# I hate my Alden chukkas!



## shawndo (Feb 22, 2007)

This is more of a rant, but would like advice if you have some. This ended up being a learning experience for me, but I'm worried that I may have become too jaded by the experience. So please comment and maybe I can change the idea I have in my head that I can only do bespoke or MTO from now on.

I actually wrote a much longer post, but it started looking like an autobiography! SO I've tried my best to trim it down. 

My first foray into higher-end shoes resulted in paying full retail for some Shell Cordovan chukka boots at the Madison Ave store. After reading raves on all the forums, I decided I wanted some and a matching belt. I spent a bit more than I think I had to, but I had the 9E boots. I thought they fit fine in the store, but after walking around for a day, my heel started slipping and my leg muscles all the way up my shins were sore. I started freaking out and immediately listed them on StyleForum to sell, since Alden wouldn't take them back. (I had worn them outside). No messages about buying them, so I went back to Alden to see what they could do for me. They took them for about a week, and did something where they made it into an 8.5E. They just put a bunch of stuffing, or something, in the shoe. This was way to tight, so they reversed it, and I was back to a 9E. I bought those heel grippers from the drug store, but that didn't work. Just ended up getting adhesive on my socks and the inside of the shoes. I eventually read somewhere that with these double-sole boots, heel-slippage was normal and it would go away soon. A ray of Hope!
I forced myself to wear these at least twice a week and wonder of wonders, the heel slipping stopped. Unfortunately, the pain didn't go away. After walking in these things for a few blocks, all the muscles from my knees to my toes would get sore.
Once a month I forget how bad the pain is, and I force myself to wear them. A year has passed and they still hurt. I'm giving up on them. I'm declaring this a $600 learning experience. 
Just one more jab at this shoe, whenever I tried to shine them, only the toe got shiny. Everything else just got an ugly matte. I probably didn't put enough effort in, but my motivation was lacking with these shoes!

Hopefully this will help some of the newbies out there:
- Not all lasts will fit you. I think I am just slightly under a 9E on this barrie last, and it is enough to cause a lot of pain. 
- If it doesn't fit you on day one, don't buy the shoes. "Breaking in" just means the leather softens. It doesn't change size!
- If you aren't sure about the fit, don't err on the side of spending $600!
- Don't wear shoes outside unless you are ready to commit.
- Fit, Fit, Fit Don't be stubborn about the look or style if it doesn't fit right.

Over the last year, I ended up getting some MTO G&Gs and am extremely happy with those, and am now feeling that maybe I'll just stay with MTO or Bespoke from now on. Hopefully I'll run into a RTW last that will fit me properly someday. Learning goes on....

So, questions:
- Can anyone suggest a chukka boot that I might have better luck with? I am hoping it's just the last and not the style I'm incompatible with
- Is there anything I can do with these shoes? Can Alden reform it over a new last or anything like that? Or should I just bite the bullet and retire them to ebay or goodwill?


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## AlanC (Oct 28, 2003)

Sorry about your experience, but they are quite lovely.


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## Teacher (Mar 14, 2005)

It's possible it's the style, though I doubt it. It sounds to me like it's the last. Oh, there are inserts and cushions that can be glued to the upper heel area that might help with slippage, but I'm going to guess -- and mind you, it is a guess -- that these will never fit to your satisfaction. eBay may be the only way to go, I'm afraid. (I wish they were slightly smaller, as I'd take a crack at them!)


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## memphislawyer (Mar 2, 2007)

You mentioned fit. There are some things that I guess we all learn but dont want it to be. For me, I can not wear boots. Oh, I have some Clark Wallabee mid-tops, kinda like Chukkas, but for me, they dont work. Not uncomfortable, but I do notice them and get self conscious. I love the look of those shoes and I am a 9D, but alas, Id violate my rule against anything over the ankle basically. They are lovely and I am sorry they do not work for you.


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## eagle2250 (Mar 24, 2006)

shawndo said:


> ...Just one more jab at this shoe, whenever I tried to shine them, only the toe got shiny. Everything else just got an ugly matte. I probably didn't put enough effort in, but my motivation was lacking with these shoes!
> 
> So, questions:
> - Can anyone suggest a chukka boot that I might have better luck with? I am hoping it's just the last and not the style I'm incompatible with
> - Is there anything I can do with these shoes? Can Alden reform it over a new last or anything like that? Or should I just bite the bullet and retire them to ebay or goodwill?


Regarding your efforts to get a good shine on the shoes, I suspect the problem has been using too much polish on the shell cord...it dosen't take much and the shoes should not be polished very often. However, maintaining a good shine does call for a good buffing before and after each wear!

The pain you describe seems to be the result of more than just a minor fit issue (by your description, less than half a size off). However, I am not qualified to properly respond to such issues. Perhaps DocD or one of the other professionals could provide an opinion pertaining to the type and degree of pain you are experiencing?


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## bjorn240 (Jan 8, 2008)

Sadly, I think that if shoes don't fit, they won't fit. I had the same experience with a pair of slightly too large hiking boots a year ago. I wore them with two pairs of socks - a Smartwool liner and a ragg wool outer. It worked decently, but I couldn't get it perfect.

BTW, I'm in NYC. Those boots are fantastic! If they fit me, I'm happy to give you a fair price on them. I'm a 9.5D or 9.5E in Allan Edmonds, so I suspect that a 9E in a Barrie last could work well for me. Let me know if you're interested.


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## Il Canzoniere (Feb 19, 2006)

Shawndo,

Perhaps you should look into something with moccasin construction for a more comfortable fit. Here's an example of a custom chukka from Russell Moccasin at a price well below Alden:


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## amemovox (Jun 26, 2005)

*Alden shoe*

Although you are disappointed, I agree with the other comments that if discomfort results from wearing those shoes, you will resent them more each time they are worn. Sometimes, we just make honest mistakes in our choices in life and it is not fault of the manufacturer.

Alden's Barrie last is quite forgiving (roomy). I owned a pair of Aldens constructed upon the Barrie last in my size 9.5d. Although comfortable, sizing down to a 9 would not have posed a problem.

Thanks for sharing and I hope you feel better.


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## Tomasso (Aug 17, 2005)

I would suggest to the OP that in the future he confine his initial wearings of new shoes to a carpeted environment, this will make returns much easier. Also, it's best to break in shoes slowly rather than putting them into full service right out of the box. Once my shoes make it off the carpet the first half dozen wearings are half-days,(evenings and weekends). I haven't been stuck with ill fitting shoes since adopting this method, _knock on wood._


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## guitone (Mar 20, 2005)

I don't have luck with most of the alden lasts, only two work for me. I purchased a pair of their

https://www.aldenshoes.com/DrawOneShoe.asp?CategoryID=60

All weather norweigan front shoes about 5 years ago or so. They seemed fine at the factory where I tried them and they even fit me their, but they would not let me walk around, a crease is a non returnable offense with Alden. So these never did fit well, and since them i have only purchase one other pair of Aldens as i just cannot trust the fit. these also caused pain in my legs, they are very heavy shoes...such is life.


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## a tailor (May 16, 2005)

the opening may be too large . try those stick on pads for the tongue instead this makes the opening tighter.


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

Where does it hurt you? How far are you toes from the end of the shoe? Where is the widest part of your foot in relation to the widest part of the sole of the shoe?


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## Andy W (Jan 18, 2007)

The Alden Barrie last is wide and in my opinion has too much volume throughout, i.e. has too much girth or simply put, it's made for fat feet. So, if your foot is an E width but perhaps you have a proportionally narrow heel or have just have a boney foot, the Barrie will be the disaster you described.

The people at the Madison Avenue store know what they are doing and the insiders knowledge of sizing down in cordovan is something I've tried to successs, so it's a pity that neither work out fore you. 

You might give a try to the Alden Chukka built on the Plaza last, which has less girth and better proportioned front to back. The other shoe that might work is the Crockett & Jones Tetbury Chukka, but hard to find in shell unless special order.


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## shawndo (Feb 22, 2007)

marlinspike said:


> Where does it hurt you? How far are you toes from the end of the shoe? Where is the widest part of your foot in relation to the widest part of the sole of the shoe?


The muscles to the outside of my shins are what hurts. I think I am unconsciously flexing my feet to fill the width or something. My feet are normally wide on most lasts. 9E-9EE most of the time, so it never dawned on me that it might be wide.

How does one get a chukka on the plaza last? Is that a special order? I'd really like to try it on before I buy!


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

Are the ball of your foot and the ends of your toes in the right places? Since the pain is not in the bottom of your foot, I would give Alden one more go at making them fit. If you're normally a 9E-EE, and 8.5E was much too tight, I'd tell them to make them into a 9D. If Alden won't do it, a cobbler can get creative (put another lining on the side of the shoe). Might as well try if you can't wear them.

Alden does not stock a plaza last chukka. Alden of Carmel has some:
AF59 AF67 AF83 and AF82
https://www.alden-of-carmel.com/


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## cpac (Mar 25, 2005)

shawndo said:


> The muscles to the outside of my shins are what hurts. I think I am unconsciously flexing my feet to fill the width or something. My feet are normally wide on most lasts. 9E-9EE most of the time, so it never dawned on me that it might be wide.


Sounds to me like you just got a size too big. If you're normally a 9E-9EE, it's likely you should have gone with a 8.5 E or even 8E on the barrie last. The pain could easily be from the contstant pointing of your toes you must have done to keep these from slipping off.


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## shawndo (Feb 22, 2007)

Oh Happy Day!
A first-rate fellow forum-er has freed me of my forsaken footwear! 
And at a fair and felicitous fee!

FFF!


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## Tomasso (Aug 17, 2005)

shawndo said:


> Oh Happy Day!
> A first-rate fellow forum-er has freed me of my forsaken footwear!
> And at a fair and felicitous fee!!


You're quite a salesman.:icon_smile_wink:


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## Beau (Oct 4, 2007)

*You've got shin splints!*

You have described the classic symptom of that pain. I can remember wearing my shell cordovan Aberdeen last slip-ons and walking over forty blocks. My shins hurt too. Hell, I walked about ten blocks in my Barrie lasted shell cordovan norwegian front bluchers, and I began to feel like I was getting shin splints. The city just isn't kind to the body walking in good shoes.

As for my personal chukka quest, I tried the Alden Chukka Barrie last, but I could not make them fit. They slipped just like you described, Shawndo. I tried them on at City Shoe in Manhattan and at the Alden Shop in San Francisco.

I really wanted a sued chukka, so I bought these Aldens:

in dark brown suede. They don't slip like the Barrie lasted chukka. These are a Leydon last. I am an 11 1/2 B or C in most Aldens, so I bought them in an 11 1/2 C. The fit like a glove because the sole is very flexible oiled leather, and the upper is an unlined single thickness of leather. The leather upper is just reversed - finished on the inside and suede to the outside. Casual yes, and I think they are way cool.

If I was going to do a dress boot, I would look for something constructed more like a single thickness goodyear-welted sole Balmoral with a captoe.


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## shawndo (Feb 22, 2007)

So how do you find these chukkas an alternative lasts? I can't seem to find them anywhere


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

They're on the flexwelt page of www.aldenshoe.com 
Here's one website that sells them https://www.theshoemart.com/cgi-bin/category.cgi?item=ALD_m_CHUKKA_BOOT_FLEX_WELT_SUEDE&rpro=1494


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## shawndo (Feb 22, 2007)

They don't have an MTO program do they?


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

Not really, but kinda. What is it that you want to do?
BTW, Alden of Carmel has some non-Barrie chukkas https://www.alden-of-carmel.com/


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## shawndo (Feb 22, 2007)

I would like a cordovan chukka on a different last and with a dainite or some other form of rubber sole.


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

Well Alden of Carmel has black cordovan chukkas on the plaza last with commando soles (AF59 and AF8)


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## shawndo (Feb 22, 2007)

Yeah, I just saw those. I'm not into black boots though. I wish they had those in the #8.


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

BTW, it would appear that if one is willing to be very very patient, and put money down up front and there is an extra fee https://askandyaboutclothes.com/community/showthread.php?t=78962 then one could say "I want these shoes that you stock in the Barrie last done up in Plaza"


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## shawndo (Feb 22, 2007)

Wow, I think I might give up on cordovan and get some of these Edward Green's


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## tmack3 (Jan 14, 2006)

Who actually likes the Barrie last? I far prefer the Aberdeen or Plaza last. Barrie is just too round.


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

Well, I can't wear the Hampton or the Aberdeen. So, while I have yet to try a Barrie, it sounds like I'd like it from the description.


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## AlonzoMosely2 (Oct 19, 2006)

I'm struggling with the Alden lasts. The Aberdeen is a little too narrow. The Hampton is pretty good, but I only have a couple of dress shoes with leather soles and am looking for casual shoes with rubber lug soles but they don't seem to make a casual shoe with the Hampton last. The modified last (sized 1/2 size down from Hampton and Barrie) is fantastic for me, but hard to find in a 12 1/2. I hated the Barrie at first, but it is starting to grow on me. Key is finding the right size - I am a full size down with Barrie than with Hampton or Aberdeen. No experience with Plaza. I find that Aldens take much longer to break in than AEs. I recently dissected a pair that didn't fit and was otherwise headed for Goodwill and they have a VERY stiff ribbed steel shank, which may account for initial uncomfortableness.


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## Beau (Oct 4, 2007)

marlinspike said:


> Well, I can't wear the Hampton or the Aberdeen. So, while I have yet to try a Barrie, it sounds like I'd like it from the description.


These were my second pair of Aldens (mine are shell cordovan, custom ordered in an 11 1/2 B). They are a bit roomie in the quarter.

I bought these a few years later to wear when it rains:

the fit is the same.

I find the Hampton to be too tight in the heel. I originally had a pair of suede wingtips in a Hampton last that were 11 1/2 C, and they were just too tight in the heel - rubbing my achilles and the inside of my right heel. I went up to an 11D and they don't cause this problem, but they are not perfect. I won't buy another pair again until I can get the fit just right.

That said, I tried on 7 different pairs of AEs a few weeks ago at their factory store in Burlington, NC and I did not like the way any of their lasts fit. My outside edge of my big toe on my right foot always rubs even when the length is spot on 11 1/2 B or C.

I am determined to get the right fit in a sleeker lasted Alden. I have not been willing to pay upwards of $1,000 for a pair of shoes. I have paid more for a suit and as much for a blazer, so maybe I should do the same for my feet. My wife is going to kill me.

I will blame this site, but then she will blame me for lurking here. I am screwed.:crazy:


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## shawndo (Feb 22, 2007)

I went to AE and Alden yesterday on Madison, and tried out the Hampton lasts, AE Park Ave, and the new AE Soho (on the new Last 0). The Hampton reminds me a lot of the AE Park Ave, and my size is the same for both (8.5 EEE). The AE Soho fit me the best at a 9E. I also think it was the best looking last of the 3 of them. It's definitely replacing my standard dress black shoe.


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## eagle2250 (Mar 24, 2006)

shawndo said:


> The AE Soho fit me the best at a 9E. I also think it was the best looking last of the 3 of them. It's definitely replacing my standard dress black shoe.


shawndo: You do have good taste in footgear! I took delivery of a pair of cognac Sohos last week...they are definitely "keepers!"


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

Beau said:


> These were my second pair of Aldens (mine are shell cordovan, custom ordered in an 11 1/2 B). They are a bit roomie in the quarter.
> 
> I bought these a few years later to wear when it rains:
> 
> the fit is the same.


When you have flat feet, there are ways fit can change that have a great impact on foot comfort that in my experience people without flat feet can't feel.


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## Loose On The Lead (Dec 28, 2007)

tmack3 said:


> Who actually likes the Barrie last?


People with high insteps.


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