# Trad Presidential Candidate?



## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

I was just watching a Rand Paul video (Senator from KY and 2016 presidential Candidate) and he was wearing a Brooks Brothers OCBD (it had the logo on the chest). In a lot of the other shots he was wearing OCBD shirts. I have no idea he was so trad. I just googled him and in nearly all of his pics he is wearing an OCBD.





He needs a little help on his hair. But, as a guy with curly hair, I feel his pain!


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## WouldaShoulda (Aug 5, 2009)

Jeans with a tie??


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

Wilder hair, better collar roll:


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

WouldaShoulda said:


> Jeans with a tie??


Its a campaign strategy. It makes him down to earth and ready to roll up his sleeves and get to work. It wouldn't be my choice, campaigns are carefully crafted. But, I think his trad style is genuine (minus the jeans) as the vast majority of his pictures he appears to dress trad.


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## Tempest (Aug 16, 2012)

I think I've seen him in a button down featuring the Hilfiger flag too, so let's not overstate things. But he's certainly the tradliest candidate in recent memory.


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

Oh my lord, that jeans and tie look is not trad. I don't know what it is, but it is not trad and it is not good. The fit and the tuck of his shirt is awful, and I don't know what he's attempting with the sloppy sleeve rolling. It's sort of an FFA-kid dresses up with Dad's tie look. 

He fails even when he dresses up, if the second photo is any indication. Come on--not even an attempt at a tie dimple, and tighten it up to the collar band, dammit.

Maybe we can get Hillary to wear OCBDs, Muffy-style.


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

Tempest said:


> I think I've seen him in a button down featuring the Hilfiger flag too, so let's not overstate things. But he's certainly the tradliest candidate in recent memory.





Duvel said:


> Oh my lord, that jeans and tie look is not trad. I don't know what it is, but it is not trad and it is not good. The fit and the tuck of his shirt is awful, and I don't know what he's attempting with the sloppy sleeve rolling. It's sort of an FFA-kid dresses up with Dad's tie look.
> 
> He fails even when he dresses up, if the second photo is any indication. Come on--not even an attempt at a tie dimple, and tighten it up to the collar band, dammit.
> 
> Maybe we can get Hillary to wear OCBDs, Muffy-style.


I hope you are not suggesting that wearing a single item disqualifies someone as dressing Trad.


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## Tempest (Aug 16, 2012)

Nobleprofessor said:


> I hope you are not suggesting that wearing a single item disqualifies someone as dressing Trad.


Magenta velour will do that, I'd think.


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

Nobleprofessor said:


> I hope you are not suggesting that wearing a single item disqualifies someone as dressing Trad.


No more than wearing a single item qualifies someone as dressing Trad.



Tempest said:


> But he's certainly the tradliest candidate in recent memory.


I don't know how we're defining recent memory, but I would say Howard Dean is at least on par.










If we're going to expand this out, I would say the current front runner for the "Preppiest Politician" award would probably be Jeff Duncan, who appears to actually know how a suit should fit.


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

On a side note, how do we feel about the beatnik-y thing? I was thinking about maybe getting a thin turtleneck to wear under sport jackets. I'd probably do a full turtleneck, rather than a mock.


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## 32rollandrock (May 1, 2008)

Mr. Paul's shirt features a visible logo. And what do we have for our departing contestant?


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

I am. But no more than wearing a single item _qualifies_ someone as dressing Trad.

He's wearing a BB shirt of questionable quality and fit and execution of wear. The shirt is probably from the outlet. And so he's trad?



Nobleprofessor said:


> I hope you are not suggesting that wearing a single item disqualifies someone as dressing Trad.


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

Duvel said:


> I am. But no more than wearing a single item _qualifies_ someone as dressing Trad.
> 
> He's wearing a BB shirt of questionable quality and fit and execution of wear. The shirt is probably from the outlet. And so he's trad?


Nope. He's not trad. He is just a fairly well known Senator and presidential candidate that wears mostly OCBD. But, he departs from the rigid adherence of TNSIL occasionally so he doesn't make the grade.


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## FLMike (Sep 17, 2008)

Nobleprofessor said:


> Nope. He's not trad. He is just a fairly well known Senator and presidential candidate that wears mostly OCBD. But, he departs from the rigid adherence of TNSIL occasionally so he doesn't make the grade.


When you say he wears mostly OCBDs, are you actually saying he mostly wears shirts made of oxford cloth, or just that most of his dress shirts have button-down collars?


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

Well, he doesn't make the grade, for more reasons than what he wears. But we won't go there.



Nobleprofessor said:


> Nope. He's not trad. He is just a fairly well known Senator and presidential candidate that wears mostly OCBD. But, he departs from the rigid adherence of TNSIL occasionally so he doesn't make the grade.


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## Tiger (Apr 11, 2010)

Duvel said:


> Well, he doesn't make the grade, for more reasons than what he wears. But we won't go there.


May not be "trad" in the sense we use it, yet far superior to the empty, um, suits of both parties, "for other reasons." Still love his dad much more, though...


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## thegovteach (Dec 2, 2012)

Want a trad President? TR....had his military uniforms made by Brooks Brothers.


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

Well, he's no Barry Goldwater, but then again, who could be?



Tiger said:


> May not be "trad" in the sense we use it, yet far superior to the empty, um, suits of both parties, "for other reasons." Still love his dad much more, though...


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

thegovteach said:


> Want a trad President? TR....had his military uniforms made by Brooks Brothers.





Duvel said:


> Well, he's no Barry Goldwater, but then again, who could be?


Teddy Roosevelt and Barry Goldwater were both unique individuals and there will probably never be someone like them. I remember reading the story about a certain former Vice President that had AUH20 on his license plate.


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

LOL. Indeed. Blow-em-up Barry, is what my dad used to call him.

I remember him (my dad) whooping for joy as we watched the LBJ landslide take shape.



Nobleprofessor said:


> Teddy Roosevelt and *Barry Goldwater were both unique individuals *and there will probably never be someone like them. I remember reading the story about a certain former Vice President that had AUH20 on his license plate.


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## Howard (Dec 7, 2004)

WouldaShoulda said:


> Jeans with a tie??


I think it's a good look.


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

Duvel said:


> LOL. Indeed. Blow-em-up Barry, is what my dad used to call him.
> 
> I remember him (my dad) whooping for joy as we watched the LBJ landslide take shape.


The attacks on Barry reached their despicable culmination when LBJ's campaign ran the Daisy Ad. The "Daisy Ad" was widely criticized as the benchmark for dirty campaign ads. It was so widely criticized the Campaign took it down the next day. But, of course, the attention it garnered only caused many more people to be in interested in it.


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

Well, for all Barry's obvious faults, at least he never wore jeans with a tie. That we know of. I frankly think he would have done this country so much harm (and possibly the world) that we'd never have recovered. LBJ was what we needed, and he was a great president in his own right, in spite of his awful handling of the war.


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

Tell us more about how this is a good look, Howard. Just curious how you see it.



Howard said:


> I think it's a good look.


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

Duvel said:


> Well, for all Barry's obvious faults, at least he never wore jeans with a tie. That we know of. I frankly think he would have done this country so much harm (and possibly the world) that we'd never have recovered. LBJ was what we needed, and he was a great president in his own right, in spite of his awful handling of the war.


Barry would certainly have been very different than LBJ. I am not sure I agree that LBJ was what we needed. BUT, may have been a better choice than Barry. One thing that is odd is how much love or hate is directed towards LBJ (and Barry for that matter). My father rarely gets fired up about politics. He will make occasional comments about a certain politician that he likes. But, nothing very strong. UNLESS, you ask him about LBJ. He hates LBJ. Of course, he served in Viet Nam and my Uncle was killed there. I don't know if its fair or not, but my father always blamed LBJ for how badly the war went.


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

Can we move this to the interchange already?


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

Let's hear what Howard says about the tie-and-jeans look first.


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

Duvel said:


> Let's hear what Howard says about the tie-and-jeans look first.


Arguments in favor of a tie with jeans:










Arguments against:


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

Also, for what it's worth, there's this TFM, brah:


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

L-feld said:


> Arguments in favor of a tie with jeans:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I thought you wanted to move this?


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## Bama87 (Oct 18, 2014)

L-feld said:


> Also, for what it's worth, there's this TFM, brah:


Shorts to long and incorrect material/pattern to be TFM, brah.


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

L-field, even Mr. Costello and Mr. Warhol cannot redeem the look.


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## Tiger (Apr 11, 2010)

Duvel said:


> Well, for all Barry's obvious faults, at least he never wore jeans with a tie. That we know of. I frankly think he would have done this country so much harm (and possibly the world) that we'd never have recovered. LBJ was what we needed, and he was a great president in his own right, in spite of his awful handling of the war.


We should either move this to the Interchange - perhaps under the heading of "Abject Failures as President" - or to an insane asylum...


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

It's like, "Ah, crap, I forgot the trousers."



Bama87 said:


> Shorts to long and incorrect material/pattern to be TFM, brah.


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## Bama87 (Oct 18, 2014)

Everyone sing along: "If it touches the knee, its not okay with me"


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## Tiger (Apr 11, 2010)

Rand Paul really looks terrible in some of these pictures - what the heck is he (sartorially) thinking?


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## FLMike (Sep 17, 2008)

L-feld said:


>


You could make an entire shirt for Orange Fury out of the excess fabric on that shirt!


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## Bama87 (Oct 18, 2014)

I want to know what is on that tie. Jellyfish?


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

Bama87 said:


> Shorts to long and incorrect material/pattern to be TFM, brah.


I guess there is no hope for Randal.



Nobleprofessor said:


> I thought you wanted to move this?


I do. Then we can take the kid gloves off!



FLCracka said:


> You could make an entire shirt for Orange Fury out of the excess fabric on that shirt!


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

Maybe I was not clear about my post. I was not suggesting he is a paragon of trad or TNSIL. I thought it was interesting that a major political candidate dresses in a way that leans toward trad. I pointed out he had a brooks brothers shirt on and many of his shirts appear to be OCBD (and yes some of them appear that way to me). I was posting something I found interesting, not suggesting that he represents the trad standard bearer.


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

Duvel said:


> All well and good, professor, if this look even leaned toward trad. I don't see how it does.


You can never leave well enough alone, can you?


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## WillBarrett (Feb 18, 2012)

Duvel said:


> Well, for all Barry's obvious faults, at least he never wore jeans with a tie. That we know of. I frankly think he would have done this country so much harm (and possibly the world) that we'd never have recovered. LBJ was what we needed, and he was a great president in his own right, in spite of his awful handling of the war.


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## FLMike (Sep 17, 2008)

Nobleprofessor said:


> You can never leave well enough alone, can you?


Once you realize that and just accept it, it will cease to bother you. Kinda.


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

Apologies. I was only expressing my opinions, as I thought others were. I did not mean to offend anyone.

It would be really cool, though, if you could just accept what I say and then let it cease to bother you. Kinda.

For the record, though, for my part, I will concede to the professor and say that, okay, a tie with jeans and an ocbd leans toward trad. Kinda.


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

WouldaShoulda said:


> Jeans with a tie??





Duvel said:


> Oh my lord, that jeans and tie look is not trad. I don't know what it is, but it is not trad and it is not good. The fit and the tuck of his shirt is awful, and I don't know what he's attempting with the sloppy sleeve rolling. It's sort of an FFA-kid dresses up with Dad's tie look.
> 
> He fails even when he dresses up, if the second photo is any indication. Come on--not even an attempt at a tie dimple, and tighten it up to the collar band, dammit.
> 
> Maybe we can get Hillary to wear OCBDs, Muffy-style.





Duvel said:


> Apologies. I was only expressing my opinions, as I thought others were. I did not mean to offend anyone.
> 
> It would be really cool, though, if you could just accept what I say and then let it cease to bother you. Kinda.
> 
> For the record, though, for my part, I will concede to the professor and say that, okay, a tie with jeans and an ocbd leans toward trad. Kinda.


For those of you bemoaning Jeans with a tie, you may want to tell some forum members your opinions:

https://askandyaboutclothes.com/community/showthread.php?48726-A-Trad-What-are-you-Wearing&p=1289507#post1289507


https://askandyaboutclothes.com/community/showthread.php?62656-What-Are-You-Wearing-Today&p=864680#post864680


https://askandyaboutclothes.com/community/showthread.php?48726-A-Trad-What-are-you-Wearing&p=1175254#post1175254


https://askandyaboutclothes.com/community/showthread.php?48726-A-Trad-What-are-you-Wearing&p=1276561#post1276561


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

Nobleprofessor, I have to apologize, because in retrospect, I realize that it is a mistake for me to give the impression that I "know" what "trad" is. I don't think I can do that anymore than you can. However, I can say this for certain: it's a look I don't like. I also think those are terrible looking outfits, the examples you've posted. Regardless of whatever esteemed Forum member is wearing the look, it remains--in my view--not a good look.


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

Duvel said:


> Nobleprofessor, I have to apologize, because in retrospect, I realize that it is a mistake for me to give the impression that I "know" what "trad" is. I don't think I can do that anymore than you can. However, I can say this for certain: it's a look I don't like. I also think those are terrible looking outfits, the examples you've posted. Regardless of whatever esteemed Forum member is wearing the look, it remains--in my view--not a good look.


no need to apologize to me, I don't wear ties with jeans. I do wear Blazers with jeans a lot. But only REAL Blazers (that is supposed to be funny).


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

Nobleprofessor said:


> no need to apologize to me, I don't wear ties with jeans. I do wear Blazers with jeans a lot. But only REAL Blazers (that is supposed to be funny).


Also known as "the Biden."


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## Adventure Wolf (Feb 26, 2014)

Jeans should not be worn with a sports coat, a suit jacket or a tie. It is a major fashion no-no. It looks terrible on anyone and everyone.


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

Adventure Wolf said:


> Jeans should not be worn with a sports coat, a suit jacket or a tie. It is a major fashion no-no. It looks terrible on anyone and everyone.


^ especially as shown above! That's just terrible.

If one absolutely must do it, don't do it wearing the same pair worn when mowing the lawn.


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

Adventure Wolf said:


> Jeans should not be worn with a sports coat, a suit jacket or a tie. It is a major fashion no-no. It looks terrible on anyone and everyone.


No jeans with a blazer even without a tie? That's a pretty bold statement and I don't think you will find much support for it. There are LOTS of forum members wearing blazers/Sport Coats and Jeans posted in the what are you wearing thread.

And a "fashion no-no"? By what standard? Who's "fashion" aesthetic? Many people in "fashion" would consider most elements of TRAD as being not in fashion.


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## Oldsport (Jan 3, 2012)

^ And so it starts again, nearly what 3-4 threads just in the last two weeks....

It's ok it you can't wear jeans and look good. It's really ok.


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## Tiger (Apr 11, 2010)

Triathlete said:


> ^ And so it starts again, nearly what 3-4 threads just in the last two weeks....


We're at the point where a thread on the existence of God would lead to a discussion of jeans and sport coats!


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

Triathlete said:


> ^ And so it starts again, nearly what 3-4 threads just in the last two weeks....
> 
> It's ok it you can't wear jeans and look good. It's really ok.





Tiger said:


> We're at the point where a thread on the existence of God would lead to a discussion of jeans and sport coats!


I must be missing something. I haven't seen any threads on Jeans and Blazers. But, I haven't read every thread recently either.


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## Oldsport (Jan 3, 2012)

^ Well, you really can't miss them. Has caused quite the rift between forum members. It's a hot topic.


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## FLMike (Sep 17, 2008)

:deadhorse-a::fool:


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

Triathlete said:


> ^ Well, you really can't miss them. Has caused quite the rift between forum members. It's a hot topic.


Hmmm. I guess I didn't see them. I started this thread because I thought it was interesting. I had no intention of getting into a war over jeans and Blazers. The comment about them caught me off guard because I thought lots of people wore jeans and blazers. But, if it has been discussed ad nauseum, then I see no reason to keep stoking the fire.


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## ocbdocd (Sep 4, 2010)

IMO Howard Dean and John Bolton are hands down the best dressed. With either we'd have the best dressed president since Bush 1 or Kennedy.


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## Tiger (Apr 11, 2010)

Duvel said:


> How does party affiliation (among the politicians, not the populace) line up with store choices? Brooks = Democrat, J. Press = Republican? O'Connell's, Andover = either? Tea Party = Walmart?


Any other cheapshots, Duvel?


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## Tiger (Apr 11, 2010)

Duvel said:


> Sorry. I assumed there would not be Tea Party folks among us. Cheap shot? Yes, it was. But no, I don't have anymore. *Backing up slowly, easing out the door* But I do wonder, seriously, if there isn't a kind of correlation?


You may wish to cease assuming - you're quite poor at it, even in this last post. I happen to be a traditional constitutionalist with a libertarian stripe, a la former Rep. Ron Paul. The term "Tea Party" is used, unfortunately, as a one-size-fits-all sobriquet, when there are so many varieties of "Tea Partiers" that I have no idea what the term means. For instance, Dr. Paul and Ted Cruz would disagree on almost every aspect of foreign policy, but both have been labelled "Tea Party" candidates. Incredibly silly...

If you'll forgive the paralipsis, Duvel, I'll refrain from associating liberal democratic garb with the sartorial choices of Mao and Castro!


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

At the risk of _continuing _ to do poorly at making, ahem, assumptions, I will venture to say that you are probably correct, at least in the latter reference. John Bolton is solidly "trad," as we say. Howard Dean can dress well but I think he tends to look just nicely presentable and not necessarily stylish or "trad-ish."



ocbdocd said:


> IMO Howard Dean and John Bolton are hands down the best dressed. With either we'd have the best dressed president since Bush 1 or Kennedy.


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## Himself (Mar 2, 2011)

L-feld said:


> Also known as "the Biden."


I am deeply sorry for every time I've worn a blazer with jeans! (Thankfully not that many.)


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## watchnerd (Mar 18, 2015)

Nobleprofessor said:


> No jeans with a blazer even without a tie? That's a pretty bold statement and I don't think you will find much support for it. There are LOTS of forum members wearing blazers/Sport Coats and Jeans posted in the what are you wearing thread.
> 
> And a "fashion no-no"? By what standard? Who's "fashion" aesthetic? Many people in "fashion" would consider most elements of TRAD as being not in fashion.


His Royal Highness, the Duke of Cambridge, AKA, Prince William, finds it perfectly acceptable to wear jeans with a blazer:


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## FLMike (Sep 17, 2008)

watchnerd said:


> His Royal Highness, the Duke of Cambridge, AKA, Prince William, finds it perfectly acceptable to wear jeans with a blazer:


I am definitely digging the jeans and blazer here, but did you say there's a guy in this picture? I didn't notice one.


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

Tiger said:


> You may wish to cease assuming - you're quite poor at it, even in this last post. I happen to be a traditional constitutionalist with a libertarian stripe, a la former Rep. Ron Paul. The term "Tea Party" is used, unfortunately, as a one-size-fits-all sobriquet, when there are so many varieties of "Tea Partiers" that I have no idea what the term means. For instance, Dr. Paul and Ted Cruz would disagree on almost every aspect of foreign policy, but both have been labelled "Tea Party" candidates. Incredibly silly...
> 
> If you'll forgive the paralipsis, Duvel, I'll refrain from associating liberal democratic garb with the sartorial choices of Mao and Castro!


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## Tempest (Aug 16, 2012)

Biden always looks like a million bucks.
Did anybody catch the story about evil Luxoticca making the Rand Paul campaign stop selling Ray-Bans to which they'd added the Rand brand?


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

Ha ha!


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

Tempest said:


> Biden always looks like a million bucks.
> Did anybody catch the story about evil Luxoticca making the Rand Paul campaign stop selling Ray-Bans to which they'd added the Rand brand?


Good. He should be selling American-made Shuron sidewinders, anyway.


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## fred johnson (Jul 22, 2009)

watchnerd said:


> His Royal Highness, the Duke of Cambridge, AKA, Prince William, finds it perfectly acceptable to wear jeans with a blazer:


Might as well add my 1 cent:
I don't think his father would.

and.. +for Dr. Ron Paul and + for John Bolton's trad look.


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## Captain America (Aug 28, 2012)

I just never wear jeans. Don't own a pair.

I DO wish candidates would get away from the old Clinton-Gore "dress like you all folks" tack. I want leadership, not the guy next door.


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

Yes, good point. It sounds elitist to say this, but in a way, I want our leaders to look a bit elitist, in dress and manner. I'm a dyed-in-the-wool Democrat, but, yes, I think the "guy next door" look on presidents is a terrible idea, as is the idea that they are somehow "part of us." They're not--they're leaders, and while they may represent us, they are distinctly _not us_ because of their choice to rise above and lead us. I don't mean to sound facetious in saying this, but to put it quite simply, they need to dress classy, with a sense of traditional style.



Captain America said:


> I just never wear jeans. Don't own a pair.
> 
> I DO wish candidates would get away from the old Clinton-Gore "dress like you all folks" tack. I want leadership, not the guy next door.


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

I noticed that President Obama seems to wear the same thing everyday. Then I read an article that confirmed this. He only wears a blue or grey suit. He said he doesn't want to have to make any additional decisions than he has to.


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

Understandable, and smart. It's just too bad he can't still do this with choices that are better looking.


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## Tempest (Aug 16, 2012)

Nobleprofessor said:


> I noticed that President Obama seems to wear the same thing everyday. Then I read an article that confirmed this. He only wears a blue or grey suit. He said he doesn't want to have to make any additional decisions than he has to.


He tried wearing that tan suit once and everybody freaked out.
https://abcnews.go.com/US/social-media-explodes-president-obamas-tan-suit/story?id=25166551


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

Well, yeah, that was kind of a mistake. Press conference. Not the time to try something new. Keep them focused on the news, not what you're wearing.


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

Tempest said:


> He tried wearing that tan suit once and everybody freaked out.
> https://abcnews.go.com/US/social-media-explodes-president-obamas-tan-suit/story?id=25166551


Yeah I remember that. I recall there was quite the active thread on that as well. A couple of things:

1) I don't think many people had seen him in a tan suit before, so it was novel and so worthy of comment.

2) He looked completely washed out and I think it was the choice of tie (at least in my opinion). He looked like he was wearing a bowl of oatmeal.


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

Tempest said:


> He tried wearing that tan suit once and everybody freaked out.
> https://abcnews.go.com/US/social-media-explodes-president-obamas-tan-suit/story?id=25166551


Yea, I saw that. The article referred to that. And I think it reinforced his desire to wear the same thing. Apparently, its not just that he wears a grey or blue suit everyday. He has several identical grey or blue suits. I suppose that would be easy.

"Well, lets see, I wore the grey yesterday, so blue today."


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

Tempest said:


> He tried wearing that tan suit once and everybody freaked out.
> https://abcnews.go.com/US/social-media-explodes-president-obamas-tan-suit/story?id=25166551


I can't find any pictures to confirm, but I remember GWB wearing an air force blue suit and getting a similar reaction.


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

Even the president of the United States sometimes must have to stand naked. Or in an inappropriate suit.



L-feld said:


> I can't find any pictures to confirm, but I remember GWB wearing an air force blue suit and getting a similar reaction.


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## ocbdocd (Sep 4, 2010)

I pretty much entirely agree actually. I partially just really like Dean, even thought I don't think he'll ever run again. Bolton nails the Ivy league look better than anyone I can think of. I personally think Dean is stylish in his lack of anything very noticeable or particularly interesting. The reduced shoulder padding and lack over tailoring are the things I notice and personally emulate. Only people like us would notice his almost always button collar and most everything else goes along with that. Everyone notices Bolton right away with the hair, non rectangular non rimless eyeglass frames, and mustache. I actually like Bolton just for his style even though what he might do with his power serious terrifies me. I do find it funny when he debates with Euro TV and he's there with his minimally styled mop, 2 roll 3, and button down yelling at them because they are so polar opposite of his views. I didn't know they are the same age and both went to Yale, and I think they are friends as a result.

Most Americans don't really like the Ivy league type. You need to have a flag pin and a triple Windsor, open neck and a blazer, or business casual with jeans to win.

I don't really buy Rand Paul as close to those two, but I've got nothing against him. I think it's pretty funny we're talking about basically the most liberal Democrat, the most Nixonian conservative, and the son of every Libertarian's favorite Lib as top contenders for this inane discussion. I find this very interesting since the style we congregate here to discus is so uniquely American, and I have little interest in actual politics and who wins what otherwise.


Duvel said:


> At the risk of _continuing _ to do poorly at making, ahem, assumptions, I will venture to say that you are probably correct, at least in the latter reference. John Bolton is solidly "trad," as we say. Howard Dean can dress well but I think he tends to look just nicely presentable and not necessarily stylish or "trad-ish."


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## WrinkledKhakis (Sep 20, 2014)

How about the one time Republican-then Independent-now Democrat, Lincoln Chafee? Blue-blooded as it gets and he rocks some serious collar rolls.


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## Tempest (Aug 16, 2012)

Rhode Island's Chafee has the style that one would expect of a political blueblood that went from exclusive northeast schooling to shoeing horses.


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

Perhaps the last Rockefeller Republican. A real throwback to the days when bipartisanship was actually a thing and politicians didn't pretend to be yokels.

My favorite story about him is how he voted for Bush Sr. as a write-in in 2004.


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## Yates (Apr 6, 2015)

Lincoln Chaffee is a good choice, as is John Bolton:










Note the William F. Buckley-esque pen/hand gesture. Note the striped tie and OCBD. Here is a man who knows his trad.


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## mankson (Sep 27, 2012)

Yates said:


> Note the William F. Buckley-esque pen/hand gesture. Note the striped tie and OCBD. Here is a man who knows his trad.


Bolton certainly has the trad style down. I'm surprised that he is being taken seriously as a candidate.


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## watchnerd (Mar 18, 2015)

mankson said:


> I'm surprised that he is being taken seriously as a candidate.


I wouldn't say that he is being taken seriously as a candidate.

As far as I"m aware, he hasn't raised any significant funds, nor has he officially declared he is running (or even put together an 'exploratory committee').

Also, I don't think he's ever held an elected office before.


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

^ if I remember correctly, he went to Yale law and was classmates with Bill and Hillary.


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## Yates (Apr 6, 2015)

I may be jumping the gun regarding Bolton's candidacy. He was mentioned in The Economist recently as a possibility for a "utility campaign:" remind 'em you're still around and maybe land a job in the next administration.

Anyway, we have a new contender today, and another Yale alumni, Dr. Ben Carson:










I'm guessing this isn't an official candidacy portrait. In my experience the bow tie tends to be polarizing. What do you think?

And, out of curiosity, are there recent bow-tied presidents? FDR, of course, but since, and for business wear, not formal attire, I'm at a loss.


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## Nobleprofessor (Jul 18, 2014)

I was in Memphis this weekend for my brother's wedding reception. And look who was a guest:



John Bolton!

Actually, he was a neighbor friend of my brother. I told him he looked like John Bolton. He laughed and we talked and I t turns out he is a great guy. He was Elvis's dermatologist. He is still a dermatologist and a great storyteller. And when he heard we were thinking about going to Graceland, he called his friend (who is the CEO of Elvis presley Enterprises) and He set us up with two super VIP tickets to see everything at Graceland!


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## gamma68 (Mar 24, 2013)

Yates said:


> And, out of curiosity, are there recent bow-tied presidents? FDR, of course, but since, and for business wear, not formal attire, I'm at a loss.


It seems the last President who wore bow ties with any regularity (outside of black tie functions) would be Harry Truman:


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## rl1856 (Jun 7, 2005)

It has been my observation that the masses tend to distrust someone who appears to be "Trad" or from a "Trad" background. While politics should be separate from appearance, unfortunately image is everything and "trad" is considered to be out of touch with mainstream America. GHWB was perhaps that last national politician who was and looked "trad" and who was successful. Even then, his advisers made sure that he wore 2 button suits with padded shoulders, and nondescript ties instead of the 3r2 sacks and whimsical patterns he favored. The reaction to Mitt Romney was partly driven by his appearance- he was someone who did not naturally wear a pair of jeans and a casual shirt- and this perception was part of the reason why some felt he was out of touch with the average voter.

On the other hand, bring back the days of Daniel Patrick Moynihan ! 

Best,

Ross


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## Duvel (Mar 16, 2014)

I think the trick for the successful "trad" wearing candidate is to wear it so naturally and with such confidence that nobody notices. Get as comfortable in your suit as you are in your pajamas, someone has said. Get there, as JFK did, and you're golden.


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