# What kind of car is this?



## JJR512 (May 18, 2010)

Look at this Autotrader listing: https://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=p&car_id=286147094

What kind of car is that in the photo? No, not the Neon...the old ugly gold-colored car in the driveway in the background.


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## fiddler (Apr 19, 2010)

Ugly? That's the Citroën SM.


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## VictorRomeo (Sep 11, 2009)

Sorry, but you post a picture of a fugly old Neon and suggest that one of the most beautiful and amazing cars ever made is the ugly one?! 

Man, you've been around those silly old Caddilacs for WAY too long! 

The SM is a true classic.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Ugly? Are you mental?  That's a Citroen SM, one of the most graceful and luxurious cars ever made in Europe. It was Citroen's top of the line model in the early 70s. I'd give my back teeth for an SM.

The SM was fitted with a Maserati engine. I had a neighbour early 80s in London who had one.

Some more info on the Maserati Citroen https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citro%C3%ABn_SM


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## fiddler (Apr 19, 2010)

I gotta say I can't see why Citroën wouldn't build these as sedans, which should be the true nature of these beasts. There were some amazing coach built models though!
Owning one would probably cause me to grind all my teeth out though, 60s Italian engines? Three timer chains? No thank you.


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## WouldaShoulda (Aug 5, 2009)

Early 70s 2dr Lux Coupe??

Here you go...



Suck on that, Frenchie!!


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## VictorRomeo (Sep 11, 2009)

I don't think our French friends have anything to worry about there now. In fact, the only thing Frenchie will suck on is a Gitane as he looks derisorily upon that pimpmobile.


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## Andy (Aug 25, 2002)

Oui, Citroen. And why did they ever stop making that Buick!


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## Cruiser (Jul 21, 2006)

I realize that this is personal preference, but I have always believed that Citroen built some of the butt ugliest cars ever conceived. This has nothing to do with nationalities as there have been some equally butt ugly American cars; the American Motors Pacer and Marlin come to mind along with the Pontiac Aztec and the early 80's Cadillac SeVille to name a few.

But having said that------ :icon_smile_big:










Cruiser


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## Kingstonian (Dec 23, 2007)

Cruiser said:


> I realize that this is personal preference, but I have always believed that Citroen built some of the butt ugliest cars ever conceived.
> Cruiser


I can see what you are saying with the 2CV for example. However even the 2CV qualifies as 'jolie laide' in my opinion.

Smoothest lift I ever had was in a DS21 Pallas. Price and reliability were the two issues. You could get a more reliable Mercedes for the same money.


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## StevenRocks (May 24, 2005)

WouldaShoulda said:


> Early 70s 2dr Lux Coupe??
> 
> Here you go...
> 
> Suck on that, Frenchie!!


 Shouldn't that boat be in the water?


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

My Dear sirs over there in the United States of America, tread very carefully otherwise I shall be forced to play the AMC Pacer card Now THAT was positively hideous! It should have been killed at birth! :icon_smile_big:


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## VictorRomeo (Sep 11, 2009)

Cruiser said:


>


Perhaps not in English, however Volvo does have a few pretty cars in it's stable.... the classic P1800 for example....


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## Cruiser (Jul 21, 2006)

VictorRomeo said:


> Perhaps not in English, however Volvo does have a few pretty cars in it's stable.... the classic P1800 for example....


When I was stationed in South Carolina in the Navy in 1971 my Commanding Officer drove one of these.

Cruiser


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## Country Irish (Nov 10, 2005)

The Citroen SM is one of my dream cars. The DS model might be an ok substitute. They are seriously underpowered but otherwise quite advanced for their age. If I want more power that Riviera would do nicely.


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## JJR512 (May 18, 2010)

Earl of Ormonde said:


> My Dear sirs over there in the United States of America, tread very carefully otherwise I shall be forced to play the AMC Pacer card Now THAT was positively hideous! It should have been killed at birth! :icon_smile_big:


Ah you can go ahead and play that card, I don't think it's going to produce the reaction you're expecting...at least, not from me. I'm not saying it's not ugly, but it's certainly not any worse than this Citroën SM.


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## Cruiser (Jul 21, 2006)

Earl of Ormonde said:


> My Dear sirs over there in the United States of America, tread very carefully otherwise I shall be forced to play the AMC Pacer card Now THAT was positively hideous! It should have been killed at birth! :icon_smile_big:


Too late. I made a pre-emptive strike and threw the Pacer out there in post #9 before you made your threat. :icon_smile_big:

Cruiser


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## Orsini (Apr 24, 2007)

No post-war US car was more dreadful looking than the Edsel, although the "meat tenderizer" grill on recent Mopars is a hall of fame item for sure.

Generally, the Citroen is a good car _if you live in France_ but I'd sooner burn money for fuel than spent it on that SM. Even another 100 horsepower would not have made it interesting.

Oval air intake with egg create gill -- tough to screw that up although I am sure, properly motivated, the Japanese may yet rise to the challenge -- that new Mazda R-8 is hideous!


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## Mike Petrik (Jul 5, 2005)

Orsini said:


> No post-war US car was more dreadful looking than the Edsel ....


I respectfully disagree.

https://www.google.com/imgres?imgur...&sa=X&ei=t-1OTe-ZGMWblgfykNUM&ved=0CBkQ9QEwAQ


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## Orsini (Apr 24, 2007)

Mike Petrik said:


> I respectfully disagree.
> 
> https://www.google.com/imgres?imgur...&sa=X&ei=t-1OTe-ZGMWblgfykNUM&ved=0CBkQ9QEwAQ


And I respect your point of view.

Perhaps I was a bit too harsh on the poor, old, Edsel and there are certainly other contenders in US automotive history for the title of "most hideous", but Orsini must remain in character.

At least that Edsel had an enormous engine that produced good torque for the day and torque makes up for a multitude of sins...


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## Cruiser (Jul 21, 2006)

Mike Petrik said:


> I respectfully disagree.


As do I. Other than the somewhat controversial oval grill that led to many jokes, the Edsel was not considered to be an especially unattractive car given the way cars looked at the time. The biggest problems were that it never could live up to the pre-introduction hype that surrounded it's release and it suffered from numerous quality and reliability problems.

Even as a child I remember seeing the commercials for this new car that was coming out, the Edsel. They made it sound like it was on par with the second coming. No car could have lived up to that with any credibility, especially when it turned up with all of the quality control issues.

Cruiser


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## blue suede shoes (Mar 22, 2010)

Cruiser said:


> As do I. Other than the somewhat controversial oval grill that led to many jokes, the Edsel was not considered to be an especially unattractive car given the way cars looked at the time. The biggest problems were that it never could live up to the pre-introduction hype that surrounded it's release and it suffered from numerous quality and reliability problems.
> 
> Even as a child I remember seeing the commercials for this new car that was coming out, the Edsel. They made it sound like it was on par with the second coming. No car could have lived up to that with any credibility, especially when it turned up with all of the quality control issues.
> 
> Cruiser


Yes, you are right in that the Edsel's styling was really no different from other full size family cars of that time. Everyone makes fun of the styling, but the styling was remarkedably similiar to the Oldsmobiles and Pontiacs of the day. If the Edsel had succeded and become a sales leader, there would have been no discouraging words about the Edsel.

Marketing experts say that the introduction failed because it was brought to the market at the start of the worst recession since WW2. Auto sales were down in 1958 for the first time since WW2. As a result, the cars of that year became "sleepers" in collectors eyes. Compare the popularity of the 1958 Chevy with the popularity of the 1957 Chevy. Also, in the next year, 1959, GM restyled all of its full size family cars, which quickly made Ford and Chrysler offering seem outdated.


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## blue suede shoes (Mar 22, 2010)

Earl of Ormonde said:


> My Dear sirs over there in the United States of America, tread very carefully otherwise I shall be forced to play the AMC Pacer card Now THAT was positively hideous! It should have been killed at birth! :icon_smile_big:


I think the AMC Pacer is by far better looking than the Citroen SM. There are some beautifully styled European cars of that time period (1960's-1970's) which still look great today, most notably the Rover, Daimlier, Jaguar, and Mercedes sedans. The Rovers and Daimilers are very underrated.


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## Orsini (Apr 24, 2007)

*Compared to the Edsel, that SM is a Ferrari GTO*

I would not have been aware of any of that fancy stuff and I make no comment on any "finer points" of the Edsel other than styling and torque.

I do remember that anyone I know who every commented on it *in 1957* felt it was real stupid looking'.

Somewhere around here I have a book with a title something like "Best Looking Cars of All Time." The Edsel ain't in there...


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## Cruiser (Jul 21, 2006)

Orsini said:


> I do remember that anyone I know who every commented on it felt it was real stupid lookin'.


What you must keep in mind is that many of us who were around back then think that a lot of late '50's cars were stupid looking in retrospect, but we didn't think that back then. I remember my 1959 Plymouth Sport Fury with it's Mopar 361ci motor. I thought that puppy was hot. Today I look at the '59 Fury and wonder "What was I thinking, that thing is ugly." :icon_smile_big:










Cruiser


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## blue suede shoes (Mar 22, 2010)

Orsini said:


> I would not have been aware of any of that fancy stuff and I make no comment on any "finer points" of the Edsel other than styling and torque.
> 
> I do remember that anyone I know who every commented on it *in 1957* felt it was real stupid looking'.
> 
> Somewhere around here I have a book with a title something like "Best Looking Cars of All Time." The Edsel ain't in there...


I can remember as a child people commenting on the terrible styling of many different cars back then. I remember some people calling the fins on the 1959 Pontiac Bonneville "pigs troughs". :icon_smile_big: Even one of the auto writers commented that "the Edsel looked like an Oldsmobile sucking a lemon".


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## Dennis V. (Apr 20, 2010)

I actually like the SM for it's engineering madness, I've seen a few over here and there is one at the car restauration club I'm a member of. It's so terribly complex for it's days that it was a miracle it ever worked at all, the hydro-pneumatic suspention alone makes that of the DS pale in comparison. The headlights steer into corners and the front licence plate is behind plexi-glass, just like the tripple headlights on either side. The interior looks like it came straight out of a 1960's B-rated science fiction movie and the rear seat is only suitable for little children who have had their legs removed.

Such a crazy car, and so expensive to maintain, but I just can't help but smile when I see one.


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## Orsini (Apr 24, 2007)

*Whataya Guys Smokin'?*

I never heard of automobile styling being graded on the curve.

That's like saying Vlad the Impaler was an OK guy because Attila the Hun was bad news too.

Oh, yeah. That colossal Plymouth is an E-Jag compared to the sorry Edsel.


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