# OCBD's in the heat



## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

A little background: My firm is semi-casual; I generally wear a sportcoat, slacks and a tie to work. I've been trying to consolidate my wardrobe and get more wear out of fewer shirts. As a result, I've started wearing OCBD's to the office. There was a time when I would only wear them open neck, but they sure look great with bow ties.

Anyways, it's starting to get warm out and I'm switching out the tweed jackets for some lighter silk jackets. In addition, I'm going to get a seersucker suit, since my office does seersucker Thursdays starting after Memorial day.

So long story short, do OCBD's look funny when paired with lightweight material like seersucker? Mine (Brooks) are kind of on the heavy side. Should I go with something lighter, like a pinpoint?

Like I said, I'm really trying to rework my wardrobe for maximum flexibility. Ideally, all of my shirts could be worn to the office or on the weekend, except of course, for a couple of polos and a couple of french cuff shirts for when I need to wear a suit.


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## Flanderian (Apr 30, 2008)

L-feld said:


> So long story short, do OCBD's look funny when paired with lightweight material like seersucker? Mine (Brooks) are kind of on the heavy side. Should I go with something lighter, like a pinpoint?


IMHO, they still look fine, but are warmer. PP or broadcloth can look very nice also. Your call.


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## Jovan (Mar 7, 2006)

Oxford cloth is no warmer or cooler than pinpoint and broadcloth, in my experience.


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## trolperft (Feb 7, 2007)

The key is to match texture. OCBD has rough texture. So it works best with a jacket with similar texture. Seersucker, which has matte and rough surface, is fine, but shiny cloth like silk doesn't look good on OCBD.


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

trolperft said:


> The key is to match texture. OCBD has rough texture. So it works best with a jacket with similar texture. Seersucker, which has matte and rough surface, is fine, but shiny cloth like silk doesn't look good on OCBD.


What about raw silk in a kind of looser weave like this:


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## Cowtown (Aug 10, 2006)

OCBDs work well with seersucker, but may not be the best choice with silk. If you are trying to minimize shirt purchases, you may want to consider broadcloth or pinpoint which will also work with seersucker.


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## Bandit44 (Oct 1, 2010)

The ocbd is a good year-round staple. It works with most garments and is comfortable in all but the hottest weather. There might be situations when a pinpoint or broadcloth would be better, but since you are looking for maximum flexibility, you are choosing the right shirt.


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## WouldaShoulda (Aug 5, 2009)

L-feld said:


> In addition, I'm going to get a seersucker suit, since my office does seersucker Thursdays starting after Memorial day.


Best dress code EVER!!


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## firedancer (Jan 11, 2011)

^agreed. 

This OCBD in warm weather comes up often. 

I find them to be much warmer than a poplin broadcloth or PP. The rougher texture of Oxford cloth also lends itself better to sweaters, tweeds and flannel. For my warm weather rigs it's almost exclusively a broadcloth or poplin ( as I'm wearing an ocbd with my palm tree Embridered shorts). 

A poster last summer mentioned how his BB OCBDs were the coolest shirts he owns. Maybe he doesn't live in a humid clime or has a different physical make up but I whole heartedly disagree. 

So with lighter weight jackets and suits I would always opt for a smoother lighter weight shirt. Add texture with a tie.


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## srivats (Jul 29, 2008)

I am one of those that cannot wear a OCBD in summer. Linen works well as does madras.


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## nolan50410 (Dec 5, 2006)

I recently got some of the BB oxfords to replace my Gitmans that are now too big. The Gitmans are substantially heavier than the BBs. I would never wear the Gitman OCBDs in the summer, but I plan on wearing these BBs with shorts and such.


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## Trip English (Dec 22, 2008)

I misread the thread title as "OCBDs in heat" and expected a new method for increasing my supply of shirts without waiting for the sales. 

Though now that the intention is clear, I personally think the OCBD (and most other dress shirts) are a little hot in the summer if you really have to worry about the outdoor temperature. I spend most of my time indoors and drive to work so I don't think so much about these things unless I'm going to be out for the day in which case I try and keep it to linen or madras or something lighter. 

I can't really speak to the matching with seersucker. I don't think there's much that looks good with blue seersucker except a white shirt, which I suppose could be an OCBD.


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## jwooten (Dec 19, 2010)

I'm in the deep south, but I really don't notice a large difference between OCBD and a pinpoint or broadcloth when a coat and tie are worn. Having been in the humid southern climate for the majority of my life though, I don't really notice heat unless its plus 110 and 100 % humidity or I'm do something stupid like wearing a flannel suit in August. So my opinion should be taken with a grain of salt. 

I guess a better question is how much sweating is acceptable and how will said perspiration effect your shirt and overall appearance? Because it's inevitable that you will perspire in the summer no matter what clothing you wear. If you look less disheveled in a OCBD than a pinpoint without noticeable comfort or utility difference, the decision should be clear.


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## firedancer (Jan 11, 2011)

^excellent point JWooten.


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

Trip English said:


> I misread the thread title as "OCBDs in heat" and expected a new method for increasing my supply of shirts without waiting for the sales.
> 
> Though now that the intention is clear, I personally think the OCBD (and most other dress shirts) are a little hot in the summer if you really have to worry about the outdoor temperature. I spend most of my time indoors and drive to work so I don't think so much about these things unless I'm going to be out for the day in which case I try and keep it to linen or madras or something lighter.
> 
> I can't really speak to the matching with seersucker. I don't think there's much that looks good with blue seersucker except a white shirt, which I suppose could be an OCBD.


The hardest part of breeding OCBD's is finding really good studs. As a result, I would recommend that any beginner start with breeding tuxedo shirts, since the studs are plentiful.

Bad humor aside, this summer I will probably be indoors most of the time. One of the downsides to my office is that half our clients are out of the country and none of my cases are even in Maryland, so I don't see the outside world very often. If someone needs to go to court, they just send someone from another one of our offices.


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## Duck (Jan 4, 2007)

An OCBD is going to be warmer, but unless it's going to be 100 degrees outside and your a door to door bible salesmen you're probably not going to notice.


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## hardline_42 (Jan 20, 2010)

I wear OCBDs day in and day out in the summer and I find them to be quite cool. The key is not in the weight of the fabric but in the weave. Oxford cloth is a relatively open weave that allows a good amount of airflow despite its weight, whereas other lighter fabrics (pinpoint, for example) wear hotter because of a tighter weave. That's not to say that fabrics like madras and seersucker aren't cooler, but they're on the more casual end of the spectrum and can't easily stand in for an OCBD.


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## Annapolitan (Jun 24, 2011)

hardline_42 said:


> I wear OCBDs day in and day out in the summer and I find them to be quite cool. The key is not in the weight of the fabric but in the weave. Oxford cloth is a relatively open weave that allows a good amount of airflow despite its weight, whereas other lighter fabrics (pinpoint, for example) wear hotter because of a tighter weave. That's not to say that fabrics like madras and seersucker aren't cooler, but they're on the more casual end of the spectrum and can't easily stand in for an OCBD.


+1 My sentiments/experience exactly. I live in MD where it can get quite hot and humid. I find the OCBDs actually drape and feel better in heat and humidity (and any other condition for that matter) than PP or broadcloths, especially when worn with a suit. I'm an OCBD devotee, though, and have about a 5 to 1 ratio of OCBD to other dress shirts, so I'm somewhat biased towards OCBD generally.


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## hookem12387 (Dec 29, 2009)

jwooten said:


> I'm in the deep south, but I really don't notice a large difference between OCBD and a pinpoint or broadcloth when a coat and tie are worn. Having been in the humid southern climate for the majority of my life though, I don't really notice heat unless its plus 110 and 100 % humidity or I'm do something stupid like wearing a flannel suit in August. So my opinion should be taken with a grain of salt.
> 
> I guess a better question is how much sweating is acceptable and how will said perspiration effect your shirt and overall appearance? Because it's inevitable that you will perspire in the summer no matter what clothing you wear. If you look less disheveled in a OCBD than a pinpoint without noticeable comfort or utility difference, the decision should be clear.


 Echo this


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## cmacey (May 3, 2009)

Jovan said:


> Oxford cloth is no warmer or cooler than pinpoint and broadcloth, in my experience.


I have to agree. I've lived in some hot places during my life and wore/wear OCBDs almost daily. I can't remember ever having noticed a difference when I wore/wear another cloth - hot is hot. As long as you don't put starch on the cloth, it will breath as well as any other cloth, IMHO.


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## Jovan (Mar 7, 2006)

Stay away from cotton twill in the heat, though. It's a tightly woven, thick fabric and that definitely makes a difference. However, great when the temps are cooler. Easier to care for, keeps its press better, but not quite as crisp looking. I think it looks rather luxurious, personally.


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## P Hudson (Jul 19, 2008)

I'm surprised by some of the comments here. A BB ocbd is considerably heavier than a BB pinpoint or broadcloth. I find it hard to believe, though I have no real empirical evidence, that it isn't warmer as well. I tend to wear them more in the cooler weather or--if it is warm-- when I'm not layering up, even though much of my work is done in air conditioning. I also don't think they go as well with a hard finished jacket, but look great with tweeds, flannel, etc.


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## 32rollandrock (May 1, 2008)

Agree with this and FD's original post. Given that I am about to try the Oxy trick for the first time to get perspiration stains from several white shirts before summer starts in earnest, this is an apt subject. I've lived in FD's neck of the woods and am not far from there now, and when the heat/humidity gets cranking, I just can't do OCBD's, and the jacket goes on only when in the safety of AC. Even a three-minute walk across a parking lot can leave one soaked. In addition to comfort concerns, I go with pinpoint or broadcloth because of cost. All of my OCBDs are BB, most of my lightweight dress shirts cost considerably less (think JAB). If they're going to end up with yellow stains, I'd rather have them not be my better shirts. But the results of the Oxy trick/test might dramatically change things.



firedancer said:


> ^excellent point JWooten.


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## Trip English (Dec 22, 2008)

Please whip up a new thread on this collar thing if it works. I have to say it didn't for me. Nothing has. The only thing I haven't tried which has been recommended is the fels naptha soap, which I have in a sealed tupperware as I discovered early on that it released a poison cloud when kept in any container smaller than an entire Wal-Mart. 

I'd stick to white OCBDs from LE or RL from Marshall's and keep the nicer ones in the cedar chest until fall.


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## Cardinals5 (Jun 16, 2009)

32rollandrock said:


> But the results of the Oxy trick/test might dramatically change things.


You talkin' the oxy method I use? Just remember, the white vinegar soak in the hottest tap water is an essential step - breaks up in the stains before the oxy annihilates them.


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## hardline_42 (Jan 20, 2010)

What's this oxy business? I wear my OCBDs all summer and the only thing I need to get collar/cuff stains out is cheap supermarket shampoo (Suave for 99 cents) and a nail brush every 3 or 4 washes. As far as underarm stains, nothing I tried ever worked, so I just stopped wearing deodorant/antiperspirant. Haven't had a problem since.


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## 32rollandrock (May 1, 2008)

Yes, this is the method to which I refer, and I will, presuming it works, post results. Rather than start with my white RLPL shirt (which I'm sick about--worn four times and already a collar ring), a rugby shirt from Princeton will be the guinea pig, Princeton being Princeton and the shirt having some pretty serious yellow going on, which isn't that surprising, Princeton being Princeton. The RLPL I will likely mail to a high-end cleaner for resurrection.



Cardinals5 said:


> You talkin' the oxy method I use? Just remember, the white vinegar soak in the hottest tap water is an essential step - breaks up in the stains before the oxy annihilates them.


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## 32rollandrock (May 1, 2008)

The quality and properties of perspiration may differ. The oxy method is, roughly, soaking the garment in question in a solution of vinegar and hot water for some length of time, then soaking in a concentrated solution of Oxyclean for another period of time, then washing. There's more to it than that, but that's a rough approximation. All told, I believe it is something like a 36-48 hour endeavor. If it doesn't work, then you take some Oxycodone and everything seems OK no matter what. It all, as they say, comes out in the wash.



hardline_42 said:


> What's this oxy business? I wear my OCBDs all summer and the only thing I need to get collar/cuff stains out is cheap supermarket shampoo (Suave for 99 cents) and a nail brush every 3 or 4 washes. As far as underarm stains, nothing I tried ever worked, so I just stopped wearing deodorant/antiperspirant. Haven't had a problem since.


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## dcjacobson (Jun 25, 2007)

Living in a northern area, I may be just a little more sensitive to heat--anything approaching 90 degrees means real discomfort for me. So my OCBDs all go into summer hibernation for July and August.

When I started working, the thing to get was polyester-blended OCBDs. Lemme tell you, those were hot. And, with my long walk from the car to my desk, I had plenty of collar and cuff stains.

Lestoil always worked for me for those stains (it should be in your grocery store's laundry aisle). I let the Lestoil soak in for a good while, and then lightly brush with a laundry brush. Then rinse and wash the shirt.

Try Lestoil; it isn't expensive any will likely do the job for you.

Good luck,
Dpm


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## Himself (Mar 2, 2011)

Heavier oxford cloth may be warmer, but it also drapes rather than clings and doesn't show sweat as readily.


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## Jovan (Mar 7, 2006)

hardline_42 said:


> What's this oxy business? I wear my OCBDs all summer and the only thing I need to get collar/cuff stains out is cheap supermarket shampoo (Suave for 99 cents) and a nail brush every 3 or 4 washes. As far as underarm stains, nothing I tried ever worked, so I just stopped wearing deodorant/antiperspirant. Haven't had a problem since.


Try this:

https://www.getdeogo.com

Made by the same good people as RibbedTee.


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## DoghouseReilly (Jul 25, 2010)

hardline_42 said:


> What's this oxy business? I wear my OCBDs all summer and the only thing I need to get collar/cuff stains out is cheap supermarket shampoo (Suave for 99 cents) and a nail brush every 3 or 4 washes. As far as underarm stains, nothing I tried ever worked, so I just stopped wearing deodorant/antiperspirant. Haven't had a problem since.


+1 for cheap shampoo. I've tried naptha soap, but this is way more effective.


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

32rollandrock said:


> The quality and properties of perspiration may differ. The oxy method is, roughly, soaking the garment in question in a solution of vinegar and hot water for some length of time, then soaking in a concentrated solution of Oxyclean for another period of time, then washing. There's more to it than that, but that's a rough approximation. All told, I believe it is something like a 36-48 hour endeavor. If it doesn't work, then you take some Oxycodone and everything seems OK no matter what. It all, as they say, comes out in the wash.


If it doesn't work, then you take some Oxycodone and everything seems OK no matter what.

LOL! :icon_smile:


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## hardline_42 (Jan 20, 2010)

Jovan said:


> Try this:
> 
> https://www.getdeogo.com
> 
> Made by the same good people as RibbedTee.


Thanks, but it really is much easier to just not wear any aluminum-based products under my arms. That's what causes the staining (not the actual perspiration).


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## Jovan (Mar 7, 2006)

I was suggesting it for the shirts that already have the stains. 

I tried Speed Stick StainGuard and it indeed did not leave stains. But it also didn't really work as an antiperspirant...


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## Tilton (Nov 27, 2011)

I learned a while ago how to avoid underarm stains. The first step is trim your underarm hair pretty close about once a week (I use my beard trimmer - no need to take it down with a razor, just very, very short). Then, after you shower, use a liberal amount of Gold Bond, the kind in the green bottle, patting it into your arm pits pretty well. Wash your hands, and finish getting dressed. Note: Don't do this with your pants already on; it will not turn out well.

It's been three years and I haven't stained an armpit yet and I was, previously, a bad pit stainer. I get no odor and my pits stay fresh and dry all day.


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## 32rollandrock (May 1, 2008)

What about the neck? Perhaps Saran Wrap carefully arranged...



Tilton said:


> I learned a while ago how to avoid underarm stains. The first step is trim your underarm hair pretty close about once a week (I use my beard trimmer - no need to take it down with a razor, just very, very short). Then, after you shower, use a liberal amount of Gold Bond, the kind in the green bottle, patting it into your arm pits pretty well. Wash your hands, and finish getting dressed. Note: Don't do this with your pants already on; it will not turn out well.
> 
> It's been three years and I haven't stained an armpit yet and I was, previously, a bad pit stainer. I get no odor and my pits stay fresh and dry all day.


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## hardline_42 (Jan 20, 2010)

Tilton said:


> I learned a while ago how to avoid underarm stains. The first step is trim your underarm hair pretty close about once a week (I use my beard trimmer - no need to take it down with a razor, just very, very short). Then, after you shower, use a liberal amount of Gold Bond, the kind in the green bottle, patting it into your arm pits pretty well. Wash your hands, and finish getting dressed. Note: Don't do this with your pants already on; it will not turn out well.
> 
> It's been three years and I haven't stained an armpit yet and I was, previously, a bad pit stainer. I get no odor and my pits stay fresh and dry all day.


^^ This. Plus, I splash on a little bit of alcohol to inhibit bacteria growth (which causes the smell).


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## Jovan (Mar 7, 2006)

Well, I'm about to start trying SweatBlock. I'll let you guys know how that goes.


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

Jovan said:


> Well, I'm about to start trying SweatBlock. I'll let you guys know how that goes.


Is it healthy to block one's sweat glands? I would consult with your family doctor or a dermatologist first, Jovan.


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## 32rollandrock (May 1, 2008)

Actually, there was a Medicaid fraud case a few years back from Arizona/California in which folks got sweat glands removed at taxpayer expense. It was a pretty big deal, as I recall, involving a boat-load of money in various kickbacks and finder's fees to whizbangs who located down-and-outs willing to undergo surgery for pay. Unfortunately, no one asked me if I would participate.



Brio1 said:


> Is it healthy to block one's sweat glands? I would consult with your family doctor or a dermatologist first, Jovan.


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## P Hudson (Jul 19, 2008)

I'd rather not discuss this in public, but since you brought it up...

Some time ago I was having trouble with dandruff and eczema. I tried all the expensive shampoos and lotions, and it kept getting worse. So I stopped using all shampoos and lotions, and substituted a teaspoon of baking soda mixed with water. All my problems are gone, my hair feels cleaner, and my skin is better. A while later, when I noticed how much my skin had improved, I decided to try it to wash my armpits as well--and stopped wearing deoderant. It seems to be working: I walk every day between 1:00 and 1:30 in full sun with no shirt on, so I perspire a little, but don't have any real B.O. I'm beginning to wonder if armpit odor is more the result of the ways we try to get clean than a necessary issue. I suppose the fact that I'm not very hairy makes it easier for me.


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## Jovan (Mar 7, 2006)

Brio1: The body perspires in other areas. This stuff supposedly lasts for a week. If I feel unhealthy, at least I'll know from the trial sample to not buy a full package. I got it with a shipment from RibbedTee.


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## jwooten (Dec 19, 2010)

Jovan said:


> Brio1: The body perspires in other areas. This stuff supposedly lasts for a week. If I feel unhealthy, at least I'll know from the trial sample to not buy a full package. I got it with a shipment from RibbedTee.


I'm not a doctor by any means, but I can't think this stuff is healthy. Perspiration is a normal bodily function, in general if you aren't sweating when you should be then something is seriously wrong.


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## bd79cc (Dec 20, 2006)

I wear OCBDs enough times during the summer to know that pinpoint and broadcloth feel a lot cooler. Night and day cooler. You'll need some sort of permanent press treatment, too, unless you're OK with a wrinkled, rumpled look. Truth be told, those thin, shiny, expensive Bobby Jones golf shirts, worn with tropical weight wool slacks and Alden calfskin tassel loafers, work the best for everyday office wear. This applies to summertime in San Antonio, which is usually hotter and moister for a much longer part of the year than most places in the U.S.


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## marg (Jan 13, 2011)

Brooks does the Brookscool OCBDs, and I love them. They make most in the casual arena, but some in dress shirts. I have 5 or 6, and I swear by them.


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## Topsider (Jul 9, 2005)

Those of you who are going to such great lengths to avoid pit stains on your dress shirts might consider simply wearing an undershirt. Yes, even in the summer.


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## Jovan (Mar 7, 2006)

Undershirts don't always help.


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## Duck (Jan 4, 2007)

This is fairly simple...

Wear the shirt, wash the shirt, if the shirt gets too yellow, throw away the shirt, repeat. No need to start wearing NASA deodorant or shaving your armpits like some ballerina in California.


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## hardline_42 (Jan 20, 2010)

Duck said:


> This is fairly simple...
> 
> Wear the shirt, wash the shirt, if the shirt gets too yellow, throw away the shirt, repeat. No need to start wearing NASA deodorant or shaving your armpits like some ballerina in California.


That's nice and all, but at $50 a pop on a really good day for a decent OCBD, I'm inclined to do whatever I can to wring a little more than just one summer month's worth of wear out of a shirt. And if you sweat just a little more than average, that nasty yellow buildup ends up on ALL of your shirts (not just the white ones), undershirts and jacket linings. I prefer a little bit of admittedly "unconventional" prevention to buying constant replacements.


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## Georgetown08 (Oct 5, 2011)

This thread seems like as good a place as any to ask:

Where can one find RTW shirts in some of the lighter fabrics (poplin, linen, madras, etc.) that come in real sizes, rather than alpha sizes?


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## Trip English (Dec 22, 2008)

I can't say I've ever seen a madras shirt with neck & sleeve sizing. Otherwise Borrelli has some very nice linen shirts in both spread and button down collars. RL usually does, though I haven't investigated the spring stuff this year.


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## Valkyrie (Aug 27, 2009)

Brooks Brothers makes a very useful very light weight end-on-end that is a very useful summertime shirt. It is made in Malaysia but needs to be ironed. Light, crisp.

https://www.brooksbrothers.com/IWCa...t_Id=1032&sort_by=&sectioncolor=&sectionsize=


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## Atterberg (Mar 11, 2012)

Jovan said:


> Well, I'm about to start trying SweatBlock. I'll let you guys know how that goes.


I also have to deal with excessive armpit perspiration. I've tried Certain Dri in the past, and it works if applied nightly.


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