# Gin & Tonic: The Decline?



## The Dandy

I rarely see people around me ordering a Gin Tonic, the other day i was at some formal party event and the butler asked me if i wanted a drink and i asked for a Gin Tonic of course, as it is my favorite evening drink. Lady 'X' who was standing right next to me suddenly turned around and said "[My name] you drink like an old man! Order yourself something more suitable for a man of your age and not something for old gentlemen." I must say that i was a bit shocked. What's wrong with a 19 year old drinking a Gin Tonic? Do we have stereotypes on what different age groups should drink now?


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## chatsworth osborne jr.

*I highly doubt this exchange occurred*

I always thought of G&T as a warm weather drink. Anyway, I'm unaware of such a classic drink being somehow dated. Is the vodka tonic fogey too now?


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## The Dandy

chatsworth osborne jr. said:


> I always thought of G&T as a warm weather drink. Anyway, I'm unaware of such a classic drink being somehow dated. Is the vodka tonic fogey too now?


I wouldn't know but i would guess so.


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## Coleman

I don't drink G&Ts in the winter. They're a summer drink for me too (but they are probably my favorite summer drink). 

If I want gin in the winter, I have a Martini. Otherwise, I drink a whiskey/whisky of some sort, either neat or as an Old Fashioned or Manhattan. 

All of the above are old-fashioned by most people's standards in the U.S., it seems, super sweet Vodka based drinks being the norm. 

Recently, at a restaurant that I like very much, I ordered an Old Fashioned. The waitress returned to the table a few minutes later and explained that such a drink was nowhere to be found in the recipe book behind the bar. I followed her to the bartender and taught them both how to make one (I would have been fine with a Martini and would have left it at that, but they wanted to know).


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## JerseyJohn

There's a difference between being a classic and being for old folks. What would she have you drink - Red Bull and vodka?


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## sjghr

Nothing wrong with G&Ts. I love them (though primarily in the summer) as do most of my friends. I live a stones throw from a gin distillery which is great! I haven't noticed any particular decline - I think it's just a matter of where you are. If I'm in the wardroom or a bar on the waterfront I'm probably more likely to see a G&T ordered than if I'm in the city centre at 2am (a rare occurance in itself...)

I've usually got at least three different gins in the cupboard, though the ever-present go-to is Plymouth. Very smooth. Lovely.


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## Coleman

^It's my new favorite, thanks to the recommendations by others here. I assume it's the distillery you live near, judging by your location?


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## Exquisite Decay

The Dandy said:


> Lady 'X' who was standing right next to me suddenly turned around and said...


If she chastised you on your choice of drink I am not sure I would use the word "Lady" to describe her.

You should have told her you just returned from the tropics and there was an outbreak of malaria and the gin and tonic was what your doctor prescribed.


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## Pentheos

Why do people keep answering this troll?


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## The Dandy

Exquisite Decay said:


> If she chastised you on your choice of drink I am not sure I would use the word "Lady" to describe her.
> 
> You should have told her you just returned from the tropics and there was an outbreak of malaria and the gin and tonic was what your doctor prescribed.


Well, very simply because she was a Lady. Her Husband is a Baron, however i believe that she comes from a more modest family.



Pentheos said:


> Why do people keep answering this troll?


Pentheos, what makes you think that i am a troll? I can assure you that i am not, i have better things to do. Now if you take offense because of my eccentricity please read all of my posts over again and you'll see that all my answers and questions are reasonable, funded and sometimes a little 'funny' if you think but always the truth. Got something against humour?


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## Chouan

I first made the aquaintance of Mr.Gin when I first went to sea. We have remained firm friends ever since, although we only meet on Friday and Saturday evenings.
For all of my career at sea, gin was the drink of choice of the majority that I sailed with. 
As far as seasonality is concerned, in summer I might liven up a Campari and soda with gin, but it is an all weather,all season pre-dinner drink for me.


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## TMMKC

I see nothing wrong with a G&T. Though I drink them less and less as the years pass (I much prefer Gimlets), I have never thought of them as an "old man" drink.

As previous posters have noted, I do tend to categorize G&Ts as a cocktail that is primailt consumed in the summer...on par with a Pimm's Cup. But that's just creative marketing from the distillers...and its become habit for most people.

I have noticed, especially within the past 2-3 years, that several of the bars and restaurants we frequent now have extensive cocktail menus...most featuring a wide ange of "retro" cocktails like Old Fashioneds, Manhattans, Rusty Nails, Sidecars and Negronis.


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## Coleman

Pentheos said:


> Why do people keep answering this troll?


I wasn't aware. Spurred on by your post I went digging into his previous posts. Thank you for the heads-up.


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## WouldaShoulda

Pentheos said:


> Why do people keep answering this troll?


He's a real mixer, that clean old man!!


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## RedBluff

It's my drink of choice during the hot Northern California Summers.


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## sjghr

Coleman said:


> ^It's my new favorite, thanks to the recommendations by others here. I assume it's the distillery you live near, judging by your location?


Quite right. I am lucky. :icon_smile_big:

Never was a big G&T fan until I joined the Navy. Up until then my opinion of gin had been somewhat jaded by a poor attempt as a ten year old to mix half a glass of the stuff with some orange juice... thankfully it was foul enough (to a ten year old) for me to spit it out and not kill myself through alcohol poisoning. Anyway, tried one in the cricket pavillion one night and thought it was pretty nice (even if it was Gordon's). Our Squadron Officer had a big thing for Plymouth - let's just say he easily won me over wih his argument (a glass of the stuff).

Definitely my favourite gin, and one that I can even drink neat. On the tour of the distillery (which everyone should do if they are ever in Plymouth, and if you're not in Plymouth, make the trip especially for it)... On the tour, they did the usual 'these are the ingredients', then they made us play with the ingredients. Then they made us drink the gin neat. We all looked at the woman as if she was barking mad, but we did as we were ordered. Then looked at her like she was a genius. Appreciating all the constituent parts certainly made the drink itself more pleasurable.


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## Dr. François

RedBluff said:


> It's my drink of choice during the hot Northern California Summers.


Those three weeks must be dreadfully hot for you. :icon_smile_big:

(I'm an East Bay native, myself).


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## Mike Petrik

Coleman said:


> ^It's my new favorite, thanks to the recommendations by others here. I assume it's the distillery you live near, judging by your location?


I think I was among those who recommended Plymouth based on the opinion of my fetching bride who has exceptional taste in all things.


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## Coleman

You were indeed. :icon_smile: Thanks again.


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## RedBluff

Dr. François said:


> Those three weeks must be dreadfully hot for you. :icon_smile_big:
> 
> (I'm an East Bay native, myself).


Thanks, it hasn't been too bad the last few years.
I was born in the city. My parents moved us to the Fresno/Clovis in the
mid 70's. I'm glad I'm back up here.


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## Acacian

Well, if it is in decline, I propose we lead the charge to its re-ascendancy.


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## BPH

Classic summer drink - Rarely touch it in the winter. I don't believe it will ever fade away.


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## tricota

The onluy drink i really like, thus I am having it all year round, including tonight...


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## Peak and Pine

Whatever happened to The Dandy, who started all these crazy threads (including this one), joined up in early February, made 147 posts and flamed out in early March?​


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## Peak and Pine

tricota said:


> The onluy drink i really like, thus I am having it all year round, including tonight...


I think that fact might be reflected in your spelling and capitalization. Hic.​


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## tricota

Peak and Pine said:


> I think that fact might be reflected in your spelling and capitalization. Hic.​


Probably...:icon_smile_big:

Though more likely it is the cold, which makes me shake and the fact that I dont really check what I write....


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## Master-Classter

G&T is my go-to summer drink and I'm only about 25 yrs. If it's on the decline, I guess I better start drinking twice as much to help compensate


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## turban1

*spot check*

hmmm. G&Ts are popular preprandials the year 'round in my club, second only to white wine. then usually red with lunch or supper and more red to follow. late at night some branch into armagnac or whiskey, a very few into liqueurs. in very hot weather some prefer a beer, lager, cider or shandy but most stick to one of the standard top two.

none of this appears to be limited to any age group, albeit the under-30s sometimes begin on India Pale Ale and stick with it.

what has nearly disappeared, curiously, is dry sherry before a meal. it was de rigeur in my student days, 30-odd years back, more popular, at least in cold weather but for many year-round, than gin and tonic. i suppose the enormous range of tasty and affordable white wines, something that that came with entry into the common market, played no small role. the the olden days, many restaurants could do no better than Blue Nun, often at near-room temperature. not all change is for the worse, i suppose.


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## PJH

I drink G&T year round. To me, it tastes as good in January as August, but I live in south Florida, so that may skew my perception a bit.

I'm a fan of Plymouth after having been introduced to it by Travis McGee, but in my experience very few bars here in the US carry it.

-Paul


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## Coleman

I just finished one (with some Plymouth gin---and before one accuses me of wasting good gin, it was mostly gin ). Not that The Dandy will ever know, now that he (or she?) trolled all of the data from us that he needed for his book or some such thing and will never be back.


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## Earl of Ormonde

Does no one drink "Gin and it" anymore? :icon_smile_wink:


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## turban1

*gin and it*



Earl of Ormonde said:


> Does no one drink "Gin and it" anymore? :icon_smile_wink:


never tried it and never seen it tried.

i did see a south asian student, at st andrews university, go to the students union bar on a crowded friday night and ask for 'two pints of beer please and a john thomas.' (the latter a code word for a fellow's apparatus in Lady Chatterly's Lover). The enormous, Glaswegian bartender looked aback: "Aye, do ye wanna try tha' again, pal?" Two pints of beer and a john thomas. "Ye ken we no serve that 'ere, so what'll ye have?" Two pints of beer and a john thomas. eventually the barkeep came to believe that either he was being had or being solicited. He reached over the bar, grabbed the little chap by his lapels and dragged him right onto the top of the bar. "Now, what's tha' again?!" he demanded.

The little fellow answered, "Two pints of beer and - Oh God! - a Tom Collins!'


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## JerseyJohn

I haven't tried the "gin and it" - a Manhattan made with gin instead of whiskey - but I've had a similar cocktail, the "Martinez", which is said to be a forerunner of the martini. It's basically a "gin and it" with a splash of maraschino liqueur. The recipe calls for half gin and half sweet vermouth, but I prefer it 2 to 1 gin to vermouth (less sweet) :drunken_smilie:.


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## Earl of Ormonde

JerseyJohn said:


> I haven't tried the "gin and it" - a Manhattan made with gin instead of whiskey - but I've had a similar cocktail, the "Martinez", which is said to be a forerunner of the martini. It's basically a "gin and it" with a splash of maraschino liqueur. The recipe calls for half gin and half sweet vermouth, but I prefer it 2 to 1 gin to vermouth (less sweet) :drunken_smilie:.


Not quite, a "gin & it" (in England anyway) was always just gin & Italian vermouth (hence the it). The ratios varied, usually 1:1 (half and half) but sometimes 2 parts gin to 1 part It. Nothing else.


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## Chouan

Earl of Ormonde said:


> Does no one drink "Gin and it" anymore? :icon_smile_wink:


My wife does, sort of, but she prefers Noilly, as do I, but I'd rather taste the gin, so its only G & T for me. If I drink vermouth I have it long, with ice and lemon, but only in hot weather if I've accidentally run out of Campari, or gin.


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## Coleman

Concerning the Gin & It (I had never heard of it), I only use dry vermouth with gin and sweet with whisk(e)y. To do the opposite in either case is undesirable to me.


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## Earl of Ormonde

Coleman said:


> it), I only use dry vermouth with gin and sweet with whisk(e)y.


Sir, any man who puts vermouth in his whiskey does not have my ear nor my repect! :icon_smile_wink:


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## Coleman

^I'd never put it in great whisk(e)y, but a Manhattan is a delicious drink with some Makers Mark (I guess I'd probably never put sweet vermouth in whisky at all, but lesser whiskeys, yes).


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## Earl of Ormonde

Coleman said:


> ^I'd never put it in great whisk(e)y, but a Manhattan is a delicious drink with some Makers Mark (I guess I'd probably never put sweet vermouth in whisky at all, but lesser whiskeys, yes).


I'm minded to allow this plea for clemency :icon_smile_wink:


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## JerseyJohn

Actually, I've never liked Manhattans with bold or unique whiskeys. A Manhattan made with Jack Daniels is a mistake I won't repeat :crazy:. I don't like them with Scotch (a "Rob Roy"), either. I usually make them with Canadian or a blended whiskey like Seagram's 7.


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## Oviatt

Manahattans made with Crown Royal are really good. G&Ts are great with Rangpur gin and Fever Tree tonic. All year 'round in sunny So Cal.


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## jbmcb

I was working on refinishing a door last weekend. Stripping using a heat gun, keeping the lacquer off with a dish of thinner (who the hell would paint over a stained door?) 

It was hot, it was humid, it was sunny, and I was holding a heat gun. I went into the house and mixed two parts Hendricks with five parts Canada Dry over ice. Perfect.

Speaking of Hendricks, I highly recommend it in a Cucumber Collins, made with a sweet champagne instead of seltzer and syrup.


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## deworde

*Odd how*

...popular the sweeter gin styles (Old Tom, Plymouth) seem to be on here with regards to Gin & Tonics. I stick with London Dry myself, all the more so since the BC Liquor Monopoly randomly decided to delist (e.g. no longer carry, which means you cannot get them, period, without paying a massive case-lot surcharge and waiting months at a time) a huge number of products - among them Brokers, a lovely juniper-laden London Dry at a lovely pricepoint, Plymouth gin, Tuaca, and others, which means my remaining Plymouth is all the more precious.

As to the Martinez, it is perhaps the precursor to the Martini and was invented by the mighty Mr Thomas, the first true aficionado of the American cocktail, however I would politely disagree with the description of it as "a Martini with some maraschino" or what have you - the gin-to-vermouth ratio is massively different (1:2 gin:vermouth), the vermouth is sweet, the bitters it uses are traditionally orange - which have no place near the classic martini - and the gin style used was classically Old Tom, a style many would find too sweet for use in a martini (let alone a G&T).

As to the OP, I'd say that to an extent it has certainly died back a bit (as did all real cocktails after the War, when the liquor companies realized that clear liquor was easier and cheaper to make and decided to make everyone think sweet/insipid was "where it's at!") but is not an "old man's" drink. I'd say about 10% of people in their early 20sdrink gin/tonics, though I've had some success introducing them to the Dark & Stormy, the Harvey Wallbanger, the Moscow Mule and I've even made a few converts to the Manhattan & Old Fashion, so the battle's not lost yet. I think it's partially the "instant gratification" component of our society that the baby boomers cultivated - people get almost indignant when told that the better cocktails and liquors are acquired tastes and that one must train/cultivate their palate to appreciate them - why work at appreciating the taste of what a regrettably large number of people view solely as an intoxicant? Sic transit gloria and all that.


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## The Bartender

*I feel your pain*



The Dandy said:


> I rarely see people around me ordering a Gin Tonic, the other day i was at some formal party event and the butler asked me if i wanted a drink and i asked for a Gin Tonic of course, as it is my favorite evening drink. Lady 'X' who was standing right next to me suddenly turned around and said "[My name] you drink like an old man! Order yourself something more suitable for a man of your age and not something for old gentlemen." I must say that i was a bit shocked. What's wrong with a 19 year old drinking a Gin Tonic? Do we have stereotypes on what different age groups should drink now?


I applaud your choice. You are clearly a man of taste, unintimidated by the reigning trends, namely the insane popularity of vodka cocktails.

The woman who made that remark clearly is a trend-follower, sadly one of many, and ignorant. A g&t, as we bartenders call them, are a classic cocktail. The reason for its decline is the advent of the fruity vodka cocktails-The Appletinis, Cosmos, and the like. Lightweights like them because you can't really taste the alcohol with all the added cranberry and other juices and liquors. But gin has a bite, a bracing flavor, just ask Winston Churchill.

James Bond ruined the Martini with his vodka preference. But I say, "Long live the g&t and the gin Martini." Especially if it's icy cold and made with Tanqueray Ten, which has a delightful minty infusion.


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## SeptemberSun

Anyone else here drink their gin with soda water/club soda? I've been off of tonic for a few years now and really enjoy my gin with soda water and lemon!


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## Douglas Brisbane Gray

Gordons do a nice pre mixed G&T as Do Marks and Spencers, can't see it being in declining popularity if they are selling it in this format.


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## The Bartender

*Gin and Soda-hold the tonic, please!*



SeptemberSun said:


> Anyone else here drink their gin with soda water/club soda? I've been off of tonic for a few years now and really enjoy my gin with soda water and lemon!


I do. For two reasons. First, the soda water or club soda is not cloyingly sweet as is tonic water, especially at cheap bars where they skimp on the gin and are heavy on the tonic water.

Second, it's hydrating, so you're in less danger of a hangover.

Does this ever happen to you? I also prefer mine with lemon, but nine out of ten times when I order it that way it comes back with a lime. Habit on the bartender's part. And sometimes, even though I specifically say CLUB SODA, it comes back with tonic water. Habit again on the bartender's part. They're so used to making it one way, they're on automatic pilot most of the time.

But at home, they are always _perfect. _

Martinis are a whole different story.


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## The Bartender

That's the right way. Jersey John knows his Manhattans.


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## The Bartender

*Bluecoat Gin*

I think I've tried most of the gins mentioned here, but I recently discovered an American distilled gin called Bluecoat. Very smooth with just the right blend of botanicals. Anybody else a fan of Bluecoat?

I don't see it around much, though.


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## eagle2250

The Dandy said:


> I rarely see people around me ordering a Gin Tonic, the other day i was at some formal party event and the butler asked me if i wanted a drink and i asked for a Gin Tonic of course, as it is my favorite evening drink. Lady 'X' who was standing right next to me suddenly turned around and said "[My name] you drink like an old man! Order yourself something more suitable for a man of your age and not something for old gentlemen." I must say that i was a bit shocked. What's wrong with a 19 year old drinking a Gin Tonic? Do we have stereotypes on what different age groups should drink now?


Rather surprised that we are 50 posts into this thread and not one us has suggested any potential impropriety, when addressing the suggestion of a 19 year old drinking alcoholic beverages. Perhaps Lady X was suggesting that "the Dandy" should more appropriately be drinking a soft drink or perhaps a nice glass of cold milk, given his young age! Having hauled more than my fair share of these intoxicated under-age sh*ts off to the drunk tank (in the good old days!), might I suggest our priorities are screwed up? Perhaps this is why so many innocents die each year, at the hands of drunk drivers. :teacha:


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## Hyacinth

+1 on club soda. It may be heresy but I've come to enjoy the Tanqueray Rangpur; it takes a little of the harsh edge off of the gin.


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## The Bartender

eagle2250 said:


> Rather surprised that we are 50 posts into this thread and not one us has suggested any potential impropriety, when addressing the suggestion of a 19 year old drinking alcoholic beverages. Perhaps Lady X was suggesting that "the Dandy" should more appropriately be drinking a soft drink or perhaps a nice glass of cold milk, given his young age! Having hauled more than my fair share of these intoxicated under-age sh*ts off to the drunk tank (in the good old days!), might I suggest our priorities are screwed up? Perhaps this is why so many innocents die each year, at the hands of drunk drivers. :teacha:


I don't think so. Ever go to an NFL game? Plenty of intoxicated adults who can do potential harm to themselves and others. It's drunks behind the wheel that kill people, not responsible drinkers, regardless of their age.

Although I'll raise a glass at cocktail hour to you for bringing up a good point!


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## The Bartender

Yes, it has a kind of spicy infusion. Nothing wrong with mixing it w/club soda imho. In fact, I think it's a superior recipe because without the tonic you can actually taste more of the gin.

Hendrick's with its cucumber infusion doesn't sit well wtih me. Rangpur is very popular in Southern California. Not so much in NYC. I wonder if they'll both survive. Tanqueray Ten is my favorite. Long may it live!


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