominate my Filson weekender sweater. The discontinued 702 model, made in the good old US of A.

On the transportation front I'll nominate my Volvo '94 Volvo 940 wagon...


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## well-kept

While I tend to think of some expensive, patinated things as long term, I realize with a huge jolt that there is one entirely disposable item I may indeed have for the rest of my life. 

In 1983 I had a bike accident. While in the hospital a friend brought me some essentials, razor, toothbrush etc. Included in the bag was... don't laugh... a large plastic Ace comb. 30 YEARS LATER I still use it every day. It has lost one tooth. 

30 YEARS!! At this rate it will go on for centuries, unnoticed and basically unloved for its longeveity. Well, now it's been written about on the internet, so, some well-deserved appreciation.

I have also just realized that I still have almost all my hair, and that it still has it's color. Maybe I have that magic comb to thank, who knows?


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## LouB

well-kept said:


> I have also just realized that I still have almost all my hair, and that it still has it's color. Maybe I have that magic comb to thank, who knows?


Perhaps you could provide a service similar to that of the "Trad Tie Swap Box" and send it around to those of us with thinning hair so we can have a swipe of the magic comb? :biggrin2:


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## Taken Aback

Pentheos said:


> Only luddites still listen to vinyl.


Not everything has been reissued via other formats.



Trip English said:


> I think Luddite is a compliment on the Trad forum.


Indeed. Being hand-made is premium aspect of many items we cherish.


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## Trip English

Not mine, but my best friend bought this knife last year and I've been eyeing it since. Definately a BIFL purchase.


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## Mississippi Mud

Trip English said:


> Not mine, but my best friend bought this knife last year and I've been eyeing it since. Definately a BIFL purchase.


Do yourself a favor and go straight to Japanese chef knives.

https://japanesechefsknife.com/


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## The Rambler

Agree, Mud. My bifl german knives never get used, since I got Globals and Kershaw/Shuns.


----------



## Bjorn

Mississippi Mud said:


> Do yourself a favor and go straight to Japanese chef knives.
> 
> https://japanesechefsknife.com/


Yep! As stated before, nothing beats Seki knives. Good link. That's where I got them as well. I like the Hattoris in particular.


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## CMDC

^I wish you guys would stop putting new ideas in my head of things I need! Those knives are gorgeous.


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## Trip English

CMDC said:


> ^I wish you guys would stop putting new ideas in my head of things I need! Those knives are gorgeous.


This thread is going to have devastating effects on my net worth.


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## srivats

Trip English said:


> This thread is going to have devastating effects on my net worth.


I've achieved my goal 

Thanks to all for participating -- I'm enjoying reading the replies in this thread so far.

I'm amazed that no one has posted watches yet


----------



## 32rollandrock

Better yet, why not the BIFL swap box? Someone donates a turntable or Japanese chef knife, I replace it with a comb...



LouB said:


> Perhaps you could provide a service similar to that of the "Trad Tie Swap Box" and send it around to those of us with thinning hair so we can have a swipe of the magic comb? :biggrin2:


----------



## WouldaShoulda

32rollandrock said:


> Better yet, why not the BIFL swap box?


With my luck, I'd wind up with Herpes.


----------



## 32rollandrock

Generally, that's a gift, not a purchase, although YMMV, especially in Nevada.



WouldaShoulda said:


> With my luck, I'd wind up with Herpes.


----------



## AdamsSutherland

*I(nfected)FL*



WouldaShoulda said:


> With my luck, I'd wind up with Herpes.


The gift that keeps on giving.

It's odd to consider that half of the "lifer" items currently in my possession are already older than I am (which is not very.)

My:
(uncle's) mid-80's Rolex sub
(dad's) 1970's Nikon FM and 50mm _f/_1.4 AIS lens
(mom's) cast iron skillet
Tiffany Co. engine-turned sterling silver belt buckle
Tiffany Co. money clip

Frankly, if something makes it 20+ years, I think that's a damn good run.

Shell will last a maximum of 25 years, it seems. I know my beater pair of BB unlined #8's won't make it past ten, though my "nice" ones should, if only because I can count the number of times I've worn them. I give my Bean Boots (10" and mocs) fifteen, tops. My best friend has a pair of Maine Hunting Shoe mocs stolen from his father that are well into their twenties, if not thirties, but those are a different beast. 







New and old at the OBX in late January.

[Insert long, hackneyed comment waxing poetic on the abject reality of planned obsolescence in consumer goods, the inevitability of theft, loss, and unforeseen damage/destruction, and the frank recognition that even things capable of "lifer" status just won't make it because they were used hard and/or frequently.]


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## The Rambler

srivats said:


> I'm amazed that no one has posted watches yet


fwiw, I did, though they were inherited and thus may not qualify


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## Walter Denton

So many implements of destruction, e.g. knives, guns, have been listed. I suppose it's because of their relative simplicity and sturdy construction. It took me a bit to realize I also had a couple of relatively simple and sturdy BIFL items - two of my musical instruments - one is an SS Stewart 5-string banjo made in Philadelphia in 1894 and still quite playable. The other is a Bart Reiter 5-string made in Michigan in 1993 and destined to be around at least for the rest of my life. Perhaps surprisingly, the SS Stewart was made in a banjo factory and the Reiter was handmade. I don't have a BIFL guitar yet but I hope to have one made for me before long - my first "bespoke" musical instrument.


----------



## AlfaNovember

Trip English said:


> This thread is going to have devastating effects on my net worth.


The CCK 1303 is under $40, if you can find it. (not helping, am I?) Its's not gorgeous, but it's got beausage for days and extra days.


----------



## Trip English

No. Clearly providing enticing price-points and helpful links is not going to help matters.


----------



## some_dude

I disagree with some of the comments about cars and longevity. A car can last for 100 years or more (essentially indefinitely) if it is properly maintained. Of course, it may not make economic sense to do so, but it can be done-- and it makes just as much sense as proper maintenance of a mechanical watch, for instance. 

The same is true for airplanes. There are many 40-50 year old airplanes still in active service (not airliners), and as long as they are taken care of, they are fine.


----------



## 32rollandrock

Not sure I can agree here. The plane built by the Wright Brothers hangs in the Smithsonian and, presumably, could be fired up with a little tinkering. But would you take a ride on it? That's an extreme example, however. Small aircraft from the 1950s are in everyday use all over the place, with strict requirements for annual maintenance tasks.

A car is a different matter entirely and can depend on where one lives. All the maintenance in the world isn't going to keep a car going forever once rust sets in, and that's a given in the Midwest and anywhere else where roads are salted in the winter. I do not think that cars kept as collector's items, i.e., stored and not used to keep them preserved, should qualify for BIFL consideration.



some_dude said:


> I disagree with some of the comments about cars and longevity. A car can last for 100 years or more (essentially indefinitely) if it is properly maintained. Of course, it may not make economic sense to do so, but it can be done-- and it makes just as much sense as proper maintenance of a mechanical watch, for instance.
> 
> The same is true for airplanes. There are many 40-50 year old airplanes still in active service (not airliners), and as long as they are taken care of, they are fine.


----------



## some_dude

Rust is repaired on valuable old cars all the time.

The reason more cars don't survive longer is not because it's not possible, but rather because it's not economical. It's a key distinction.

Analogously, spending $500 on a mechanical watch service is clearly not economical either, yet that is how you keep a mechanical watch going for decades.

Incidentally, storing a car and not using it can in some ways be harder on it than driving it regularly. Cars were designed to drive, not to sit, and that becomes apparent in any garage queen.



32rollandrock said:


> A car is a different matter entirely and can depend on where one lives. All the maintenance in the world isn't going to keep a car going forever once rust sets in, and that's a given in the Midwest and anywhere else where roads are salted in the winter. I do not think that cars kept as collector's items, i.e., stored and not used to keep them preserved, should qualify for BIFL consideration.


----------



## CAG

Absolutely on the aircraft. I work with aircraft title records, and it's nothing to see one from the 70s. Commercial airliners seem to make it about 20 years (at least with US Registration, then they get sold somewhere else).

The only thing I own that I fully expect to have in my posession when I die is my Merkur razor.


----------



## 32rollandrock

Some rust can be repaired--I've done it on my Buick when a small spot appears near the bottom of a door, for instance. That's surface rust, though. The body cancer variety of rust--the type where it is literally from the inside out--is an entirely different matter, or so I am told. It apparently involves cutting out the metal section of door or whatever it is that is infected, just as a surgeon would do with a tumor, then welding in a new section of metal. Goes to show, I suppose, that you can fix anything if you want to spend enough money, but for a garden-variety Jeep, Volvo, Mercedes, Subaru, etc.? I don't think so, and I mean no offense to those who can't imagine life without them. I'm just saying. If we're talking a Tucker or Deusenberg (sp?), sure.



some_dude said:


> Rust is repaired on valuable old cars all the time.
> 
> The reason more cars don't survive longer is not because it's not possible, but rather because it's not economical. It's a key distinction.
> 
> Analogously, spending $500 on a mechanical watch service is clearly not economical either, yet that is how you keep a mechanical watch going for decades.
> 
> Incidentally, storing a car and not using it can in some ways be harder on it than driving it regularly. Cars were designed to drive, not to sit, and that becomes apparent in any garage queen.


----------



## Trip English

She's back from her tune-up. 20 years down...


----------



## AlfaNovember

Don't think we didn't spot the 6-eye.


----------



## Bricktop

Trip English said:


> She's back from her tune-up. 20 years down...


I'm betting that JW Blue won't see the end of 2011.

For me, I got a birthyear Gillette Super Speed DE razor off eBay. It will outlast me for sure.


----------



## dparm

Omega Speedmaster Professional

A timeless design that has not changed in decades. Neil Armstrong wore it in space. Looks great in the office with a suit, at the beach, or anywhere else. Will run forever and you can't get bored with its looks.


----------



## dparm

My next "for life" purchase will likely be a .45 ACP, perhaps a Colt 1911. My father has an original that has seen thousands of rounds and it still works beautifully. He has run some crazy hot loads through it and never had any issues with stovepiping or whatnot.


----------



## Congresspark

Walter Denton said:


> So many implements of destruction, e.g. knives, guns, have been listed. I suppose it's because of their relative simplicity and sturdy construction. It took me a bit to realize I also had a couple of relatively simple and sturdy BIFL items - two of my musical instruments - one is an SS Stewart 5-string banjo made in Philadelphia in 1894 and still quite playable. The other is a Bart Reiter 5-string made in Michigan in 1993 and destined to be around at least for the rest of my life. Perhaps surprisingly, the SS Stewart was made in a banjo factory and the Reiter was handmade. I don't have a BIFL guitar yet but I hope to have one made for me before long - my first "bespoke" musical instrument.


Glad to see a mention of musical instruments (and by a fellow upstate trad musician, if I'm guessing correctly). The characteristic of a buy it for life item is that you don't even think about replacing it. That's the case with my fiddle, a pre-War German Amati copy that I lucked into. Nothing exceptional, i can imagine (have played, in fact) different sounding instruments I might enjoy, but I'm so familiar with this one, that I can't see the point of changing.


----------



## godan

Walter Denton said:


> So many implements of destruction, e.g. knives, guns, have been listed. I suppose it's because of their relative simplicity and sturdy construction. It took me a bit to realize I also had a couple of relatively simple and sturdy BIFL items - two of my musical instruments - one is an SS Stewart 5-string banjo made in Philadelphia in 1894 and still quite playable. The other is a Bart Reiter 5-string made in Michigan in 1993 and destined to be around at least for the rest of my life. Perhaps surprisingly, the SS Stewart was made in a banjo factory and the Reiter was handmade. I don't have a BIFL guitar yet but I hope to have one made for me before long - my first "bespoke" musical instrument.


Some here have taken "implements of destruction" into harm's way, often in the service of their country or community. Reliability is highly prized when your life depends on it. Simple, sturdy devices are, in my experience, more often reliable than complicated, fragile ones.


----------



## The Rambler

Congresspark said:


> Glad to see a mention of musical instruments (and by a fellow upstate trad musician, if I'm guessing correctly). The characteristic of a buy it for life item is that you don't even think about replacing it. That's the case with my fiddle, a pre-War German Amati copy that I lucked into. Nothing exceptional, i can imagine (have played, in fact) different sounding instruments I might enjoy, but I'm so familiar with this one, that I can't see the point of changing.


reminds me of the song "drunken angel" by Lucinda Williams. Nice to hear from you, Congresspark.


----------



## ArtVandalay

Johnnie Walker...num num num.


----------



## Congresspark

The Rambler said:


> reminds me of the song "drunken angel" by Lucinda Williams. Nice to hear from you, Congresspark.


Thank you, Rambler. And that's a fine song from a fine album.


----------



## DG123

Rolex 36mm Oyster Perpetual silver dial model 116000.


----------



## cecil47

When I bought my first "real" racing bike, I thought it would be the last. A stunningly beautiful midnight blue over chrome Columbus SL tubed Ciocc. Cutting edge at the time with 2, yes 2, water bottle braze-ons and a braze-on front derailleur! Alas, racing takes its toll and bikes become tools rather than works of art. Went through several, including an incredible looking but oh so twitchy Gios Torino, with the last being a singularly ugly Sandvic tubed Fuji titanium. This bike, however, proved to me that functionality can really be art. A battleship grey, light, responsive, and tough utilitarian vehicle that outlasted unscathed more wrecks than I can remember.

Of all the guns in the safe, including several very nice competition models, my Ithaca 37 featherlights, 12 and 20 gauges from the 1950s, are still the shotguns I reach for when going hunting. They're light (hence the name) and indestructible, and I don't worry about dropping them in the mud flow of a river that the Rio Grande is. Again, utilitarian beauties.

My Kimber Classic 1911. 'nuff said.

The Rolex GMT Master II and Oyster winder. Ditto.


----------



## 32rollandrock

What happened to the Ciocc? Those were gorgeous. Surely, the frame didn't break--did it?



cecil47 said:


> When I bought my first "real" racing bike, I thought it would be the last. A stunningly beautiful midnight blue over chrome Columbus SL tubed Ciocc. Cutting edge at the time with 2, yes 2, water bottle braze-ons and a braze-on front derailleur! Alas, racing takes its toll and bikes become tools rather than works of art. Went through several, including an incredible looking but oh so twitchy Gios Torino, with the last being a singularly ugly Sandvic tubed Fuji titanium. This bike, however, proved to me that functionality can really be art. A battleship grey, light, responsive, and tough utilitarian vehicle that outlasted unscathed more wrecks than I can remember.
> 
> Of all the guns in the safe, including several very nice competition models, my Ithaca 37 featherlights, 12 and 20 gauges from the 1950s, are still the shotguns I reach for when going hunting. They're light (hence the name) and indestructible, and I don't worry about dropping them in the mud flow of a river that the Rio Grande is. Again, utilitarian beauties.
> 
> My Kimber Classic 1911. 'nuff said.
> 
> The Rolex GMT Master II and Oyster winder. Ditto.


----------



## tocqueville

cecil47;1255175
My Kimber Classic 1911. 'nuff said.
.[/QUOTE said:


> Are modern 1911s mechanically the same as the original? Or is it only the look that's the same?


----------



## The Rambler

there's always something better. always. unless you can muster an attitude like Congresspark's, biflers who think they have the best will trade up for something better, when they find it.


----------



## Bucksfan

tocqueville said:


> Are modern 1911s mechanically the same as the original? Or is it only the look that's the same?


Some are, but most aren't. I think the Colt offerings are as close to original as is currently available from a mass production shop, though some of the firing mechanism is improved over the original design. I have a Smith & Wesson 1911, which is similar in look, but has an external ejector and full-length guide rod.


----------



## 32rollandrock

Cast iron skillets and LPs excepted.



The Rambler said:


> there's always something better. always. unless you can muster an attitude like Congresspark's, biflers who think they have the best will trade up for something better, when they find it.


----------



## The Rambler

32rollandrock said:


> Cast iron skillets and LPs excepted.


true of skillets, fo' sho', but most of my lps have been destroyed by boozing and wild parties.


----------



## ds23pallas

I don't think there is much of anything I have purchased that I expected to "last a lifetime" with regular use but there are a few items that I hoped would last a _long _time when compared to their competition. Barbour jackets, Filson briefcase and luggage are a couple of examples. If I get more than 20 years from them I would be happy.

Another example of this is my '85 300D. With only 260,000 kms on the odo, it still has a lot of life left in it.


----------



## Trip English

I'd like to hope that your 300D is canary yellow.


----------



## ds23pallas

Trip English said:


> I'd like to hope that your 300D is canary yellow.


I wish! Astral Silver with blue MB Tex.


----------



## hookem12387

My friend's 300d ("Penelope") made it to 500k before going through so much oil she was no longer worth it. I'd say you're still in the break in period! Awesome cars.


----------



## 32rollandrock

Shame on you.



The Rambler said:


> true of skillets, fo' sho', but most of my lps have been destroyed by boozing and wild parties.


----------



## MacTweed

ds23pallas said:


> Another example of this is my '85 300D. With only 260,000 kms on the odo, it still has a lot of life left in it.


Very nice! I have been keeping an eye out for an 80s Mercedes diesel. Very nice cars, with classic styling and very durable engines. I have noticed about a handful of probably original owners in the Charleston area who have impeccably maintained theirs. I'm sure their not selling anytime soon...


----------



## godan

Bucksfan said:


> Some are, but most aren't. I think the Colt offerings are as close to original as is currently available from a mass production shop, though some of the firing mechanism is improved over the original design. I have a Smith & Wesson 1911, which is similar in look, but has an external ejector and full-length guide rod.


This forum may not be the place for a detailed response. My first 1911 was an Army Remington Rand, about forty years ago. Since then, I have fired tens of thousand of rounds through 1911's, still shoot often and own many. I am deeply familiar with their internals, can respond fully and refer you to authoritative sources, if the op wants to pm me.


----------



## cecil47

32rollandrock said:


> What happened to the Ciocc? Those were gorgeous. Surely, the frame didn't break--did it?


Sold off cheap to a junior racer in need of a ride. Re-cycled, as it were. It was pretty beat up by them, but still usable.


----------



## 32rollandrock

I have a Colnago Super from ca 1980 that still looks good because I was anal retentive and also quit racing while Reagan was in office. Surely, hopefully, your bike, scratches and all, is still giving someone joy, maybe someone who hit Goodwill on the right day and couldn't believe their good fortune. I grew up believing that if you bought a 531 or Columbus bike, it would last forever.

A close friend who is 6'5" and hard on bikes went through three Campy cranksets, with the right-side arm breaking in the middle on all three (he produces a lot of torque--I wasn't present when the breaks happened, but I can just imagine) before Campy finally told him that nothing lasts forever and so they would no longer replace the component gratis (the last time around, IIRC, they gave him a full crankset, Nuovo Record no longer being in production). I thought that was pretty feeble on Campy's part--you pay top dollar, by gum, a crank arm shouldn't break, no excuses. My friend, to my knowledge, has never busted a steel frame unless hit by a car, which has happened. Aluminum frame, different story. Not at carbon fiber yet. He is enormously proud of his crank-arm breaking reputation.



cecil47 said:


> Sold off cheap to a junior racer in need of a ride. Re-cycled, as it were. It was pretty beat up by them, but still usable.


----------



## firedancer

Has anyone mentioned A Kitchen Aid mixer?


----------



## inq89

dparm said:


> Omega Speedmaster Professional


Mmm yes, my coveted Speedy Pro. Plan on buying this upon graduation as my first big purchase. My watch collection (in its infancy right now) will outlive me.

I appreciate the 1980s-early 90s European cars. Would love to have a cheap diesel beater to drive around in one day. My first car was a 1991 Volvo 960 in racing green (drove in high school starting 2006). Hated it at first but grew to appreciate the car and the classic styling. Sad to say we recently sold it.

I'll probably buy another Volvo and keep it to pass down to my kids. Can see it going 30+ years.


----------



## 32rollandrock

I'm talking out of school, having never owned one, but Volvos have a reputation as money pits once they get old and start requiring repairs. I had a roommate many years ago who bought a wagon secondhand and it was always breaking down. Rock solid and dependable for a long, long time, sure. But not forever, and Volvo mechanics don't come cheap.



inq89 said:


> Mmm yes, my coveted Speedy Pro. Plan on buying this upon graduation as my first big purchase. My watch collection (in its infancy right now) will outlive me.
> 
> I appreciate the 1980s-early 90s European cars. Would love to have a cheap diesel beater to drive around in one day. My first car was a 1991 Volvo 960 in racing green (drove in high school starting 2006). Hated it at first but grew to appreciate the car and the classic styling. Sad to say we recently sold it.
> 
> I'll probably buy another Volvo and keep it to pass down to my kids. Can see it going 30+ years.


----------



## jkiley

In addition to cast iron cookware, has anyone mentioned Allclad stainless stuff? I have only been using mine (heavily) for 4-5 years, but it's hard to tell from new when polished.


----------



## Bjorn

32rollandrock said:


> I'm talking out of school, having never owned one, but Volvos have a reputation as money pits once they get old and start requiring repairs. I had a roommate many years ago who bought a wagon secondhand and it was always breaking down. Rock solid and dependable for a long, long time, sure. But not forever, and Volvo mechanics don't come cheap.


Guess that depends on where you live, in Sweden Volvo mechanics are cheap, parts readily available, and American cars are considered money pits 

Guess those days are soon gone, what with Volvo going Chinese. Not that I mind terribly, it was either that or no more Volvo.


----------



## 32rollandrock

I am somehow reminded of Mexico, where cars seem to be used, patched up, used, patched up, used, patched up just about forever. Then there's Cuba, a true BIFL car culture.



Bjorn said:


> Guess that depends on where you live, in Sweden Volvo mechanics are cheap, parts readily available, and American cars are considered money pits
> 
> Guess those days are soon gone, what with Volvo going Chinese. Not that I mind terribly, it was either that or no more Volvo.


----------



## Red Tractors

32rollandrock said:


> I'm talking out of school, having never owned one, but Volvos have a reputation as money pits once they get old and start requiring repairs. I had a roommate many years ago who bought a wagon secondhand and it was always breaking down. Rock solid and dependable for a long, long time, sure. But not forever, and Volvo mechanics don't come cheap.


No worse really than any other old and worn vehicle. My '90 Volvo 245DL is currently having it's transmission rebuilt, but it's no more expensive than it would have been on a 21 year old Ford. Older Volvo's are simple enough that if you have any mechanical aptitude at all you can do a decent percentage of your own work. At least the simpler things.


----------



## Red Tractors

Cast iron cookware, (Wagner for me). But it must be USA made, Griswold,Erie,National or Wapak are also fine old names. 

Old Peugeot bikes are wonderful (I have a PX10 and a PR10) But a Raleigh will last forever. Preferably one of the better ones made by Carlton. 

Stanley-Bailey planes reached their pinnacle with the type 9 through 11 made between 1903 and 1917 or so. The Bedrock planes are great, but not enough of an improvement to warrant the extra $$ they bring. 

Walker-Turner power tools, Delta could not make anything better, so they bought W-T and started using their designs/patterns for their own.


----------



## MacTweed

firedancer said:


> Has anyone mentioned A Kitchen Aid mixer?


Although they are great, I'm not sure about BIFL. I use my Kitchen Aid professional stand mixer quite regularly and the motor is is going out. It just doesn't have the power. I could have the windings revarnished... I bake a lot of bread. My next one is going to be from a restaurant supply store--probably a very small Hobart. But yes - they are quite nice and work very well.


----------



## Trip English

Ktichen appliances, like all small home appliances, have gone to sh**. Even ones that used to have a reputation for quality. My mom has had an Oster blender (pea green), for example, from some time in the early eighties up until now. All the inner workings are likely metal. I've lived on my own for almost 15 years and have owned at least 4 blenders and am currently without one because I refuse to buy another piece of crap and spending $400 on a blender (the apparent floor of a restaurant grade blender) offends my delicate sensibilities. I'll leave my food solid thankyouverymuch.


----------



## dorji

^^If you do ever decide to spend $$ on a blender Vitaprep will not let you down.


----------



## dorji

jkiley said:


> has anyone mentioned Allclad stainless stuff?


One of my nicer professional kitchens provided me with a small army (35) of 10" saute pans, plus about a dozen each of 8" and 12". Those things take a serious beating and still perform!!


----------



## Hayek

I love my Tumi computer briefcase. It's been going strong for over 7 years and shows almost no wear. I know this isn't orthodox trad, especially when Filson and Orvis options are available, but I have a tough time imagining a better computer bag.


----------



## TheGreatTwizz

firedancer said:


> Has anyone mentioned A Kitchen Aid mixer?


I figured I'd let this get rolling before pondering. Yes, a Kitchen Aid, assuming it isn't of the entry level variety, is certainly a BIFL item. A recent acquisition (that is soon to be given to its end user) made me really think about BIFL, as I've said for a long time that I'm only ever buying one of these (setting is just a placeholder; I can't stop wearing it)......










That led me to think of the watches I expect to have for life and hand down to my children.


----------



## Benson

I've had Allclads for ten plus years; there are few better stainless steel pans around (viking is the only one I can think of) and they are still almost all made in the U.S. 

Though not tradly at all, my Global knives have lasted for a long time despite considerable abuse. One did break, however, likely from water deposit weakening at the base of the blade (places I've lived have had nitrate-heavy water), and Global replaced it quickly and without fuss.


----------



## Trip English

Your Rollie's been bedazzled. Bedazzled for life.


----------



## Ekphrastic

Coming from a family of hoarders, I often try to _not_ keep things for life, since I'm afraid of the hoarding tendencies taking root in me. (When my grandfather passed, they hauled eighteen tons of trash out of his house. And that's just the stuff _they threw away_.)

Nevertheless, I do have some BIFL items. Chief among them: my 1993 G&L Legacy electric guitar. G&L was the company that Leo Fender started after he sold Fender to CBS (and after he'd had a go with Ernie Ball). Maple neck, ash body, Seymour Duncan pickups--I love it, even though the neck is way, way too skinny for my long fingers (which I didn't realize when I bought it; for years, I was wondering why my hand would cramp up after playing for a few minutes). I've thought of getting (or even building) a new neck for it, but it sounds really great, and I'd hate to change anything on it, just in case the changes would negatively affect its tone.

But, yeah, ol' Leo built these guitars to last. I've pounded on it for years and years now, once smashing the middle pickup so hard that I drove it into the control cavity, and it just keeps going. (I had to reinforce that pickup a little, but no biggie.) I may need a refret sometime in the future, but that's only because I never got the frets re-crowned along the way like I should've. And whatever finish Leo applied to the guitar's body could stop artillery fire; one time, I was adjusting a tremolo spring, and it shot out, gouging through the clearcoat. It didn't touch the wood, though, which was amazing; I had a guy try to polish out the scratch, and he said it was like trying to polish glass. On any other guitar, that scratch would have been cutting lumber.

I'll stop now. Can you tell I love it?


----------



## Bjorn

Demeyere layered stainless cookware. Had one of those ones. Would have kept it for life. Best cookware I've ever handled. 

Dads Navitimer:


Boats can also fall into the BIFL category.


----------



## 32rollandrock

Bjorn said:


> Boats can also fall into the BIFL category.


Much to the disappointment of some of their owners.


----------



## The Rambler

rueful lol.


----------



## Sartre

TheGreatTwizz said:


>


Mostly I don't get the cult of Rolex -- too often they look to me like the watches given to the top producing insurance salesmen at the annual convention -- but this is a beautiful piece.


----------



## The Rambler

very funny, Sartre; completely agree on that one, too: beautiful, Twizz. The Rolex Precision is one of my all-time favorites. Wish I had one.


----------



## Trip English

32rollandrock said:


> Much to the disappointment of some of their owners.


A boat is a hole in the water you throw money into.

*B*ust *O*ut *A*nother *T*housand.


----------



## rsmeyer

Any of my bespoke suits and sport jackets from Chipp. Some are approaching 30 years.


----------



## Thom Browne's Schooldays

ds23pallas said:


> I don't think there is much of anything I have purchased that I expected to "last a lifetime" with regular use but there are a few items that I hoped would last a long time when compared to their competition. Barbour jackets, Filson briefcase and luggage are a couple of examples. If I get more than 20 years from them I would be happy.
> 
> Another example of this is my '85 300D. With only 260,000 kms on the odo, it still has a lot of life left in it.


You know, I have a "nice" newer car that I have to sink money into regularly, repairs and such.
I'm kinda tempted to just say "screw it" and buy an older merc or volvo.

The cost would probably be the same or cheaper, but at least I'd be spending the money on something I like



Red Tractors said:


> Cast iron cookware, (Wagner for me). But it
> must be USA made, Griswold,Erie,National or Wapak are also fine old
> names.
> 
> Old Peugeot bikes are wonderful (I have a PX10 and a PR10) But a Raleigh
> will last forever. Preferably one of the better ones made by Carlton.
> 
> Stanley-Bailey planes reached their pinnacle with the type 9 through 11
> made between 1903 and 1917 or so. The Bedrock planes are great, but not
> enough of an improvement to warrant the extra $$ they bring.
> 
> Walker-Turner power tools, Delta could not make anything better, so they
> bought W-T and started using their designs/patterns for their
> own.


What about older, pre-Trek Bontrager mountain bikes?

I think that bedrock planes are worth the extra money, I had written a couple paragraphs on my experiences with blade chatter in bedrock and non-bedrock planes, but then decided it would interest no one.


----------



## eagle2250

As many are wont to do, in the after-glow of the Thanksgiving holiday, we began dragging out Christmas decorations and going through them and I was reminded of perhaps another example of a "buy it for life" purchase/gift (as the case may be!)...a Lionel Train Set, purchased in the very early 1950's and from what I've been told, it is worth a lot more now than what it would have originally cost! Sixty years of pleasure and increased value...sounds like money well spent to me.


----------



## joenobody0

rsmeyer said:


> Any of my bespoke suits and sport jackets from Chipp. Some are approaching 30 years.


You are fortunate. I'm not sure I'm going to be able to keep my size 38/155lb body for 30 years.


----------



## Bjorn

Sartre said:


> Mostly I don't get the cult of Rolex -- too often they look to me like the watches given to the top producing insurance salesmen at the annual convention -- but this is a beautiful piece.


A Rolex sub is always a Rolex sub, always gonna be a classic...


----------



## TheGreatTwizz

Trip English said:


> Your Rollie's been bedazzled. Bedazzled for life.


Heh, yes, but common consensus by those more knowledgeable than me is that this is a factory bezel with very high quality stones (you should see it glimmer in a jewelry store). This is why it is worn by the g/f more than myself.



Sartre said:


> Mostly I don't get the cult of Rolex -- too often they look to me like the watches given to the top producing insurance salesmen at the annual convention -- but this is a beautiful piece.





The Rambler said:


> very funny, Sartre; completely agree on that one, too: beautiful, Twizz. The Rolex Precision is one of my all-time favorites. Wish I had one.


Thank you gentlemen. Sartre, I think you're referring to the two tone steel/gold ones, and I very much agree with you. I have many friends that wear two tones, and I'm not, personally, a fan (although I'm on the hunt for a two tone with rose gold). Rambler, these can be had anywhere down the city or on ebay for a song and a dance. Consider it sometime, and know that the Air King, being nearly 40 years old, keeps better time than the Datejust, which is less than 20.


----------



## Nico01

Trip English said:


> A boat is a hole in the water you throw money into.
> 
> *B*ust *O*ut *A*nother *T*housand.


I have been told before that one can accurately recreate the experience of owning a boat by standing in the bathtub with a rain jacket, while throwing cash every which way. However, it's all worth it for those moments when youre heeling hard on a near reach in steady winds.


----------



## Trip English

That sounds like a wonderful thing to experience on a friend's boat.


----------



## eagle2250

^^
ROFALOL. Perhaps so Trip, but as for me, I'm going to try a maiden voyage using that "bathtub w/rainjacket" approach suggested by Nico01. Land Ho ye slimmy maggots! :crazy:


----------



## Bjorn

You cant beat boats in costing money. Maybe if you bought a tank or a helicopter. 

But when the weather is good, the wind is good, you've turned off your phone and you've got a gin and tonic, that's pretty damn good.


----------



## PatentLawyerNYC

Cast iron skillet (as mentioned)
Toyota Land Cruiser (to borrow a term used above, ours is the "bedazzled" Lexus version)
Wustof cutlery


----------



## Pappa

Yes, my two cast iron skillets, grandfather's FDick steel(knife sharpening tool from 1890s), Tru Hone knife sharpener, AllClad SS copper lined skillet, Sig P220 handgun and Stoner S-15 rifle(223.) and a couple of Harris Tweeds from Ben Silver.


----------



## CrescentCityConnection

Let's see...I have a Barbour Beaufort that I bought in 1988 that is still going strong and looks even better with age. I think this jacket will easily last me another 20 years so its been a terrific friend! A Rolex sub that I bought in 1991 while I was in Europe. I fully expect it to last my lifetime and to become an heirloom piece. Then theres my 1999 323i...just had a fair amount of work done to it and I am hoping that it too will be a BIFL item...time will tell with this one!


----------



## WouldaShoulda

Sartre said:


> Mostly I don't get the cult of Rolex -- too often they look to me like the watches given to the top producing insurance salesmen at the annual convention -- but this is a beautiful piece.


Funny, the one you liked reminded me of a watch given to the top producing salesman at a Scotts Turfbuilder convention!!


----------



## WouldaShoulda

Bjorn said:


> You cant beat boats in costing money. Maybe if you bought a tank or a helicopter.
> 
> But when the weather is good, the wind is good, you've turned off your phone and you've got a gin and tonic, that's pretty damn good.


YAR!!


----------



## mr.v

i hope to retire one day, and have a shot at becoming the top producing salesman at that convention. im with sartre, i've never been excited about rolex, it was a great relief, one expensive thing i didn't have to lust for. that particular watch is sweet.



WouldaShoulda said:


> Funny, the one you liked reminded me of a watch given to the top producing salesman at a Scotts Turfbuilder convention!!


----------



## Nico01

WouldaShoulda said:


> YAR!!


Looks like tons of fun! Is that a 30 footer?


----------



## bbcrock

Philly Joe said:


> I nominate the Garrard 301..if you bought it for life, price isn't the ultimate consideration.
> 
> Plus they were quite reasonable until lately. Mine was $20 in 1989.


My mother has a Garrard turntable she bought in 1961, but it hasn't seen a lot of use recently. That's a full 50 years though.

I think in the end, however, how we listen to music will be so radically different in 10 years, essentially an online catalog of everything and all our systems connected to the internet, that it hardly matters. To me, buying an mp3, which I don't do, is just an extension of buying a cd. There will be one or two generations after that which change the whole process significantly.


----------



## WouldaShoulda

Nico01 said:


> Looks like tons of fun! Is that a 30 footer?


27.

But I'm working on it!!


----------



## Brooksfan

I'd like to propose a new take on Buy It for Life. That is, rather than having the specific object for decades (or life) replacing it with the identical object after it has served its useful life. Examples include Brooks OCBDs, the Gloverall Duffle Coat (might have to get a new one after 25 years but there's nothing better), etc. I don't mind buying a new item if I can say I've gotten my use out of the first item and there's nothing I'd rather have to replace it.


----------



## Kingstonian

Wisco said:


> CM, get thee a Rega P3 and be happy for life. There are lots of high-end audiophile turntables out there, but the Rega is as good a BIFL piece as their is in audio. You could even consider the lower cost Rega RP1 at around the pair of a Alden cordovan shoes (clothing tie in).


I have a Rega Planar 3. It was sensibly priced in the UK compared to Linn Sondek. Cheaper version was a Rega Planar 2.

My loudspeakers are also older British ones - Spendor.


----------



## andy b.

I have a Bosch jigsaw I purchased 15 years ago that I use very frequently, and it shows no signs of slowing down. My "lawn mower" is a 1954 John Deere Model 40U that had an engine rebuild in 2003 and I suspect it will outlast me, and my children (or until the government outlaws gasoline). I have a 1906 Singer Model 27 treadle-powered sewing machine that I use on occasion that has already survived several generations and will survive several more. I also have an 1877 Singer Model 12, but I don't use it very often because the needles are no longer available and have to be handmade.

Andy B.


----------



## Omega

Buy It for Life... I usually try to buy things with lifetime or, even better, unconditional, warranty... Here are items I own and find them really good.

Clothing.
Tilley has lifetime warranty on their pants not to be worn out. Perhaps it is because they are confident that their customers' waist will change before they wear out their pants . At the same time, their famous hats are outstanding. I have T3 and really like the hat, but now I realise that perhaps a lighter hat would be even better.
Leather goods - I have Papworth briefcase for about 8 years and it ages well. I have a belt I bought in Hungary in 1997 and it also really good. Finally, my 20+ years old shoes - my mother bought me Cedex loafers made in Northampton (I guess it was a special order from Soviet government) and they still exist! And I am confident that this brand's quality is not as good as of any Church's, Grenson or C&J! So, I believe that if you buy full grain shoes for £300+, you may end up using them all your working life. And the conclusion? Buy something what you like, not what was offered to you at a discount, otherwise you will hate your shoes for 30+ years 
I surprised my Russian friends when I showed them my grandfather's Soviet cufflinks - they never came across shirts with cufflinks during Soviet times. I suspect all my cufflinks will last for a long time, therefore I buy them made from precious metals and in a quite plain style so that they looked well during any fashion. And Omega Seamaster watch, of course.
Shoe lasts - too basic to break...

Tools
As long as tools are basic and the metal is good, they will last you a lifetime. I started with Tramontina, SAK SwissChamp, then bought Spyderco Delica and then Busse BA3 when I realised that they will accompany me for the rest of my life if I want to while they all are not exactly what I want. So I ordered myself custom Randall Bird & Trout. I waited for 5 years, but it is made to my specifications. Plus I have my grandfather's Soviet hunting knife and a knife made by my father with Roselli's blade. It is more than enough. Good knife sharpeners will definitely last a lifetime - Spyderco Tri-angle, GatCo Tri-ceps, Soviet sharpener for razors and sharpening stones collected by my grandfather.
Stanley, Bosch, Makita, Black&Decker - these tools are great. And it is worth paying extra for comfort if you use tools regularly. Otherwise it is better to buy something cheap and get rid of after use - I have a great Black&Decker electric saw which I did not use for 8 years. The only danger with some of these tools is that the technology can make them old while they are still in working order.

Kitchen staff.
Czech Bohemian crystals are standard setters in many countries.
East German "Madonna" sets in former USSR have a status perhaps even higher than Wedgewood in the UK.
Le Creuset are nice pots, but my wife does not like their weight. We will keep them, but definitely no intention to buy more.

Miscellaneous.
I have Wilkinson Sword razor with a shiny handle I bought in 1996. I like it not only because it is functional, but also beautiful. As one of my friends said:"It looks like a statue in the washing room".
Tumi garment bag which I bought recently - I am sure it will last me to my retirement.
Kent brush - have a few of them and expect them to last for a long time.
Taurus and Henri LLoyd backpacks - they both have lifetime warranty.
Zippo engraved brass lighter.
Pelikan and Cross pens.
Storus money clip I received as a present recently - I hope it will become obsolete soon because the current technology allows payments using mobiles.

When I buy Last For a Lifetime items, I make sure I like them not because of good price, but quality - quality is remembered after price is forgotten. However, I avoid getting attached to things and consciously try to avoid famous brands and buy less known high-end makers because this shows my knowledge of the subject, not a blind following of the fashion.


----------



## 32rollandrock

I have Mission speakers from Britain that are at least 30 years old and like them very much. Had to have a tweeter replaced a couple times owing to a certainly-not-BIFL Sony amp that has since met its much-deserved doom, but other than that, they're going strong.



Kingstonian said:


> I have a Rega Planar 3. It was sensibly priced in the UK compared to Linn Sondek. Cheaper version was a Rega Planar 2.
> 
> My loudspeakers are also older British ones - Spendor.


----------



## Jovan

Reminds me: Not sure if I said before in this thread, but I have a wooden box-style radio from the '60s which is still going strong, performance wise. Sounds like any other plastic radio you'd hear now. Looks wise, it's a little dinged and the upholstery in the front is starting to come unglued. Maybe there's a way to restore it? Would that even be worth the effort? Who knows.


----------



## winston1156

I have a Mcintosh 2102 amp in my office... it will outlast me. My 1987 mercedes 560 sel will get at least 15 more years. I have a corded craftsman power drill purchased @1959 from Sears... Cannot kill it.


----------



## pinchi22

Braun burr coffee grinder ("Made in West Germany", 1970s vintage, Dieter Ram design, I believe).
IWC (3706) Pilot Watch.
Global chef knife.
French black steel saute pans.
Pre-1980 Sears Roebuck hammer.
Victorinox attache case.
Barbour international jacket.
Naim "olive" amp, pre-amp and power supplies.
Sonus Faber speakers.
Tempurpedic mattress.


----------



## Serenus

Aside from my violins, violas, etc., my buy it for life claim to fame is a beautifully engineered toyo 45 large-format camera. It is constructed like a tank, amazingly easy to work with, and can accept old-school 4x5 sheet film or a digital back. I suppose you cando a lot of the bellows movements in photoshop nowadays, but there's nothing quite like looking through the ground glass with a loupe...And it goes great with flannels and a nice pipe.


----------



## eyedoc2180

winston1156 said:


> I have a Mcintosh 2102 amp in my office... it will outlast me. My 1987 mercedes 560 sel will get at least 15 more years. I have a corded craftsman power drill purchased @1959 from Sears... Cannot kill it.


I cited the Benz a while back on this thread. Funny that you don't see many Beamers or Audis as old as your Benz, or other models that I admire. My 2003 E500 just got paint refurbished and a new rear end. Wax 'er up with some Zaino, and we're looking for another 10 years. It's like taking your living room for a ride, a true keeper. Then again, there's that new SL550......
:rolleyes2:


----------



## TimHardy

Akubra 'Snowy River' hat.


----------



## Himself

I have a pair of original Irwin Vice-Grips pliers that were my grandfathers, probably from the 1930s when he started working as an electrician. I actually still use them -- a lot.


----------



## jbierce

Omega speedmaster professional


----------



## sbdivemaster

Jovan said:


> Reminds me: Not sure if I said before in this thread, but I have a wooden box-style radio from the '60s which is still going strong, performance wise. Sounds like any other plastic radio you'd hear now. Looks wise, it's a little dinged and the upholstery in the front is starting to come unglued. Maybe there's a way to restore it? Would that even be worth the effort? Who knows.


I actually looked into the same thing a while back; there's quite an active vintage radio restoration community out there:

https://www.vintagetunesradios.com/

Might be a fun project - could lead to a new hobby. :icon_smile:


----------



## hookem12387

jbierce said:


> Omega speedmaster professional


Beautiful. One of the 3 watches I hope to someday own (with a blue-faced Heuer Monaco and a pepsi-bezeled Rolex GMT)


----------



## Jovan

sbdivemaster said:


> I actually looked into the same thing a while back; there's quite an active vintage radio restoration community out there:
> 
> https://www.vintagetunesradios.com/
> 
> Might be a fun project - could lead to a new hobby. :icon_smile:


Thanks!


----------



## tocqueville

Gads, I want that.



jbierce said:


> Omega speedmaster professional


----------



## tocqueville

My Duluth Packs Rambler just arrived.

https://duluthpack.com/rambler-day-pack.html

There are prettier, cheaper, and perhaps more practical packs the same size on the market, but I went with the Duluth Pack in the expectation that I will never have to replace it, and it will never fail me while traveling. Plus it's made by some folks in Minnesota vice a Chinese sweat shop. Anyway, having just inspected my new bag, I think it might just live up to its promise. I'm frankly wondering how long it will take before it feels broken in.


----------



## Acme

Ten years ago I moved into a 1930 Chicago style octagon-front bungalow. Stained glass windows, 3/4" oak hardwood floors, plaster walls with 9' ceilings, and radiator heat.










Most days I'd like to think I'll own it for life, other days it feels like it owns me.


----------



## stewartu

Thought that i might try to resurrect this thread.

i like the idea of buying things that will last long enough to pass on to my kids. In that vein I use vintage Gillette razors, and buy quality products like Alden shoes, rolex timepieces, and filson bags. 

What are you owning based on this rationale?


----------



## stewartu

I love the simplicity of this post. All hail to things simple, functional, and long lived. My glass is raised.



well-kept said:


> While I tend to think of some expensive, patinated things as long term, I realize with a huge jolt that there is one entirely disposable item I may indeed have for the rest of my life.
> 
> In 1983 I had a bike accident. While in the hospital a friend brought me some essentials, razor, toothbrush etc. Included in the bag was... don't laugh... a large plastic Ace comb. 30 YEARS LATER I still use it every day. It has lost one tooth.
> *
> 30 YEARS!! At this rate it will go on for centuries, unnoticed and basically unloved for its longeveity. Well, now it's been written about on the internet, so, some well-deserved appreciation.*
> 
> I have also just realized that I still have almost all my hair, and that it still has it's color. Maybe I have that magic comb to thank, who knows?


----------



## Tilton

Probably in the same boat as everyone else here, but every time I say "this is the only ____ I'll probably ever have to buy!" I find myself buying another just because - and usually in half the time it took me pick the first one.


----------



## godan

stewartu said:


> Thought that i might try to resurrect this thread.
> 
> i like the idea of buying things that will last long enough to pass on to my kids. In that vein I use vintage Gillette razors, and buy quality products like Alden shoes, rolex timepieces, and filson bags.
> 
> What are you owning based on this rationale?


I share your choices. If you decide to have your Gillettes rebuilt, I recommend Razor Emporium. They may not be loved on some of the shaving sites, and they are not inexpensive, but two Fatboys they did for me were excellent, and I dealt only with courteous, informed people. The good news (I tend to believe) about Rolexes is that modern lubricants last longer than those that might have been used when a watch was made, so after Rolex service these days, one can wait a few more years before the next one.


----------



## Corcovado

Stickley furniture and the occasional guitar.


----------



## drlivingston

I would trade my tie collection for that Martin... It's a beautiful instrument.


----------



## AshScache

Love that stickley furniture--we've got a few pieces in my family but I can't get my wife interested in them!


----------



## Corcovado

drlivingston said:


> I would trade my tie collection for that Martin... It's a beautiful instrument.


Thanks drlivingston.



AshScache said:


> Love that stickley furniture--we've got a few pieces in my family but I can't get my wife interested in them!


Maybe if you buy yourself a few electric guitars she'll be more in favor of Stickley furniture.


----------



## stewartu

Glad to hear this. My 1987 explorer II just returned from its $400 service. Only been done twice since new so i guess thats not too bad.



godan said:


> I share your choices. If you decide to have your Gillettes rebuilt, I recommend Razor Emporium. They may not be loved on some of the shaving sites, and they are not inexpensive, but two Fatboys they did for me were excellent, and I dealt only with courteous, informed people. The good news (I tend to believe) about* Rolexes is that modern lubricants last longer than those that might have been used when a watch was made, so after Rolex service these days, one can wait a few more years before the next one.*


----------



## Fiddlermatt

Corcovado said:


> Stickley furniture and the occasional guitar.


Holy D41! What year is it?


----------



## Howard

stewartu said:


> Thought that i might try to resurrect this thread.
> 
> i like the idea of buying things that will last long enough to pass on to my kids. In that vein I use vintage Gillette razors, and buy quality products like Alden shoes, rolex timepieces, and filson bags.
> 
> What are you owning based on this rationale?


What do you mean?


----------



## 32rollandrock

drlivingston said:


> I would trade my tie collection for that Martin... It's a beautiful instrument.


Your ties, due respect, will wear out. That Martin...


----------



## Corcovado

Fiddlermatt said:


> Holy D41! What year is it?


It's probably 10 to 15 years old. It was a NOS item that was a little shopworn when I bought it, and I've never dated it, although I suppose I could do so by the serial number. Because it was a little worn where the neck rested against the hanger, they had marked it down considerably.


----------



## A10ACN

I think some BIFL items are classics and if one were to buy with the intention of lifetime use, the items should be such. With that in mind and keeping with some themes here:
-Rolex Submariner (I'd put the GMT Master in there, too) New or used can be serviced.
-Barbour OR Filson jacket (both have models which have been in their lines forever). Can be repaired at the respective factories.
-Wagner or Griswold cast iron skillets. Previously owned (the only way to obtain them now). Forever.
-Le Creuset Roasters and a few other pieces. Forever.
-Randall knives. There are better handmade knives out there today BUT Randall is a classic and can be repaired, reground, rehandled at the shop.
-Colt 1911 pistol. 100+ years and still gets the job done. Still made, can be rebuilt by Colt.
-Milt Sparks holsters and leather. The modern classic designs trusted by professionals. 
-Holland and Holland, Westley Richards, or Purdey shotguns. Still built and can be rebuilt by the factories.
-Harley Davidsons. This pains me as I am NOT a Harley fan, but they are a classic staple and can be rebuilt, reconfigured probably more than any other mechanical, personal transporter. No comments on reliability new or used...(sigh).
-Craftsman hand tools. The new ones aren't quite the same as the old ones but still lifetime replacement guarantee. 
-I have to say Stickley furniture as well. Classic. Timeless. Repairs can be made by skilled craftsmen if not the factory.
-Alden shoes, Russell boots. They both have their issues but well made and can be returned for repairs. Eventually they will not be able to resole them, but can theoretically rebuild them at that point but by then, the cost would probably not be worth it.
Sorry, no computer, audiophile, or bicycle recommendations from me.


----------



## Tilton

I'm sorry, but anyone buying a Holland and Holland or Purdey is not buying it because they see a great value in the longevity of the firearm. They are ultimate luxury items. AYA, Browning, Winchester - sure. H&H or Purdey are missing the point.


----------



## rwaldron

I bought a "for the rest of my life" wallet. After an unfortunate incident on a fish trip, that wallet will remain at the bottom of a Bayou "for the rest of my life."


----------



## 32rollandrock

^^

Sorry, but a Harley isn't BIFL, nor, for that matter, is any mode of transportation with an internal combustion engine. No car or motorcycle on the planet will last forever unless you never use it. Anything can be rebuilt if you are willing to spend the money, this, for instance:

https://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/11/automobiles/its-a-duesie-the-first-in-fact.html?hpw&_r=0

Fine car, I'm sure, as are all Duesenbergs, but it eventually wore out, as will a Harley, as will a Jeep Wagoneer, as will a Volvo or any other vehicles that get much love here. BIFL means you never, ever have to buy another one.


----------



## A10ACN

Tilton said:


> I'm sorry, but anyone buying a Holland and Holland or Purdey is not buying it because they see a great value in the longevity of the firearm. They are ultimate luxury items. AYA, Browning, Winchester - sure. H&H or Purdey are missing the point.


AYA uses a copy of the H&H action, IIRC, thus Holland is the classic. Browning reverted to using Japanese manufacturing for some of their classic models (A5), Winchester went under until FN brought it back. If Winchester had stayed in continuous business, I considered and would have listed the Winchester 94. You can visit the Holland or Purdey shops to this day and order a new shotgun or rifle. You may also take your used/handed down H&H or Purdey to that same location and ask for it to be brought back to as new. The double rifle or shotguns they make today are made the same way as they were over 100 yrs ago (with some modern machinery). The fact that I can purchase a used gun of these makers and have as good and as classic of a firearm as someone who walks in and orders bespoke reaffirms the classic label. It can be argued that the person who owns and hunts the 100 yr old classic carries more clout than a person who walks in and buys because "they are the ultimate luxury items." 
If you are just arguing because of the price, I would say you are missing the point. Buy once, own/use a lifetime, value retained or as seen with the British Best, increased.


----------



## Jovan

Whatsamatta? Don't like those Japanese or Belgians getting their fingers all over your beloved American firearms?


----------



## tocqueville

32rollandrock said:


> ^^
> 
> Sorry, but a Harley isn't BIFL, nor, for that matter, is any mode of transportation with an internal combustion engine. No car or motorcycle on the planet will last forever unless you never use it. Anything can be rebuilt if you are willing to spend the money, this, for instance:
> 
> https://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/11/automobiles/its-a-duesie-the-first-in-fact.html?hpw&_r=0
> 
> Fine car, I'm sure, as are all Duesenbergs, but it eventually wore out, as will a Harley, as will a Jeep Wagoneer, as will a Volvo or any other vehicles that get much love here. BIFL means you never, ever have to buy another one.


I recently did some research into the military use of motorcycles. It turns out that the US Army never warmed up to them in large part because the Harley machines it bought in large numbers in the 1910s-1930s and used through to the end of WWII were complete crap. At one point during the war, the Army told Harley to copy one of the BMW models (which was a magnificent machine by all accounts), but even a Harley knock off of a BMW failed to impress.

I found that amusing given the mystique about them and the aura of their WWII-era military association.


----------



## Jovan

Oh, snap... them's fightin' words to all the Harley addicts.


----------



## tocqueville

A watch I purchased about three years ago and wore fairly regularly (a German watch with a Swiss movement) broke recently. In need of a new daily-wear watch, I pulled out my grandfather's automatic Seiko, which, according to the serial number on the back, is a but few months older than I am (42). I have no idea if it has ever been serviced. But it runs fine, +/- about 50 seconds per day, but with an odd ability to even out after a few days. And the lume still works. I need to get it cleaned and lubed so that it will keep at it, but I expect to go for another 40 years. The bad news is that it's harder to justify buying a new watch, which I really want to do.


----------



## Tilton

A10ACN said:


> AYA uses a copy of the H&H action, IIRC, thus Holland is the classic. Browning reverted to using Japanese manufacturing for some of their classic models (A5), Winchester went under until FN brought it back. If Winchester had stayed in continuous business, I considered and would have listed the Winchester 94. You can visit the Holland or Purdey shops to this day and order a new shotgun or rifle. You may also take your used/handed down H&H or Purdey to that same location and ask for it to be brought back to as new. The double rifle or shotguns they make today are made the same way as they were over 100 yrs ago (with some modern machinery). The fact that I can purchase a used gun of these makers and have as good and as classic of a firearm as someone who walks in and orders bespoke reaffirms the classic label. It can be argued that the person who owns and hunts the 100 yr old classic carries more clout than a person who walks in and buys because "they are the ultimate luxury items."
> If you are just arguing because of the price, I would say you are missing the point. Buy once, own/use a lifetime, value retained or as seen with the British Best, increased.


I think you're missing the point...

There is no discussion of clout going on and, let's be honest, no one buys an $80,000 shotgun without having at least one eye toward prestige. The fact that AYA has the same action as a Holland and is at most 1/10 the price is really not making your argument stronger.


----------



## 32rollandrock

If the watch works so well, why do anything to it at all? Just wondering...

As for Harleys, that's interesting history. But I can't say that I'm surprised. My dad says that the Harleys he rode in the 50s were such rattleboxes that you needed to regularly tighten every possible nut and bolt because the shake was such that they loosened on their own. Fast forward to today, when modern technology makes it possible to eliminate the vibration and the Harley set still wants the vibration (oh, but the rubber mounted engine smooths it out, they say, as if that's a reason) while rejecting such radical things as liquid-cooled motors that improve performance, extend engine life and reduce pollution.

No, I don't think that Harleys fit our aesthetic. Overpriced, under-performing and trying too hard to look vintage when they are not.



tocqueville said:


> A watch I purchased about three years ago and wore fairly regularly (a German watch with a Swiss movement) broke recently. In need of a new daily-wear watch, I pulled out my grandfather's automatic Seiko, which, according to the serial number on the back, is a but few months older than I am (42). I have no idea if it has ever been serviced. But it runs fine, +/- about 50 seconds per day, but with an odd ability to even out after a few days. And the lume still works. I need to get it cleaned and lubed so that it will keep at it, but I expect to go for another 40 years. The bad news is that it's harder to justify buying a new watch, which I really want to do.


----------



## A10ACN

Tilton said:


> I think you're missing the point...
> 
> There is no discussion of clout going on and, let's be honest, no one buys an $80,000 shotgun without having at least one eye toward prestige. The fact that AYA has the same action as a Holland and is at most 1/10 the price is really not making your argument stronger.


Then, by your argument, anything that is a cheaper copy or a knockoff of an original is better??

I took the 'Buy It For Life' stipulation as an item one can buy and have it last for a lifetime of use, perhaps with factory maintenance; with some confidence that the manufacturer would still be in business during that time, the style would not fade and is the original of that genre. Something to pass down to the next generation. If price is the consideration, than everything on the list can be removed. Wal-Mart carries most everything a person needs.


----------



## A10ACN

Jovan said:


> Whatsamatta? Don't like those Japanese or Belgians getting their fingers all over your beloved American firearms?


Well, I don't think anyone for a moment thought that Browning (FN) moved manufacturing to Japan with the sole purpose of increasing the quality of the guns. Everything made for retail by a large company or corporation is made to a price point. I would say that, comparing the price of a NIB vintage Belgian Browning to a Japanese Browning, most gun folks feel the original Belgian guns are better/worth more.


----------



## 32rollandrock

A10ACN said:


> Wal-Mart carries most everything a person needs.


Wal-Mart does not carry Macallan of any kind. Or Glenfiddich. Or decent shoes. Or boxers. Or shirts. Or, come to think of it, any sort of clothing at all that is worth wearing. Or cheese that is worth eating. Or bread. Or, really, anything at all worth buying.


----------



## drlivingston

32rollandrock said:


> Wal-Mart does not carry Macallan of any kind. Or Glenfiddich. Or decent shoes. Or boxers. Or shirts. Or, come to think of it, any sort of clothing at all that is worth wearing. Or cheese that is worth eating. Or bread. Or, really, anything at all worth buying.


Au contraire mon frere! Great Value milk is awesome! :icon_smile_big:


----------



## 32rollandrock

drlivingston said:


> Au contraire mon frere! Great Value milk is awesome! :icon_smile_big:


I do not drink milk.


----------



## Pentheos

An $80,000 gun -- while you would certainly never need to replace it in your lifetime -- is ostentatious and contrary to the trad ethos (whatever that is, and it does not interest me enough to debate it, but I take it to involve a compromise between longevity and frugality). An $80,000 gun represents that absolute best of the best. In terms of clothing and price points, it is tantamount to bespoke boxers or MTM shoelaces -- items some people have, surely, but no one here.


----------



## A10ACN

Pentheos said:


> An $80,000 gun -- while you would certainly never need to replace it in your lifetime -- is ostentatious and contrary to the trad ethos (whatever that is, and it does not interest me enough to debate it, but I take it to involve a compromise between longevity and frugality). An $80,000 gun represents that absolute best of the best. In terms of clothing and price points, it is tantamount to bespoke boxers or MTM shoelaces -- items some people have, surely, but no one here.


What's more trad than something of understated quality and traditional hand making, that, as a testament to that tradition and quality is warranted by royalty? I fear that folks may be arguing just due to the price, completely disregarding the point that Hollands and Purdeys pretty much defined what a sidelock, hammerless, sidexside shotgun is and the tasks it was designed to do. By 1880 they pretty much had it figured it out and nothing has really changed much since then except for others who have tried to make it better, stronger, cheaper, more garish (chose any or as many as you want). Still they plod along with their traditional ways. I define trad as classic and enduring, which I think these guns fit well into that definition.


----------



## Pentheos

A10ACN said:


> What's more trad than something of understated quality and traditional hand making, that, as a testament to that tradition and quality is warranted by royalty? I fear that folks may be arguing just due to the price, completely disregarding the point that Hollands and Purdeys pretty much defined what a sidelock, hammerless, sidexside shotgun is and the tasks it was designed to do. By 1880 they pretty much had it figured it out and nothing has really changed much since then except for others who have tried to make it better, stronger, cheaper, more garish (chose any or as many as you want). Still they plod along with their traditional ways. I define trad as classic and enduring, which I think these guns fit well into that definition.


Do you own one?


----------



## A10ACN

Pentheos said:


> Do you own one?


Nope. Not a shotgun guy. I appreciate fine gunmaking, though. And tradition.


----------



## Jovan

A10ACN said:


> Well, I don't think anyone for a moment thought that Browning (FN) moved manufacturing to Japan with the sole purpose of increasing the quality of the guns. Everything made for retail by a large company or corporation is made to a price point. I would say that, comparing the price of a NIB vintage Belgian Browning to a Japanese Browning, most gun folks feel the original Belgian guns are better/worth more.


Of course they didn't. But who says it decreased quality, either? Maybe it's simply they can get the same job done elsewhere for a little less.

In any case, I was joking. Lighten up.


----------



## Tilton

For someone who hunts more than driven birds, a Winchester Model 12 is an understated item that will last a lifetime with reasonable maintenance. For any hunter I know, 90% of Hollands would not be understated. Of course a Holland will last a long time if you're only using it for driven birds, but I have little doubt that it would need significant regular maintenance and care if one hunted it the way I hunt my shotguns. I can't imagine anyone wading high tide to a blind at 3:00 AM with their Holland. There's a reason most of my shotguns are synthetic stock, coated receiver and barrel, and non-gas operated - because I want (and expect) them to last a long time. FWIW, I shoot Benelli almost exlusively due to reliability in salt and mud and low maintenance needs due to a recoil operation as opposed to mechanical or gas operation.


----------



## A10ACN

Jovan said:


> Of course they didn't. But who says it decreased quality, either? Maybe it's simply they can get the same job done elsewhere for a little less.
> 
> In any case, I was joking. Lighten up.


I'm sure that was the thought when they moved, however, the market seems to think that the Belgian made guns were better= higher purchase/resale.

No probs, I'm light. If a person gets out of sorts over some written words they disagree over on a clothing/style, they should probably get out in the sun more. :cool2:


----------



## A10ACN

Tilton said:


> For someone who hunts more than driven birds, a Winchester Model 12 is an understated item that will last a lifetime with reasonable maintenance. For any hunter I know, 90% of Hollands would not be understated. Of course a Holland will last a long time if you're only using it for driven birds, but I have little doubt that it would need significant regular maintenance and care if one hunted it the way I hunt my shotguns. I can't imagine anyone wading high tide to a blind at 3:00 AM with their Holland. There's a reason most of my shotguns are synthetic stock, coated receiver and barrel, and non-gas operated - because I want (and expect) them to last a long time. FWIW, I shoot Benelli almost exlusively due to reliability in salt and mud and low maintenance needs due to a recoil operation as opposed to mechanical or gas operation.


Plenty of hunters, explorers, adventurers used their Brit Best guns and rifles in rough environments. For example, Selous, Sutherland, Roosevelt, Hemingway are some of the owners whose rifles still exist in fine condition after hard use in harsh conditions.
Sounds like your Benelli has served you well.


----------



## Corcovado

Pentheos said:


> An $80,000 gun -- while you would certainly never need to replace it in your lifetime -- is ostentatious and contrary to the trad ethos (whatever that is, and it does not interest me enough to debate it, but I take it to involve a compromise between longevity and frugality). An $80,000 gun represents that absolute best of the best. In terms of clothing and price points, it is tantamount to bespoke boxers or MTM shoelaces -- items some people have, surely, but no one here.


If I go out and purchase such a gun, that's too ostentatious to be trad. But if I inherited it from my grandfather, who used it on hunting trips with Hemingway or Leon Leonwood Bean, now that's trad. 

It occurs to me that certain high performance cars or motorcycles, while not necessarily designed to hold up to decades of enjoyment, might indeed end up being "by it for life" items anyway.


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## A10ACN

Corcovado said:


> But if I inherited it from my grandfather, who used it on hunting trips with Hemingway or Leon Leonwood Bean, now that's trad.


I agree! That would be the BEST way of coming into possession of anything of lasting use and value, in my opinion. Just for the history. However, the lineage has to start with someone. Grandpa had to pony up the bucks back in his day. I hope to someday hand down my BIFL items. Hopefully to someone appreciates them.


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## Tilton

Speaking of which, Hemingway favored the Winchester 12 and 21 field grades for much of his bird hunting, and a W. & C. Scott for upland birds (this is also the gun he killed himself with). Humorously, he also preferred a Thompson machine gun for shark hunting. :icon_scratch:


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## Jovan

A10ACN said:


> I'm sure that was the thought when they moved, however, the market seems to think that the Belgian made guns were better= higher purchase/resale.
> 
> No probs, I'm light. If a person gets out of sorts over some written words they disagree over on a clothing/style, they should probably get out in the sun more. :cool2:


Probably just a cachet thing, I'm betting. "Look, I own FN guns from when they were made in Belgium!"


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## hardline_42

Jovan said:


> Probably just a cachet thing, I'm betting. "Look, I own FN guns from when they were made in Belgium!"


Just to add to the fray, the Belgian A5s were largely handmade and fitted, used thinner barrels for better balance and had nicer engraving and wood finishing. When the labor costs in Belgium made it impossible to produce affordable A5s there anymore, the production was moved to Japan, where labor costs were cheap and the factory contracted to produce them had then-modern milling technology to produce them with very tight tolerances and high quality, albeit with heavier barrels and less attention to fit and finish.

That being said, depending on the type of hunting someone does, the choice between a Belgian or Japanese A5 can say a lot. If I saw someone with a Belgian A5 in a duckblind or boat, where they're required to shoot hard steel shot, often caked in mud, knocked over and can easily end up going for a swim, I'd say it was a bad choice. A Japanese A5 in the same scenario, with a heavier barrel, less concern over "prettiness" and less of a premium paid to acquire, I'd say that hunter knows what he likes. On the other hand, a Belgian A5 in the field behind some dogs? Absolutely, every time. The only thing finer would be a well-balanced and well-loved SXS.


----------



## Tilton

hardline_42 said:


> Just to add to the fray, the Belgian A5s were largely handmade and fitted, used thinner barrels for better balance and had nicer engraving and wood finishing. When the labor costs in Belgium made it impossible to produce affordable A5s there anymore, the production was moved to Japan, where labor costs were cheap and the factory contracted to produce them had then-modern milling technology to produce them with very tight tolerances and high quality, albeit with heavier barrels and less attention to fit and finish.
> 
> That being said, depending on the type of hunting someone does, the choice between a Belgian or Japanese A5 can say a lot. If I saw someone with a Belgian A5 in a duckblind or boat, where they're required to shoot hard steel shot, often caked in mud, knocked over and can easily end up going for a swim, I'd say it was a bad choice. A Japanese A5 in the same scenario, with a heavier barrel, less concern over "prettiness" and less of a premium paid to acquire, I'd say that hunter knows what he likes. On the other hand, a Belgian A5 in the field behind some dogs? Absolutely, every time. The only thing finer would be a well-balanced and well-loved SXS.


Bringing back some memories for me. The first decent shotgun I ever owned was a 1972 A5 Lightweight, made in Belgium, bought at a gun show for $750. It was a beauty. I wasn't really into hunting then, just shooting clays. Once I got into waterfowl, I realized I needed much more hard-wearing equipment.


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## hardline_42

Tilton said:


> Bringing back some memories for me. The first decent shotgun I ever owned was a 1972 A5 Lightweight, made in Belgium, bought at a gun show for $750. It was a beauty. I wasn't really into hunting then, just shooting clays. Once I got into waterfowl, I realized I needed much more hard-wearing equipment.


Nice! I'm really hard on my duck hunting gear. Oddly enough, I've never had any problems with gas-autos. I currently use a Remington SPR453 (Russian-made hunk of unbreakable pig iron) and it's lasted for at least five or six seasons getting uglier on the outside and slicker on the inside. My hunting buddy had the Benelli with the recoil system. Slick as snot out of the box and a joy to shoot, but the recoil system is a lot harder on the shooter than cushy gas so he got rid of it after about two seasons.


----------



## Tilton

hardline_42 said:


> Nice! I'm really hard on my duck hunting gear. Oddly enough, I've never had any problems with gas-autos. I currently use a Remington SPR453 (Russian-made hunk of unbreakable pig iron) and it's lasted for at least five or six seasons getting uglier on the outside and slicker on the inside. My hunting buddy had the Benelli with the recoil system. Slick as snot out of the box and a joy to shoot, but the recoil system is a lot harder on the shooter than cushy gas so he got rid of it after about two seasons.


Interesting. I think it depends which Benelli. My first Benelli was an M2 it was about the same recoil as a mid-range, modern gasser. In January of 2009, I got serious about geese and went nuts - bought several guns from big-name mfgs, tried them, and sold all but one by the end of my college spring break that year. Now I have a Benelli Super Vinci, SBEII, and I'm sharing an UltraLight 20GA with the old man. I like the SV the most and have never noticed much recoil.


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## hardline_42

Tilton said:


> Interesting. I think it depends which Benelli. My first Benelli was an M2 it was about the same recoil as a mid-range, modern gasser. In January of 2009, I got serious about geese and went nuts - bought several guns from big-name mfgs, tried them, and sold all but one by the end of my college spring break that year. Now I have a Benelli Super Vinci, SBEII, and I'm sharing an UltraLight 20GA with the old man. I like the SV the most and have never noticed much recoil.


My buddy had the SBEII. I could notice a slight difference in felt recoil but it didn't bother me. However, he hunts probably four days a week from September to February and is a waterfowl hunting guide as well. He can easily go through a couple of cases of ammo in a season, so I can see how even a little bit more felt recoil can become uncomfortable. I don't hunt nearly enough to feel it and he offered it to me, but I didn't have the cash at the time.


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## Tilton

Perhaps being built like an out-of-shape linebacker makes a difference. Also, I'm mostly a goose guy, so when you're shooting 1 3/4oz loads, generating something like 52ft-lbs of recoil, a slight difference is probably not particularly notable. I read an article once that also noted shooters perceive more recoil when they don't wear hearing protection.


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## bellemastiff

I am torn about whether H&H and Purdeys are trad or not. I am biased and I ordered both two years ago, after the sale of my business, as a "treat". I have received the P but not the H yet. On the one hand, they are expensive, and these guns do "make a scene" at a hunt club (even when I try to hide it a bit... the wood is just too beautiful). On the other hand, I have one son (and plan to have more--or daughters), and I think my plans to hand the guns down is nothing if not traditional.

Actually, IMO, the Silver Pigeon (my first and "other" gun) may be the tradliest gun. I think they are a cut above the <$1,500 OUs, but, they are 98% as functionally good (And 101% as durable) as an H&H gun. Also Beretta will be in business (and likely still made in Italy) in 50 years -- and the Silver Pigeon is certainly a nice enough gun , I ALSO will enjoy "handing it down".

One other point I would make about Purdey's or H&H's. I went for very "figured" wood (lighter hued, too, and in the case of H&H, I upgraded to the middle wood grade-- P only has one grade). I think a lot of Englishmen get lightly figured wood to make them less "flashy". .. maybe that is tradlier. I think it's a bit silly though. I should intentionally make a handmade functional work of art, less beautiful, because I am embarrassed to be able to afford it? Final note, one can be frugal and poor, frugal and middle class, or frugal and wealthy. And frugal doesn't mean not buying expensive things---it means getting value for money. I've "downgraded" my boxer-briefs from Polo RL to Fruit of the Loom, because $20 boxers weren't functionally better than $7 boxers (and both were made in China). Yet, I personally believe I will find my H&H to be a "good value" in the long run. I also enjoyed the purchase knowing if the Fed loses control of the monetary base and we enter a period of hyperinflation, I own some tangible assets that will hold real value over time regardless of currency devaluation.

BTW, does anyone else see the logical fallacy that it's tradly for your father to order a Purdey (or buy a Rolex) and hand it down to you, but it's not tradly to buy one of each and hand them down to your own sons?


----------



## godan

bellemastiff said:


> Final note, one can be frugal and poor, frugal and middle class, or frugal and wealthy. And frugal doesn't mean not buying expensive things---it means getting value for money.
> 
> BTW, does anyone else see the logical fallacy that it's tradly for your father to order a Purdey (or buy a Rolex) and hand it down to you, but it's not tradly to buy one of each and hand them down to your own sons?


Very well said.


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## eyedoc2180

I'm sitting at the kitchen table, solid oak with carved feet, that my grandparents bought in Reading, PA just after their wedding in 1903. 6 chairs were $3 each, and the table was $10. Bought for three lifetimes, and going strong!


----------



## Himself

Corcovado said:


> It occurs to me that certain high performance cars or motorcycles, while not necessarily designed to hold up to decades of enjoyment, might indeed end up being "by it for life" items anyway.


A childhood friend is still, at age 49, driving a '65 Ford Mustang that his parents bought new, and his mother drove until she died. They also had a VW Microbus, bought new, that I think his dad still drives (at age 90).

Another 90 year old friend only recently gave up his bought-new Porsche 356 for a Miata.

And another friend in his 70s still enjoys his 911 SC.


----------



## Tilton

bellemastiff said:


> I am torn about whether H&H and Purdeys are trad or not. I am biased and I ordered both two years ago, after the sale of my business, as a "treat". I have received the P but not the H yet. On the one hand, they are expensive, and these guns do "make a scene" at a hunt club (even when I try to hide it a bit... the wood is just too beautiful). On the other hand, I have one son (and plan to have more--or daughters), and I think my plans to hand the guns down is nothing if not traditional.
> 
> Actually, IMO, the Silver Pigeon (my first and "other" gun) may be the tradliest gun. I think they are a cut above the <$1,500 OUs, but, they are 98% as functionally good (And 101% as durable) as an H&H gun. Also Beretta will be in business (and likely still made in Italy) in 50 years -- and the Silver Pigeon is certainly a nice enough gun , I ALSO will enjoy "handing it down".
> 
> One other point I would make about Purdey's or H&H's. I went for very "figured" wood (lighter hued, too, and in the case of H&H, I upgraded to the middle wood grade-- P only has one grade). I think a lot of Englishmen get lightly figured wood to make them less "flashy". .. maybe that is tradlier. I think it's a bit silly though. I should intentionally make a handmade functional work of art, less beautiful, because I am embarrassed to be able to afford it? Final note, one can be frugal and poor, frugal and middle class, or frugal and wealthy. And frugal doesn't mean not buying expensive things---it means getting value for money. I've "downgraded" my boxer-briefs from Polo RL to Fruit of the Loom, because $20 boxers weren't functionally better than $7 boxers (and both were made in China). Yet, I personally believe I will find my H&H to be a "good value" in the long run. I also enjoyed the purchase knowing if the Fed loses control of the monetary base and we enter a period of hyperinflation, I own some tangible assets that will hold real value over time regardless of currency devaluation.
> 
> BTW, does anyone else see the logical fallacy that it's tradly for your father to order a Purdey (or buy a Rolex) and hand it down to you, but it's not tradly to buy one of each and hand them down to your own sons?


If an H&H last as long as a Silver Pigeon II, proportionate to price (ie. if the lowest-end H&H [~$38,000] lasts about 10x longer than a field-grade B-SPII [~$3,200]), then it would be as good of a value as a B-SPII. If it lasts longer, the H&H would be a better value. However, that seems unlikely. We've had this discussion many times about shoes (buying $100 shoes that will last two years vs. $300 shoes that will last 15-20 years with a few resolings). In any event, if I could easily afford an H&H or Purdey, I would probably buy one. Do I think that buying/owning an H&H/Purdey in anyway reflects trad values/New England frugality? Absolutely not. If you can afford the toys, there's no reason not to buy them, but being able to afford them doesn't make them trad or BIFL.


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## bellemastiff

I don't view literal physical durability as the only aspect of traditional style. Otherwise Kevlar clothing would be trad.

I also think exceptions can be made for objects of art and beauty. Would owning a Monet masterpiece be "trad?" Only if you inherit it?

With women, art, and maybe high end double guns, there is no trad or non trad. How you appreciate it, how you show off (or not) and how you take care of possessions could be tradly (or not). I have a beautiful wife, a beautiful double gun, and a small art collection, but I try to be a gentleman in regards to my possessions and relationships, and hopefully I avoid the type of flamboyance or attitude that is perceived as boorish and non trad.


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## Corcovado

Himself said:


> A childhood friend is still, at age 49, driving a '65 Ford Mustang that his parents bought new, and his mother drove until she died. They also had a VW Microbus, bought new, that I think his dad still drives (at age 90).
> 
> Another 90 year old friend only recently gave up his bought-new Porsche 356 for a Miata.
> 
> And another friend in his 70s still enjoys his 911 SC.


I was actually thinking of this sort of situation if you'll pardon my gallows humor:


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## Tilton

Have y'all seen the Volvo commercial where the guy has put almost 3 million miles on a Volvo 1800S with only two rebuilds?






https://www.mnn.com/green-tech/tran...n-who-has-almost-3-million-miles-on-his-volvo


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## Jovan

Corcovado said:


> I was actually thinking of this sort of situation if you'll pardon my gallows humor:


James Dean wore v-necks as an outer shirt?! WHAT A DAMN HIPSTER.

A pretty promising young actor's life cut short. What a shame. The irony is that he was speaking out about the dangers of street racing just a while before his unfortunate passing.


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## PennyTheDog

I've been viewing this site for a long time, but this thread finally inspired me to join-- I love reading everyone's replies. I have one fer sher and three maybes.

My definite for life item is my guitar. It's a nylon string custom build by Paul McGill in Nashville. The whole process took about nine months, and was really fun. I have great memories of hanging out at his house, playing music with the other musicians hanging around, and even sleeping in his basement. The guitar is loud, beautiful, and distinctive. It's 13 years old now.

The more questionable items are my steel Surly Cross Check that I commute on everyday, my 1990's Vuarnet 006-model unilynx sunglasses, and my Victorinox Small Tinker pocket knife. These items are part of my everyday identity.


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## TheGreatTwizz

A10ACN said:


> Well, I don't think anyone for a moment thought that Browning (FN) moved manufacturing to Japan with the sole purpose of increasing the quality of the guns. Everything made for retail by a large company or corporation is made to a price point. I would say that, comparing the price of a NIB vintage Belgian Browning to a Japanese Browning, most gun folks feel the original Belgian guns are better/worth more.





hardline_42 said:


> Just to add to the fray, the Belgian A5s were largely handmade and fitted, used thinner barrels for better balance and had nicer engraving and wood finishing. When the labor costs in Belgium made it impossible to produce affordable A5s there anymore, the production was moved to Japan, where labor costs were cheap and the factory contracted to produce them had then-modern milling technology to produce them with very tight tolerances and high quality, albeit with heavier barrels and less attention to fit and finish.
> 
> That being said, depending on the type of hunting someone does, the choice between a Belgian or Japanese A5 can say a lot. If I saw someone with a Belgian A5 in a duckblind or boat, where they're required to shoot hard steel shot, often caked in mud, knocked over and can easily end up going for a swim, I'd say it was a bad choice. A Japanese A5 in the same scenario, with a heavier barrel, less concern over "prettiness" and less of a premium paid to acquire, I'd say that hunter knows what he likes. On the other hand, a Belgian A5 in the field behind some dogs? Absolutely, every time. The only thing finer would be a well-balanced and well-loved SXS.


While I'm certainly talking a different realm of guns, I recently picked up a Browning XT Trap (Golden Clays, Grade VII); Japanese made, absolutely the highest grade of O/U Browning produces. I've shot this alongside older Belgian Browning O/Us, and I find the metal work, and quality of internals to be superior on the Japanese version. I've gotten some strange looks when I've told my friends I'm looking to sit in a duck blind with it to duck hunt...


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## bellemastiff

Duck hunting with an OU = awesome. I have only hunted ducks twice but both times I brought my SPII. I didn't get any weird looks BTW. I love double guns for their looks, admittedly, but also (more important to me) their ​intrinsically safety-centric design.


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## Tilton

I've hunted ducks with a double and found it to be somewhat of a handicap. No chance for triples or a third follow-up shot, to start with. Second, at least the gun I hunted with (once [impromptu goose hunt while visiting my uncle, was unprepared and had no gear]), had fixed chokes. While the mod/imp set up was fine for that day, I would have a hard time limiting myself like that every hunt. When you hunt in a club and get in a blind with folks out of your own friend group, you'll meet plenty of older guys who hunt doubles for ducks because that's what they've always hunted and that's what they have. Nothing wrong with it, but it is definitely not the best option if you're open to different set ups.


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## hardline_42

Tilton said:


> I've hunted ducks with a double and found it to be somewhat of a handicap. No chance for triples or a third follow-up shot, to start with. Second, at least the gun I hunted with (once [impromptu goose hunt while visiting my uncle, was unprepared and had no gear]), had fixed chokes. While the mod/imp set up was fine for that day, I would have a hard time limiting myself like that every hunt. When you hunt in a club and get in a blind with folks out of your own friend group, you'll meet plenty of older guys who hunt doubles for ducks because that's what they've always hunted and that's what they have. Nothing wrong with it, but it is definitely not the best option if you're open to different set ups.


I agree, and don't find a double useful for waterfowl. The one probable benefit is the ability to use a different choke on each barrel, but I've never run into a situation where it was needed, except maybe trying to get a cripple that's 50 yards downstream. A good semi-auto, or even a pump if you're inclined, gets you that all-important third shot. And for September goose season, where the bag limits are enormous and you don't have to plug your gun, a double makes zero sense.


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## tocqueville

Whatever you guys are using, could you please shoot more Canadian geese?


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## Bjorn

tocqueville said:


> Whatever you guys are using, could you please shoot more Canadian geese?


Agreed.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2


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## Tilton

tocqueville said:


> Whatever you guys are using, could you please shoot more Canadian geese?


I do what I can, brother. They are absolutely delicious and also usually the most fun to hunt. I'd love nothing more than to spend all of early goose season filling my deep freeze with that ribeye of the sky.


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## tocqueville

Good. Kill 'em all.


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## hardline_42

tocqueville said:


> Whatever you guys are using, could you please shoot more Canadian geese?


Actually, that's what September goose season is all about. The weather is rarely cold enough for any migratory birds to come through. The purpose is to thin out resident geese populations that like to hang out, year-round, and poop everywhere. The bag limit is something like 15 geese per day and there's no limit to how many rounds you can load in your gun. They really want you to hammer these birds. Personally, I think there should be no licensing fees in September, since hunters are really doing everyone a favor. :biggrin2:

Also, a small nit that needs to be picked. It's *Canada *geese, not "Canadian" (very common mistake). I wouldn't want to offend any actual Canadians, since all the ones I know are quite respectful of our sports fields and office parks!



Tilton said:


> I do what I can, brother. They are absolutely delicious and also usually the most fun to hunt. I'd love nothing more than to spend all of early goose season filling my deep freeze with that ribeye of the sky.


Tilton, you're going to have to share some recipes with me. I can't get those honkers even remotely palatable without some very heavy-handed cooking methods (a million hours in a crock pot and drowned in BBQ sauce). Now, a mallard or wood duck breast seared over butter in a cast iron pan with a little salt and pepper? Perfection! It tastes just like prime rib to me.


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## Tilton

I'll send in a PM.


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## eyedoc2180

I would pay to see a 90 year old driving a 60s era VW Microbus! That's pretty cool, trad or not.


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## Bjorn

H. Gerstner & Sons toolbox:




Haven't got one myself but I sure would like one...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2


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## taylorgtr

PennyTheDog said:


> I've been viewing this site for a long time, but this thread finally inspired me to join-- I love reading everyone's replies. I have one fer sher and three maybes.
> 
> My definite for life item is my guitar. It's a nylon string custom build by Paul McGill in Nashville. The whole process took about nine months, and was really fun. I have great memories of hanging out at his house, playing music with the other musicians hanging around, and even sleeping in his basement. The guitar is loud, beautiful, and distinctive. It's 13 years old now.
> 
> The more questionable items are my steel Surly Cross Check that I commute on everyday, my 1990's Vuarnet 006-model unilynx sunglasses, and my Victorinox Small Tinker pocket knife. These items are part of my everyday identity.


Which McGill guitar do you have? I've lusted after a Super Ace for a long time.....Right now, I have 7 guitars....but the Telecaster is my favorite, and a definite BIFL item:


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## andy b.

PennyTheDog said:


> The more questionable items are my steel Surly Cross Check that I commute on everyday,


I have a Pugsley, and I'd say as long as you take care to prevent the frame from rusting from the inside out, your Cross Check is probably a BIFL item. :thumbs-up:

Andy B.


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## taylorgtr

Might as well post the rest of the lot:

Rick Turner Renaissance-N electric nylon-string and Taylor W-10 (Walnut back and sides, spruce top)


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## taylorgtr

Taylor 514ce and 335 project guitar (it's a fake that I bought off of CL, and I upgraded pretty much everything, so it plays / sounds better than one off the Gibson line....but since it's fake, it's a BIFL guitar by default.


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## PennyTheDog

I have Tommy Jones model #4. I wouldn't be surprised if it was one of the last, because Tommy Jones died from alcohol a couple years later. I actually got to play one of the early Super aces in Paul's basement-- he was super excited about the model. It sounded amazing, like all his guitars. I also got to play a resonator of his-- now THAT was a unique sounding guitar.

The time I got to spend with Paul made some great memories: him talking about what Jerry Reed is like, what beer Buster Jones liked, Earl Klugh... I was in heaven!

If your like me, the first time you play one of his guitars you'll know you eventually will buy one!

PS. Nice collection-- I'll post a picture of the McGill as soon as I can.



taylorgtr said:


> Which McGill guitar do you have? I've lusted after a Super Ace for a long time.....Right now, I have 7 guitars....but the Telecaster is my favorite, and a definite BIFL item:
> 
> View attachment 8746
> View attachment 8747


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## taylorgtr

I was at the '99 CAAS convention, and got to see Chet play (I think that was one of his last public appearances). Jerry Reed was recovering from heart surgery, and Tommy Emmanuel got his CGP award. It might have been the 1st or 2nd year that Paul had his Super Ace at the event, and I was playing through my best tunes on one....when I noticed someone playing in behind me. They were filling in perfectly, and while I could tell they were really good, they weren't trying to overshadow me. When I finally looked over my shoulder, I saw who it was:










Tommy Freakin' Emmanuel.


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## PennyTheDog

That's super cool! Did you keep it together? Get to talk to him? I'm trying to remember what year I was at CAAS-- it was right around then, but I'd guess 2000. I introduced myself to Guy Van Duser, but he was totally uninterested.



taylorgtr said:


> I was at the '99 CAAS convention, and got to see Chet play (I think that was one of his last public appearances). Jerry Reed was recovering from heart surgery, and Tommy Emmanuel got his CGP award. It might have been the 1st or 2nd year that Paul had his Super Ace at the event, and I was playing through my best tunes on one....when I noticed someone playing in behind me. They were filling in perfectly, and while I could tell they were really good, they weren't trying to overshadow me. When I finally looked over my shoulder, I saw who it was:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Freakin' Emmanuel.


----------



## taylorgtr

Tommy E. is an interesting guy - he was just hanging out, and we had a laugh about how nervous I was once I realized who I was playing with. He was also very friendly when I saw him last year in DC. @ CAAS, some people were very approachable (Pat Kirtley, Buster B. Jones), and some others were 'big' stars (e.g., wouldn't give you the time of day). I had met Chet twice before, and got to talk with him after a concert in the '80s, and he was not in the best of health at the time, but my nephew talked to him, and he was gracious enough to sign an autograph, even though his handlers (understandably) wanted to get him away from the crowd. 

On the flight back home to DC, a woman saw me putting my Rick Turner guitar in the overhead, and she asked if I played the guitar, and I told her I was at a guitar convention. She said she knew about it.....because her husband was Paul Yandell. Music business being what it is, she had a 'regular' job, and she was going to a conference in DC.


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## cincydavid

He's coming to Cincinnati Sept 15th...I have tickets...saw him last year too, great show!

And on the subject of Canada geese, they are protected around here for some unknown reason...can't hurt them in any fashion. The cemetery is overrun with them, they are a nuisance. They get nasty if you get too close too...


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## eagle2250

^^LOL!
Geese are also protected out here in Hoosierville, but they are indeed to be considered a rather magical creature...being the only waterfowl I am aware of that produces 3 ounces of goose sh*t, for every ounce of food they ingest. They really can 'fowl-up' a shoreline.


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## gaseousclay

some of my BIFL items:

- Gillette Fat Handle Tech DE razor

- Alden shell cordovan cap toe bals and Alden Indy boots

- Winchester 9422 XTR


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## Tilton

Eagle and David, you can definitely hunt Canada geese in OH and IN, and I have hunted them myself in the latter. Perhaps you are confusing the Federal Migratory Bird Act, which prohibits you from harassing or killing the geese without a permit, with protection from being hunted all together like the protection that, say, the bald eagle enjoys. Ducks are also protected under FMBA, as are doves. You must purchase a federal migratory bird stamp, which legally functions as an exemption to the FMBA, allowing hunters to take a limited number of specific migratory birds.


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## eagle2250

^^You are correct about being able to hunt geese in Indiana, but what I am talking about are the flocks of geese that have made a couple of ponds in our local community their seemingly permanent homes. We may be able to hunt them, but they are protected by municipal ordinance and residents who have been unfortunate enough to hit one of the critters with their cars have been taken to court and been required to pay fines for such transgressions!


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## Tilton

Ah, gotcha, yeah localities themselves can restrict hunting on whatever they'd like. Resident geese are definitely a pain and can get super aggressive. I grew up on a lake with a sizable resident population and remember having a neighbor whose standard poodle puppy got a bit fresh with a goose and paid the price with a broken leg.


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## pleasehelp

This thread is pretty entertaining. It seems that BIFL can take a few forms, with perhaps the most applicable here being: (1) something is built with such quality/durability that it will last for a lifetime, and the price premium of that product is offset by the durability premimum; (2) something is so nice that you take the care to preserve and repair it so that it will last a lifetime, even if from a pure functionality standpoint, other products may be superior or more cost effective; and (3) something is sentimental so you preserve it for life and economics don't really play into the equation.

I was raised to value #1 (mostly with tools, musical instruments and furniture). I think that guns and cars generally fall into bucket 2 or 3.


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## Tilton

You hit the nail on the head. If a shotgun lasts 100 years on almost no maintenance it is because it wasn't used often enough to make a difference. Same goes for a car except even if you just parked it indoors for 100 years, it'd still take some maintenance to just let it sit like that. On the other hand, a Stanley #101 plane will last you 100 years with pretty minimal care. Going by your list, #1 is BIFL, #2 and #3 pretending to be #1 happens when people try to justify their purchases to themselves. I think there's a lot of that going around in this thread.


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## rwaldron

I just bought this ice chest.


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## Tilton

For the prices I see them at, why'd you choose a Pelican over a Yeti?


----------



## rwaldron

Tilton said:


> For the prices I see them at, why'd you choose a Pelican over a Yeti?


I got the nominal 45-QT (actual 49.5 qt.) Pelican for $200 from Costco. I've never seen the nominal 45-QT (actual 37.6 qt.) Yeti for any price lower than $320. Furthermore, Yeti's are not made in the USA and now only have a 5-year warranty. The Pelican is made in the USA and has a lifetime warranty (like all pelican products).

It also has a molded in ruler on top, which is nice for measuring fish.


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## Tilton

Gotcha. When I googled the Pelican cooler it was $350 for the 45qt. Makes sense now, price alone would have been enough for me. I've been fairly happy with my Pelican cases, though my oldest one leaks now if fully submerged. I never thought to warranty it seeing as it is 10+ years old.


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## eloquentlight

Hi all,

First post here - and loving this thread! I think my BIFL item would be the Seamaster my grandmother bought my grandfather in about 1959. They lived in Venezuela then, and my grandfather wore it until he busted the Hessalite dome on it. When I lived with them as a teenager, my grandfather asked me to help him (on the "newfangled" internet) to get it repaired by Omega. We did, and he ended up giving it to me last year for Christmas. Wear it every day.


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## t-sartor

The WW2 BAR my grandfather had. No idea how he got it


----------



## Billax

eloquentlight said:


> Hi all,
> 
> First post here - and loving this thread! I think my BIFL item would be the Seamaster my grandmother bought my grandfather in about 1959. They lived in Venezuela then, and my grandfather wore it until he busted the Hessalite dome on it. When I lived with them as a teenager, my grandfather asked me to help him (on the "newfangled" internet) to get it repaired by Omega. We did, and he ended up giving it to me last year for Christmas. Wear it every day.


That, Sir, is the quintessential BIFL example. Who knows, you may be able to pass it on to your Son! Then it would be a BIFG (by it for generations).


----------



## mikeh

gaseousclay said:


> some of my BIFL items:
> 
> - Gillette Fat Handle Tech DE razor
> 
> - Alden shell cordovan cap toe bals and Alden Indy boots
> 
> - Winchester 9422 XTR


My Gillette Fatboy adjustable is definitely on the list. Hadn't thought of it until you mentioned your Tech.



Tilton said:


> You hit the nail on the head. If a shotgun lasts 100 years on almost no maintenance it is because it wasn't used often enough to make a difference. Same goes for a car except even if you just parked it indoors for 100 years, it'd still take some maintenance to just let it sit like that. On the other hand, a Stanley #101 plane will last you 100 years with pretty minimal care. Going by your list, #1 is BIFL, #2 and #3 pretending to be #1 happens when people try to justify their purchases to themselves. I think there's a lot of that going around in this thread.


Really? I'm not sure I agree. Maybe #3 isn't BIFL, but just because something requires maintenance shouldn't disqualify it. If it is worth being the gun, the razor, the whatever that you intend to use for the rest of your life, then it is worth putting a little effort into. Shoes won't last a lifetime if you wear them with regularity, but it is the same argument we make for buying good shoes, taking care of them, having them recrafted, and being able to keep them for several decades. BIFL shouldn't have to mean that you can buy it for life and not have to do much of anything to take care of it, should it?

Ah, last entry on my BIFL list. This one requires maintenance. Must be trad because I got my Dad to pass it down to me when he no longer used it. My Coleman 425C two burner stove. Built in Kansas in 1964, used all over the mountains of NC and VA when I was a child, now used in the woods (there ain't no real mountains!) of Wisc., and bound for many more years and a few more restorations. It hasn't had much maintenance (we pretty well treated it like it was category 1) but with a little work on the surface rust and a coat of paint, I guess my son will have to paint it again in, oh, 2064. Maybe it will be a good project for him to get it ready for some serious traveling in his retirement. He's only 7 now, I guess that would be early retirement. He has already cooked on it though!


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## Tilton

Well, I also wouldn't consider any pair of shoes BIFL. Being 25, I do not see myself buying a pair of shoes and having them last 60 years. If I were 60 it would be another story. Perspective plays a large role here, but I see the general rule of thumb being if a product will outlive the owner without a significant investment in maintenance, it is BIFL, but if you have to reinvest anywhere near the purchase price back into the product just to keep it working, you're fighting a losing battle. Just be happy with owning nice things and don't worry so much about longevity.


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## eagle2250

^^Indeed!
While I've taken very good care of my shoes/boots and have enjoyed wearing several pairs over periods of 15 to 30 years, they all will eventually wear out. Even my belovedcrazy 30 year old shell cordovan Leeds will be toast, when the present set of soles wears out...and I, at one point, thought I could nurse them along for a lifetime, but such is just not to be!


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## Reuben

I definitely wouldn't agree that a BIFL must be entirely maintenance-free. In fact, the first thing that comes to my mind when I think BIFL would be a good carbon steel fixed blade knife, like a Randall.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - now Free


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## Tilton

Reuben said:


> I definitely wouldn't agree that a BIFL must be entirely maintenance-free. In fact, the first thing that comes to my mind when I think BIFL would be a good carbon steel fixed blade knife, like a Randall.


If you interpreted anything I said to mean "entirely maintenance-free," I apologize for being unclear. That is not what I said or meant. What I did say was that a BIFL item isn't really BIFL if it requires a significant investment in maintenance. Interpret that as you wish, but as eagle points out, many items that people on here claim to be BIFL items will most certainly wear out during their lifetime. A hyperbolic example would be a car: they will last a long time, but eventually your repairs will follow the law of diminishing returns and, after a certain number of repairs, you would have been better served to have just bought another.

As mentioned above, sentimental items or items seldom used and therefore seldom exposed to wear and tear, aren't really BIFL items. I have a pair of patent opera slippers that will likely outlast me because I don't really like them, I walk about 50 yards/year in them, and I have no particular drive to get rid of them. Given the circumstances, some on here would call that BIFL, but I would just call it pampered and under-utilized.


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## Reuben

Sorry about misinterpreting you, then. Going back and re-reading I can see how I jumped to conclusions. How do you feel about something that by it's nature gets less use and lasts a lifetime as a result? Say I have a nice pair of hunting boots, only use them for hunting. As a result, they get worn maybe 50-75 times a year, and seldom for a full day. They're not babied, used for their intended purpose, but just don't see as much wear as my other pairs of shoes by virtue of what they are.

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## Bjorn

My Hattori HD chefs knives. I have a petty, a Santoku and a Nakiri. As long as they are sharpened properly on stones, I could see them lasting a very long time. Have a Mizuno UX10 knife as well that that will probably outlast me. Western style Japanese chefs knives are really great. German and French knives just don't get as sharp, though they are good for hacking away at stuff that's hard. The steel in the Mizuno is Swedish Sandvik steel, so that's a plus of course. 

I'd like a Hattori Chinese cleaver as well, but it's expensive. Would look good on a magnet list and they are supposed to be fun to use...


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## Koala-T

My handmade Sankovitz pocket knife, bought on vacation in Budapest.


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## DannoRye

Tilton said:


> You hit the nail on the head. If a shotgun lasts 100 years on almost no maintenance it is because it wasn't used often enough to make a difference. Same goes for a car except even if you just parked it indoors for 100 years, it'd still take some maintenance to just let it sit like that. On the other hand, a Stanley #101 plane will last you 100 years with pretty minimal care. Going by your list, #1 is BIFL, #2 and #3 pretending to be #1 happens when people try to justify their purchases to themselves. I think there's a lot of that going around in this thread.


FWIW, My H&K handguns are carried daily, and I probably put between 2-300 rounds through my USP each month. I fully expect them to last, and I am not anal about maintenance.


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## Tilton

Sure, and I have a USP-C and I'm sure it will last as well (of course, it doesn't like cheap ammo, but that's another story). But that's apples to oranges if you're trying to compare your USP to a Purdey. It would be more appropriate to compare a USP to a Remington 870 - a workhorse that can go to hell and back and keep on shooting with only a minimum of maintenance.


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## Jovan

The USP is the Rolls Royce of handguns. Quite expensive, but worth every penny. That said, I'm more inclined to go with the classic M1911A1 type pistol when it comes to bang for the buck.


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## hardline_42

Jovan said:


> The USP is the Rolls Royce of handguns. Quite expensive, but worth every penny. That said, I'm more inclined to go with the classic M1911A1 type pistol when it comes to bang for the buck.


The Rolls Royce of handguns? I don't know about that. I think Tilton's comparison is more accurate. However, there are plenty of custom 1911s that probably fall into the Purdey category (though it's hard to compare a BBQ gun to a high end shotgun, regardless of price). While I've owned my share of 1911s (both Colt and others), my favorite has to be the Hi Power, Browning's crowning achievement.


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## Tilton

Jovan said:


> *The USP is the Rolls Royce of handguns.* Quite expensive, but worth every penny. That said, I'm more inclined to go with the classic M1911A1 type pistol when it comes to bang for the buck.


Again, not even close to a reasonable comparison. SIG is almost always notably more expensive and H&Ks are generally not much more expensive than peer brands (S&W, Colt, Springfield, Beretta, FNH) - only about 50% more expensive than a similar-caliber full-size Glock, which is usually considered to be a "cheap" (albeit reliable) firearm. I was referencing shotguns that are >100x more than other products with a similar lifespan.


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## DannoRye

I respectfully disagree as well. The value in the USP, and the reason I chose it, is that it is overbuilt and tested to a degree that no other sidearm in the world is. The amount of torture testing the factor does is unparalleled, and while expensive, it is the most reliable handgun I could carry. Can't put a price tag on that, but it is a tool and not a luxury item. More like an old volvo or Mercedes than a rolls.


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## Tilton

Yes, in terms of cars, the USP is much more like a Mercedes Unimog than a Rolls.


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## Eric W S

DannoRye said:


> I respectfully disagree as well. The value in the USP, and the reason I chose it, is that it is overbuilt and tested to a degree that no other sidearm in the world is. The amount of torture testing the factor does is unparalleled, and while expensive, it is the most reliable handgun I could carry. Can't put a price tag on that, but it is a tool and not a luxury item. More like an old volvo or Mercedes than a rolls.


Has someone thrown it from a plane at 10,000 feet yet? The infamous Glock Forum test ended with that. It loaded and fired fine after they dug it up. Hard to beat a Glock on some levels...

HK is half the shell of it's former self. I still covet most of their older designs which were better. The 93 with the roll. Umm tasty...


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## tocqueville

Were old volvos really that durable? Or was it that old volvo owners held on to their cars longer


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## drlivingston

tocqueville said:


> Were old volvos really that durable? Or was it that old volvo owners held on to their cars longer


Absolutely... my old hand-me-down 1983 Volvo 240 was freaking bullet proof. Someone else is still driving it!


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## DannoRye

tocqueville said:


> Were old volvos really that durable? Or was it that old volvo owners held on to their cars longer


My 850 is still being driven after giving me 300,000 faithful miles.


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## hardline_42

tocqueville said:


> Were old volvos really that durable? Or was it that old volvo owners held on to their cars longer


I've got at least 200k on my '93 245 (the odometer hasn't been as durable as the rest of the car). I had more than that on my '92 244 before I sold it. They're durable vehicles but they're also very easy to maintain and service since they lack a lot of the newer systems that modern cars have.


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## DannoRye

With the addition of being robust and very safe.


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## Tilton

I had an '87 Wrangler in high school that had 260k on it when I bought it for $2,800. I sold it for $4,995 with 292k during college and, five years after selling it, I was in town visiting my parents and saw it parked at the public library. Naturally, I walked over, stuck my head inside and took a peek at the odo: 340k.


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## hardline_42

Tilton said:


> I had an '87 Wrangler in high school that had 260k on it when I bought it for $2,800. I sold it for $4,995 with 292k during college and, five years after selling it, I was in town visiting my parents and saw it parked at the public library. Naturally, I walked over, stuck my head inside and took a peek at the odo: 340k.


Had to have been the straight six.


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## DannoRye

They are great cars too. My best friend growing up had a Cherokee and it was very reliable until he rolled it one winter day, and even then it probably saved his life. I drive Subarus now days but have always had a soft spot for those jeeps. Sadly in the NE they are all rotted from the road salt.


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## Tilton

Yup, the old AMC 4.0L. I was looking at new cars in maybe 2007 or 2008 and a Jeep dealership told me that the 4.0L was being (or maybe had been already) discontinued because it was overbuilt and owners weren't seeing the need to upgrade as quickly as Jeep wished they would. I don't know if there's any truth to his claim, but engineered obsolescence is most certainly a thing, not particularly a good thing or a bad thing, but a thing no less.


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## DannoRye

Stupid notion that hurts the brand in the long run. I'm surprised the dealership would admit to such a thing, but my cousin leases a new liberty and I can confirm their quality has fallen off significantly.


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## godan

The comments above about lowered Jeep quality are consistent with my recent experience. In the 1970's and 80's, my four cylinder CJ5 was primitive, but absolutely reliable and trustworthy (if the driver understood how Jeeps cornered at highway speeds.) I recently looked at new Wranglers with an open mind, but to my experienced eye the quality was much lower than my old Jeep, there was no longer a four cylinder option and mileage was worse than several small 4wd trucks. Also, the local dealership is owned by a buffoon in Denver whose screaming commercials clog the local stations. I would have swallowed the poor taste for a good car, but the Jeep is no longer a good car. Instead, I bought my fourth new Subaru from a family-owned dealership where everyone understands exactly how to talk (and listen) to academics.


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## Tilton

Danno, I bought mine specifically to go off-road (I also had another car at the time) and so I bought a MIG welder and some leaf springs to an old Ford pickup and went to town. The first thing I did was put a 6-point roll cage on it. I rolled that Jeep several times in the two and a half years I owned it and never had a problem. It would drain oil out when upside down, but carrying a few extra quarts would take car of that.


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## Reuben

We've got an ancient WW2-surplus jeep that we use as a quail wagon, and it's still ticking along despite decades of rough, rough wear.

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## Jovan

hardline_42 said:


> The Rolls Royce of handguns? I don't know about that. I think Tilton's comparison is more accurate. However, there are plenty of custom 1911s that probably fall into the Purdey category (though it's hard to compare a BBQ gun to a high end shotgun, regardless of price). While I've owned my share of 1911s (both Colt and others), my favorite has to be the Hi Power, Browning's crowning achievement.





Tilton said:


> Again, not even close to a reasonable comparison. SIG is almost always notably more expensive and H&Ks are generally not much more expensive than peer brands (S&W, Colt, Springfield, Beretta, FNH) - only about 50% more expensive than a similar-caliber full-size Glock, which is usually considered to be a "cheap" (albeit reliable) firearm. I was referencing shotguns that are >100x more than other products with a similar lifespan.





DannoRye said:


> I respectfully disagree as well. The value in the USP, and the reason I chose it, is that it is overbuilt and tested to a degree that no other sidearm in the world is. The amount of torture testing the factor does is unparalleled, and while expensive, it is the most reliable handgun I could carry. Can't put a price tag on that, but it is a tool and not a luxury item. More like an old volvo or Mercedes than a rolls.


Understood, everyone. I actually didn't know Sig were more expensive. I just remember reeling from sticker shock when I picked up a USP45 at a surplus store once. Perhaps they were needlessly marking them up... a lot of things that weren't firearms were in that place.


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## DannoRye

I paid over 1k for my usp, and that was msrp. My life might depend on it some day.


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## 32rollandrock

DannoRye said:


> I paid over 1k for my usp, and that was msrp. My life might depend on it some day.


I probably shouldn't ask, and at the risk of a major derail, but how in tarnation do you spend your days? You've already said that you pack heat on a daily basis, now this. Please say that you are in law enforcement and not one of those--and this might upset some folks--gun nuts who think that the world is a safer place when everyone is armed to the teeth.


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## gamma68

2003 Martin OM-18V. Solid mahogany back and sides, solid Sitka spruce top, solid ebony fretbaord with abalone pearl inlays, bone nut and saddle. This one will never leave my hands while I'm alive. If future owners care for it as I have, I expect it will continue to play beautifully long after I'm gone.


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## DannoRye

32rollandrock said:


> I probably shouldn't ask, and at the risk of a major derail, but how in tarnation do you spend your days? You've already said that you pack heat on a daily basis, now this. Please say that you are in law enforcement and not one of those--and this might upset some folks--gun nuts who think that the world is a safer place when everyone is armed to the teeth.


I guess some people would call me a gun nut. Personally I don't take offense. I live in a relatively dangerous city, and have drawn in defense twice. I know that I am safer armed, and since having been in my company when I was run off the road by four thugs who then surrounded our vehicle, my girlfriend much prefers it as well.

I'm not a typical gun enthusiast, I'm not a hunter, but I do carry concealed and take my own safety and the safety of my family seriously in that regard. To each his own.


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## mjo_1

Nice Martin, gamma! I should take some pics of my D-18GE. Now if only I had an HD-28V to compliment it....


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## godan

DannoRye said:


> I guess some people would call me a gun nut. Personally I don't take offense. I live in a relatively dangerous city, and have drawn in defense twice. I know that I am safer armed, and since having been in my company when I was run off the road by four thugs who then surrounded our vehicle, my girlfriend much prefers it as well.
> 
> I'm not a typical gun enthusiast, I'm not a hunter, but I do carry concealed and take my own safety and the safety of my family seriously in that regard. To each his own.


+1. I share your views and your practices.


----------



## DannoRye

Glad to hear that


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## 32rollandrock

DannoRye said:


> I guess some people would call me a gun nut. Personally I don't take offense. I live in a relatively dangerous city, and have drawn in defense twice. I know that I am safer armed, and since having been in my company when I was run off the road by four thugs who then surrounded our vehicle, my girlfriend much prefers it as well.
> 
> I'm not a typical gun enthusiast, I'm not a hunter, but I do carry concealed and take my own safety and the safety of my family seriously in that regard. To each his own.


OK, then. I appreciate your answer. I hate guns. Absolutely loathe them--if it were up to me, the Second Amendment would be repealed, all handguns melted down for scrap and anyone found with a handgun would be put in jail (rifles and shotguns, different deal). I understand that people can and do disagree on this issue, but here isn't the time or place. I also understand that it's legitimate to talk about firearms in the context of BIFL, but I also think that such discussion should be tempered--I don't want to think about self-defense and carrying guns when I come to this website. I'm not saying anyone crossed any lines, but I guess I felt like we were approaching one somehow. Hope that makes sense.


----------



## DannoRye

32rollandrock said:


> OK, then. I appreciate your answer. I hate guns. Absolutely loathe them--if it were up to me, the Second Amendment would be repealed, all handguns melted down for scrap and anyone found with a handgun would be put in jail (rifles and shotguns, different deal). I understand that people can and do disagree on this issue, but here isn't the time or place. I also understand that it's legitimate to talk about firearms in the context of BIFL, but I also think that such discussion should be tempered--I don't want to think about self-defense and carrying guns when I come to this website. I'm not saying anyone crossed any lines, but I guess I felt like we were approaching one somehow. Hope that makes sense.


I don't know what to tell you. If you didn't want to discuss it, why would you ask me that? You didn't go very far towards "tempering" the discussion...

It's clear you were just looking for an opportunity to share your petulant opinion, and to suggest that I should be thrown in jail and my property destroyed is childish & misplaced at best.

I will be blunt with you, as it appears you are very delicate. If the conversation should, in your opinion, approach a line with which you are uncomfortable, I suggest you remove yourself from it and allow the rest of us to carry on unmolested, rather than produce a display so dramatic as the one above.


----------



## gamma68

If you guys want to argue about guns, start another thread. Preferably on a NRA-endorsed website.


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## 32rollandrock

Plenty of talk about guns on this thread, with no objection, until someone says they pack heat every day, shoot thousands of rounds of ammo a month and their life depends on the gun they carry. That's too far for a men's fashion website, I think. Talk about concealed carry elsewhere, pal, and appreciate that politics don't belong here--we have plenty to argue about sartorially without branching out into this. This ain't the place.

Peace.



DannoRye said:


> I don't know what to tell you. If you didn't want to discuss it, why would you ask me that? You didn't go very far towards "tempering" the discussion...
> 
> It's clear you were just looking for an opportunity to share your petulant opinion, and to suggest that I should be thrown in jail and my property destroyed is childish & misplaced at best.
> 
> I will be blunt with you, as it appears you are very delicate. If the conversation should, in your opinion, approach a line with which you are uncomfortable, I suggest you remove yourself from it and allow the rest of us to carry on unmolested, rather than produce a display so dramatic as the one above.


----------



## gamma68

32rollandrock said:


> Plenty of talk about guns on this thread, with no objection, until someone says they pack heat every day, shoot thousands of rounds of ammo a month and their life depends on the gun they carry. That's too far for a men's fashion website, I think. Talk about concealed carry elsewhere, pal, and appreciate that politics don't belong here--we have plenty to argue about sartorially without branching out into this. This ain't the place.
> 
> Peace.


I object. You raised the debate by asking DannoRye about his gun usage. Then you didn't like his answer and fueled the fire. And then you have the nerve to state that "politics don't belong here." Didn't you send this thread into that arena??

If folks want to talk about guns as "buy it for life" items, I have no issue with that. You were right about one thing: this is a men's fashion website. If you want to continue to make guns a political issue, take _your _discussion elsewhere.


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## gamma68

mjo_1 said:


> Nice Martin, gamma! I should take some pics of my D-18GE. Now if only I had an HD-28V to compliment it....


Thanks, mjo_1. Wish I had more time to play it. Most Martin guitars remain "buy it for life items," I should think. I would enjoy seeing some pics of your D-18G.


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## Tilton

gamma68 said:


> I object. You raised the debate by asking DannoRye about his gun usage. Then you didn't like his answer and fueled the fire. And then you have the nerve to state that "politics don't belong here." Didn't you send this thread into that arena??
> 
> If folks want to talk about guns as "buy it for life" items, I have no issue with that. You were right about one thing: this is a men's fashion website. If you want to continue to make guns a political issue, take _your _discussion elsewhere.


Well said. All Danno was doing what justifying the price of an item he considers BIFL when Jovan posited it might be more of an extravagance than other options. 32 started the debate and politicized it then cried foul when things didn't go his way. That's not how it works, pal.

In the scope of things, when the standard in reliability and affordability is $600 (Glock), $900-1000 isn't that outrageous. The difference isn't very far apart from AE and Alden ($345 for AE PAs, $486 for Alden captoes).

In any event, I paid $500 for my USP-C in 9mm. I got a sweetheart deal when luck met fortune (for me) and my fraternity brother's father (I was in college at the time) put word out to all the boys that he wanted it gone that weekend - he happened to be in town for Parent's Weekend (said friend's mother was having an extremely rough time coming off of some very strong antidepressants and friend's father had recently retired and moved and no longer felt the need to have the weapon).


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## dkoernert

More guitar talk. BIFL amplifiers, what would you put on the list? My personal grail is an old Fender Deluxe Reverb or Princeton Reverb. Paired with the '74 Telecaster I played the other day , I'd never need any other guitar equipment for the rest of my life.


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## mjo_1

I haven't played my electric in a long time, but I think I'll keep it and my amp forever. I've got an American standard stratocaster and a USA made blues junior that I got new in the late 90s. It's enough for me, but if I were to upgrade and keep forever (while being realistic), I think I'd like an older Blues Deluxe. My old guitar teacher had a mid 60s blackface Super Reverb that was awesome. I'd like something like that or maybe one of the newer "boutique" amps if funds were unlimited. (think bad cat, Dr. Z, matchless, etc)


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## dkoernert

I played that '74 Tele through an older Blues Deluxe. The sound was short of life-changing. What a fantastic combination. If I had $4k to spare, that guitar and amp would have gone home with me no questions asked. Dr. Z amps are awesome. I was just recently introduced to them while watching something on Brad Paisleys tour setup. I'd love to get my hands on one someday.


----------



## pleasehelp

mjo_1 said:


> I haven't played my electric in a long time, but I think I'll keep it and my amp forever. I've got an American standard stratocaster and a USA made blues junior that I got new in the late 90s. It's enough for me, but if I were to upgrade and keep forever (while being realistic), I think I'd like an older Blues Deluxe. My old guitar teacher had a mid 60s blackface Super Reverb that was awesome. I'd like something like that or maybe one of the newer "boutique" amps if funds were unlimited. (think bad cat, Dr. Z, matchless, etc)


The old blackface Fenders are all great, with the Super Reverb holding a special place due to SRV's use. The problem with all of them is how loud they are. You really need to crank them to hear their potential. It's awesome if you've got the venue to handle it, but can be tough in some homes. The nice thing about some of the boutique amps is that some of them allow you to crank the tubes and still play at a reasonable volume.


----------



## rwaldron

How do y'all feel about Saddleback Leather Co.? That seems like some BIFL stuff, and I really appreciate the company's spirit, I'm just not quite a fan of their style.


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## Yodan731

rwaldron said:


> How do y'all feel about Saddleback Leather Co.? That seems like some BIFL stuff, and I really appreciate the company's spirit, I'm just not quite a fan of their style.


I bought their classic briefcase a couple months ago. I'm a 31 year old professional going back to school part time for a Master of Public Administration degree.

I am using it for school, where I am mostly wearing khakis and an OCBD to class. It fits in well with these more casual clothes and has loads of room for books, notebooks, electronics, snacks, etc.

I rarely wear it to work outside of school days. My office is on the dressy end of business casual, ties required, suits rarely seen. So, the case feels a bit too casual for the office.

So far it is just starting to soften up a bit, but is going to take a long time to truly break in. I can easily see it lasting decades with regular maintenance. I also recently ran into a guy with a 7 year old version that he claims he uses daily, and it was still looking good.

Overall, I'm pleased with the purchase.


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## godan

Yodan: You mention the case is beginning to soften. I'm around leather often, but usually in this dry climate. The effects of your environment on leather will be different. That said, if you plan keep it for decades, the best plan is to prevent drying and cracking, rather than to wait until problems become apparent. You might ask the best local leather guy you can find about maintenance - what, if anything, he would recommend to clean and treat the leather and how often it should be applied. Good luck with it.


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## Yodan731

When I say soften, I mean that the leather is becoming more pliable, less stiff.

I'm pretty comfortable with leather care up here in the four seasons of western New York, so I feel pretty confident taking care of the briefcase.

Thanks for the thought though!


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## fishertw

Brooksfan said:


> I'd like to propose a new take on Buy It for Life. That is, rather than having the specific object for decades (or life) replacing it with the identical object after it has served its useful life. Examples include Brooks OCBDs, the Gloverall Duffle Coat (might have to get a new one after 25 years but there's nothing better), etc. I don't mind buying a new item if I can say I've gotten my use out of the first item and there's nothing I'd rather have to replace it.


I agree with Brooksfan. Navy Brooks 3/2 blazer, Gloverall duffel coat, Harris tweed charcoal sport coat, blue seersucker sport coat for summer all qualify as those which we either buy for life, OR. Replace with an exact replica in a different ( usually larger) size.


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## gaseousclay

Almost forgot about the Montana sling for my rifle. Very durable and made in the US


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## MycroftH

Great thread. I would nominate some of my woodworking hand tools, which have held up under a tremendous beating and my grandchildren will someday use:

Ashley Iles (Made In England) "American Pattern" cabinetmaker chisels, which fit my hand like a dream










My Veritas Low Angle Jack Plane and Smoothing Plane, which are mechanical works of art and will take a shaving in hard Curly Maple so thin you can almost see through it...


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## Tilton

Planes like those are the first thing that comes to mind when I see this thread. :thumbsup:


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## Bjorn

tocqueville said:


> Were old volvos really that durable? Or was it that old volvo owners held on to their cars longer


Durable and very easy to do maintenance on. Simple 4 cyl engines.


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## tocqueville

Bjorn said:


> Durable and very easy to do maintenance on. Simple 4 cyl engines.


Speaking of old cars, i was just in west africa, where cars that die go to live a second life. The standard taxi where i was was an early 90s mercedes c class, diesel. I asked one driver how many km were on the odometer, and he just gave a look that combined "how the hell do i know" with "do you really want to know?" Anyway, my take away was that at least older mercedes diesels were BIFL. Dont get me wrong: these things were totally clapped out. But they worked.


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## hardline_42

MycroftH said:


> Great thread. I would nominate some of my woodworking hand tools, which have held up under a tremendous beating and my grandchildren will someday use:
> 
> Ashley Iles (Made In England) "American Pattern" cabinetmaker chisels, which fit my hand like a dream
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My Veritas Low Angle Jack Plane and Smoothing Plane, which are mechanical works of art and will take a shaving in hard Curly Maple so thin you can almost see through it...


Beautiful tools! My brother is an accomplished furniture maker and often gifts me old Stanley planes that he finds at antique shops and yard sales and then rebuilds. The mechanical simplicity and robustness of an old jackplane or a smoothing plane is amazing. I don't do much woodworking, but I occasionally head out to the garage with some scrap wood just to make tissue-paper-thin shavings.


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## DannoRye

Bjorn said:


> Durable and very easy to do maintenance on. Simple 4 cyl engines.


Another point on the old Volvos is that they make the newer ones look even shoddier. I had an awful experience with a 2003 XC70 with a Chinese transmission and swore off the brand for good. Sad.


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## SaintClarence27

To me there are only a few things that you can really BIFL. For something REALLY BIFL, I want it to be as usable/quality when I pass it down to my children as it was the day I bought it. There are only a few things that can really satisfy this:

Cast Iron - mentioned a few times, I've got a skillet, dutch oven, and a griddle that I will have forever. I have no fear that these will not last.
Watch - I have my Grandfather's 1976 datejust Rolex. It needs repaired, but when I get the money I will still have it.
Good quality chef's knife - While some in this thread have sworn by Japanese models, I followed Alton Brown's advice and just went to a local restaurant supply store to get mine. They let me try out as many as I wanted, and I got a really nice quality knife that really "fit" me for under $100 (a Dexter Russell Connoisseur 10"). I've used it every single day since, and it's still going strong. I doubt I'll ever need another one.
Hunting knife(s) - I have a Buck 110 (already mentioned, I think) and a couple of leatherman multitools (my favorite is a skeletool cx).

I could probably include some tools in this list, and maybe even some antique furniture.


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## thomj513

Back to the musical instruments. After all the years of playing I've keep my mid '60s Guild Starfire III that was made in Hoboken, N.J. It's not totally original but pretty close as being young and dumb when I got it I did modify it to suit the style(s) of music I was playing [from chord/melody jazz to prog-rock, jazz-rock ala Yes, fusion, and who knows what else]. I've had various guitars over the years but I've always keep the Guild. Amps are a different thing. I played a few no-name tubed and solid state amps until the early '70s when I got an Acoustic Control Corp 150 head with 4 x 12 cabinet. I used the Acoutic for a few years until I got the tube amp bug and bought a Marshall stack. OOoooohhhhh that Marshall sounded awesome.....nothing quite like it at the time. Fast forward a couple of decades and I'm playing, sporadically, my Guild through a Fender Champion 600 amp. Sounds good and works for me for now. That is until I talk Reinhold [Bogner] or Nick [Greer Amps] out of one of their old demo amps; the company I'm with sells wire and tubing products to both. T.


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## eloquentlight

DannoRye said:


> Another point on the old Volvos is that they make the newer ones look even shoddier. I had an awful experience with a 2003 XC70 with a Chinese transmission and swore off the brand for good. Sad.


We've really loved our 08 XC70 - apparently after the Chinese transmissions they switched manufacturers for their transmissions - they use Aisin Warner now I think? No real problems to speak of on the Volvo, and we're about to have our 75k checkup before our summer road trip vacation.

That said, I hear the XC90's are _terrible _and should be avoided...


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## eloquentlight

*Rolleicord*

Second time posting here, with another family heirloom. For Christmas this year, my granddad gave me the camera he taught me photography on - a Rolleicord Vb. Lovely camera with no electronics, and should last an eternity:


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## MaxBuck

eloquentlight said:


> Second time posting here, with another family heirloom. For Christmas this year, my granddad gave me the camera he taught me photography on - a Rolleicord Vb. Lovely camera with no electronics, and should last an eternity:


Great-looking camera. Good luck finding film for it past, say, 2017.


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## Captain America

This is a great thread, particularly since I'm in the market for graduation presents.

In my experience, these have been good, long-lasting things:

--A pair of Vasque mountain boots I bought at age 16, which finally wore out 30 years later (I'd let the leather go dry and tried roofing a bit with them on).

--Stickley Morris chair and settle

--my cheap Timex automatic

--LL Bean camp mocassins I bought back in 1984, but which only now are starting to wear through: do I get them resoled?

--my Pentax K-1000SE bought back around 1980.

--all the vinyl records I have ever owned: funny how my CD's scratch and die in only a couple of years. The CD Technology was highly worshipped by TechnoPhiles back in the day.

--my Brooks Brothers trench coat. I'm astounded at the price they now fetch: $700!

--my LL Bean Norwegian sweater. It will take a few wars to wear this down.

---my Raleigh Technium bike, circa 1986; cogs are getting nasty, though.


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## Tilton

A black and red Technium was my first road bike. In college, I dumped all the worn out comps for a single speed set up and eventually sold it. Replace those cogs and get a new chain - cheap fix! Any Shimano 6-speed freewheel will fit it, but I think mine was 13-23, if you want to have the same gearing (and assuming yours was the same). Shouldn't run you more than $40 including shipping for the freewheel and chain.

Also, 30 years to wear out a pair of (I presume) Sundowners means you didn't use them hard enough! That, or they were done after 5k miles but you refused to let them go.


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## gamma68

Captain America said:


> --all the vinyl records I have ever owned: funny how my CD's scratch and die in only a couple of years. The CD Technology was highly worshipped by TechnoPhiles back in the day.


You must be rough on your compact discs.


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## 32rollandrock

Records are a great call. I truly do buy them for life. Still have the first one I ever bought from way back in 1977.


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## CMDC

^Saturday Night Fever"???


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## 32rollandrock

CMDC said:


> ^Saturday Night Fever"???


Boston's debut album.


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## Reuben

32rollandrock said:


> Boston's debut album.


Excellent choice.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Monocle

Just contributing to the tangent...

Although my first purchase was Foreigner 4 on vinyl, it did not stay my favorite for long.

Yes, it's even framed, along with all of the other ones from significant musical moments in my life.


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## Shaver

Anyone recall Led Zeps performance on Live Aid? :icon_pale:


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## Tilton

32rollandrock said:


> Records are a great call. I truly do buy them for life. Still have the first one I ever bought from way back in 1977.


Fun stuff to remember. My first CD was Tom Petty's Full Moon Fever, purchased from a Hill's Department Store. My first record was Elton John's Goodbye Yellow Brick Road, appropriately (for the Trad forum, at least) purchased from a yard sale two blocks from my parent's house for $0.25. Several years later when I was in high school, the same couple had a yard sale and I came home with with a Pioneer SX-1250 receiver and matching Pioneer PL-550 turntable - I don't recall the exact price, but I probably paid <$25 total. They're wonderful pieces of equipment, though my speakers are crappy later 70's AIWAs on their last leg. Still have the gear and the record in the basement somewhere.


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## gamma68

Shaver said:


> Anyone recall Led Zeps performance on Live Aid? :icon_pale:


Sure do.


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## 32rollandrock

Reuben said:


> Excellent choice.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks. I bought Hotel California the day after. I still have every record I have purchased or otherwise come across (see below). The Boston album wore out long ago (records are like clothes and cars, if you use them enough, even carefully, they won't last forever) and I finally replaced it, with the new (vintage) copy arriving just yesterday. It's like 1977 all over again...


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## Pentheos

The dusting seems to be going better.


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## Ensiferous

I like the current audio theme, so I'll jump in. While I hope they do, there is a chance that these components won't really last "for life," but the Thorens TD-124 just might. From c. 1960, it is the same age as my favorite vintage Ivy clothes.


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## Captain America

I bought my first 33 LP around 78 or 79. Queen, A Night at the Opera. REALLY liked Bohemian Rhapsody back then! A

And I think my Vasques when through two re-solings.


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## rwaldron

My Dad passed away in December, and then then just a couple of months later, my mom fried the year-old audio receiver. When she got a replacement, she asked me to help set it up. When I ran new speaker wire to the 30 year old B&W speakers (rear), I took the dust cover off to look at, and admire the B&W design. a few minutes later, we were wiring up the front speakers It took the dust cover off of those, which were only a year old (purchased with the now toast receiver). Only then did I realize that the new speakers were so close in appearance and condition to the old ones that I wasn't exactly sure which were new, and which were old. I look forward to inheriting them all one day.


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## 32rollandrock

rwaldron said:


> My Dad passed away in December, and then then just a couple of months later, my mom fried the year-old audio receiver. When she got a replacement, she asked me to help set it up. When I ran new speaker wire to the 30 year old B&W speakers (rear), I took the dust cover off to look at, and admire the B&W design. a few minutes later, we were wiring up the front speakers It took the dust cover off of those, which were only a year old (purchased with the now toast receiver). Only then did I realize that the new speakers were so close in appearance and condition to the old ones that I wasn't exactly sure which were new, and which were old. I look forward to inheriting them all one day.


I don't know when it comes to stereo components.

I have one foot firmly in the past with a Yamaha PX-3 turntable circa 1981 (it cost about a grand when new) and the other in modern times with a pair of Audio Monitor speakers ($500 on close-out). I was on a budget when I bought the speakers and was planning on going the used/vintage route, but when I auditioned speakers, there was no contest, given the size of the room and intended purpose. The modern speakers sounded way, way better than high-end older speakers I've used that had a much higher MSRP. Technology really has come a long way when it comes to stereo gear. The best stuff today sounds so much better than the best stuff 20-30 years ago--even the "mediocre" stuff today gives a lot of the high-end stuff from the 70s and 80s a run for the money. When you look at used gear, and I do that a lot, stuff that's 20 or even ten years old often sells for a third or less of its original price. A lot of that, of course, is the fact that it's used, but it's also a matter of competing with modern gear. Five hundred bucks goes a lot further today than it once did when it comes to audio equipment, I think.

As for Thorens, really great turntables, of course--and a lot of them will play 78s. But put one next to a modern Rega.


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## Fatman

A Buy it for life product:

Mephisto Chess Computer, manufactured in Germany, in the 1980's.

Even though chess software has long passed these dedicated computers, they continue to sell at very high prices on Ebay, and still work perfectly.


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## Duvel

Interesting to see this thread bubble up during the season of giving. But hey, I am as materialistic as the next guy, and so I'll jump into the mix. 

I buy several things for life, as it were. I try as best I can to buy clothing that stays in style and will endure. Beyond that I have some prized possessions.

My stereo is built mainly of vintage components, such as a Technics SL1200/M3D turntable, Sansui 7700 receiver, Yamaha k950 tape deck, and Advent 1 speakers. This stuff has stood the test of time.

I bought a new Taylor guitar 6-string in 1994, a dreadnaught 710. I paid a pretty penny, especially for then, and it has aged beautifully. 

Records are the other thing I invest in. Like 32, I truly consider them lifetime purchases. I don't have anything terribly rare, and I'm not that kind of collector, but I have a lot of interesting records, very good sounding records, and ones that mean a lot to me.


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## 32rollandrock

^^

I don't need four sets of speakers, but I thrifted my most recent ones (JBL's and KLH's--don't ask me the model numbers) because I just couldn't walk past stuff that nice tagged for $15. I haven't decided which to keep, but I'm guessing I'll soon be flipping speakers on CL. That said...

I will quibble about BIFL stereo equipment. My Yamaha turntable was built 1980-ish but my Yamaha amp and Music Fidelity speakers are modern. I'm not sure about the amplifier, but there is a world of difference between vintage speakers and modern ones. My three pair of thrifted vintage speakers, KLH, JBL and Polk Audio, went for a pretty fair amount of money when new, much more than my modern MF's that I got on clearance for $500, and there really is a pretty dramatic difference. The sound is so much richer and crisper. This is what advances in technology can do. I'm guessing that the same could be said for TT's, but a man can spend only so much on stereo upgrades in a year, and I've more than used up this year's limit.

I think it's true that there's a baseline of quality in audio gear such that a high-end system from the 70s or 80s is always going to sound good, and it will last a long time. But, if/when your Advents need refoaming, as they inevitably will, that's a good time to consider an upgrade. Or at least take a test listen. A man is entitled to a significant upgrade every 20 or 30 years, I think.


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## Duvel

Good points, 32 My Advents were recently refurbished, so I'm hoping they have some life left. Then again I have to consider how much listeining life I have left myself--perhaps not more than 30 more years or so, if I'm lucky?


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## Oak City Trad

Duvel said:


> Good points, 32 My Advents were recently refurbished, so I'm hoping they have some life left. Then again I have to consider how much listeining life I have left myself--perhaps not more than 30 more years or so, if I'm lucky?


If it's too loud, you're too old! ...though I never thought that phrase made any sense when you think about it.

One thing I'll say for the JBLs is they're known for really well-balanced monitors (not much high or low coloration; which is great for mixing). But alas, here we are in the present with "Beats by Dre". Sigh...


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## Bjorn

Got a new absolutely smashing set of 5.2 speakers from XTZ that I feel I might hold on to for a long, long time. Reviewed here: https://www.trustedreviews.com/xtz-cinema-series-review

Truly amazing sound at that price (though not really cheap by my standards) and very well built.


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## 32rollandrock

Those look serious...



Bjorn said:


> Got a new absolutely smashing set of 5.2 speakers from XTZ that I feel I might hold on to for a long, long time. Reviewed here: https://www.trustedreviews.com/xtz-cinema-series-review
> 
> Truly amazing sound at that price (though not really cheap by my standards) and very well built.


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## Bjorn

32rollandrock said:


> Those look serious...


Have wanted some real speakers since I was 12. Never had the finance til now 

Perfect cinema speakers. Great music speakers as well.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Duvel

There is the well-known psychoacoustics effect at work for me, too, I have to admit. I know there are better speakers out there, for instance, than my Advents, and I've heard them and enjoyed them. But the look of the Advents as well as the nostalgia attached to them is something the other speakers aren't going to have. There's also knowing that many audiophiles still highly regard them. 

So, as they say, it's all good.


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## Duvel

Oh, and books. I think of books as lifetime purchases, those books, at least, that I can return to from time to time. I don't buy a lot of books, but the ones I buy are keepers, classics of some kind, and ones that I enjoy rereading. I borrow a lot of books from the library for lighter reading.


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## gamma68

I'd consider this a Trad way to listen to music. I often play an LP while ironing a shirt.

1955 RCA Orthophonic Hi-Fi. Plays at 33, 45 and 78 rpm.


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## orange fury

Duvel said:


> Oh, and books. I think of books as lifetime purchases, those books, at least, that I can return to from time to time. I don't buy a lot of books, but the ones I buy are keepers, classics of some kind, and ones that I enjoy rereading. I borrow a lot of books from the library for lighter reading.


I love reading, but I strongly prefer to read a physical book or newspaper than something on a computer or tablet screen. I have a friend that collects leather-bound books- I'd like to start a collection at some point, but really don't have the space for something like that right now


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## orange fury

gamma68 said:


> I'd consider this a Trad way to listen to music. I often play an LP while ironing a shirt.
> 
> 1955 RCA Orthophonic Hi-Fi. Plays at 33, 45 and 78 rpm.


BIG Dave Brubeck fan, I would love to have a setup like that, but I have to settle for Pandora and CDs lol


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## Duvel

OF, this is very heartening to hear from a young one! Print will never die.



orange fury said:


> I love reading, but* I strongly prefer to read a physical book or newspaper *than something on a computer or tablet screen. I have a friend that collects leather-bound books- I'd like to start a collection at some point, but really don't have the space for something like that right now


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## 32rollandrock

Nice looking rig, but...

You're making a tradeoff. Your records aren't going to be BIFL with a stylus/tonearm like that.



gamma68 said:


> I'd consider this a Trad way to listen to music. I often play an LP while ironing a shirt.
> 
> 1955 RCA Orthophonic Hi-Fi. Plays at 33, 45 and 78 rpm.


----------



## orange fury

Duvel said:


> OF, this is very heartening to hear from a young one! Print will never die.


Funny story: a couple years ago a buddy and I had to fly on business. I had printed out my boarding pass the night before our trip, and on the way to the airport I bought a Wall Street Journal at a Starbucks. He had his boarding pass pulled up on his phone and had his iPad for the flight, and he spent the entire drive to the airport making fun of how much of an "old man" I was. Once at the airport, it turned out that all of the digital ticket scanners were down, so he had to go print his ticket in the airport's business center. When we finally boarded the plane, there was an electronics ban for the 3 hour flight due to turbulence and storms, meaning he wasn't allowed to turn on his iPad.

my printed plane ticket and physical newspaper may be "old fashioned", but they don't require an on/off switch :biggrin:


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## Duvel

I'm not sure of the exact reasons--physical, psychological--but I find reading anything online much less enjoyable than reading it in print. And yes, as with your example, I feel more secure having a printed copy of things like tickets and receipts. While this also is partly a generational preference, I also think there's some common sense to it as well that crosses generations.


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## orange fury

Duvel said:


> I'm not sure of the exact reasons--physical, psychological--but I find reading anything online much less enjoyable than reading it in print. And yes, as with your example, I feel more secure having a printed copy of things like tickets and receipts. While this also is partly a generational preference, I also think there's some common sense to it as well that crosses generations.


From a purely tactile perspective, I prefer the feel of newsprint. I like the texture of paper and being able to physically turn pages more than clicking a mouse or swiping my finger across a screen. Technology is great from a functional perspective, but if I'm doing something for my own enjoyment, archaic isn't a bad thing.

another example is writing: I use ballpoint pens and legal pads at work every day because they don't require any thought to use. However, if Im writing for enjoyment (thank you notes and the like), I'm going to use a fountain pen and stationary.


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## Howard

gamma68 said:


> I'd consider this a Trad way to listen to music. I often play an LP while ironing a shirt.
> 
> 1955 RCA Orthophonic Hi-Fi. Plays at 33, 45 and 78 rpm.


Wow, I sure do miss the sound of old Victrolas.


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## Howard

orange fury said:


> I love reading, but I strongly prefer to read a physical book or newspaper than something on a computer or tablet screen. I have a friend that collects leather-bound books- I'd like to start a collection at some point, but really don't have the space for something like that right now


same here, I'd rather read a newspaper than to look at a tablet.


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## mjo_1

orange fury said:


> From a purely tactile perspective, I prefer the feel of newsprint. I like the texture of paper and being able to physically turn pages more than clicking a mouse or swiping my finger across a screen. Technology is great from a functional perspective, but if I'm doing something for my own enjoyment, archaic isn't a bad thing.
> 
> another example is writing: I use ballpoint pens and legal pads at work every day because they don't require any thought to use. However, if Im writing for enjoyment (thank you notes and the like), I'm going to use a fountain pen and stationary.


I'm in complete agreement, and I'm 28. I tried taking notes on my laptop for the first week of law school, which was a huge failure. I was basically a stenographer, taking down every word, and would end up with a giant wall of text that was a pain to go back through. I used notebooks and a pen the rest of the way through. Plus, studies have shown that those who hand write notes end up with a better grasp of the material.

I shudder when reading stories of high schools that have replaced textbooks with iPads. I much prefer the ability to highlight, write in the margins, etc.


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## gamma68

Howard said:


> Wow, I sure do miss the sound of old Victrolas.


I think you're a little confused, Howard. While my 1955 RCA Orthophonic does have a nice sound, it's not a Victrola.

I actually do have a Victrola, a model VV-X from 1915. I rescued it from the curbside on a trash day several years ago. It only needed minimal restoration and it plays wonderfully.


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## rwaldron

I'm Planning on my Red Oxx flying boxcar to last a lifetime: https://www.redoxx.com/Expedition-Duffel-Bags/Flying-Boxcar/91021/140/Product


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## 32rollandrock

^^

I just got a J.W. Hulme large duffel from eBay. Can't tell that it's ever been used. It's massive, and I expect it to outlast me by a significant margin.


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## tocqueville

I expect to have and enjoy my 1960s Woolrich hunting coat for ever.


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## oxford cloth button down

Duvel said:


> Oh, and books. I think of books as lifetime purchases, those books, at least, that I can return to from time to time. I don't buy a lot of books, but the ones I buy are keepers, classics of some kind, and ones that I enjoy rereading. I borrow a lot of books from the library for lighter reading.


I really don't won very many "things." I don't like clutter, but I do own quite a few neckties and books. This hit home when I was watching the documentary "My Architect" a few years ago and heard, "He owned nothing," Esther said in a recorded interview. "Only books and neckties."


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## hardline_42

My Scandinavian Forest Axe:










It was an anniversary gift from my wife a couple of years ago and I love it. With a little care, it can literally last several lifetimes with maybe a new handle every 50 years or so.


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## Fading Fast

oxford cloth button down said:


> I really don't won very many "things." I don't like clutter, but I do own quite a few neckties and books. This hit home when I was watching the documentary "My Architect" a few years ago and heard, "He owned nothing," Esther said in a recorded interview. "Only books and neckties."


I've spent the last 30 years of my life doing two things - getting rid of clutter (I own very few things for a 50 year old man) and accumulating books (the one thing I want to own). My girlfriend and I just bought a coop apartment (the first for either of us) and we are having some work done which includes building and buying a serious number of bookshelves. My goal is to have a small number of clothing items that I really love and a large number of books that I really love. Other than that, a few basics and I'm good to go.

I have no problem reading on line - and do so all day long, but for enjoyment reading, I prefer physical books. We collect old books - not expensive ones, just old editions - it is, for us, a fun and modest hobby whose only real cost is space, which we have hopefully solved with the apartment. Neckties makes sense and I love the idea, but now that I work from home, I can count on one or two hands the number of times a year I wear one. I hate owning things that I don't use.

And with this post I cross the Rubicon into 2000 posts.


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## mjo_1

That axe is awesome. I've now added that to the ever growing list of things I didn't know I needed. And I just killed a good 20 minutes on their web site. Good stuff!

FF, congrats on 2000!


----------



## hardline_42

mjo_1 said:


> That axe is awesome. I've now added that to the ever growing list of things I didn't know I needed. And I just killed a good 20 minutes on their web site. Good stuff!


Thanks. It's actually not very useful for use at home though it makes a great camp axe, but the quality has sold me on GB. I plan on adding a wildlife hatchet and splitting maul from which I expect to get plenty of use.


----------



## Duvel

I echo this sentiment. I don't have a lot of things. My wife and are among the least accumulators among our friends and peers. Everyone we know owns a huge flatscreen television, the latest state-of-the-art wired-in-the-walls sound system, the latest iPad and i-whatevers, the newest cars. We just don't get it. Our possessions are the few things that are meaningful in some way--music (records and CDs, a simple vintage system, a guitar), books, a couple of laptops, some good but simple cooking things, and, of course, coffee supplies (french press and a Chemex). Our furniture is ancient--good but ancient. We simply don't want much.

We don't own a television, we're off the cable grid, and we watch what we want to watch via Netflix.

It feels very clean to live simply.

At the same time, we both enjoy clothes, so the closets need a going through every couple of years.



oxford cloth button down said:


> *I really don't won very many "things." I don't like clutter, *but I do own quite a few neckties and books. This hit home when I was watching the documentary "My Architect" a few years ago and heard, "He owned nothing," Esther said in a recorded interview. "Only books and neckties."


----------



## Fading Fast

Duvel said:


> I echo this sentiment. I don't have a lot of things. My wife and are among the least accumulators among our friends and peers. Everyone we know owns a huge flatscreen television, the latest state-of-the-art wired-in-the-walls sound system, the latest iPad and i-whatevers, the newest cars. We just don't get it. Our possessions are the few things that are meaningful in some way--music (records and CDs, a simple vintage system, a guitar), books, a couple of laptops, some good but simple cooking things, and, of course, coffee supplies (french press and a Chemex). Our furniture is ancient--good but ancient. We simply don't want much.
> 
> We don't own a television, we're off the cable grid, and we watch what we want to watch via Netflix.
> 
> It feels very clean to live simply.
> 
> At the same time, we both enjoy clothes, so the closets need a going through every couple of years.


Your wife and you would get along well with my girlfriend and me. We haven't owned a car in over ten years, have two old TVs (one was a gift), a twenty year old stereo (a good one that sounds great - when I do buy, I tend to buy good stuff, just don't buy often) and the basics. We are buying some things for the apartment we just bought, but are trying to find vintage items (not "antiques," just good quality old items) where we can. Most of our friends think we are odd, but we just don't find that having a lot of stuff does anything of us. Let me emphasize, I do not see anything wrong, at all, in anyway, with others who do buy a lot of stuff - to each his own - just not our thing.


----------



## Duvel

Nice. The funniest thing about our lifestyle is when people try to talk to us about the TV shows they're watching, or a TV commercial. "You mean, you haven't seen..." Like we live under a rock. "No, but may I talk to you about this great book of John Cheever short stories I'm reading?"


----------



## my19

hardline_42 said:


> My Scandinavian Forest Axe:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It was an anniversary gift from my wife a couple of years ago and I love it. With a little care, it can literally last several lifetimes with maybe a new handle every 50 years or so.


Beautiful axe. I have a fairly large hatchet from another old Swedish forge, Hults Bruk, sold under the Husqvarna name. Perfect straight-grain pattern in the handle and superb head geometry. I use it quite a bit around camp and I know it will outlast me by many decades.


----------



## hardline_42

my19 said:


> Beautiful axe. I have a fairly large hatchet from another old Swedish forge, Hults Bruk, sold under the Husqvarna name. Perfect straight-grain pattern in the handle and superb head geometry. I use it quite a bit around camp and I know it will outlast me by many decades.


Yes, the Husqvarnas are probably the best value for a Swedish axe right now. I believe they are currently manufactured by Hultafors (Hults Bruk) and were up until recently manufactured by Wetterlings. They might not come shaving sharp but they have the same great geometry and use high quality steel just like the GBs. These kinds of tools are truly a pleasure to use and get better with age.


----------



## Natty Beau

Duvel said:


> I echo this sentiment. I don't have a lot of things. My wife and are among the least accumulators among our friends and peers. Everyone we know owns a huge flatscreen television, the latest state-of-the-art wired-in-the-walls sound system, the latest iPad and i-whatevers, the newest cars. We just don't get it. Our possessions are the few things that are meaningful in some way--music (records and CDs, a simple vintage system, a guitar), books, a couple of laptops, some good but simple cooking things, and, of course, coffee supplies (french press and a Chemex). Our furniture is ancient--good but ancient. We simply don't want much.
> 
> We don't own a television, we're off the cable grid, and we watch what we want to watch via Netflix.
> 
> It feels very clean to live simply.
> 
> At the same time, we both enjoy clothes, so the closets need a going through every couple of years.


We're in our mid and late twenties, but this sounds a lot like us, except we bought a big screen TV and declined to get home Internet service. We watch DVDs and have an admittedly large collection of those.


----------



## Duvel

Actually, I wouldn't mind a flat screen TV of some kind. Nothing huge though. Right now we just use one of our laptops. It's cozy, but sometimes it would be nice to see a bigger screen.


----------



## Dr.Piper

hardline_42 said:


> My Scandinavian Forest Axe:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It was an anniversary gift from my wife a couple of years ago and I love it. With a little care, it can literally last several lifetimes with maybe a new handle every 50 years or so.


Just a great axe. I started with their large splitting axe, then got one of these. Then...um...a wildlife hatchet. And a small forest axe.

And a mini belt hatchet. But that's all.


----------



## Fading Fast

Duvel said:


> Actually, I wouldn't mind a flat screen TV of some kind. Nothing huge though. Right now we just use one of our laptops. It's cozy, but sometimes it would be nice to see a bigger screen.


Staying close to the "buy for life" theme of the thread, the problem today is that with technology it is hard to buy for life. My Dad bought a color TV the year I was born - 1964 - and he had that same TV when he passed away in 1990 (he did not buy a lot of things or often, but did buy good stuff when he bought). Other than not having remote control, it wasn't particularly dated versus the new tube TVs that were in the stores in 1990. But a 26 year old TV today would be incredibly behind the curve. Even the TV we have that is five years old doesn't have enough USB ports for cable, DVR and Apple TV (for streaming). I think it actually makes sense to buy slightly dated technology - last year's TV model where the price has dropped considerably versus the of-the-moment TV, since it will be dated in a year anyway. This way, if you need to buy 3 or 4 TVs in the next 20 years to stay current, your overall cost will be meaningfully lower.


----------



## Natty Beau

Duvel said:


> Actually, I wouldn't mind a flat screen TV of some kind. Nothing huge though. Right now we just use one of our laptops. It's cozy, but sometimes it would be nice to see a bigger screen.


Our laptops are old as dirt and won't play DVDs reliably, so I got us a 42" flat screen. It's like being at the movies.


----------



## wwilson

Dr.Piper said:


> Just a great axe. I started with their large splitting axe, then got one of these. Then...um...a wildlife hatchet. And a small forest axe.
> 
> And a mini belt hatchet. But that's all.


I don't own a GB, but I am fairly attached to my Keen Kutter and Simmons axes...and these little guys...


----------



## red_shift

Fading Fast said:


> Staying close to the "buy for life" theme of the thread, the problem today is that with technology it is hard to buy for life. My Dad bought a color TV the year I was born - 1964 - and he had that same TV when he passed away in 1990 (he did not buy a lot of things or often, but did buy good stuff when he bought). Other than not having remote control, it wasn't particularly dated versus the new tube TVs that were in the stores in 1990. But a 26 year old TV today would be incredibly behind the curve. Even the TV we have that is five years old doesn't have enough USB ports for cable, DVR and Apple TV (for streaming). I think it actually makes sense to buy slightly dated technology - last year's TV model where the price has dropped considerably versus the of-the-moment TV, since it will be dated in a year anyway. This way, if you need to buy 3 or 4 TVs in the next 20 years to stay current, your overall cost will be meaningfully lower.


With technology I've learned that it's best to put off buying anything new for as long as possible so when you do take the plunge it will be a significant improvement over what you had before. Modern computers and cell phones are a night and day improvement over the things I grew up with 20 years ago. It's not exactly buy it for life but at least you'll be able to see where your money is going.

Also, congratulations on 2000+ posts! I've appreciated your posts in the past and here's to 2000+ more.:thumbs-up:


----------



## Dr.Piper

wwilson said:


> I don't own a GB, but I am fairly attached to my Keen Kutter and Simmons axes...and these little guys...


Nice looking!


----------



## Andersdad

Gamma - We need a room by room tour of your house.


----------



## Howard

gamma68 said:


> I think you're a little confused, Howard. While my 1955 RCA Orthophonic does have a nice sound, it's not a Victrola.
> 
> I actually do have a Victrola, a model VV-X from 1915. I rescued it from the curbside on a trash day several years ago. It only needed minimal restoration and it plays wonderfully.


Oh OK I thought they were the same thing.


----------



## blairrob

gamma68 said:


> I think you're a little confused, Howard. While my 1955 RCA Orthophonic does have a nice sound, it's not a Victrola.
> 
> I actually do have a Victrola, a model VV-X from 1915. I rescued it from the curbside on a trash day several years ago. It only needed minimal restoration and it plays wonderfully.


That is a brilliant find and looks like a lovely restoration. Thanks for sharing that!


----------



## Odradek

Duvel said:


> Nice. The funniest thing about our lifestyle is when people try to talk to us about the TV shows they're watching, or a TV commercial. "You mean, you haven't seen..." Like we live under a rock. "No, but may I talk to you about this great book of John Cheever short stories I'm reading?"


I haven't watched much television for years, but our "Freeview" satellite box broke over 18 months ago and we've been without a TV ever since, and really don't miss it at all. 
The children would ask if it was fixed for the first month or so, but after that they just accepted that we had no TV. They are 8 and 5 and I think it's far better for them. They do a lot of drawing and reading.
We still have the actual television and we can watch DVDs when we want on it, but there's just no channel reception.
My wife will watch the occasional TV programme on her laptop, but that's about it.

A bit ironic given that we both work in the film and television industry.


----------



## Odradek

gamma68 said:


> I think you're a little confused, Howard. While my 1955 RCA Orthophonic does have a nice sound, it's not a Victrola.
> 
> I actually do have a Victrola, a model VV-X from 1915. I rescued it from the curbside on a trash day several years ago. It only needed minimal restoration and it plays wonderfully.


That's amazing, and unbelievable that someone would just throw it out. 
My uncle has always been lucky at finding thrown out relics himself, like the complete Victorian mahogany staircase he restored and installed in his modest suburban house. Found in a skip.
Anyway he has a small collection of vintage gramophones, including one that plays the really old wax cylinders.


----------



## gamma68

Odradek said:


> That's amazing, and unbelievable that someone would just throw it out.


The same household was also throwing away a large antique pump organ, which sat next to the Victrola. I had a much smaller house at the time and had no room for the pump organ. I really hope someone took it before the garbage truck came.


----------



## Captain America

Odradek said:


> I haven't watched much television for years, but our "Freeview" satellite box broke over 18 months ago and we've been without a TV ever since, and really don't miss it at all.
> The children would ask if it was fixed for the first month or so, but after that they just accepted that we had no TV. They are 8 and 5 and I think it's far better for them. They do a lot of drawing and reading.
> We still have the actual television and we can watch DVDs when we want on it, but there's just no channel reception.
> My wife will watch the occasional TV programme on her laptop, but that's about it.
> 
> A bit ironic given that we both work in the film and television industry.


What you say is true. I've been TV-free since 1992, and I can say that this one act has (A) added years of real time to my life, (B) made my family much stronger, (C) broadened my mind and my skills.


----------



## Captain America

eloquentlight said:


> Second time posting here, with another family heirloom. For Christmas this year, my granddad gave me the camera he taught me photography on - a Rolleicord Vb. Lovely camera with no electronics, and should last an eternity:


beautiful camera; I've been intrigued by medium format; longtime 35mm guy here (my Pentax K-1000 SE is pushing 40).


----------



## Bradley.Kohr.II

Disturbingly, probably my Pelican rolling case, which I use as a suitcase - when filled to the brim, it comes in at 47#, and it just doesn't seem to wear at all - nor can I see how the airline could hurt it, barring something truly extraordinary. 

My "city hat" and "cattle baron" by Texas Hatters. 

Lucchese boots come close - carry belts by the beltman.net definitely count - wear one almost every day, with rotation, for years thus far, w.o. appreciable wear. Oddly enough, the horse-hide one isn't wearing that well. 

I have a competition gun, built by a friend's son, who was apprenticed to a very old 'smith - it was his first commissioned work, I believe, which is darn near sublime - a fellow shooter named it "Poetry in Motion" when he shot it, thereafter, shortened to Poetry. Most other guns you can feel loosen and degrade over time - that one just doesn't seem to wear. 

I had a 1983 240D. That definitely counts as a BIFL car. The engineering and build were just incredible, even if it was terrifyingly under-powered. 

I lose them all the time, but I will, probably, always carry an Alox SAK Electrician pocket knife.


----------



## 32rollandrock

Bradley.Kohr.II said:


> Disturbingly, probably my Pelican rolling case, which I use as a suitcase - when filled to the brim, it comes in at 47#, and it just doesn't seem to wear at all - nor can I see how the airline could hurt it, barring something truly extraordinary.
> 
> My "city hat" and "cattle baron" by Texas Hatters.
> 
> Lucchese boots come close - carry belts by the beltman.net definitely count - wear one almost every day, with rotation, for years thus far, w.o. appreciable wear. Oddly enough, the horse-hide one isn't wearing that well.
> 
> I have a competition gun, built by a friend's son, who was apprenticed to a very old 'smith - it was his first commissioned work, I believe, which is darn near sublime - a fellow shooter named it "Poetry in Motion" when he shot it, thereafter, shortened to Poetry. Most other guns you can feel loosen and degrade over time - that one just doesn't seem to wear.
> 
> I had a 1983 240D. *That definitely counts as a BIFL car*. The engineering and build were just incredible, even if it was terrifyingly under-powered.
> 
> I lose them all the time, but I will, probably, always carry an Alox SAK Electrician pocket knife.


Sorry, but I don't think cars can qualify. We're talking life. Every car ever made will eventually wear out.


----------



## rwaldron

I just got this in today, and I am fairly certain it will outlast me.


----------



## Nobleprofessor

32rollandrock said:


> Sorry, but I don't think cars can qualify. We're talking life. Every car ever made will eventually wear out.


An old Mercedes Diesel can life a lifetime. Everything will eventually wear out given enough time. Most of the high mileage award cars are Diesel Mercedes. They can and do last a lifetime. My old diesel Mercedes had over 500,000 miles. There are 1000's of them out with over 1 Million miles. What is a lifetime of driving? 60 years approximately? Assuming you bought it at 16 and drove it to a normal life expectancy? 15,000 miles a years times 60 years is 900,000 miles. So, yes, cars can be lifetime purchases.

There is a guy with a volvo with 3 million miles on it. When asked if it would make it another million, he wasn't worried about the car, he was worried about the car, he wondered whether he could live long enough.

https://consumerist.com/2013/09/23/...st-mileage-by-a-single-driver-in-one-vehicle/


----------



## 32rollandrock

Nope. Sorry. Cars need repairs. The older they get, the more significant the repairs become. At some point, it makes more economic sense to simply get a new car--I'm guessing that's why you no longer have the Mercedes. Last a long time, sure, but it didn't last a lifetime.

Sure, there's going to be someone here or someone there who got 3 million miles or whatever on Volvo, but that's outlier stuff. If a Mercedes, or any brand for that matter, lasted 900,000 miles as a matter of course, there would be a whole lot more of them on the road than are on the road.



Nobleprofessor said:


> An old Mercedes Diesel can life a lifetime. Everything will eventually wear out given enough time. Most of the high mileage award cars are Diesel Mercedes. They can and do last a lifetime. My old diesel Mercedes had over 500,000 miles. There are 1000's of them out with over 1 Million miles. What is a lifetime of driving? 60 years approximately? Assuming you bought it at 16 and drove it to a normal life expectancy? 15,000 miles a years times 60 years is 900,000 miles. So, yes, cars can be lifetime purchases.
> 
> There is a guy with a volvo with 3 million miles on it. When asked if it would make it another million, he wasn't worried about the car, he was worried about the car, he wondered whether he could live long enough.
> 
> https://consumerist.com/2013/09/23/...st-mileage-by-a-single-driver-in-one-vehicle/


----------



## Duvel

My Rolling Stones boot LPs from the 70s, especially the ones with Mick Taylor. The space he is given on the studio LPs is but a fraction of what he truly could do, as the live stuff shows.


----------



## Nobleprofessor

32rollandrock said:


> Nope. Sorry. Cars need repairs. The older they get, the more significant the repairs become. At some point, it makes more economic sense to simply get a new car--I'm guessing that's why you no longer have the Mercedes. Last a long time, sure, but it didn't last a lifetime.
> 
> Sure, there's going to be someone here or someone there who got 3 million miles or whatever on Volvo, but that's outlier stuff. If a Mercedes, or any brand for that matter, lasted 900,000 miles as a matter of course, there would be a whole lot more of them on the road than are on the road.


So, you are saying if something needs repairs that means it doesn't qualify as a lifetime purchase?


----------



## Fading Fast

Duvel said:


> My Rolling Stones boot LPs from the 70s, especially the ones with Mick Taylor. The space he is given on the studio LPs is but a fraction of what he truly could do, as the live stuff shows.


All my Stones' albums are buy it for life items - their music does not get old to my ears.


----------



## Bama87

The only thing I own at this point in my life that I feel would qualify as a BIFL purchase was my wife's wedding ring.


----------



## 32rollandrock

Nobleprofessor said:


> So, you are saying if something needs repairs that means it doesn't qualify as a lifetime purchase?


Depends on the nature and extent. It is one thing to put a new handle on an ax. It is entirely another to replace an engine. Or a transmission. Or a driveline. Or any other number of things that will eventually need fixing/replacement on a car.

I don't want to talk about cars anymore. I'd rather talk about the Stones, and I agree with Duvel, with a minor quibble. I am now in the process of replacing virtually all of my Stones albums. They've been played so much that most are worn out. Kind of like a car.


----------



## MythReindeer

The only truly "buy it for life" thing is arguments about whether something qualifies as BIFL. They always pop up and never really end.


----------



## Duvel

I did that a while ago, actually, with a bunch of LPs from my college days, when my turntable's stylus was like an anvil. Believe it or not, the one record I've had a devil or a time finding a decent replacement for is Goats Head Soup. I have a couple of VG-plus grade copies but I'll be damned if there's a reasonable EX-grade out there.



32rollandrock said:


> Depends on the nature and extent. It is one thing to put a new handle on an ax. It is entirely another to replace an engine. Or a transmission. Or a driveline. Or any other number of things that will eventually need fixing/replacement on a car.
> 
> I don't want to talk about cars anymore. I'd rather talk about the Stones, and I agree with Duvel, with a minor quibble. I am now in the process of replacing virtually all of my Stones albums. They've been played so much that most are worn out. Kind of like a car.


----------



## 32rollandrock

Duvel said:


> I did that a while ago, actually, with a bunch of LPs from my college days, when my turntable's stylus was like an anvil. Believe it or not, the one record I've had a devil or a time finding a decent replacement for is Goats Head Soup. I have a couple of VG-plus grade copies but I'll be damned if there's a reasonable EX-grade out there.


My stylus was the same way. From now on, though, my vinyl will be BIFL.


----------



## Duvel

Mine is also my BFF.



32rollandrock said:


> My stylus was the same way. From now on, though, my vinyl will be BIFL.


----------



## rwaldron

32rollandrock said:


> I don't want to talk about cars anymore. I'd rather talk about the Stones, and I agree with Duvel, with a minor quibble. I am now in the process of replacing virtually all of my Stones albums. They've been played so much that most are worn out. Kind of like a car.


We should talk about The Oyster Bed that I got aw well. A solid piece of metal to cook Oysters, Butter, and Garlic together on. This is something that deserves discussion.


----------



## pleasehelp

Nobleprofessor said:


> An old Mercedes Diesel can life a lifetime. Everything will eventually wear out given enough time. Most of the high mileage award cars are Diesel Mercedes. They can and do last a lifetime. My old diesel Mercedes had over 500,000 miles. There are 1000's of them out with over 1 Million miles. What is a lifetime of driving? 60 years approximately? Assuming you bought it at 16 and drove it to a normal life expectancy? 15,000 miles a years times 60 years is 900,000 miles. So, yes, cars can be lifetime purchases.
> 
> There is a guy with a volvo with 3 million miles on it. When asked if it would make it another million, he wasn't worried about the car, he was worried about the car, he wondered whether he could live long enough.
> 
> https://consumerist.com/2013/09/23/...st-mileage-by-a-single-driver-in-one-vehicle/


Cars are an interesting one because some folks buy them as tools and others buy them as toys. If you're buying them as toys then there are certain cars that you buy-for-life, but it's generally due to the stylistic nature of the toy rather than the durable nature of the car. This may speak to the timeless style and excitement that these cars offer.


----------



## Fatman

_*I love this thread!*_

A few "buy it for life" items that I am hoping...I am big on taking care of high quality items, treating leather, etc...

Martin guitar (custom 15 mahogany) 
Valentine radar detector (upgradeable) 
Canada Goose Expedition parka (is it warm! I hope it lasts)
Church Grafton heavy country brogues (these go with everything and announce your arrival 10 minutes before you get there)
Ugg slippers. (I have lots of miles on mine and every year or two, I get new insoles) With leather conditioner and new insole, they feel "new" each year. 
2011 Mercedes C300 sport (I want this to last me the next 25 years)
Mephisto Chess Computers. These are from the 80's and are selling for more now than they did back then!

this next one sounds strange but...

Frabo leather police dog leash from Germany. It is 29 years old. I have left it out in the rain and snow, and loaned it out and got it back and...but I have always treated the leather. It is still in great condition.

I think some may add German or Italian made safety razors. Some are 150 years old and still give close clean smooth shaves.


----------



## SammyH

Limmer Boots are for life. My father is in his late eighties and still hiking in the same pair he bought when he was 25 and hiked all over the world with. They would last several liftetimes more actually, with proper care. The grandson of the guy who fitted my father, about five years ago fitted me. It was quite a day. 

He also has Aldens and AE's that look fabulous and he purchased them in his 30s.

Some things are worthy of several lifetimes....


A superbly made fountain pen. I have antique waterman pens that are from the early 20th century and are still gorgeous and write exceedingly well (they were also used nearly everyday by my grandfather).
A high quality watch. I have an antique Wittnauer (also from my grandfather.)
Good smoking pipes (ditto) and cigarette case (ditto) and pewter flask (ditto)
Good furniture (ditto).
I have many harris tweeds and traddy jackets handed down to me that are 60 years old. Ties too.
Books (nearly two thousand volumes, lol - lovely and surely will last long after I'm gone with the right owner)
Apple computer, iPad, iPhone.....kidding lol :tongue2:


----------



## rwaldron

I recently saw my Great Grandfather's 2 trigger side-by-side break action shotgun. I've fired it at quail before, and though it about destroyed my shoulder and a hunting companion's hearing, it still worked just fine, and I can't for-see it having any problems in the next 100 years of it's life. I wonder If my Remington 870 express will look half as good at 100 years old.


----------



## Fatman

SammyH said:


> Limmer Boots are for life. My father is in his late eighties and still hiking in the same pair he bought when he was 25 and hiked all over the world with. They would last several liftetimes more actually, with proper care. The grandson of the guy who fitted my father, about five years ago fitted me. It was quite a day.
> 
> I'd like a pair of Limmers! Do you recommend the stock, already manufactured, in Germany? The custom made is too expensive, and it is, methinks, a few years wait. I like the buy it for life concept and wonder if you think this applies to the stock boots.


----------



## SammyH

Fatman said:


> SammyH said:
> 
> 
> 
> Limmer Boots are for life. My father is in his late eighties and still hiking in the same pair he bought when he was 25 and hiked all over the world with. They would last several liftetimes more actually, with proper care. The grandson of the guy who fitted my father, about five years ago fitted me. It was quite a day.
> 
> I'd like a pair of Limmers! Do you recommend the stock, already manufactured, in Germany? The custom made is too expensive, and it is, methinks, a few years wait. I like the buy it for life concept and wonder if you think this applies to the stock boots.
> 
> 
> 
> Absolutely my friend. Truly stellar boots; the only difference with the custom is u have some options and fit. Not a huge deal; I really did it so I could be with my Dad and get a photo and all of that. I'd have otherwise been fine with the stock boots. They are a fabulous company to support as well. They wear like iron, as u well know. Cheers!
Click to expand...


----------



## LordSmoke

rwaldron said:


> I just got this in today, and I am fairly certain it will outlast me.
> 
> View attachment 13585


:amazing: Me! Me! Me! The dozen version looks perfect for our occasional bushel-o-oysters weekends - all-you-can-eat raw oyster Saturdays, raw oyster appetizers followed by oysters Rockefeller and grilled oyster Sundays!


----------



## Fatman

SammyH said:


> Fatman said:
> 
> 
> 
> Absolutely my friend. Truly stellar boots; the only difference with the custom is u have some options and fit. Not a huge deal; I really did it so I could be with my Dad and get a photo and all of that. I'd have otherwise been fine with the stock boots. They are a fabulous company to support as well. They wear like iron, as u well know. Cheers!
> 
> 
> 
> interesting anecdote for cold weather clothing: I just came in from a walk with wife and dog, wearing our TEI 4 (not the warmest) Canada Goose parka. Temperature -15 F. This is the Langford, as the Expedition was too warm for Maine. I wore only an undershirt, with hood up, and no hat. Since we were walking, I was comfortable, but if we were only standing around, a Merino wool sweater beneath it would have sufficed.
> For gloves, I had the Canada Goose down gloves. These are made in China, not Canada. I was toasty.
Click to expand...


----------



## SammyH

Fatman said:


> SammyH said:
> 
> 
> 
> Next question: for the "buy it for life" purchase ---is the Lightweight model (brown) as top quality as the "Standard" model?
> 
> 
> 
> I can't speak for that model - I've never seen anyone actually wear them. I've spent a lot of time in the Whites at the huts in winter and fall hiking and count many of the AMC peeps as friends/colleagues; my family has served on the board for many years, etc. And nearly to a person they have the standard model. And love them. And wear them nearly everywhere - they get super comfortable believe it or not. The brown are going to be lighter obviously and I should think not as rugged/durable.
> 
> Having said that, you should know that boots like the Standard Limmer (and Scarpa Rio's, etc.) are not like most boots in that they take a VERY long time to get comfortable for walking long distances in. As long as some boots wear out, lol. But once you've gone through that 6 months/1 year (depending on how much you walk, your weight, etc.) then you have a rugged pair of boots that practically feel like they are your feet, for life.
Click to expand...


----------



## MrAndersonGCC

Fading Fast said:


> All my Stones' albums are buy it for life items - their music does not get old to my ears.


Amen to the vinyls lasting. I just purchased a good used vinyl copy of Elton John's "Captain Fantastic and the Brown Dirt Cowboy". Taking too good care of it for it not to be passed down.

And +1 on the Diesel Merc's. They do indeed last forever.


----------



## Fatman

SammyH said:


> Fatman said:
> 
> 
> 
> I can't speak for that model - I've never seen anyone actually wear them. I've spent a lot of time in the Whites at the huts in winter and fall hiking and count many of the AMC peeps as friends/colleagues; my family has served on the board for many years, etc. And nearly to a person they have the standard model. And love them. And wear them nearly everywhere - they get super comfortable believe it or not. The brown are going to be lighter obviously and I should think not as rugged/durable.
> 
> Having said that, you should know that boots like the Standard Limmer (and Scarpa Rio's, etc.) are not like most boots in that they take a VERY long time to get comfortable for walking long distances in. As long as some boots wear out, lol. But once you've gone through that 6 months/1 year (depending on how much you walk, your weight, etc.) then you have a rugged pair of boots that practically feel like they are your feet, for life.
> 
> 
> 
> I just sent my measurements to the Limmers for their opinion. I hope to land the standards. For a buy it for life purchase, I don't mind 6-12 months break in time period!
> 
> thank you for your response.
Click to expand...


----------



## 32rollandrock

SammyH said:


> Fatman said:
> 
> 
> 
> I can't speak for that model - I've never seen anyone actually wear them. I've spent a lot of time in the Whites at the huts in winter and fall hiking and count many of the AMC peeps as friends/colleagues; my family has served on the board for many years, etc. And nearly to a person they have the standard model. And love them. And wear them nearly everywhere - they get super comfortable believe it or not. The brown are going to be lighter obviously and I should think not as rugged/durable.
> 
> Having said that, you should know that boots like the Standard Limmer (and Scarpa Rio's, etc.) are not like most boots in that they take a VERY long time to get comfortable for walking long distances in. As long as some boots wear out, lol. But once you've gone through that 6 months/1 year (depending on how much you walk, your weight, etc.) then you have a rugged pair of boots that practically feel like they are your feet, for life.
> 
> 
> 
> Had never heard of Limmers previously. Reminds me of my Raichle boots. I can't imagine them ever wearing out; then again, I've barely worn them the last 20 years. Horrifically uncomfortable for the first 75 miles or so of hiking--crying out in pain uncomfortable. Now, utter bliss.
Click to expand...


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## Fatman

The Limmer is impressive, right out of the box. It's a joy to own them. Karl Limmer spent quite a bit of time educating me.


----------



## Duvel

I realized a while ago that records do not wear out, contrary to what the digital revolutionists of the 1980s wanted us to believe. I can pull out a record I bought in 1968 and it still sounds good. Take care of these things by cleaning them and using a good stylus, and they will endure. Every LP in my collection, even the cheesiest record, is a lifetime keeper.

My problem is, I'm not sure who would get my colleciton when I die. My children don't appreciate LPs the way I do. I don't have audiophile friends who are really young and could get a lifetime of enjoyment from them.



Fading Fast said:


> All my Stones' albums are buy it for life items - their music does not get old to my ears.


----------



## Fatman

Duvel said:


> I realized a while ago that records do not wear out, contrary to what the digital revolutionists of the 1980s wanted us to believe. I can pull out a record I bought in 1968 and it still sounds good. Take care of these things by cleaning them and using a good stylus, and they will endure. Every LP in my collection, even the cheesiest record, is a lifetime keeper.
> 
> My problem is, I'm not sure who would get my colleciton when I die. My children don't appreciate LPs the way I do. I don't have audiophile friends who are really young and could get a lifetime of enjoyment from them.


I, too, remember being told in the 80's that the "new format" will last forever, as my records would degrade.

Give your kids time, plus, when you are gone, they might cherish the LPs, as they cherish their memories of you.

Here is a touching thread along the same line: https://askandyaboutclothes.com/com...-on-the-inheritance-of-style&highlight=limmer


----------



## Duvel

Heh heh. Debatable. But a thought.

It's interesting to me that I have more trouble with my CDs than my LPs. A good many of them "skip" or are outright unplayable, and I take good care of these, too, and play them on an excellent player.

I'm also fanatical about my LP covers, by the way. I use the polyvinyl sleeves on each and every one. The only covers that look a bit worn are the very earliest ones I bought as a young kid when I didn't use these. But these cover sleeves ensure against virtually any kind of wear or damage to the cover.



Fatman said:


> I, too, remember being told in the 80's that the "new format" will last forever, as my records would degrade.
> 
> Give your kids time, plus, *when you are gone, they might cherish the LPs, as they cherish their memories of you.*


----------



## Fatman

Update on Limmer boots...

I may have received a defective boot; with just 15 minutes in the snow, the leather has blackened in spots. I will have the local cobbler take a look.


----------



## SammyH

Fatman said:


> Update on Limmer boots...
> 
> These are great boots.


So great to hear that you are pleased. I wore mine to Mass the other day (with Harris Tweed, lambswool trousers, bow tie, OCBD, etc.) Many years from now they will be a thing of such beauty. And all the memories of starting your own business in them will be somehow part of them.


----------



## GKae

I'm fascinated by this topic. A lot of useful pointers in this thread. I hope it's not terribly wrong if I mention that I created a blog for the very purpose of gathering all the items that are known to be very durable, called - all criticism and suggestion welcome. It's still fresh and a little rough around the edges, but I'll be adding more content soon.


----------



## Duvel

And your first post here is in this thread. I constantly marvel at life's coincidences.


----------



## ThatDudeOrion

Duvel said:


> And your first post here is in this thread. I constantly marvel at life's coincidences.


I really enjoy all of your posts D, but this may be your best work yet.


----------



## Fading Fast

ThatDudeOrion said:


> I really enjoy all of your posts D, but this may be your best work yet.


+1 great catch. And, yes, bigger picture, Duvel is one of the members whose posts I particularly enjoy.


----------



## Chi

Duvel said:


> I realized a while ago that records do not wear out, contrary to what the digital revolutionists of the 1980s wanted us to believe. I can pull out a record I bought in 1968 and it still sounds good. Take care of these things by cleaning them and using a good stylus, and they will endure. Every LP in my collection, even the cheesiest record, is a lifetime keeper.
> 
> My problem is, I'm not sure who would get my colleciton when I die. My children don't appreciate LPs the way I do. I don't have audiophile friends who are really young and could get a lifetime of enjoyment from them.


Possibly donate the albums to a library?


----------



## SammyH

@Duvel, it wouldn't be hard to find a genuine audiophile who would love to have them; yeah, make sure they get in the right hands.


----------



## Duvel

The owner of a record store that has been around for decades in my hometown is a pretty good acquaintance. My age, too. I may pick his brain about this the next time we get together.


----------



## Fatman

SammyH said:


> So great to hear that you are pleased. I wore mine to Mass the other day (with Harris Tweed, lambswool trousers, bow tie, OCBD, etc.) Many years from now they will be a thing of such beauty. And all the memories of starting your own business in them will be somehow part of them.


Can you tell me: what model you have, and how they look now?

The reason: I wore them out in the snow storm and 15 minutes in the snow left one boot with what I thought was a deep water stain (not the other).I emailed them photo. They said that it appears that the varnish came off (it is just black underneath the beautiful brown) and that their customers don't care about looks, and eventually, they will be "all black" in color.

I recognize that mountain climbers likely do not care for looks, but as a member here, as you can guess, I do. I think they looked great with blue jeans and a nice sweater. Since Limmer won't do anything, I will see the local cobbler to see if he can dye it back to the original, so they match. They are beautiful, and rich, thick leather, and LImmer said that they will basically turn all black over time.

Yet, I plan on treating them as I do all other fine leather products: I do use LImmer boot grease, and though they say not to use wax to stop the breathing process, I will use a light coat nicely buffed, to protect the leather from the rain. I then clean the leather (shoes, boots, etc) and use conditioner on all my leather. I've had some leather last 30 years this way, and I have never "choked" leather overdoing it with wax. The wax does not last long, as it is very thin, and I don't want the leather breathing process to stop, but I do, very much, like the appearance of my boots to stay as nice as I can keep them, even if I do some real hiking.

Am I "off" in this manner? These are the mid weight dark browns, and I know the Limmer grease will darken, but I have used their grease on other leather, and it darkened beautifully, but not this black, down to the basic leather look that one boot has. I told them that I believed it was a manufacturing defect from Germany but to no avail.

my wife would like the Lightweights and pictures of some of them that are more than 3 years old (even the beat up ones) still show the two-tone brown color. She will use them trail hiking, but also to hockey games, and so on. I will keep them nice looking for her!

Do most cobblers do leather dying, or is this an at home project? Youtube has some good video on it, but I feel more comfortable going to a pro, when one can be found.

if they should just look black, old and beat up, although disappointed in appearance, the quality of the boot, one piece leather, Norwegian process sole...remains tops.

Perhaps it is my expectation that needs to be corrected.


----------



## SammyH

Sorry to hear about your troubles; I cannot vouch for the mid or light weights. I've never even seen them. 

As far as customer service, yes these guys are not LLBEAN; most of their customers I'm sure wouldn't really care, unless it was a genuine defect in the leather. I'm sure they will stand behind the durability of their boots (I've never known anyone to have a problem), but as for looks I am not sure. If it's a genuine defect in the leather/process I would definitely pursue it. 

I own the Limmer Standards. They started out black and they are black now. They are quite worn in, beautifully so. I've replaced the soles once. Once they get to a certain "worn look" they sort of stabilize, if you know what I mean. Meaning my fathers very, very old ones look more or less like mine. 

I hope you can get them back to the color you wanted them to be; or you can get them to replace them if the leather is actually defective. Leather of course does change color; especially when it gets wet.


----------



## Fatman

Thanks, Sammy. I edited my post. It was a negative experience but perhaps it was just a bad week for them. Perhaps the next interaction will be better. 
I do not want to scare off potential customers either. I do hope things get straightened out and the business is passed to the next generation. I have doubt. 

If the cobbler dyes them to looking the same color; great. If not, I will just limit their use to hiking and so on. If only they were not so darn handsome looking!


----------



## my19

Duvel said:


> The owner of a record store that has been around for decades in my hometown is a pretty good acquaintance. My age, too. I may pick his brain about this the next time we get together.


Please post his thoughts. I have a couple thousand LPs, 45s and 78s, but neither my wife nor my daughter would have any interest in these. I wouldn't even want to stick them with hauling the records off to Half Price Books for whatever meager amount they might bring.


----------



## Duvel

I would be glad to. Better yet, just send me your collection, now, and I'll just lump them into my donation when the time comes, wherever they end up going.



my19 said:


> Please post his thoughts. I have a couple thousand LPs, 45s and 78s, but neither my wife nor my daughter would have any interest in these. I wouldn't even want to stick them with hauling the records off to Half Price Books for whatever meager amount they might bring.


----------



## SammyH

I bet there are forums where audiophile/LP enthusiasts congregate. I can't imagine it would be hard to find a very serious collector who would know how to take care of them and pass them on.


----------



## 32rollandrock

The issue is, no two people have the same taste. Just because you like records doesn't mean you'll like Jack's records or Jill's records--there is no one in this world who values the collection as much as you do because it is a reflection of you and nobody else. And so the collection should die when you do. When the time comes, which is to say when you are no longer physically able to play them, have the collection sold in one piece and have the proceeds donated to your favorite charity. Or give the money to your heirs.


----------



## Duvel

Nice suggestion, 32. Very true--my collection is personal, in many ways.


----------



## my19

Duvel said:


> I would be glad to. Better yet, just send me your collection, now, and I'll just lump them into my donation when the time comes, wherever they end up going.


Sorry, I like listening to them too darn much. But I do have a few I could part with -- like the three pristine copies of 'Purple Rain,' complete with poster, that I somehow managed to acquire.


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## Duvel

Funny how we acquire those things, isn't it. I "somehow" have three complete original Apple pressings of the white album, numbered and everything, and three other miscellaneous copies. The Natural Beauty still often asks why I need "those duplicates." She doesn't understand my explanation that they're not really duplicates.



my19 said:


> Sorry, I like listening to them too darn much. But I do have a few I could part with -- like the three pristine copies of 'Purple Rain,' complete with poster, that I somehow managed to acquire.


----------



## my19

Duvel said:


> Funny how we acquire those things, isn't it. I "somehow" have three complete original Apple pressings of the white album, numbered and everything, and three other miscellaneous copies. The Natural Beauty still often asks why I need "those duplicates." She doesn't understand my explanation that they're not really duplicates.


I just say, 'It's an addiction." It works with shoes, too.


----------



## Duvel

That works? I say, "It's a serious undertaking. I am an archivist of popular culture."

That doesn't work either, but it elicits a laugh. Occasionally.



my19 said:


> I just say, 'It's an addiction." It works with shoes, too.


----------



## sskim3

I think I found a buy it for life item for myself. It is a vintage gillete fat adjustable DE razor. now i just need to find one in an acceptable price range.


----------



## 32rollandrock

sskim3 said:


> I think I found a buy it for life item for myself. It is a vintage gillete fat adjustable DE razor. now i just need to find one in an acceptable price range.


OK, this is one I've never understood. I know there are razor freaks (and I use that term with all respect), but I've never grasped why folks spend what they do on razors and accompanying shaving kits. I suppose I should get myself to an upscale barber one of these days and see for myself what all the fuss is about.


----------



## Shaver

32rollandrock said:


> OK, this is one I've never understood. I know there are razor freaks (and I use that term with all respect), but I've never grasped why folks spend what they do on razors and accompanying shaving kits. I suppose I should get myself to an upscale barber one of these days and see for myself what all the fuss is about.


My friend I imagine that, even with my 'pricey' shaving equipment, over the course of my life I have actually spent less dollars than you will have on the art of the shave. The ongoing cost of my shaving is (approximately) a mere £29 per year.


----------



## Duvel

I believe in a good shave, and while I haven't upgraded to Shaver's level, I do see the value in it. A few years back I switched from the multiblade supermarket razor to a simple double edge, and, along with that, started using a simple shaving brush and a bowl with shaving soap. It is a much more enjoyable experience, and the shave is better, closer, more comfortable.


----------



## 32rollandrock

Shaver said:


> My friend I imagine that, even with my 'pricey' shaving equipment, over the course of my life I have actually spent less dollars than you will have on the art of the shave. The ongoing cost of my shaving is (approximately) a mere £29 per year.


Money isn't everything, of course, and you haven't seen my beard lately. I'm guess, though, that I spend less than you, although I wouldn't call my morning ritual art of any sort. I've never added it up, but if I spent $50 a year, I'd be surprised. Same way with soap and shampoo and pretty much every other toiletry item. I get the cheapest possible so that I don't smell bad and invest the savings in whisky.


----------



## Shaver

32rollandrock said:


> Money isn't everything, of course, and you haven't seen my beard lately. I'm guess, though, that I spend less than you, although I wouldn't call my morning ritual art of any sort. I've never added it up, but if I spent $50 a year, I'd be surprised. Same way with soap and shampoo and pretty much every other toiletry item. I get the cheapest possible so that I don't smell bad and invest the savings in whisky.


In England a certain strata of society (homeless beggars) adhere to a very similar credo as the one you have outlined above, with the notable exception that they substitute cider for whisky.

:devil:


----------



## 32rollandrock

Shaver said:


> In England a certain strata of society (homeless beggars) adhere to a very similar credo as the one you have outlined above, with the notable exception that they substitute cider for whisky.
> 
> :devil:


Over here we call it Olde English 800. It will deliver a HFL (hangover for life).


----------



## Shaver

32rollandrock said:


> Over here we call it Olde English 800. It will deliver a HFL (hangover for life).


"On the Isle in the Vette, bumping Seven Duece,
See that top on that 40, you know it's coming loose"


----------



## sskim3

Duvel said:


> I believe in a good shave, and while I haven't upgraded to Shaver's level, I do see the value in it. A few years back I switched from the multiblade supermarket razor to a simple double edge, and, along with that, started using a simple shaving brush and a bowl with shaving soap. It is a much more enjoyable experience, and the shave is better, closer, more comfortable.


My investment has been pretty nominal and it is under $40 for my initial set up with razor, soap, mug, witch hazel, after shave. And it has given me better shaves. It pales in comparison to the amount of money we spend on socks, ties, belts, cufflinks. And this is something that I use everyday with more frequency. So why not spend the extra dollars to "pamper yourself"? We can all shop at JC Penney and Target instead of Brooks Brothers, Alden's, Orvis, etc., but we don't. I am looking at DE shaving the same way we look at clothing. Invest a little bit more to get better value and utility.

Plus, I hated shaving since it was more like a chore. DE shaving makes it a more enjoyable experience. More thought goes into it and I like that.


----------



## my19

Duvel said:


> That works? I say, "It's a serious undertaking. I am an archivist of popular culture."
> 
> That doesn't work either, but it elicits a laugh. Occasionally.


My wife and daughter have given up on me. They realize that when I get interested in something, I'm already gone. There's no reeling me back.

On the plus side, during one of my estate sale record searches, I found a very clean 1S-1S-1S-1S RCA Living Stereo pressing of Ansermet's Royal Ballet Gala. I paid $4 for it. Good copies, and this is a nice one, go for $1,500-$2,000 on eBay. So that won me some points.


----------



## Duvel

Geeze!

Not long ago, I started getting obsessive about issue numbers and such, including the production numbers scratched in the runout space etc. I forced myself back from that edge after buying my fifth copy of AJA. One can easily go down the rabbit hole...



my19 said:


> My wife and daughter have given up on me. They realize that when I get interested in something, I'm already gone. There's no reeling me back.
> 
> On the plus side, during one of my estate sale record searches, I found a very clean 1S-1S-1S-1S RCA Living Stereo pressing of Ansermet's Royal Ballet Gala. I paid $4 for it. Good copies, and this is a nice one, go for $1,500-$2,000 on eBay. So that won me some points.


----------



## Shaver

my19 said:


> My wife and daughter have given up on me. They realize that when I get interested in something, I'm already gone. There's no reeling me back.
> 
> On the plus side, during one of my estate sale record searches, I found a very clean 1S-1S-1S-1S RCA Living Stereo pressing of Ansermet's Royal Ballet Gala. I paid $4 for it. Good copies, and this is a nice one, go for $1,500-$2,000 on eBay. So that won me some points.


Those old 'Living Stereo' releases really are quite fine. The Opera recordings I have which utilised this technique are shimmering delights.


----------



## 32rollandrock

my19 said:


> My wife and daughter have given up on me. They realize that when I get interested in something, I'm already gone. There's no reeling me back.
> 
> On the plus side, during one of my estate sale record searches, I found a very clean 1S-1S-1S-1S RCA Living Stereo pressing of Ansermet's Royal Ballet Gala. I paid $4 for it. Good copies, and this is a nice one, go for $1,500-$2,000 on eBay. So that won me some points.


I try not to look up the worth of my records. If I did, I might be tempted to sell them. But I would never do that.


----------



## 32rollandrock

Shaver said:


> "On the Isle in the Vette, bumping Seven Duece,
> See that top on that 40, you know it's coming loose"


Bravo.


----------



## Fatman

with red laces added. I'd like to see if these one week old Limmers can be made to look nice again! The alternative is to let them be beaten to all black color. I don't know if dye is the answer, as the usual techniques of water stain removal have not worked and the company thinks it is the plain leather showing. Advice on my "lifetime" hiking boot purchase?


----------



## my19

32rollandrock said:


> I try not to look up the worth of my records. If I did, I might be tempted to sell them. But I would never do that.


I confess that I bought the Royal Ballet Gala mostly because I love the look of the RCA Soria series, with the slip-case cover and the bound-book look.

It was only when I showed it to a far more savvy friend that I learned it was actually worth more than the $4 I paid for it. The music is beautiful, though, and the sound, thanks to the Decca crew in London, is superb.


----------



## Duvel

I learned that lesson a long time ago. Way back when, college days, I think, I brought a few records in to trade at a record store. The guy thumbed through them, pulled a 20 from the drawer, and as soon as the cash was in my hands, he ran--I kid you not--to his office in the back of the store, where I heard him exclaiming over the phone to someone, "You are NOT going to believe what some kid just gave me!"I felt sick.



32rollandrock said:


> I try not to look up the worth of my records. If I did, I might be tempted to sell them. But I would never do that.


----------



## SammyH

Fatman said:


> with red laces added. I'd like to see if these one week old Limmers can be made to look nice again! The alternative is to let them be beaten to all black color. I don't know if dye is the answer, as the usual techniques of water stain removal have not worked and the company thinks it is the plain leather showing. Advice on my "lifetime" hiking boot purchase?


While I haven't looked at this leather closely, it seems to me that the leather will darken naturally on brown-dyed leather like that. What looks terrible to you looks like a lovely patina to me.

I had a couch made last year out of untreated leather - it's gorgeous and has all kinds of marks on it. Why? Because its not half-plastic; it's a natural product that changes over time and reflects use; that's the beauty of the thing. Most "leather" couches are mostly plastic. And they kind of always look the same, sort of like stainless steel, which I despise as a kind of evil metal.

I say enjoy them and don't worry so much about them looking like when you purchased them. You may find that once you don't mind that they are changing that they take on a kind of beauty you hadn't planned for, which is the nature of beauty anyway. Many of the best things that will happen to you - and have happened to you - you could never have planned. Don't try to control things too much; that way lies misery.


----------



## Captain America

Duvel said:


> I believe in a good shave, and while I haven't upgraded to Shaver's level, I do see the value in it. A few years back I switched from the multiblade supermarket razor to a simple double edge, and, along with that, started using a simple shaving brush and a bowl with shaving soap. It is a much more enjoyable experience, and the shave is better, closer, more comfortable.


This is pretty much my deal. I started because of the great concern about landfills and the amount of trash, etc., and got off the canned shaving cream. Got a mug and some shaving soap. And a brush from Walgreens. I ran into a bag of old bar shaving cream at a garage sale, bought it for a dollar or something, and that lasted me a very good long while. . . when I ran out, I learned that just the regular bar shaving cream was FANTASTIC STUFF; from Amazon.

I went through a number of cheap Walgreens brushes, with bristles regularly falling out, then made the Great Discovery of Tweezerman brushes at amazon. These are the same price, but fabulous. The razor I use is the cheapo Wal Mart stuff.

This all works very well for me.


----------



## SammyH

Captain America said:


> This is pretty much my deal. I started because of the great concern about landfills and the amount of trash, etc., and got off the canned shaving cream. Got a mug and some shaving soap. And a brush from Walgreens. I ran into a bag of old bar shaving cream at a garage sale, bought it for a dollar or something, and that lasted me a very good long while. . . when I ran out, I learned that just the regular bar shaving cream was FANTASTIC STUFF; from Amazon.
> 
> I went through a number of cheap Walgreens brushes, with bristles regularly falling out, then made the Great Discovery of Tweezerman brushes at amazon. These are the same price, but fabulous. The razor I use is the cheapo Wal Mart stuff.
> 
> This all works very well for me.


It's my experience that unless you hang a brush upside down that even a high quality badger brush will eventually come apart.

I have two "Aristocratic Safety Razors" like this from my grandfather:









The take some practice but there's really no comparison to the plastic/moving/power/8-blade thingies. I have a few straight razors too - haven't used them and probably never will.


----------



## Duvel

My wife has a very small business selling natural soaps that she makes. This means I have an abundance of free shaving soap in whatever flavor I choose (although I do subsidize the production, essentially, so it's not totally free--but there is always soap in our house!).


----------



## sskim3

Duvel said:


> My wife has a very small business selling natural soaps that she makes. This means I have an abundance of free shaving soap in whatever flavor I choose (although I do subsidize the production, essentially, so it's not totally free--but there is always soap in our house!).


NICE! That is awesome! And you can directly request her to make scents too! Definitely cool stuff.


----------



## Duvel

Favorites: Bay Rum, and Cherry Almond. I'll never grow a beard, because I like shaving with this soap so much.


----------



## Fatman

Buy it for Life Limmer purchase update...

the blackened area continues to spread and after a half hour walking outside yesterday, it is on the other boot as well. It appears that the dye was not appropriated correctly to the leather. After no call backs, nor email responses from Limmer, I sought a local cobbler who said it was factory defect and dying entire shoes is expensive and messy. When Limmer finally got back to me, he was not honest. I think the stock business may be shutting down. My wife attempted to place an order for their Lightweights. He said he would "call back next week when he has time to review her tracings." No call back. The custom boot business/repair shop is now a completely separate business from the stock boot sales. The stock boots are made by Meindl, in Germany, so I will see if there is something that they can do for me. They have nice boots and they sell the exact same models with "Meindl" across the top, rather than Limmer. From talking to the Limmer Custom shop, there is tension between the two businesses. 
Its sad. I spent quite a lot ($360) and they look awful, like light brown with large black splotches. Custom shop had me try a few things to see if it was a water stain, but it isn't. It is the black leather coming through. Since they won't back them, nor take them back, I am out the money. 
I've read so many good things about their customer service (comments on hiking blogs run 9:1 in favor), but most of these are from about a decade ago. 
Caveat emptor.


----------



## SammyH

Fatman said:


> Buy it for Life Limmer purchase update...
> 
> the blackened area continues to spread and after a half hour walking outside yesterday, it is on the other boot as well. It appears that the dye was not appropriated correctly to the leather. After no call backs, nor email responses from Limmer, I sought a local cobbler who said it was factory defect and dying entire shoes is expensive and messy. When Limmer finally got back to me, he was not honest. I think the stock business may be shutting down. My wife attempted to place an order for their Lightweights. He said he would "call back next week when he has time to review her tracings." No call back. The custom boot business/repair shop is now a completely separate business from the stock boot sales. The stock boots are made by Meindl, in Germany, so I will see if there is something that they can do for me. They have nice boots and they sell the exact same models with "Meindl" across the top, rather than Limmer. From talking to the Limmer Custom shop, there is tension between the two businesses.
> Its sad. I spent quite a lot ($360) and they look awful, like light brown with large black splotches. Custom shop had me try a few things to see if it was a water stain, but it isn't. It is the black leather coming through. Since they won't back them, nor take them back, I am out the money.
> I've read so many good things about their customer service (comments on hiking blogs run 9:1 in favor), but most of these are from about a decade ago.
> Caveat emptor.


Very sorry about your experience; I've also never purchased anything stock from them, much less the brown mid-weights, so it's true that may be a very different thing.

If the actual performance of the boot is effected, and/or it's a real defect, they really ought to replace them or return your money. If they won't, I'd consider calling them up and asking them if avoiding you and not making good on their products is really worth risking their reputation in what is after all a very small world; and that even a single BBB filing, bad yelp review, etc. can really effect their business significantly. I've approached it that way before - calmly and even with notes of concern in one's voice - and have gotten a very quick response to my problem. He's probably just hoping you'll go away. Once he realizes you won't, I imagine he'll do something.

Anyway, sorry for the bum steer!


----------



## Fatman

Sammy, it wasn't your steering. They have had a sterling reputation for years. I probably should have made the trip and had them custom. The maker, Meindl, actually sells the same model, in dark brown, that is gorgeous. 
The local cobbler recommended that I use "Bear Boot Grease" in black, as this will, at least, give them a uniformed appearance. It is bees wax mixed with bear fat (oil) which is made near where I live and has been used on leather goods for a long time. It comes in black, brown and neutral and he advised to use black. I will give it a try.

I do think the stock business, now separate from custom and repair, is going out of business. Someone else recently posted that he went to purchase the standards and was told they "might not be in for 3 months." 
Buying Meindl, which has a great reputation in Europe that I've read, is a bit tricky here in the US. Cabelas only carries a few models, so ordering from Germany or the UK means about $40 shipping and making sure the size is correct. There's lots of threads here about buying shoes overseas and I know my size in Church and Robinsons but will have to see how the sizing goes from Cabelas Meindl before ordering directly from Germany.

We live and learn, and hopefully, learn so more!

Cheers!

update: after posting, and sending Limmer the professional's opinion on defective, he called and said to return them. He is so certain that it is "normal" wear (15 minutes outside??) that he said an exchange would do the same thing. I'm grateful for the return and don't mind sans shipping cost.

In further research, there has been similar reports with one type of famous LL Bean hiking boot that was made in Italy but no longer. In short order, some of the leather used wore down to the bare leather in weeks. I do think that companies in the US struggle to oversee the quality of the factories in China, as the factory managers are always trying to out-do each other with cutting costs. Reports of "down" mixed with dog hair, newspapers, and other such products have caused more caution. I think mixing cheap leather with better leathers in "corrected" fashion, itself, could produce nasty competition and cutting costs and harming overall quality.

LL Bean's struggle? Here is their statement: _ "We aggressively investigate reports of code violations and require factories to make all changes necessary to achieve compliance with our code. A course of action is identified for any noncompliance concerns. Although monitoring hundreds of factories worldwide is an ongoing challenge, L.L.Bean has an effective program that has made a meaningful contribution to improving global sourcing practices."_

I also learned that Meindl has the direct opposite advice on treating leather. They insist that leather should be treated and protected before the first wearing outside, while Limmer insists to wait several weeks to let the varnish wear off and then use their grease. I like to use light wax while conditioning for breathing, especially in bad weather, on my good leather shoes. 
I also was able to see lots of pictures of the Limmers online that were well used and broken in. They did not look like mine. In fact, just before I sent them, I wore them again (not knowing he was accepting the return) and black appeared on the newly forming crease. The cobbler, 2nd generation, and his mother (1st) said that they had never seen anything like this. 
I offered to send them, and additional money, for exchange (because I wore them outside) but they turned me down. 
Kudos, however, to Limmer for taking the return, no matter what it took to get them to change their mind.


----------



## ROI

Though I didn't anticipate at the time I bought them that they would mature into a BIFL, I have a pair of standard color-8 Alden LHS pennies that I bought at Mark Shale (RIP) in Chicago in 1984 that I still wear at least once every couple weeks. Considering that I just turned 60, it seems likely they'll be the only pair I'll ever need.


----------



## Fatman

Last thoughts on BIFL and Kent Clothing Brush.

I have always enjoyed getting something new, taking care of it, and keeping it for a very long time, and I have reached an age where a good product, newly purchased, may be for life. 

I enjoy treating leather and the "best friend sweater" that goes on and on each winter, and so forth. 

I have found that the simple daily application of Kent clothing brush has made an impact in not only how clothing appears, but, as time marches on, how certain items are holding up. 

Today I wear an old sweater that due to the application of Kent brush, looks, not new, but in very nice condition. If winter decides to end, I will put it away for next year, but the brushing of clothing (learned here in the forum) has made an impact on appearance and longevity (at least the last few years) much like leather preservative has allowed me to own a "Frabo polizi leather leash" for more than 26 years, in spite of being left out in the rain, lost, recovered, and so forth, (and daily use). 

If you have not found what a good clothing brush can do for you, you're missing something special. Learning how skin cells and dust, invisible to the eye (my eyes, especially) deteriorates fabric, has taught me to make brushing a daily ritual. 

Give it a try. The Kent brushes, I believe, are still made in the UK and are of sound quality.


----------



## Shaver

^Wise words. 

It takes me much longer of an evening to disrobe than it does to get dressed in a morning, for each woollen item removed is thoroughly brushed before being hung up or put away.


----------



## Fatman

Tilton said:


> Well, I also wouldn't consider any pair of shoes BIFL. Being 25, I do not see myself buying a pair of shoes and having them last 60 years. If I were 60 it would be another story. Perspective plays a large role here, but I see the general rule of thumb being if a product will outlive the owner without a significant investment in maintenance, it is BIFL, but if you have to reinvest anywhere near the purchase price back into the product just to keep it working, you're fighting a losing battle. Just be happy with owning nice things and don't worry so much about longevity.


I wonder.

Let's say at age 25 you build up a shoe collection that, by age 30, means 5 pair of "work shoes", that is, those you wear to work. 
Assuming that they are all high quality leather (Alden, Church, and so on...) and:

1. Rotated
2. Treated, cleaned, polished, repeat

Might they last you for your entire work career? Perhaps even with a re-soling?

Perhaps others can weigh in on this, who have had such experience. I recall my father's shoes (he built up quite a collection beginning in 1938, and then after he returned from the war, 1945, and rotated them, and taught his kids (including himself) to use his old "shoe shine" kit. These were in great shape when he retired and went to his oldest son.


----------



## Fatman

Shaver said:


> ^Wise words.
> 
> It takes me much longer of an evening to disrobe than it does to get dressed in a morning, for each woollen item removed is thoroughly brushed before being hung up or put away.


Shaver, any very old items of wool, in particular, that has lasted you many years?

By the way, I did try, with great effort, to emulate your winter outdoor clothing, especially with wool. While at a concert last winter, in a photo shoot, the star gently grabbed my wool coat collar and said, "nice coat!" 
But this year was one in which I was out in -20F below and had to go to down! When things moderate a bit, I will return to the wool and scarf. 

Any cashmere last longer than expected with brushing?


----------



## 32rollandrock

Fatman said:


> I wonder.
> 
> Let's say at age 25 you build up a shoe collection that, by age 30, means 5 pair of "work shoes", that is, those you wear to work.
> Assuming that they are all high quality leather (Alden, Church, and so on...) and:
> 
> 1. Rotated
> 2. Treated, cleaned, polished, repeat
> 
> Might they last you for your entire work career? Perhaps even with a re-soling?
> 
> Perhaps others can weigh in on this, who have had such experience. I recall my father's shoes (he built up quite a collection beginning in 1938, and then after he returned from the war, 1945, and rotated them, and taught his kids (including himself) to use his old "shoe shine" kit. These were in great shape when he retired and went to his oldest son.


Used shoes? Ick.


----------



## Tilton

Fatman said:


> I wonder.
> 
> Let's say at age 25 you build up a shoe collection that, by age 30, means 5 pair of "work shoes", that is, those you wear to work.
> Assuming that they are all high quality leather (Alden, Church, and so on...) and:
> 
> 1. Rotated
> 2. Treated, cleaned, polished, repeat
> 
> Might they last you for your entire work career? Perhaps even with a re-soling?
> 
> Perhaps others can weigh in on this, who have had such experience. I recall my father's shoes (he built up quite a collection beginning in 1938, and then after he returned from the war, 1945, and rotated them, and taught his kids (including himself) to use his old "shoe shine" kit. These were in great shape when he retired and went to his oldest son.


Well, sure, with a deep enough bench, anything can become BIFL, but I don't think that's the point here.


----------



## Anon 18th Cent.

my19 said:


> My wife and daughter have given up on me. They realize that when I get interested in something, I'm already gone. There's no reeling me back.
> 
> On the plus side, during one of my estate sale record searches, I found a very clean 1S-1S-1S-1S RCA Living Stereo pressing of Ansermet's Royal Ballet Gala. I paid $4 for it. Good copies, and this is a nice one, go for $1,500-$2,000 on eBay. So that won me some points.


Proud of taking advantage of an uninformed seller, eh? Was it a little old lady?

If only the shoe could be on the other foot.


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## my19

Edwin Ek said:


> Proud of taking advantage of an uninformed seller, eh? Was it a little old lady?
> 
> If only the shoe could be on the other foot.


It was more a case of an uniformed but very lucky buyer. I bought it for the cool slip-case, so I could add it to the four or five other Soria sets I have. No clue of value -- I don't think I'd ever seen a Soria that cost more than 10 bucks.

There were thousands of records available at this estate sale, each marked $2 per record, mostly opera. Someone was a serious collector, and I suspect his/her kids just wanted to clear 'em out.


----------



## 32rollandrock

my19 said:


> It was more a case of an uniformed but very lucky buyer. I bought it for the cool slip-case, so I could add it to the four or five other Soria sets I have. No clue of value -- I don't think I'd ever seen a Soria that cost more than 10 bucks.
> 
> There were thousands of records available at this estate sale, each marked $2 per record, mostly opera. Someone was a serious collector, and I suspect his/her kids just wanted to clear 'em out.


You have nothing to apologize for in my book. Sellers of anything--books, records, clothing, cars--have to take some responsibility to be informed when setting a price. The vehicle I drive now was purchased for $1,500-$2,000 below its worth. I do not know why it was offered at such a low price, nor did I point out the vehicle's worth to the seller. Indeed, I haggled $200 off the already inexplicably low asking price. I did drive more than 50 miles to see it, so I invested gas money and time with no guarantees, and I was rewarded. It could easily have been a wasted trip. When I find shell cordovan shoes at Goodwill for $4, I do not take them up to the counter and tell them that they could sell them for $150 on eBay, as I plan to do.

Sometimes, you just get lucky, as you did with this record. Other times, you know full well that you are getting something that's worth a lot for practically nothing. You know that because you spent time and brain cells and often money acquiring knowledge, which never comes free. You also took the time to go to the estate sale in the first place. This is what capitalism is all about. Those who do their research and prepare and take a bit of time and trouble finish ahead of those who do not. It's the American way.

If it were me, I would go back to that estate sale and buy up every record that's left. Sounds like the sort of thing where they'd be happy to take $200 or so.

Conversely, I just paid $80 for a near-mint MoFi copy of Aqualung. It was a fair price, but more, by far, than I had ever previously paid for a record, and there was haggling involved. The seller is getting rid of his father's record collection, and he has taken the time to learn what each one is worth. It is not an insignificant amount of time. Then again, it is not an insignificant amount of money.


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## RogerP

A few odds and ends:

It's already a good deal oder than I am, and in better shape. :redface: I expect that it will easily last me the rest of my days:



I'd expect the same of most of the quality boots that I own, but this pair from Edward Green look and feel very close to indestructible:



The first knife I ever made will undoubtedly last a lifetime:



It's everything I could want in a road bike. I don't see myself needing another.



My favorite cufflinks in lovely lapis, sterling and gold. God forbid I should ever lose these.


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## 32rollandrock

^^

Careful what you say about road bikes. I would have sworn the exact same thing about my circa 1980 Colnago. In some areas, technology really does have a way of subsuming stuff we thought would be state-of-the-art forever. That knife is utterly groovy.


----------



## RogerP

32rollandrock said:


> ^^
> 
> Careful what you say about road bikes. I would have sworn the exact same thing about my circa 1980 Colnago. In some areas, technology really does have a way of subsuming stuff we thought would be state-of-the-art forever. That knife is utterly groovy.


Cheers. I was really impressed with how well the knife performed the first time I had the opportunity to put it to its intended use. Dressed out two does and it was still good to go.

On the bikes, I get the whole n +1 thing. I'm that way with shoes, but not with bikes. And thank heavens. :biggrin: It's quite unlikely that my abilities will ever exceed that of the bike. And while every year will bring something shinier and even better to the market, I expect I'll remain content. I took the same approach with golf clubs once I realized I was pretty hooked on the game - buy a really good set, then just play and ignore all the marketing hype trying to convince you that you need to upgrade every year. There are almost certainly better clubs out there than my 10 year old Pings - but none that would make me enjoy the game any more or play any better. If I were riding - or golfing -competitively, I might have a different view.


----------



## 32rollandrock

RogerP said:


> Cheers. I was really impressed with how well the knife performed the first time I had the opportunity to put it to its intended use. Dressed out two does and it was still good to go.
> 
> On the bikes, I get the whole n +1 thing. I'm that way with shoes, but not with bikes. And thank heavens. :biggrin: It's quite unlikely that my abilities will ever exceed that of the bike. And while every year will bring something shinier and even better to the market, I expect I'll remain content. I took the same approach with golf clubs once I realized I was pretty hooked on the game - buy a really good set, then just play and ignore all the marketing hype trying to convince you that you need to upgrade every year. There are almost certainly better clubs out there than my 10 year old Pings - but none that would make me enjoy the game any more or play any better. If I were riding - or golfing -competitively, I might have a different view.


When the five-pound bicycle hits the market, you will feel differently.


----------



## Fatman

32rollandrock said:


> ^^
> 
> Careful what you say about road bikes. I would have sworn the exact same thing about my circa 1980 Colnago. In some areas, technology really does have a way of subsuming stuff we thought would be state-of-the-art forever. That knife is utterly groovy.


1980 Colnago steel?

"Steel is real" and bike enthusiasts drool over a Colnago that is "aged and beautiful" if in good shape!

Can you post a picture?

I've always wanted one.


----------



## RogerP

32rollandrock said:


> When the five-pound bicycle hits the market, you will feel differently.


Not really. I'm still going to weigh the same. And trust me, the bike's weight is small potatoes in comparison. :redface:


----------



## Himself

32rollandrock said:


> I try not to look up the worth of my records. If I did, I might be tempted to sell them. But I would never do that.


Mine are in a friend's garage, 2500 miles away. I'd gladly digitize the lot and take the cash. Over the years I hadn't thought about it much, and increasingly have felt physical goods to be an encumbrance.

I like trad/Ivy dress because it's so simple and versatile, good for a minimalist.


----------



## 32rollandrock

Fatman said:


> 1980 Colnago steel?
> 
> "Steel is real" and bike enthusiasts drool over a Colnago that is "aged and beautiful" if in good shape!
> 
> Can you post a picture?
> 
> I've always wanted one.


Your wish is my command. Please forgive the cluster. I need to get a corncob. And yes, it is full Campy.


----------



## 32rollandrock

Himself said:


> Mine are in a friend's garage, 2500 miles away. I'd gladly digitize the lot and take the cash. Over the years I hadn't thought about it much, and increasingly have felt physical goods to be an encumbrance.
> 
> I like trad/Ivy dress because it's so simple and versatile, good for a minimalist.


Having digitized more than a few records, I'm here to tell you that you're better off filching from YouTube or buying secondhand CD's (which are ridiculously cheap these days) than you are digitizing LPs. It takes forever, which can be both good and bad. Then again, there are worse things than whiling away the better part of a day playing records and drinking beer.


----------



## Woofa

Roger,

Did you say that you made that knife? It is beautiful but I am afraid I have no experience with someone actually doing this. Was this a local artisan that you worked with or something similar for a one time deal or is this one of your hobbies? I would think that knife making at the level you show would be quite an intensive and lengthy process.


----------



## godan

RogerP said:


> A few odds and ends:
> 
> It's already a good deal oder than I am, and in better shape. :redface: I expect that it will easily last me the rest of my days:
> 
> I'd expect the same of most of the quality boots that I own, but this pair from Edward Green look and feel very close to indestructible:
> 
> The first knife I ever made will undoubtedly last a lifetime:
> 
> It's everything I could want in a road bike. I don't see myself needing another.
> 
> My favorite cufflinks in lovely lapis, sterling and gold. God forbid I should ever lose these.


Nice knife. One of my Randalls is over forty years old - O1 tool steel and what was then new technology, a Micarta handle. Used for everything, including field dressing deer, elk, etc. Shows its age, but I take care of it and it is still going strong. Good luck with yours.


----------



## rwaldron

SammyH said:


> I had a couch made last year out of untreated leather - it's gorgeous and has all kinds of marks on it. Why? Because its not half-plastic; it's a natural product that changes over time and reflects use;


Photos please?


----------



## rwaldron

SammyH said:


> It's my experience that unless you hang a brush upside down that even a high quality badger brush will eventually come apart.


Is that the trick? I have a Truefitt & Hill Super Badger that is loosing bristles like crazy.


----------



## Fatman

Limmer update: 

after several appeals and posting, they decided to give a refund. I am grateful. I learned that there was a production defect and was able to buy the Meindl Perfekt directly from Germany. (Meindl makes all the Limmer models except the custom). 

It is gorgeous and, in my opinion, even nicer than the Limmer as it has more padding, even thicker stitching, and beautiful colors (light and dark brown) for appearance. Also different was the recommendation: Meindl says to treat the boots before wearing them outside the very first time. 
I recommend the Meindl Perfekt "buy it for life" purchasing for anyone who likes hiking boots.

I recommend the Meindl Ortler for hiking, yes, but those of you here at AAAC will grasp this, I don't use them for hiking. They are so beautiful and so comfortable (after the several months break in) that I keep them just for casual wear. The two toned color is protected with a bit of Loake's wax, and I wear them everywhere except on the trails! I find them more comfortable and supportive than any shoes I own.


----------



## hardline_42

rwaldron said:


> Is that the trick? I have a Truefitt & Hill Super Badger that is loosing bristles like crazy.


If you hang a brush to dry with the bristles facing up, water seeps into the knot and breaks down the adhesive that holds the bristles in the handle. You should always dry it with the bristles facing down.


----------



## WildCard22

hardline_42 said:


> If you hang a brush to dry with the bristles facing up, water seeps into the knot and breaks down the adhesive that holds the bristles in the handle. You should always dry it with the bristles facing down.


Also try not to apply excessive pressure why creating a lather.


----------



## WildCard22

Or use your brush to clean out the sink after shaving.


----------



## rwaldron

hardline_42 said:


> If you hang a brush to dry with the bristles facing up, water seeps into the knot and breaks down the adhesive that holds the bristles in the handle. You should always dry it with the bristles facing down.


sounds like a process that can't be reversed


----------



## Fatman

Regarding the "buy it for life" thread...it is one of my all time favorites of the forum, after the didactic What are you wearing today" brilliancy. 

I am curious regarding older posters and their thought process on "buy it for life" items.

Why are you drawn to BIFL items? (beyond quality)

Does said purchase cause you to think about mortality?

Have you ever made the connection between a BIFL item and whether or not it will outlive you?

Lastly, and perhaps one that requires the most thought:

Have you ever caused damage to a BIFL item that seemed to bother you more than the ordinary of waste, disappointment, replacement issues, and so on? 

In other words, have you put much philosophical thought into these items and your own life that you are comfortable sharing?

My profession urges me in learning...so, thank you!


----------



## 32rollandrock

I'll address damage to a BIFL item. I recently dropped an Ipod dock on an audiophile quality copy of Aqualung. I had only had the chance to hear the record once before putting a deep gouge into it that ran across several tracks. It was the most expensive record I had ever purchased, and I was crushed, way beyond the amount of money I had paid, which was considerable. I had hunted for just the right copy for nearly a year before finding one. Fortunately, karma was with me and I soon found another copy. Not quite as good as the one that was ruined, but close. Still, every time I hear the tiniest nick in my new copy, I think about the old one and curse myself.



Fatman said:


> Regarding the "buy it for life" thread...it is one of my all time favorites of the forum, after the didactic What are you wearing today" brilliancy.
> 
> I am curious regarding older posters and their thought process on "buy it for life" items.
> 
> Why are you drawn to BIFL items? (beyond quality)
> 
> Does said purchase cause you to think about mortality?
> 
> Have you ever made the connection between a BIFL item and whether or not it will outlive you?
> 
> Lastly, and perhaps one that requires the most thought:
> 
> Have you ever caused damage to a BIFL item that seemed to bother you more than the ordinary of waste, disappointment, replacement issues, and so on?
> 
> In other words, have you put much philosophical thought into these items and your own life that you are comfortable sharing?
> 
> My profession urges me in learning...so, thank you!


----------



## Duvel

Ouch! I hate when that happens, although fortunately, knock on wood, I've yet to damage anything that valuable. One thing I learned, rather early on: Drinking and spinning LPs do not mix. I stay away from the stylus and the turntable if I suspect my blood-alcohol level is anywhere close to the legal limit.


----------



## rwaldron

I think my Red Oxx - Flying Boxcar might out last the nuclear holocaust: https://www.redoxx.com/Shop-by-Gear-Item/Flying-Boxcar/91021/13/Product


----------



## Nico01

Duvel said:


> Ouch! I hate when that happens, although fortunately, knock on wood, I've yet to damage anything that valuable. One thing I learned, rather early on: Drinking and spinning LPs do not mix. I stay away from the stylus and the turntable if I suspect my blood-alcohol level is anywhere close to the legal limit.


That's one reason why, when I was searching for a second turntable, I decided to limit myself to ones that had cue-ing and auto-lift. I don't trust myself lowering the stylus manually, and I have several times dozed off before the record side is complete (both of those problems, of course, made worse due to the consumption of alcohol).


----------



## A10ACN

BIFL- pretty much anything by Filson. (though the new off shore stuff might be questionable)


----------



## WesleyBentz111

Trevor said:


> I love this thread. I am 100% against the throw away society.
> 
> Here is my cast iron skillet i use all the time. Its 125 years old already.... it will be 175 by the time im done with it and can pass it onto my children/their children!


Nice cast iron skillets are the best for cooking like anything and everything.


----------



## Fatman

I return it to my all time favorite Ask Andy About Clothes Forum thread, where I have learned much, and contributed some, joining others who love quality.

I have something to add:

Midnight Special instruments at:

I shared my thoughts with the "Ukulele Underground" Forum. I began to play the ukulele after developing slight arthritis in my left hand hindering guitar practice. Once I fell in love with the ukulele, I got a ukulele bass or "UBass", and sought a quality ukulele banjo. I record at home for my grandchildren, and although not a professional musician, it is quite special to leave behind recordings for my children and grandchildren which says to them: "There is more to life than a ham sandwich and working 9-5." I want them to not only inherit the Protestant Work Ethic, but I want them to love life, love clothing and appearance, and celebrate, no matter where they are economically, quality.

I wanted a "banjo-ukulele" in tenor (larger) size and went to 4 stores to test them out. I did massive online research and found that in my current price range, I would end up with an "okay" instrument, but when finances change, would end up seeking out a high quality, well manufactured instrument.

For quality of musical instruments, my reference point is the Martin OM 42. Like others, I saved for it, cherished it, but ultimately sold it because *I was afraid to play it. *I settled on a Custom Martin 15 high gloss mahogany and had my 6 children all sign it on the inside: it will not be sold.

I found a Canadian musician and craftsman through a review and took a low risk chance on purchasing one of his instruments. He is Hugh Hunter, near Ontario, Canada, and is, himself, a multi-instrument musician who builds these one by one, from his home.

I purchased the open back banjo-ukulele, also in tenor size, and am stunned at the quality. It should be selling for several thousand dollars, easily, given the craftsmanship and the materials. It sounds wonderful, plays beautifully, and is gorgeous to look at.

It is a "buy it for life" quality that I share here with you, fellow appreciators of quality.

I am not a professional, nor a collector, but I played enough to establish a decent reference point. For example, 
I own the Pono AD2 Cedar top and find it to be of high quality in sound and construction, as well as beauty. It appears that its value exceeds its price tag, should it have been manufactured in the US or Canada, where labor costs would have driven up the price.

The Midnight Special, handmade by Hugh Hunter of Canada, represents a marriage of craftsmanship and musician experience and insight. It is head and shoulders above the best that I sampled at Guitar Center and three other stores (excluding the myriad of You Tube video reviews).

It has a beautiful sound, louder than I had prepared myself for (a plus) with that true 'banjo' sound I had hoped for in spite of its diminutive size.

The construction is impressive, with the attention to detail that a hand-made (realistically, it is a 'de facto' custom, customized to a musician's liking) using top quality (and expensive) components. The wood is beautiful, the tuners smooth (and strong) and the feel substantial.

The neck is straight, the action low, and the instrument beautiful to the eye.

The cost is something that actually triggered a bit of guilt in me. It did not give me that "nailed a bargain!" feel when a treasure at Brooks Brothers was discovered in clearance (like a cashmere sweater that should not have ended up in clearance) as BB is a large corporation. I won't publish the price here, it is not an advertisement for Mr. Hunter, but suffice to say the value appears to be, to my amateurish eyes, four times or more the actual cost. 
Given the Canadian-US dollar exchange, it was less than anything I sampled, yet of far greater quality.

It's quality v price is something I feel awkward about. It's not some great bargain from a nameless, huge manufacture who overcharges anyway; it is extreme craftsmanship from a man who's own signature and name rests upon his work.

Why isn't sold for far more?

Perhaps it is that he feels such kinship with musicians that he covers his costs and makes only a small amount on his labor so that others may embrace and enjoy that which has enriched his life; I don't know, but whatever his reasoning, I am stunned at the quality and blessed to own another "life time purchase", and glad to share this with others at AAAC forum.

​Last edited by martinfan; Today at 11:00 AM​


----------



## Fatman

32rollandrock said:


> Your wish is my command. Please forgive the cluster. I need to get a corncob. And yes, it is full Campy.


Gorgeous.

Gorgeous.

I have not ridden one but I have heard older riders use this phrase in describing hobbyist cycling:

"smooth as silk."

A true BIFL item.


----------



## Fatman

Shaver said:


> My friend I imagine that, even with my 'pricey' shaving equipment, over the course of my life I have actually spent less dollars than you will have on the art of the shave. The ongoing cost of my shaving is (approximately) a mere £29 per year.


I have found this to be so. As is his wont, Shaver's advice is sound.

I have learned to use the time shaving to enjoy myself, and practice a craft long forgotten. When I "graduated" to the straight razor shave, I faced quite a learning curve, but I now have the satisfaction of honing a new skill, and I love the guilt-free quiet time of stropping and using some handmade soaps from enthusiasts.

The cost of cartridge razors, per year, is very high. My family has switched to safety razors, including my wife and daughter, and love both the shave and the savings. I think the razors are about .09 per, and they change them twice a week.

My straight razor is over 100 years old. I intend to pass it along to one of my sons. Many of these straight razors are BIFL.


----------



## Duvel

A musical instrument is a well worthwhile lifetime investment, Fatman. I own only one musical instrument, a lovely rosewood and pine Taylor 710 six-string acoustic guitar that I purchased _new _in 1994 for around $1,300. My then-wife was not pleased with me. It was the only major purchase I made alone during our marriage, without prior knowledge or approval of my partner, but I had to have it. We couldn't really afford, but I picked up an extra job to pay it off, well before the balance was due at the shabby strip-mall loan-shark office that fronted the cash for the thing. Paid ahead of time, paid with no interest--take that! It was a good feeling.

I never regretted that purchase. It has aged beautifully over the years, mellowing both in the coloring of the wood and in the tone itself. I keep it humidified in the winter, stored in its case, and polished and well maintained with fresh strings routinely.

It is a thing of beauty, and in spite of my inexpert technique, one that gives me hours of enjoyment.


----------



## NicholasJenkins

I agree,but our cast iron skillet, after 22 years of great performance, just developed a large split. We hope we can pass down our new one to our son.


----------



## A10ACN

NicholasJenkins said:


> I agree,but our cast iron skillet, after 22 years of great performance, just developed a large split. We hope we can pass down our new one to our son.


I would be interested to hear how this occurred. Brand?


----------



## CSG

Considering all the antique items we own, our BIFL list is rather long. I don't think of clothing, shoes, automobiles, and similar as BIFL but I do think of much furniture, art, books, watches, jewelry, etc. as BIFL. For instance, today, I'm wearing a Rolex Datejust I bought new in 1989. Closing in on 30 years old. Looks almost new. Well, wait. My grandfather gave me his grandfather's pocket watch (an 1877 American Watch company case and P.J. Bartlett movement). Wasn't working and I set it aside. After his death, I found a watchmaker who cleaned and restored the old key-wind piece for $100 and that watch runs accurately today. I also ended up with my granddad's own pocket watch, a gift he got when he graduated Harvard in 1925. It runs great. I have books that are 200-300 years old and furniture that is 100-200 years old that we use in our daily lives.

These are all things that are able to last through multiple generations and I find comfort in haveing and living with old things. I would think the point of the thread boils down to buying quality and passing on disposable goods when ever possible. Less truly is more when you buy quality.


----------



## Duvel

A10ACN said:


> I would be interested to hear how this occurred. Brand?


----------



## my19

Duvel said:


>


Ha! Fortunately, my lovely bride rarely touches a cooking utensil and never a cast iron skillet.


----------



## Jouster

I recently received one of these after a nine-year wait:



Better believe it's a keeper!

Now, I'll be the first to admit that astronomical telescopes are not exactly day-to-day items. But this one sure is beautiful, very well made and, since the basic refractor design has not changed since 1609, likely to be just as effective in a few decades when I'm a doddery old fella.


----------



## Duvel

We have several cast iron skillets. They're wonderful. We'd never use them to violent ends, however--that would hurt.



my19 said:


> Ha! Fortunately, my lovely bride rarely touches a cooking utensil and never a cast iron skillet.


----------



## CMDC

Speaking of optics, a few months ago I picked up these Zeiss binoculars for my bird watching. Amazing quality...

https://www.zeiss.com/sports-optics...binoculars/conquest-hd-binoculars.html#models


----------



## my19

Duvel said:


> We have several cast iron skillets. They're wonderful. We'd never use them to violent ends, however--that would hurt.


I have a couple of cast iron skillets -- a Lodge and a no-name that is my particular favorite. I also have a Lodge Dutch Oven which doesn't get nearly as much use as the skillets, but when called upon, performs admirably, too.

My daughter, fortunately, likes doing things in the kitchen, so these will be hers someday.


----------



## CSG

CMDC, I agree with you about Zeiss. I have a 10x25 Victory, and 8x32 Conquest HD, and an 8x42 Victory HT. Also have an early Televue Pronto 70mm telescope. Went through the Genesis and NP101 but came back to the compact Pronto. All of these are lifetime optics.


----------



## RogerP

Sorry for the absurdly tardy reply, gents - I do need to visit this side of the forum more often.



Woofa said:


> Roger,
> 
> * Did you say that you made that knife*? It is beautiful but I am afraid I have no experience with someone actually doing this. Was this a local artisan that you worked with or something similar for a one time deal or is this one of your hobbies? I would think that knife making at the level you show would be quite an intensive and lengthy process.


Yes - that was my first of my own making. There's a detailed thread on the interchange somewhere about the process, which is indeed both lengthy and intensive. And thank you.



godan said:


> Nice knife. One of my Randalls is over forty years old - O1 tool steel and what was then new technology, a Micarta handle. Used for everything, including field dressing deer, elk, etc. Shows its age, but I take care of it and it is still going strong. Good luck with yours.


Randalls were my first introduction to the very concept of quality cutlery and part of the inspiration for what has been a decades-long passion.


----------



## Skoorb

Enjoying this thread as a new user. I am keen on Buy Once, Cry Once items... but it's hard to say that I have many things that are truly, truly BIFL. Life is a long time, even buying quality what will I have 20, 30, 40, 50 years later? My wedding ring. Iron skillets as mentioned if I can still lift them... I have several old Wagners; my dad says that the way to tell really good ones is if they are thin... better heat transfer with thin ones. Gibson guitars, but I've bought and sold and never kept them. Hand tools?

A recent acquisition of mine via a gift from my brother is a YETI cooler. Now that thing is a tank, truly enjoyable to own and use, and likely to last for a long, long time... but a lifetime? We shall see.


----------



## Fatman

Here I return to one of my favorite threads of Ask Andy...

I also offer a new phrase that I read elsewhere which may be appropriate for those of us in the Autumn or Winter of our lives:

The "Endgame Purchase" as indicative of buying something for life, knowing it may outlive us due to quality, and is such that upgrades may not persuade us from our decision.

My Endgame Purchase, as a "Buy It For Life" dares to venture into the world of technology, as this is one area in which some items, particularly "Sony", are still going strong in spite of technological advances:

Headphones.

My Buy It For Life purchase has yet, another nod to German manufacturing:

The Beyerdynamic T1 headphone.

Beginning at age 13, as a beneficiary of having 8 older siblings, I was exposed to a wide variety of music:

Mom gave me Classical (as did Warner Brothers cartoons) and Irish Folk
One sister gave me soul, Aretha
Another sister was a hippie and gave me Folk, and Dylan
A brother gave me rock and pop, with The Beatles and on and on.

the problem is that after 40 years of listening, there is no way I am going to listen to the same version of "Blood on the Tracks" or "Sgt. Pepper" only because I have heard them far too many times!

In researching headphones, I read, repeatedly, that the Beyerdynamic 'flagship' headphones, the T1 would "bring your old music library back to life!" in various descriptive articles and comments.

It is true!

I am hearing instruments that I _did not know _
were part of the song composition!

The detail is stunning. In some classical pieces, I can hear the 'tap' of the fingernail hitting the piano, or the scratch of the guitar string, or the breathing of the singer. It is amazing. I get 'lost' in the music with the entire catalog becoming as if 'fresh and new' for me.

The comfort is such that hours of typing articles while music is playing in my head (I walk and chew gum) gives no discomfort nor fatigue.

The manufacturing is as they are the "Mercedes Benz of headphone manufacturing", hand made in Germany.

They are expensive but built to last decades and the improvement of the flag ship model is that they have detachable cables; something every parent (or now grandparent) knows the contrary: kids pull, get tangled, and even step on headphone wires which greatly shorten the lifespan of the headphones. This is not rectified.

I do not understand the "Telsa" measurement of magnetic power, but can hear the stunning difference between them and many other models tested, including Bose.

They have an old school look; nothing fancy, nothing for "bass heads" who wish for amplified continual heavy mind numbing bass, and are a marvelous "buy it for life" quality product that enhances the lives of those of us who hold a certain appreciation for life.

I'm listening to Happy Traum play with John Sebastian, a half century removed from their first professional appearances, and the definition and separation of instruments makes me feel front and center row seating!


----------



## CSG

Revisiting this thread from my earlier response in November, I also have a few Fender and MArtin guitars and a few Rolex and Omega (and other brands of mechanical watches). My oldest watch is my great-great grandfather's American Watch Company pocket watch. It was made in 1877 but wasn't working when my grandfather gave it to me in the early 1980's. I had it rebuilt a few years later and it still runs perfectly today.


----------



## chosenhandle

I'm going with my Beckstein grand piano. Sounds better 15 years after I bought it and my piano tech says it isn't even quite broke in yet.


----------



## Bermuda

I have a green Eastern Mountain Sports jacket with a waxy feel that I've had since 1994


----------



## Shaver

Thanks fat man. After reading your recommendation of Beyerdynamic, a brand of which I was previously ignorant, I decided to purchase a set of their in-ear headphones to use with my ipod. Worth every penny, a rich, deep and clear sound which far surpasses my previous Sennheiser 'phones and significantly improves my enjoyment of music on the go.



Fatman said:


> Here I return to one of my favorite threads of Ask Andy...
> 
> I also offer a new phrase that I read elsewhere which may be appropriate for those of us in the Autumn or Winter of our lives:
> 
> The "Endgame Purchase" as indicative of buying something for life, knowing it may outlive us due to quality, and is such that upgrades may not persuade us from our decision.
> 
> My Endgame Purchase, as a "Buy It For Life" dares to venture into the world of technology, as this is one area in which some items, particularly "Sony", are still going strong in spite of technological advances:
> 
> Headphones.
> 
> My Buy It For Life purchase has yet, another nod to German manufacturing:
> 
> The Beyerdynamic T1 headphone.
> 
> Beginning at age 13, as a beneficiary of having 8 older siblings, I was exposed to a wide variety of music:
> 
> Mom gave me Classical (as did Warner Brothers cartoons) and Irish Folk
> One sister gave me soul, Aretha
> Another sister was a hippie and gave me Folk, and Dylan
> A brother gave me rock and pop, with The Beatles and on and on.
> 
> the problem is that after 40 years of listening, there is no way I am going to listen to the same version of "Blood on the Tracks" or "Sgt. Pepper" only because I have heard them far too many times!
> 
> In researching headphones, I read, repeatedly, that the Beyerdynamic 'flagship' headphones, the T1 would "bring your old music library back to life!" in various descriptive articles and comments.
> 
> It is true!
> 
> I am hearing instruments that I _did not know _
> were part of the song composition!
> 
> The detail is stunning. In some classical pieces, I can hear the 'tap' of the fingernail hitting the piano, or the scratch of the guitar string, or the breathing of the singer. It is amazing. I get 'lost' in the music with the entire catalog becoming as if 'fresh and new' for me.
> 
> The comfort is such that hours of typing articles while music is playing in my head (I walk and chew gum) gives no discomfort nor fatigue.
> 
> The manufacturing is as they are the "Mercedes Benz of headphone manufacturing", hand made in Germany.
> 
> They are expensive but built to last decades and the improvement of the flag ship model is that they have detachable cables; something every parent (or now grandparent) knows the contrary: kids pull, get tangled, and even step on headphone wires which greatly shorten the lifespan of the headphones. This is not rectified.
> 
> I do not understand the "Telsa" measurement of magnetic power, but can hear the stunning difference between them and many other models tested, including Bose.
> 
> They have an old school look; nothing fancy, nothing for "bass heads" who wish for amplified continual heavy mind numbing bass, and are a marvelous "buy it for life" quality product that enhances the lives of those of us who hold a certain appreciation for life.
> 
> I'm listening to Happy Traum play with John Sebastian, a half century removed from their first professional appearances, and the definition and separation of instruments makes me feel front and center row seating!
> 
> 
> View attachment 15741


----------



## Chi

I have a Tumi ballistic expandable duffle bag that I bought just over 20 years ago. Still in perfect condition. I will have it for the rest of my life (as long as an airline doesn't lose it).

By the way, I am particularly happy with it because I got it for half price - my buddy worked at a high end luggage store at the time, I picked up a few pieces of Tumi ballistic luggage at great prices through him.


----------



## RobertM

Dang, Fatman, that's quite the list! LOL. I concur on the headphones although my personal favorites are Grados. I have the 80s and the 125s. I can't recall, quite, why I thought I needed two, except that, during an intensely audiophiliac stage, I could not determine which better suited my needs, and I also felt myself compellingly entertained by the notion of comparing and contrasting them. After more than a decade of ownership and hundreds of hours listening to both, I still cannot describe any discernible difference.


----------



## RobertM

Postscript: Headphones as life purchase, yes, to maintain marital sanity/family peace, lease agreements, neighborly congeniality. More important, it is the most wonderful, immersive musical experience.


----------



## Andersdad

Big Green Egg


----------



## orange fury

Andersdad said:


> Big Green Egg


I had a buddy in high school whose dad was able to pick up two for the price of one at a store closing sale- unbelievable piece of equipment.

Also, when I eventually buy a house, I'm getting a Klose barrel smoker- with the stories I've heard about their build quality, my grandkids will get to fight over it.


----------



## eagle2250

^^


Andersdad said:


> Big Green Egg


Purchased as a supplement to or a replacement for an LP gas grill? Has the Big Green Egg met your expectations? I do not ask these questions lightly, as this may be the next purchase for our nest!


----------



## Patrick06790

I regularly fish with my father's bamboo rods — including one made by the great Jim Payne. Most of these rods were purchased in the immediate post-war period. They are heavy, slow, and terrible for nymphing. They are excellent for single dry fly presentations, and for the teams of wet flies I like to use in the classic Catskill tradition.

You wouldn't think that the weight difference between a three or four ounce bamboo rod and a modern graphite rod weighing in at an ounce and change would make a big difference, but try making several hundred casts over a four-hour period with each and then tell me how your casting arm feels. My father only switched to graphite when his arthritis made bamboo untenable. He got an extra 10 years of fishing out of that.


----------



## Andersdad

eagle2250 said:


> ^^
> 
> Purchased as a supplement to or a replacement for an LP gas grill? Has the Big Green Egg met your expectations? I do not ask these questions lightly, as this may be the next purchase for our nest!


It has surpassed my expectations. I use it 3-4 times a week (even in the Minnesota winter) and have not fired up my gasser since the egg landed on my deck in November. I even use it in place of my oven for things like lasagna and desserts.


----------



## CSG

Chi said:


> I have a Tumi ballistic expandable duffle bag that I bought just over 20 years ago. Still in perfect condition. I will have it for the rest of my life (as long as an airline doesn't lose it).
> 
> By the way, I am particularly happy with it because I got it for half price - my buddy worked at a high end luggage store at the time, I picked up a few pieces of Tumi ballistic luggage at great prices through him.


I've had my Tumi leather trimmed, ballistic nylon garment bag for over 30 years. So far, so good.


----------



## eagle2250

Andersdad said:


> It has surpassed my expectations. I use it 3-4 times a week (even in the Minnesota winter) and have not fired up my gasser since the egg landed on my deck in November. I even use it in place of my oven for things like lasagna and desserts.


Thank you for the feedback on the "Egg." Your endorsement may be all that was needed to motivate me to press on with the purchase! Thanks again.


----------



## Fatman

I have had the blessing to have come across another "Buy it for Life" item; this time, born, raised, manufactured and loved, straight from the United Kingdom. 

It is Chord Electronic's "Mojo" 

Having the German made Beyerdynamic headphones, all digital music must be converted back to analog from digital in order for us to hear it. Since audio has, literally, millions of pieces of digital information, a converter (Digital to Analog Converter, or "DAC") is needed. So much is lost. Macbook Pro has a decent DAC, as do iPhones, which most people have. 

The owner of Chord gave a lengthy interview on You Tube that impressed me. They released this new product in October of 2015 and it won awards across the world for giving us beautiful stunning sound. In the interview the owner said, "I am 60 years old and have more money than I need. I wanted to do something for the average person who loves music but cannot afford an audiophile's DAC."

He took the technology of their least expensive DAC, which is about $2500, and put it into a tiny little piece of magic, called the "mobile joy", or "Mojo" which is smaller than a pack of cigarettes. 

It blew away all of his competitors, which he expressed regret over. He took 30 years of technology and even had a special battery invented for it, which he thinks will last 25 years. The tiny thing can be run over by a car and still work. It has an on off button and two volume buttons. That's it. 

It drives your good headphones to allow you to hear what only audiophiles generally do for 1/4th the cost. 

As impressed as I have been with hearing my old music catalog with Beyerdynamic T1 headphones, this has taken it to an entirely new level. It is stunning. 

The London Philharmonic Orchestra sound is "in high definition."

It is like Bob Dylan is singing in my living room. It has not only "sound stage" of separation of instruments, but the vocals are up front, especially the highs. 

I hear instruments I did not know where even played on some albums. 

This is a product that not only matches the hype and awards, but it supersedes it. If the Blue Danube could reduce me to tears, it now stuns me with wonder. I did not think more clarity could come from recorded music than what I had experienced with the Beyerdynamics, but, as some advised me, this allows me to hear what the headphones are capable of producing. 

The Mojo was made to be mobile, especially for iPhones, but the company has acknowledged that people are using it at their desks, as well. For me, I ended up selling my desk top DAC, and my desk top Amp, as well as my iPhone portable amp, using the Mojo for everything. One tiny little instrument does it all. 

I think the Mojo is going to harm Chord's sales of their more expensive items (up to $20,000 for a converter) and some blind A/B testing has shown that those who own higher models cannot discern the difference in quality. 

It is like going from watching sports on a low def TV and changing the channel to the same sports game on crystal clear high def TV. 

It's hard to describe, but it appears to be a "buy it for life" quality item from the UK's Chord Electronics. If you listen to your music from iTunes, or iPhone or i this or i that, you'll be stunned at the beauty.

I hate to run Shaver into spending more money, but...this is wonderful. Since it is portable I use it with inexpensive in ear headphones, too, and it is a marvel. The UK should be proud of the innovation that they worked hard at producing at such a low price, and putting tech into something this tiny, and this well built. A video surfaced of one of their models being run over by a tank!


----------



## David J. Cooper

eagle2250 said:


> ^^
> 
> Purchased as a supplement to or a replacement for an LP gas grill? Has the Big Green Egg met your expectations? I do not ask these questions lightly, as this may be the next purchase for our nest!


I've had a medium BGE for just over a year now and I like it but it isn't worth the $$$. I had a Weber Performer previously and kind of miss it for two reasons. The gas lighter and the ease of removing burnt ashes.

I resist using the BGE for quick meals because the cleaning, lighting and warm up process is quite a time waster.

To me a lot of the money you spend on the Egg goes into their promotion budget. It works for them but their magazine is such a bit of glossy trash IMHO. Just pages of testimonies from 3rd rate chefs.


----------



## Shaver

Shall I just PM you my bank details in order that you may empty my account at your leisure?

More seriously, I am intrigued- will this device really enhance my in ear phones and ipod rig to such an appreciable degree? I am already quite astonished by the improvement in quality that the Beyerdynamics have granted, could I truly recognise a further increase?



Fatman said:


> I have had the blessing to have come across another "Buy it for Life" item; this time, born, raised, manufactured and loved, straight from the United Kingdom.
> 
> It is Chord Electronic's "Mojo"
> 
> Having the German made Beyerdynamic headphones, all digital music must be converted back to analog from digital in order for us to hear it. Since audio has, literally, millions of pieces of digital information, a converter (Digital to Analog Converter, or "DAC") is needed. So much is lost. Macbook Pro has a decent DAC, as do iPhones, which most people have.
> 
> The owner of Chord gave a lengthy interview on You Tube that impressed me. They released this new product in October of 2015 and it won awards across the world for giving us beautiful stunning sound. In the interview the owner said, "I am 60 years old and have more money than I need. I wanted to do something for the average person who loves music but cannot afford an audiophile's DAC."
> 
> He took the technology of their least expensive DAC, which is about $2500, and put it into a tiny little piece of magic, called the "mobile joy", or "Mojo" which is smaller than a pack of cigarettes.
> 
> It blew away all of his competitors, which he expressed regret over. He took 30 years of technology and even had a special battery invented for it, which he thinks will last 25 years. The tiny thing can be run over by a car and still work. It has an on off button and two volume buttons. That's it.
> 
> It drives your good headphones to allow you to hear what only audiophiles generally do for 1/4th the cost.
> 
> As impressed as I have been with hearing my old music catalog with Beyerdynamic T1 headphones, this has taken it to an entirely new level. It is stunning.
> 
> The London Philharmonic Orchestra sound is "in high definition."
> 
> It is like Bob Dylan is singing in my living room. It has not only "sound stage" of separation of instruments, but the vocals are up front, especially the highs.
> 
> I hear instruments I did not know where even played on some albums.
> 
> This is a product that not only matches the hype and awards, but it supersedes it. If the Blue Danube could reduce me to tears, it now stuns me with wonder. I did not think more clarity could come from recorded music than what I had experienced with the Beyerdynamics, but, as some advised me, this allows me to hear what the headphones are capable of producing.
> 
> The Mojo was made to be mobile, especially for iPhones, but the company has acknowledged that people are using it at their desks, as well. For me, I ended up selling my desk top DAC, and my desk top Amp, as well as my iPhone portable amp, using the Mojo for everything. One tiny little instrument does it all.
> 
> I think the Mojo is going to harm Chord's sales of their more expensive items (up to $20,000 for a converter) and some blind A/B testing has shown that those who own higher models cannot discern the difference in quality.
> 
> It is like going from watching sports on a low def TV and changing the channel to the same sports game on crystal clear high def TV.
> 
> It's hard to describe, but it appears to be a "buy it for life" quality item from the UK's Chord Electronics. If you listen to your music from iTunes, or iPhone or i this or i that, you'll be stunned at the beauty.
> 
> I hate to run Shaver into spending more money, but...this is wonderful. Since it is portable I use it with inexpensive in ear headphones, too, and it is a marvel. The UK should be proud of the innovation that they worked hard at producing at such a low price, and putting tech into something this tiny, and this well built. A video surfaced of one of their models being run over by a tank!


----------



## eagle2250

David J. Cooper said:


> I've had a medium BGE for just over a year now and I like it but it isn't worth the $$$. I had a Weber Performer previously and kind of miss it for two reasons. The gas lighter and the ease of removing burnt ashes.
> 
> I resist using the BGE for quick meals because the cleaning, lighting and warm up process is quite a time waster.
> 
> To me a lot of the money you spend on the Egg goes into their promotion budget. It works for them but their magazine is such a bit of glossy trash IMHO. Just pages of testimonies from 3rd rate chefs.


Thank you for the personal insight(s) into the actual utility of the grill. Ease of use will definitely have an impact on my final decision. Thanks again!


----------



## David J. Cooper

Hi eagle. I hope I didn't sound bitter, The great thing about the egg is once you get it hot it stays hot. I have a pseudo commercial gas range (5 Star Brand) and the stove top is awesome but the oven is terrible. I thought I would use the BGE as an outdoor oven, thus justifying the cost (over $2,000 cdn with accessories). So far I haven't.

Quite often I would fire up the Weber and be grilling steaks in 20 minutes or so, the BGE takes almost twice that time to get ready to cook. Of course some of that is me. It is causing my Mrs and I to drink a whole bottle of white before the steaks are on the grill.


----------



## eagle2250

^^
Not bitter at al, but rather, helpfully informative. As I consider expanding my outdoor cooking options, the Big Green Egg is the primary brand I have been considering. However, other manufacturers also offer their versions of "Kammodo" grills that address the inconveniences you mention. At the local Home Depot store they offer Vision Grills version of such for about $450 less than a comparably sized BGE...and the Vision grill features an electric starter for firing up the charcoal and fold away countertops, to boot. In the end, I'm not sure my choice of poison will be a Big Green Egg...or one of the alternatives. 

LOL. Should all else fail, my trusty Weber LP Grill will be watching my Six!


----------



## jd202

eagle2250 said:


> ^^
> Not bitter at al, but rather, helpfully informative. As I consider expanding my outdoor cooking options, the Big Green Egg is the primary brand I have been considering. However, other manufacturers also offer their versions of "Kammodo" grills that address the inconveniences you mention. At the local Home Depot store they offer Vision Grills version of such for about $450 less than a comparably sized BGE...and the Vision grill features an electric starter for firing up the charcoal and fold away countertops, to boot. In the end, I'm not sure my choice of poison will be a Big Green Egg...or one of the alternatives.
> 
> LOL. Should all else fail, my trusty Weber LP Grill will be watching my Six!


Count me as a BGE skeptic as well- I think they're pretty overhyped and overpriced. If you're primarily looking for an outdoor oven (to make pizza or bread or etc.), the BGE is pretty excellent, but you'd do better to save money and get one of the clones. For barbecuing and/or smoking meat, I'll take my Weber Smokey Mountain over the BGE any day. And the BGE is too much fuss for quick grilling, in my opinion.

To be sure, it's a nice piece of hardware, but I think the price is too high.


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