# 'The Trad' in Esquire



## AlanC (Oct 28, 2003)

'The Trad' is listed amongst Esquire's 12 Styles of the American Man (see #10):

The Trad
Also Known As: The New Englander, the professor.
Dress code: Tweed blazers, button-down oxford-cloth shirts, rumpled khaki chinos. First known sighting: The original J. Press shop in New Haven, Connecticut, 1902. Recent sighting: Hipster coffee shop near you. Hall of Famers: Miles Davis, George Plimpton, John Updike. Signature accessory: Knit tie. Bragging rights: Wearing the same pair of khakis for fifteen years. Cause for stress: Hole in the crotch of said khakis. Pickup line: "I like your cardigan." Favorite book: The Stories of John Cheever. On his iPod: Talking Heads. In his driveway: 1983 Mercedes Benz S-Series. In his closet: Three-button wool herringbone blazer ($265) by J. Crew; cotton shirt ($30) by L.L. Bean; cotton tie ($95) by Gant; cotton trousers ($98) by Dockers; leather belt ($45) by J. Press; leather loafers ($495) by Prada; glasses ($405) by Tom Ford.


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## Patrick06790 (Apr 10, 2005)

Dockers. Please.


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## El_Abogado (Apr 21, 2009)

The whole article is pretty funny. I especially liked that the Minimalist was next to the Trad. There is more of a connection than apparent between the two, I think.


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## rgrossicone (Jan 27, 2008)

Patrick06790 said:


> Dockers. Please.


Patrick, Esquire has bills to ay you know...its not "real" journalism!


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## El_Abogado (Apr 21, 2009)

Patrick06790 said:


> Dockers. Please.


Don't disagree on the Dockers, but I'm guessing ad revenue may have played a role in their selection.


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## Patrick06790 (Apr 10, 2005)

And why is he knocking the plates off the table?

There's a WASP in the lineup too.


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## Ron_A (Jun 5, 2007)

I actually prefer the WASP to the "Trad", but the whole piece is kind of dumb.


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## AlanC (Oct 28, 2003)

Patrick06790 said:


> And why is he knocking the plates off the table?


He's angry because he believes the term 'Trad' is simply an Internet construct.

My proposal for 'In His Closet':

Norman Hilton 3/2 sack sportcoat (vintage)
BB OCBD
Polo RL silk knit tie
Ben Silver pocket square
Alden belt
Bills khakis
Alden shell cordovan LHS
Anglo-American glasses


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## TDI GUY (Oct 26, 2008)

An interesting development. Could this be a sign that Trad is moving from the message boards to the mainstream, much as the Ivy League style moved from the campus to the mainstream?

I'm also curious as to why he seems to be flying into a fit of rage.

He seems moments away from morphing into Angry Trad:


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## Ron_A (Jun 5, 2007)

AlanC said:


> He's angry because he believes the term 'Trad' is simply an Internet construct.
> 
> My proposal for 'In His Closet':
> 
> ...


You mean to tell me real Trads don't wear $500 Prada loafers?


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## TDI GUY (Oct 26, 2008)

AlanC said:


> He's angry because he believes the term 'Trad' is simply an Internet construct.


Or maybe because of what happened to the Trad entry on wikipedia.....


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## Mississippi Mud (Oct 15, 2009)

Patrick06790 said:


> And why is he knocking the plates off the table?
> 
> There's a WASP in the lineup too.


He's angry because they called his Bills Dockers.


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## Coleman (Mar 18, 2009)

^:icon_smile_big:

"Hey Trad-O, nice Dockers."


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## El_Abogado (Apr 21, 2009)

AlanC said:


> He's angry because he believes the term 'Trad' is simply an Internet construct.
> 
> My proposal for 'In His Closet':
> 
> Ben Silver pocket square


Wouldn't he get that pocket square from Benson & Clegg and save some money?


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## El_Abogado (Apr 21, 2009)

Mississippi Mud said:


> He's angry because they called his Bills Dockers.


Nice!

And he's peeved because his favorite ESPN on-air personality got silenced for trash talking about Hannah Storm.


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## Trip English (Dec 22, 2008)

I think he's also mad about his Prada loafers and Tom Ford glasses. 

Ker-blah.


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## dwebber18 (Jun 5, 2008)

Trip English said:


> I think he's also mad about his Prada loafers and Tom Ford glasses.
> 
> Ker-blah.


I know I would be, haha. Kinda thought Trad was all about classic American style. Guess I was wrong again


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## WouldaShoulda (Aug 5, 2009)

Leather loafers by Prada and Dockers??


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## Bermuda (Aug 16, 2009)

I think it's cool that the term "trad" is getting exposure though. Maybe some slobs will read this issue and get a clue as to how to dress


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## Quay (Mar 29, 2008)

He may be angry because before lunch arrived he was served half a cup of cold decaf instead of a decent cocktail. Either that or he just got the bill for those loafers and couldn't stomach writing it down, double-entry style, in his personal accounts book.


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## Dr.Watson (Sep 25, 2008)

Prada and Dockers aside, I think the _picture_ is a pretty fair representation of trad as I have seen it on this forum (and it mentioned J. Press).

I also agree that the "minamalist" shares some trad elements. The WASP appears to be more anglo-oriented though.


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## PeterSawatzky (Feb 20, 2009)

I think the photo captures the overall spirit of trad (its gestalt, as it were) pretty well considering the sources listed. Clearly the sources reflect who pays their bills.


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## Coleman (Mar 18, 2009)

The Woodsman's got some Tradly details goin' too.


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## Nerev (Apr 25, 2009)

Wasn't there a big uprising here when they removed "Trad" from Wikipedia? Showed those bastards!


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## jamgood (Feb 8, 2006)

Tintin litigious?

Dockers has a K-1 Khaki made of Cramerton Cloth that's based on mid-century U.S. Army issue summer dress chino trousers. They mimic those of young veterans on college campi via the G.I. Bill. Arguably the first of the Ivy campus khaki trousers.


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## Mississippi Mud (Oct 15, 2009)

Coleman said:


> The Woodsman's got some Tradly details goin' too.


I thought that too, Coleman.

I'm at least 30% Woodsman in my attire. Like any true Mississippian, I have to be prepared to march through muddy fields and wade tupelo swamps at any given time.


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## chacend (Mar 4, 2008)

AlanC said:


> 'The Trad' is listed amongst Esquire's 12 Styles of the American Man (see #10):
> 
> The Trad
> Also Known As: The New Englander, the professor.
> Dress code: Tweed blazers, button-down oxford-cloth shirts, rumpled khaki chinos. First known sighting: The original J. Press shop in New Haven, Connecticut, 1902. Recent sighting: Hipster coffee shop near you. Hall of Famers: Miles Davis, George Plimpton, John Updike. Signature accessory: Knit tie. Bragging rights: Wearing the same pair of khakis for fifteen years. Cause for stress: Hole in the crotch of said khakis. Pickup line: "I like your cardigan." Favorite book: The Stories of John Cheever. On his iPod: Talking Heads. In his driveway: 1983 Mercedes Benz S-Series. In his closet: Three-button wool herringbone blazer ($265) by J. Crew; cotton shirt ($30) by L.L. Bean; cotton tie ($95) by Gant; cotton trousers ($98) by Dockers; leather belt ($45) by J. Press; leather loafers ($495) by Prada; glasses ($405) by Tom Ford.


I'd have to say this is damn near to what I wore today in look if not brand:

3/2 Grey Wool Herringbone Sport Coat (J Press)
Green University Stripe OCBD (LL Bean)
Wool Tartan Tie (J Press)
Ultimate Khakis (Orvis)
Leather Belt (Allen Edmonds)
Indy boots (Alden 405)
Glasses (Anglo American)

The guy in the picture is all mixed up. He won't by a decent pair of khakis but he will buy Prada Loafers? I'd bet we could through the entire Trad WFWAYWT thread and not find one Prada entry. If he's paying $500 for loafers they are most definitely LHS.:teacha:


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## The Rambler (Feb 18, 2010)

Yes, Jamgood, I think that's exactly where khakis on campus, and so many other "traditions" got their start. I can think of no government program that comes close to the GI Bill in bang for the buck.


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## mjo_1 (Oct 2, 2007)

chacend said:


> I'd bet we could through the entire Trad WFWAYWT thread and not find one Prada entry.


Don't forget that trad hero kitonbrioni!! :icon_smile_big:


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## chacend (Mar 4, 2008)

mjo_1 said:


> Don't forget that trad hero kitonbrioni!! :icon_smile_big:


You're right, I have always wondered why he posts there. Post count stat padding?


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## Youngster (Jun 5, 2008)

I definitely end up looking a lot more like the "woodsman" most days. Maybe I should splinter off and see if we can start an "Ask Andy Woodsman forum."


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## The Rambler (Feb 18, 2010)

Funny stuff, particularly: "The Minimalist" first sighting: Plymouth Rock; and "The WASP" recent sightings: non-WASPs everywhere.:icon_smile_big:


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## phyrpowr (Aug 30, 2009)

Okay, so this article was written by a czyk, right? Prada? $400 Tom Ford glasses?

Was it _meant _to be a parody, or are some people that out of touch. I grew up in a small town, but surely even a NY _fashionista _should know that outdoorsmen and workmen don't waste money on fake clothes


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## The Rambler (Feb 18, 2010)

I think it was meant to be hip, gently satirical, funny. Hard to do, just a laugh or two and you've suceeded, I think.


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## crohnsappleadams (Nov 30, 2009)

TDI GUY said:


> An interesting development. Could this be a sign that Trad is moving from the message boards to the mainstream, much as the Ivy League style moved from the campus to the mainstream?
> 
> I'm also curious as to why he seems to be flying into a fit of rage.
> 
> He seems moments away from morphing into Angry Trad:


Are automatic weapons trad?


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## Henry346 (Oct 31, 2009)

crohnsappleadams said:


> Are automatic weapons trad?


Bolt action garands, springfields, and enfields!


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## phyrpowr (Aug 30, 2009)

Henry346 said:


> Bolt action garands, springfields, and enfields!


A friend used to say "When the made the Springfield '03 and Colt 1911, they could've stopped right there"


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## Henry346 (Oct 31, 2009)

phyrpowr said:


> A friend used to say "When the made the Springfield '03 and Colt 1911, they could've stopped right there"


Let me clarify that i know the garand isn't bolt action. That was a slip up.


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## erbs (Feb 18, 2008)

Nerev said:


> Wasn't there a big uprising here when they removed "Trad" from Wikipedia? Showed those bastards!


Who is "they"? Why doesn't someone just make another Trad article? I thought the whole point of Wikipedia is that anyone can edit it.


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## TDI GUY (Oct 26, 2008)

phyrpowr said:


> Okay, so this article was written by a czyk, right? Prada? $400 Tom Ford glasses?
> 
> Was it _meant _to be a parody, or are some people that out of touch. I grew up in a small town, but surely even a NY _fashionista _should know that outdoorsmen and workmen don't waste money on fake clothes


My guess is that it was not meant to be a parody, but rather that outfitting the model was constrained by the need to use articles of clothing from those manufacturers that have given Esq. product that they expect to see appear in the magazine. Prada provided loafers; Alden did not. Etc. Under those circumstances, it is rather impressive how close they got. Maybe there will be a new crop of Esquire readers who find their way to the forum as a result.


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## Got Shell? (Jul 30, 2008)

New threads that will appear:
Should I send my prada loafers to b.nelson yet?
How do jcrew tweed blazers run?
Does j.press make anything good besides belts?


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

AlanC said:


> 'The Trad' is listed amongst Esquire's 12 Styles of the American Man (see #10):
> 
> Bragging rights: Wearing the same pair of khakis for fifteen years. Cause for stress: Hole in the crotch of said khakis.


Been there,done that. Hole detected last summer. :icon_smile:


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## Tom Buchanan (Nov 7, 2005)

Against my better judgment, I subscribed to Esquire because it was $5.00 for the whole year through Amazon. 

After receiving my first issue, I realized that I had overpaid 

I was not sure what to make of this layout. I suppose it is a "witty" way to showcase clothes. 

I was not sure if it was meant to be satire until I realized that William F. Buckley and Andre Benjamin each fail one of the threshold criteria for being a WASP, much less a WASP Hall of Famer. (just so that no one thinks I am making a prejudicial statment, I fail two of the criteria).


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## crohnsappleadams (Nov 30, 2009)

Henry346 said:


> Bolt action garands, springfields, and enfields!


How about this?


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## rsmeyer (May 14, 2006)

Tom Buchanan said:


> Against my better judgment, I subscribed to Esquire because it was $5.00 for the whole year through Amazon.
> 
> After receiving my first issue, I realized that I had overpaid
> 
> ...


Today's Esquire, unlike the great magazine under Arnold Gingrich, is a product of immature jerks with no taste or knowledge, but plenty of "attitude". A worthless rag.If you can, get a copy of early-late 60's Esky (E-Bay, other old magazine sites) and look at the difference, Read George Frazier, Chip Tolbert et al on clothes. Learn something.


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## Joe Beamish (Mar 21, 2008)

What ISN'T meant to be this, these days?

Indeed I agree -- it's a slapdash effort. Notice our "trad" character is a pretty weak entry -- non-trad looking belt and khakis, no pocket square, jacket sleeves too long to show sleeve cuffs, jacket looks darted, not a 3/2 roll.

The characterization hinges on a cursory look -- there's an OCBD and a knit tie, and that's good enough for Esquire.



The Rambler said:


> I think it was meant to be hip, gently satirical, funny. Hard to do, just a laugh or two and you've suceeded, I think.


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## rsmeyer (May 14, 2006)

Joe Beamish said:


> What ISN'T meant to be this, these days?
> 
> Indeed I agree -- it's a slapdash effort. Notice our "trad" character is a pretty weak entry -- non-trad looking belt and khakis, no pocket square, jacket sleeves too long to show sleeve cuffs, jacket looks darted, not a 3/2 roll.
> 
> The characterization hinges on a cursory look -- there's an OCBD and a knit tie, and that's good enough for Esquire.


"Hip"


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## TradMichael (Apr 13, 2006)

rsmeyer said:


> Today's Esquire, unlike the great magazine under Arnold Gingrich, is a product of immature jerks with no taste or knowledge, but plenty of "attitude". A worthless rag.If you can, get a copy of early-late 60's Esky (E-Bay, other old magazine sites) and look at the difference, Read George Frazier, Chip Tolbert et al on clothes. Learn something.


And if the Tom Buchanans are complaining about its content now, it should be no surprise that the Nick Carraways want nothing to do with it, either. The logo might be about the same but it's about the opposite of what it used to be. And then there's Raincoat's post of a cover circa '73, showing the writers they'd published. Look hard---approximately none of those writers would be welcome there now.


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## R0ME0 (Feb 10, 2010)

AlanC said:


> 'The Trad' is listed amongst Esquire's 12 Styles of the American Man (see #10):
> 
> The Trad
> Also Known As: The New Englander, the professor.
> Dress code: Tweed blazers, button-down oxford-cloth shirts, rumpled khaki chinos. First known sighting: The original J. Press shop in New Haven, Connecticut, 1902. Recent sighting: Hipster coffee shop near you. Hall of Famers: Miles Davis, George Plimpton, John Updike. Signature accessory: Knit tie. Bragging rights: Wearing the same pair of khakis for fifteen years. Cause for stress: Hole in the crotch of said khakis. Pickup line: "I like your cardigan." Favorite book: The Stories of John Cheever. On his iPod: Talking Heads. In his driveway: 1983 Mercedes Benz S-Series. In his closet: Three-button wool herringbone blazer ($265) by J. Crew; cotton shirt ($30) by L.L. Bean; cotton tie ($95) by Gant; cotton trousers ($98) by Dockers; leather belt ($45) by J. Press; leather loafers ($495) by Prada; glasses ($405) by Tom Ford.


Nice!


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## D&S (Mar 29, 2009)

The part I hated the most was about the recent sighting at "a hipster coffee shop near you." Hipsters are the anti-Trad... or, at least, I'm strongly anti-hipster.


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## TradMichael (Apr 13, 2006)

D&S said:


> The part I hated the most was about the recent sighting at "a hipster coffee shop near you." Hipsters are the anti-Trad..


That's the whole thing, the nihilistic hipster attitude is what colors _Esquire_ these days, like they'd rather be an A-list _Vice_ instead of what they used to be. Ok fine, but I kind of wish they would change their logo and name to match.



Youngster said:


> I definitely end up looking a lot more like the "woodsman" most days. Maybe I should splinter off and see if we can start an "Ask Andy Woodsman forum."


Get an Andover Shop catalog. That's the look right there.



AlanC said:


> My proposal for 'In His Closet':
> 
> Norman Hilton 3/2 sack sportcoat (vintage)
> BB OCBD
> ...


Alan, this inspired my WAYW yesterday because I happened to be wearing a lot of it (Bill's, Alden cape cod belt, and so on) with just a few mods: the vintage tweed was the first I ever owned and has gone through all kinds of adventure, the knit tie lost its label before I knew it, Kent Wang made the white linen pocket square. Mug from Club Diner in Lowell, which is a great place to get coffee.


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## eagle2250 (Mar 24, 2006)

Good grief, I seem to have the wardrobe of a Trad, the vehicle of a working man, the signature accessory of a Woodsman and the reading preferrences of the Powerhouse. Jeez, I must really be conflicted eek! Thanks for sharing that article with us, AlanC...I think!


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## svb (Dec 5, 2007)

I refuse to be pigeonholed.

Someone get me a scotch.


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