# Your favourite sports car?



## pichao (Apr 13, 2008)

What is your favourite sports car?

Here is one favourite of mine, a 1969 Fiat 124 Spider that I recently aquired...









Already dreaming about swedish summer, driving through southern Sweden with my tweed jacket on...:icon_smile:


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Lovely! And if you get up to Karlstad in the summer (June onwards) there is a group that gathers every Thursday evening on the old airfield with European sports cars, classics & Mazda Miatas.....Yank tanks not welcome! The American cars, motorbikes & modern street racers have their own gathering on Thursdays at the canal lockkeeper's cottage.


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## Snow Hill Pond (Aug 10, 2011)

Earl of Ormonde said:


> Lovely! And if you get up to Karlstad in the summer (June onwards) there is a group that gathers every Thursday evening on the old airfield with European sports cars, classics & Mazda Miatas.....Yank tanks not welcome! The American cars, motorbikes & modern street racers have their own gathering on Thursdays at the canal lockkeeper's cottage.


Why are you hatin' on the USA? BTW, everyone knows that only girls drive Miatas.

Seriously, to the OP, Pichao, nice car.

To answer the question, I've been wanting a Mini Cooper S for a while, but wifey is unconvinced. Some nonsense about practicality, family vehicle, yada yada yada...The new Subaru BRZ is intriguing...but rear-wheel drive and the Pocono winters might be a bad combination.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Snow Hill Pond said:


> Why are you hatin' on the USA? BTW, everyone knows that only girls drive Miatas.


...


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## my19 (Nov 11, 2009)

My dad had a 1953 MG TD when I was a kid, and it remains my favorite. Just wish we still had it.

And I have to concur with Snow Hill Pond -- the Subaru BRZ and its cousin from Scion look like a lot of fun.


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## Mike Petrik (Jul 5, 2005)

One of my partners decided to spend a few years in DC and asked me to kindly take custody of the following and drive it regularly:

https://www.edmunds.com/mercedes-benz/sl-class/

So it is my current favorite by far.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

*M-505 Adams Brothers Probe 16*










"The Durango-95 purred away real horrorshow - a nice, warm, vibraty feeling all through your guttiwuts".

.
.
..


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## Snow Hill Pond (Aug 10, 2011)

Mike Petrik said:


> One of my partners decided to spend a few years in DC and asked me to kindly take custody of the following and drive it regularly:
> 
> https://www.edmunds.com/mercedes-benz/sl-class/
> 
> So it is my current favorite by far.


But is it fun to drive? Fun, like going down a curvy country road at 70 mph, up and down hillocks pushing the engine to a throaty roar?


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## Snow Hill Pond (Aug 10, 2011)

pichao said:


> What is your favourite sports car?
> 
> Here is one favourite of mine, a 1969 Fiat 124 Spider that I recently aquired...
> 
> ...


Is that original paint? I don't see any rust. The exterior looks nice and I like the color. Considering it's 40+ years old, the exterior looks immaculate to my admittedly amateur eye. Is it going to be a driving car or a show car?


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## Gurdon (Feb 7, 2005)

*Lotus Seven*

I had a right-hand-drive 1963 Lotus 7 for a few years. Wish it had not been necessary to sell it. Subsequently bought a Lotus Elise. It was faster, much more crash-worthy and better handling than the Seven but not nearly as pleasurable to drive. May perhaps someday get a plain vanilla Caterham 7. The Lotue Europa which I had prior to the Seven handled far better than it did, but durability and reliability were not good.

Gurdon


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## pleasehelp (Sep 8, 2005)

Really tough to pick a "favorite." At this stage in my life, I enjoy my 993 for general sportscar use, and I don't think there is a better sportscar for me. It's a beautiful car, fun engine/brakes, handles nicely if you know how to drive it and quirky enough to be fun while still very reliable. I would stop short of calling it my favorite sports car. 

I really like some of the supercars and some of the old classics. If someone told me that they would give me one sportscar for free, and that I wasn't allowed to sell it (so that I won't just pick the most valuable car), I would probably pick the McLaren F1.


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## pichao (Apr 13, 2008)

Snow Hill Pond: Originally it was yellow, it was repainted in 2005. I will drive it, but only use it during summer, and only on sunny days...


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## Langham (Nov 7, 2012)

I once had an MGB - it took forever to go fast, it vibrated badly at speed, to make it stop required almost superhuman effort, it handled badly, it was rusty and it broke down quite often. Otherwise it was fine. It sounded much better after I had succeeded in ripping off the low-slung exhaust silencer driving it up a cart track.

Generally, sports cars seem to require higher levels of care and maintenance than I am prepared to give.


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## pichao (Apr 13, 2008)

Another favourite of mine, a saab 93 from the end of the fifties...


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## Mike Petrik (Jul 5, 2005)

Snow Hill Pond said:


> But is it fun to drive? Fun, like going down a curvy country road at 70 mph, up and down hillocks pushing the engine to a throaty roar?


Yes, it is a blast to drive. But "pushing" this engine would yield a speed far in excess of what a curvy country road can safely accommodate -- and I'm not timid.


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## CuffDaddy (Feb 26, 2009)

My "favorite," in the sense that I decided to spend money on it, is a 2004 Nissan 350Z. After nearly a decade, it's still a fun car to drive.


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## Snow Hill Pond (Aug 10, 2011)

Mike Petrik said:


> Yes, it is a blast to drive.


I was afraid of that. Now I'm jealous...just a little...but indeed jealous.


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## IvanD (Jan 5, 2012)

I know its more of a Grand Tourer, but this would have to be my pick.....









I have had the pleasure of driving one, and I must say it was one of the best driving experiences of my life. But alas, owning one is out of my reach


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## gaseousclay (Nov 8, 2009)

Aston Martin, new and old:


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## Langham (Nov 7, 2012)

I definitely prefer the old Aston Martin (I nearly bought a DB6 30 years ago, but fool that I was chose an MG instead, on account of a £500 price difference).


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## pleasehelp (Sep 8, 2005)

I don't mean to hi-jack the thread, but I am curious as to the thinking behind some of the choices. In my case, I've always found the 911 to be an interesting car because of the continuity and the attempt to constantly improve around a fundamentally flawed original layout. I like the air-cooled 911s, and I wanted one that I wouldn't have to tinker with constantly, so I decided on the 993.


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## gaseousclay (Nov 8, 2009)

pleasehelp said:


> I don't mean to hi-jack the thread, but I am curious as to the thinking behind some of the choices.


I personally think the Aston Martin combines cool with class. with that said, if I had the money I doubt i'd actually buy a sports car such as the Aston Martin. i'd be too afraid of driving it around and putting wear and tear on the vehicle and thus, spending $100k+ for a vehicle seems like a waste of money.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

1960s Lotus Europa, it was one of the first sports cars I remember admiring as a kid & also one of the toy cars I had. I liked it's low slung, sleek lines, and the flatbed formed by the rear engine, and the slit of a rear window, and I still do....one day, she will be mine....

https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/at...-lotus-europa-special-jps-livery-img_0457.jpg


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## WouldaShoulda (Aug 5, 2009)

Any vintage Mercedes Pagoda SL will do...

(Gosh, I just noticed the house this swell car is parked in front of is horrible!!)



Snow Hill Pond said:


> But is it fun to drive? Fun, like going down a curvy country road at 70 mph, up and down hillocks pushing the engine to a throaty roar?


No, fun like going down route 52 at 50 mph, up and down hillocks on the way to the point to point races at Winterthur!!


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## eagle2250 (Mar 24, 2006)

Twenty-four posts in a thread, titled "What is your favorite sports car" and as yet no mention of that incomparable American sports machine...the Corvette? I loved that beast, but at this point in my life am just to cheap to carry the associated freight (read as 'cost of') for such a luxury!


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## Hitch (Apr 25, 2012)

Favoring the underdog I've always liked the Griffith GT.


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## pleasehelp (Sep 8, 2005)

eagle2250 said:


> Twenty-four posts in a thread, titled "What is your favorite sports car" and as yet no mention of that incomparable American sports machine...the Corvette? I loved that beast, but at this point in my life am just to cheap to carry the associated freight (read as 'cost of') for such a luxury!


Vettes are really amazing cars. The new ones compare favorably to many of the world's supercars for a small fraction of the price, and the high-end ones (or the aftermarkey tuned ones) are among the fastest, and most capable handling, cars in the entire world. Many of the old ones are among the most iconic cars in the world. Not necessarily a "favorite" for me, but I hope to acquire a few particular models at some point in my life.


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## Gurdon (Feb 7, 2005)

Earl of Ormonde said:


> 1960s Lotus Europa, it was one of the first sports cars I remember admiring as a kid & also one of the toy cars I had. I liked it's low slung, sleek lines, and the flatbed formed by the rear engine, and the slit of a rear window, and I still do....one day, she will be mine....
> 
> https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/at...-lotus-europa-special-jps-livery-img_0457.jpg


You might look into an Elise. It is an extremely well executed modern reliable Lotus. I was smitten from the time I first saw them at the LA Auto Show prior to their introduction to the US market.

It embodies Chapman's approach of low overall weight and high power to weight ratio, exceptional handling and reasonable cost. In many ways the Elise is a throwback to his 1960's cars, particularly the Europa, before Chapman started building cars for the well to do. It handles better than the Europa, is solid with good build quality, and was extremely reliable during the time I owned it.

If I'd driven mine more frequently than I was doing I'd have kept it. Although as I wrote above, I find the Seven more appealing to my sense of what constitutes a sports car. I don't regret selling the Elise, I do regret having sold the Seven.

Regards,
Gurdon


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## gaseousclay (Nov 8, 2009)

eagle2250 said:


> Twenty-four posts in a thread, titled "What is your favorite sports car" and as yet no mention of that incomparable American sports machine...the Corvette? I loved that beast, but at this point in my life am just to cheap to carry the associated freight (read as 'cost of') for such a luxury!


one of my neighbors has a mint white 60's Corvette. coindentally, when I went to the body shop to get an estimate on damage to my car I saw my neighbor's Corvette pictured in their look book. apparently my neighbor's oldest son had stolen his Corvette and smashed it to hell. he ended up paying $30k to have it completely restored. some people have too much time and money to be blowing $30k on fixing a car.


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## Joseph Peter (Mar 26, 2012)

Shaver said:


> *M-505 Adams Brothers Probe 16*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Outstanding reference, Mr. Shaver....or should I say, Mr. Deltoid?


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## fishertw (Jan 27, 2006)

Owned two miatas and a 2011 Audi TT. The TT was fun to drive but no match for putting the top down on a miata and being on the Blue Ridge Parkway in two minutes from my house.
Tom


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## Snow Hill Pond (Aug 10, 2011)

fishertw said:


> Owned two miatas and a 2011 Audi TT. The TT was fun to drive but no match for putting the top down on a miata and being on the Blue Ridge Parkway in two minutes from my house.
> Tom


I think you're on the right track. A good sportscar (in my opinion) must be one that can be driven for pure fun.


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## my19 (Nov 11, 2009)

Snow Hill Pond said:


> I think you're on the right track. A good sportscar (in my opinion) must be one that can be driven for pure fun.


... and with the top down.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Gurdon said:


> The Lotus Europa which I had prior to the Seven handled far better than it did, but durability and reliability were not good.


One common complaint I often hear and read about the Europa is that it gets extremely warm in that small cockpit with the engine at your back.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

This is the top-end sports vehicle I currently pilot around central Sweden

https://i471.photobucket.com/albums/rr72/James_de_B/Focus008.jpg


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## adoucett (Nov 16, 2012)

A couple years ago, I _really_ wanted one of these:

The Alfa Romeo Spider Veloce

Don't poke too much fun now! I still think it's a fantastic looking car...and one I may actually be able to afford versus something a little more exotic like a Ferrari (although if I could have one of those, the 365 Daytona would rank highly)


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

As much as I like the idea of an Alfa Spyder, I just can't get past the MG nose on it. I've always seen the MG for what it is, a family car with a sportscar nose, an awful machine. You know the MG had exactly the same engine and running gear as the small Austin and Morris saloon cars.


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## stephenkarl (Dec 21, 2011)

I love the look of the current Aston Martin generation (especially the one-77...) and the Maserati Granturismo MC Stradale, but I would have to say my current favourite is the Audi R8 because I know I fit in it.


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## phyrpowr (Aug 30, 2009)

While I've never owned or even driven one, I still think the Austin Healey 3000 is the most sports car looking sports car ever.


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## Regillus (Mar 15, 2011)

1971 Pantera Pre-L


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## 127.72 MHz (Feb 16, 2007)

If I had to put my finger on just one "Quintessential" sports car it would have to be any year 911. (And I must say that I have several favorite sports cars.) But it would be hard times indeed before I would part with my AMG SLK32. I love this car.


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## herfitup (Mar 4, 2012)

Earl of Ormonde said:


> One common complaint I often hear and read about the Europa is that it gets extremely warm in that small cockpit with the engine at your back.


I had a 1970's Porche 914 that never had that problem. You almost couldn't get any heat out of the air-cooled engine.


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## 127.72 MHz (Feb 16, 2007)

^^ As a veteran of more air cooled VWs than I can recall you're was/is a common problem. There are things one can do to help with the issue but the fact that they are air cooled dictates than heating for the occupants will always be an issue.


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## tocqueville (Nov 15, 2009)

pleasehelp said:


> Vettes are really amazing cars. The new ones compare favorably to many of the world's supercars for a small fraction of the price, and the high-end ones (or the aftermarkey tuned ones) are among the fastest, and most capable handling, cars in the entire world. Many of the old ones are among the most iconic cars in the world. Not necessarily a "favorite" for me, but I hope to acquire a few particular models at some point in my life.


I read in a car review of a Corvette something that really nailed it: Corvettes are cars made by people who have never been in a Porsche for people who have never been in a Porsche. I don't argue with the performance specs, but the fit and finish and the interior design have always been a joke. A pure 911 is a thing of beauty.

On another note, I once got a ride from a guy in a 1970s Ferrari. Super model gorgeous. What struck me though, was how the engine and car complained all while we drove through London...until we finally got far enough away from the city to open it up. At some point above, maybe, 80 MPH, all those bits that had been growling in disharmony began to harmonize. It was glorious.


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## pleasehelp (Sep 8, 2005)

tocqueville said:


> I read in a car review of a Corvette something that really nailed it: Corvettes are cars made by people who have never been in a Porsche for people who have never been in a Porsche. I don't argue with the performance specs, but the fit and finish and the interior design have always been a joke. A pure 911 is a thing of beauty.


That's an interesting comparison with Porsche - can't say I agree, but I suspect that they were comparing the more modern ones and focusing on interior build quality. In my opinion, the early Corvettes (e.g., pre-1970) had nicer interiors than the 911s. From ~1970 until approx 1999, both Corvettes and 911s had pretty unimpressive interiors (the C3 Corvettes I've seen from that straddled that time seemed to get worse as they got newer, but that may be because the owners cared for them less). In 1999 Porsche came out with the 996 model 911, and that it the first time that that they started to have a pseudo-refined/luxurious build, however many Porsche purists say that the 996 is where Porsche lost its way. The Corvette took major leaps forward with the design C-5 (circa 1997) in everything but the interior, which remained pretty cheesy. So from 1999 until present, I suppose the criticism is valid for comparing the interiors. However, from a driving/engineering standpoint, the Corvette is a very impressive machine that can handle itself against the 911.

My current 911 falls into the unimpressive-interior category, but it has a ton of character. Tough for me to imagine getting rid of that car even as I add others.


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## Stirling Newberry (Mar 4, 2013)

It depends on the purpose. Automotive design is about trade offs, power means more weight, lower torque band means less top end horsepower, oversteer versus understeer. Convertible? Luxurious interior? Riotous launch? Handling in turns? For the track, or for street use? The same cars don't dominate across the board in racing, because each automobile is a tool. There is also the sense of the machine itself, do you like crisp short throws from the gearbox? Instant response from naturally aspirated, the zip of a supercharger, or the top end of a turbo? These are aesthetic decisions. One can have a wonderful driving experience with a vintage sports car whose engine puts out less than some renditions of the Fiat 500, and there are supercars that are numb bullet trains for people who commute down the autobahn. 

The current 911 is a faster, cleaner, easier to handle machine than earlier models, but the attention and connect is less. The Corvette is a blue collar interior, and in its Z1 incarnation a nervous beast, but in the right hands it is a very impressive tool all the way to the limit. Both machines offer beauties of their own. The 911 envelopes you, the Corvette challenges you. Both amazing works of engineering.


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## pleasehelp (Sep 8, 2005)

Stirling Newberry said:


> It depends on the purpose. Automotive design is about trade offs, power means more weight, lower torque band means less top end horsepower, oversteer versus understeer. Convertible? Luxurious interior? Riotous launch? Handling in turns? For the track, or for street use? The same cars don't dominate across the board in racing, because each automobile is a tool. There is also the sense of the machine itself, do you like crisp short throws from the gearbox? Instant response from naturally aspirated, the zip of a supercharger, or the top end of a turbo? These are aesthetic decisions. One can have a wonderful driving experience with a vintage sports car whose engine puts out less than some renditions of the Fiat 500, and there are supercars that are numb bullet trains for people who commute down the autobahn.
> 
> The current 911 is a faster, cleaner, easier to handle machine than earlier models, but the attention and connect is less. The Corvette is a blue collar interior, and in its Z1 incarnation a nervous beast, but in the right hands it is a very impressive tool all the way to the limit. Both machines offer beauties of their own. The 911 envelopes you, the Corvette challenges you. Both amazing works of engineering.


Interesting that you view the Corvette as more challenging. The 911 is so fundamentally flawed in its layout that it can get you in a boatload of trouble if you don't know what you're doing when pushing the car. I remember distinctly the first time I lost my tailend in a 911 - very different feeling. In fact, the challenge of the 911 is what drew me to it. I think the Corvette is a relatively easy car to drive in that it has excellent balance, steering, braking, etc. However, reasonably minds may differ.


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## pleasehelp (Sep 8, 2005)

Stirling Newberry said:


> It depends on the purpose. Automotive design is about trade offs, power means more weight, lower torque band means less top end horsepower, oversteer versus understeer. Convertible? Luxurious interior? Riotous launch? Handling in turns? For the track, or for street use? The same cars don't dominate across the board in racing, because each automobile is a tool. There is also the sense of the machine itself, do you like crisp short throws from the gearbox? Instant response from naturally aspirated, the zip of a supercharger, or the top end of a turbo? These are aesthetic decisions. One can have a wonderful driving experience with a vintage sports car whose engine puts out less than some renditions of the Fiat 500, and there are supercars that are numb bullet trains for people who commute down the autobahn.
> 
> The current 911 is a faster, cleaner, easier to handle machine than earlier models, but the attention and connect is less. The Corvette is a blue collar interior, and in its Z1 incarnation a nervous beast, but in the right hands it is a very impressive tool all the way to the limit. Both machines offer beauties of their own. The 911 envelopes you, the Corvette challenges you. Both amazing works of engineering.


Interesting that you view the Corvette as more challenging. The 911 is so fundamentally flawed in its layout that it can get you in a boatload of trouble if you don't know what you're doing when pushing the car. I remember distinctly the first time I lost my tailend in a 911 - very different feeling. In fact, the challenge of the 911 is what drew me to it. I think the Corvette is a relatively easy car to drive in that it has excellent balance, steering, braking, etc. However, reasonably minds may differ.


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## Stirling Newberry (Mar 4, 2013)

The current 991 is a vastly easier car to drive, particularly the 4 and 4s, than any previous 911 platform. The hydro-mounts on the engine deal with some of the wayward habits of the engine mounting. The manual has auto rev matching. There are Audi-like electronic stability control breaking that make entering turns vastly easier. These and other changes add up to a distinctly different feel to the car from the 997 platform. I have not had a chance to drive a production stingray, but it does not have the same focus on ease of use. The C6 based ZR1, likewise, does not make concession to lack of driving precision, and becomes more difficult to handle well before the limit. Perhaps it is better that the car communicates that the window is getting narrow, where the the 911 whispers in your ear what a great driver you are until grip goes to zero...

Given a choice of Porsche vehicles for US road driving, the Boxster with a few modifications would be my choice, even the S is too powerful for the American. But for various reasons, I understand the cult of the 911 on the track, even though I am not a member. Perhaps because I will never be wealthy enough to push a GT3 off a cliff.

What the rear mount of the classic 911 layout gets you is that enveloping feeling, because downforce from momentum increases with speed. It's close to floating, but it doesn't make turns easier. But "If you wanted more understeer, you should have bought the Audi..."


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## pleasehelp (Sep 8, 2005)

Stirling Newberry said:


> The current 991 is a vastly easier car to drive, particularly the 4 and 4s, than any previous 911 platform. The hydro-mounts on the engine deal with some of the wayward habits of the engine mounting. The manual has auto rev matching. There are Audi-like electronic stability control breaking that make entering turns vastly easier. These and other changes add up to a distinctly different feel to the car from the 997 platform. I have not had a chance to drive a production stingray, but it does not have the same focus on ease of use. The C6 based ZR1, likewise, does not make concession to lack of driving precision, and becomes more difficult to handle well before the limit. Perhaps it is better that the car communicates that the window is getting narrow, where the the 911 whispers in your ear what a great driver you are until grip goes to zero...
> 
> Given a choice of Porsche vehicles for US road driving, the Boxster with a few modifications would be my choice, even the S is too powerful for the American. But for various reasons, I understand the cult of the 911 on the track, even though I am not a member. Perhaps because I will never be wealthy enough to push a GT3 off a cliff.
> 
> What the rear mount of the classic 911 layout gets you is that enveloping feeling, because downforce from momentum increases with speed. It's close to floating, but it doesn't make turns easier. But "If you wanted more understeer, you should have bought the Audi..."


Interesting description. Way different than my experience in either car (particularly my experience in 911s, which is almost the opposite), but I admit to having zero time in a 991. I've been toying with the idea of looking into a 991 turbo when it becomes available, but I'll need to spend some time in one first (and wait for it to be on the market a little while to see where the issues are). I assume you have a 991 - did you have a previous 911 to contrast it with? Have you enjoyed what sounds like a completely different car form previous 911s?


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## Stirling Newberry (Mar 4, 2013)

pleasehelp said:


> Interesting description. Way different than my experience in either car (particularly my experience in 911s, which is almost the opposite), but I admit to having zero time in a 991. I've been toying with the idea of looking into a 991 turbo when it becomes available, but I'll need to spend some time in one first (and wait for it to be on the market a little while to see where the issues are). I assume you have a 991 - did you have a previous 911 to contrast it with? Have you enjoyed what sounds like a completely different car form previous 911s?


Have no, have tracked, yes. I neither make enough money, nor am I even remotely close to good enough to be a professional driver. HPDE insurance is expensive enough for GRM.

The newest version isn't a completely different car, but it is different. The steering, isn't the same. I know people who feel the 993 was the last "true" nuenelfer, with all of the, um, character intact. Other people like it because it is more, well, a super car. Where did you track yours?


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## herfitup (Mar 4, 2012)

Not the right size to fit in a Porche anymore. Hell, I don't fit in my wife's Celica. I'll stick to my 1999 Mercedes E55. Enough power to get me up to speed when I need it and only another 5 seconds to 100. At my age I don't have much need to go over 100 mph anymore. Nice cross between sports car performance and comfort.


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## Stirling Newberry (Mar 4, 2013)

pichao said:


> What is your favourite sports car?
> 
> Here is one favourite of mine, a 1969 Fiat 124 Spider that I recently aquired...
> 
> ...


Very nice, a classic car.

Sadly it is still a bit chilly here for driving with the top down.


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## pleasehelp (Sep 8, 2005)

Stirling Newberry said:


> Have no, have tracked, yes. I neither make enough money, nor am I even remotely close to good enough to be a professional driver. HPDE insurance is expensive enough for GRM.
> 
> The newest version isn't a completely different car, but it is different. The steering, isn't the same. I know people who feel the 993 was the last "true" nuenelfer, with all of the, um, character intact. Other people like it because it is more, well, a super car. Where did you track yours?


I see. I have a friend that has offered me the opportunity to track his 991, probably at Lime Rock, so maybe I'll take him up on that.

I don't track my 993 for a variety of reasons.


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## Stirling Newberry (Mar 4, 2013)

pleasehelp said:


> I see. I have a friend that has offered me the opportunity to track his 991, probably at Lime Rock, so maybe I'll take him up on that.
> 
> I don't track my 993 for a variety of reasons.


The Connecticut Valley group is large and active, and well known to be among the friendlier ones.


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