# just what IS metrosexual?



## Bernard Arnest (Oct 22, 2007)

I've heard the term thrown around increasingly over the past couple years. I probed a couple of friends who were sure that they understood it from the magazines they read, but they failed to quantify it. At best, "it's... not a fashion, it's a lifestyle.. of sorts," 

Could you explain to me in more clear, objective terms what a metrosexual is, or perhaps most easily, relating the beginnings of the term and what sort of personality and style it first was applied to? It never sounded as simple as "effeminate man," I know that much, but it's never been explained to me either.



thanks!
-Bernard


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## Didactical (Jul 23, 2007)

Lots of people like to call me that because I dress nicely (I just ignore it now). I would say very classic styles, not often ties (I'm in IT or I would...I promise). 

I have always thought its someone who was a slave to fashions and looked like their clothes wore them...as well as excessive primping (not necissarily in an effiminate way).


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## Didactical (Jul 23, 2007)

I forgot to address the origion. It was coined by someone in a magazine...see here for more on the subject.


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## trims (Apr 12, 2007)

Classic suits and ties is not metrosexual. Metrosexual is Ryan Seacrest. Armani / D&G / high fashion, spikey hair with highlights, lots of time spent on skin care, etc.


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## The Gabba Goul (Feb 11, 2005)

I suppose that we're all metrosexual, from what I gather, the whole concept started because there is a sect of ignorant fellas out there who think that if you're into wearing nice clothes, and taking care of yourself (you know, proper grooming/hygene) and place importance on looking/feeling/smelling good, then you must be gay...well aparently they realized that there are, indeed straight men who are into such activities, so they had to coin a phrase for it (although a stupider name they couldnt have picked...it sounds like somebody who likes to have sex on a bus or somehting)...some of the writers/designers who may or may not have been a bit too light in their loafers grabbed onto this thing and ran with it...now aparently the line between gay and straight had become blurred...whatever...

I used to buy into the whole "metro" thing alot more than I do now (I also used to subscribe to every single menswear magazine under the sun)...but after a bit of research, I find that men have been taking care of themselves with things like manicures/pedicures, and spa treatments and cologne and stuff like that hundreds of years...there's absolutely nothing avante guarde (sp?) about men participating in any of these activities...in fact, it should be something that we all treat ourselves to regularly...nothing different about it, no need for a special name/classification...just a matter of taking care of yourself...


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## Didactical (Jul 23, 2007)

I believe it has morphed into something entirely different than it origionally meant. Mainly if you try at all, when you get dressed, you will probably be refered to as a metrosexual, at some time or another (more so if you are younger). I do say that some people use this as an insult (ahem....a coworker). I dont know why but I am generally mildly offended when I am told that. Mainly I believe it started out as a cross between Metropolitan (?) and Homosexual. I know and have worked with many homosexual men that have the worst taste in clothing...ever. Wherever this notion that gay people are automatically just fashion/decorating/etc. geniusous is weird. 

I guess I am only insulted because they choose to use the word as such...if that word didnt exist i am sure they would find another. Whatever...where I work I do stand out a bit...


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## RJman (Nov 11, 2003)

Bernard Arnest said:


> I've heard the term thrown around increasingly over the past couple years. I probed a couple of friends who were sure that they understood it from the magazines they read, but they failed to quantify it. At best, "it's... not a fashion, it's a lifestyle.. of sorts,"
> 
> Could you explain to me in more clear, objective terms what a metrosexual is, or perhaps most easily, relating the beginnings of the term and what sort of personality and style it first was applied to? It never sounded as simple as "effeminate man," I know that much, but it's never been explained to me either.
> 
> ...


I think you and the Professor need to take the time machine to 2003 and find out.


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## katon (Dec 25, 2006)

Vain and effete, ignores understatement and appropriateness of clothing in favor of others looking their way, something of a dandy.


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## JDC (Dec 2, 2006)

Bernard Arnest said:


> I've heard the term thrown around increasingly over the past couple years. I probed a couple of friends who were sure that they understood it from the magazines they read, but they failed to quantify it. At best, "it's... not a fashion, it's a lifestyle.. of sorts,"
> 
> Could you explain to me in more clear, objective terms what a metrosexual is, or perhaps most easily, relating the beginnings of the term and what sort of personality and style it first was applied to? It never sounded as simple as "effeminate man," I know that much, but it's never been explained to me either.
> 
> ...


A metrosexual is the exact opposite of an "effeminate man". It refers to a guy who not only takes care of himself with regard to clothing, personal hygiene etc, he is also secure enough in his heterosexuality that he's not threatened by other guys who have sexual orientations different than his own. "Gay friendly" is the current vernacular.


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## The Gabba Goul (Feb 11, 2005)

FrankDC said:


> A metrosexual is the exact opposite of an "effeminate man". It refers to a guy who not only takes care of himself with regard to clothing, personal hygiene etc, he is also secure enough in his heterosexuality that he's not threatened by other guys who have sexual orientations different than his own. "Gay friendly" is the current vernacular.


No, it's not...you were right at first, but it has nothing to do with gays either way...I mean, damn...not everything in the world has to be about gay or straight...

now I'm sure you're going to try and turn this into a big debate...

I suppose the real question is, how long before this gets moved to the interchange...hmmmmm...


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## Didactical (Jul 23, 2007)

The Gabba Goul said:


> No, it's not...you were right at first, but it has nothing to do with gays either way...I mean, damn...not everything in the world has to be about gay or straight...


Right....i think David Beckham is the poster child for Metrosexual's everywhere. On the bleeding edge of Fashion at all times...


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## JDC (Dec 2, 2006)

The Gabba Goul said:


> No, it's not...you were right at first, but it has nothing to do with gays either way


That's absolutely incorrect. Where do you think the "sexual" part of metrosexual comes from?

You're clueless as usual.


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## Didactical (Jul 23, 2007)

FrankDC said:


> That's absolutely incorrect. Where do you think the "sexual" part of metrosexual comes from?
> 
> You're clueless as usual.


I think originally it was used to make up the word...because the media made up the word...they could use 2 convenient stereotypes that they had available and slammed them together to make a SUPER-STEREOTYPE!!!

Now the term has evolved away from that, due to the massive flaw that homosexuals are no better or worse at dressing themselves on average than any hetrosexual person. As a society we have noticed that becoming homosexual doesnt give you superpowers of "fashion"...so the term has become more about people and dressing nicer than the average person and even taking care of other standard hygene (from what I can see). Although my homophobic friends tend to use it to insinuate that the person they are hurling the term "metrosexual" at is indeed a homosexual.


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## The Gabba Goul (Feb 11, 2005)

Didactical said:


> I think originally it was used to make up the word...because the media made up the word...they could use 2 convenient stereotypes that they had available and slammed them together to make a SUPER-STEREOTYPE!!!
> 
> Now the term has evolved away from that, due to the massive flaw that homosexuals are no better or worse at dressing themselves on average than any hetrosexual person. As a society we have noticed that becoming homosexual doesnt give you superpowers of "fashion"...so the term has become more about people and dressing nicer than the average person and even taking care of other standard hygene (from what I can see). Although my homophobic friends tend to use it to insinuate that the person they are hurling the term "metrosexual" at is indeed a homosexual.


100% correct...don't mind frank, he won't rest intill he can mangle this thing into a political debate wherein he can lob juvenile insults at anybody who disagrees with him...

So tell me frank...if the "sexual" part apparently means gay...what does the "metro" part mean??? Surely a person can not live in the city and still be metrosexual...or am I just being a biggoted tyrant???


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## JDC (Dec 2, 2006)

Didactical said:


> I think originally it was used to make up the word...because the media made up the word...they could use 2 convenient stereotypes that they had available and slammed them together to make a SUPER-STEREOTYPE!!!
> 
> Now the term has evolved away from that, due to the massive flaw that homosexuals are no better or worse at dressing themselves on average than any hetrosexual person. As a society we have noticed that becoming homosexual doesnt give you superpowers of "fashion"...so the term has become more about people and dressing nicer than the average person and even taking care of other standard hygene (from what I can see). Although my homophobic friends tend to use it to insinuate that the person they are hurling the term "metrosexual" at is indeed a homosexual.


Your own Wiki cite explains it correctly:

Metrosexual man, the single young man with a high disposable income, living or working in the city (because that's where all the best shops are), is perhaps the most promising consumer market of the decade. In the Eighties he was only to be found inside fashion magazines such as GQ, in television advertisements for Levis jeans _*or in gay bars*_. In the Nineties, he's everywhere and he's going shopping with Mark Sullivan a big butch aircraft engineer.​"The typical metrosexual is a young man with money to spend, living in or within easy reach of a metropolis - because that's where all the best shops, clubs, gyms and hairdressers are. He might be officially gay, straight or bisexual, but *this is utterly immaterial because he has clearly taken himself as his own love object and pleasure as his sexual preference*.

A metrosexual is not only gay friendly, sexual orientation is "utterly immaterial".


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## StevenRocks (May 24, 2005)

RJman said:


> I think you and the Professor need to take the time machine to 2003 and find out.


+1. Best post of the thread!


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## The Gabba Goul (Feb 11, 2005)

Here we go again...

...okay frank, I'll bite...how many millenia has_ the man _been keeping the metrosexuals down???


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## JDC (Dec 2, 2006)

The Gabba Goul said:


> Here we go again...
> 
> ...okay frank, I'll bite...how many millenia has_ the man _been keeping the metrosexuals down???


Nice try at sidestepping, to hide your cluelessness.

Sorry, I'm not falling for your trolls this time.


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## The Gabba Goul (Feb 11, 2005)

FrankDC said:


> Nice try at sidestepping, to hide your cluelessness.
> 
> Sorry, I'm not falling for your trolls this time.


ooooookaaay frank...I'm the one who's trolling...how does that one about the pot, and the kettle go again???


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## omairp (Aug 21, 2006)

To the man walking down the street, all of us are metrosexuals for taking an interest in clothing and talking about it. A guy I work with even called me a metrosexual a few days ago because I talked with another co-workers about clothes for a few minutes. I think its retarded, but what can you do?


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## sia (Apr 27, 2007)

omairp said:


> To the man walking down the street, all of us are metrosexuals for taking an interest in clothing and talking about it. A guy I work with even called me a metrosexual a few days ago because I talked with another co-workers about clothes for a few minutes. I think its retarded, but *what can you do?*


Convert 'em...unlike sexual orientation, this is contagious...


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## Bernard Arnest (Oct 22, 2007)

Oops, I didn't intend to open such a can of worms, nor start a flame! It was an honest question!

Hmm, I have a bit more of an understanding then. Well-dressed, but in a more youthful way; referencing the wider range of hairstyles; and business casual suits and sport coats? Possibly even the vests I saw when I googled who Beckham was; which isn't even "business" casual at all, more something out of a Barbarian-themed film.... yet still with the common thread of attention paid to looks.

I assume that there are not "metrosexuals" over 30, the look is impossible or awkward?



On the subject of fashion conversion: As a child, I used to disdain people who cared about looks at all; weren't there far more worthwhile things to invest time and energy in? Looks were for the fashion-conscious "dumb blonde" stereotype, not for the intelligent and cultured. 
People who look down on other people for caring about fashion, have made the above assumptions that I have grown out of. They may keep those assumptions to justify not wanting to think about their clothes.

Eh, that will probably always be the case... 
I don't care for sports, either, but have grown out of the immaturity that assumed them uncouth and not worthwhile. It was just an excuse for not caring; because deep down I felt out of place for not knowing the home baseball team.
Likewise, those who don't care for clothes DO have generic options to look presentable without thinking, but should not look down on those who do; simply acknowledge that it's simply not an interest of theirs, not justify it by making it out to be an inferior pursuit.

As for fashion conversion, it's fairly easy. I approach EVERYTHING in large, obsessive chunks. A month ago I decided to start paying meaningful attention to my clothing; and so here I am! It's just another art form, like the oil painting and marble carving I've tried before; so why neglect it? 
The way it will play out is that I will restock my wardrobe and blanket this forum with dozens of posts over the next few months, have an additional list for gifts from my parents and grandparents (still in college), and then buy nothing new for another year-- but, having spent a dedicated few months to paying attention, will have a greatly heightened sense of coordination for the rest of my life. 

For those close ones who dress poorly, I wonder if you can help them best by simply setting an example, and letting them come to you when they start caring?
I never did appreciate the fine shirts my grandmother got me as a child; what's this bit of cloth, when I could be getting legos? Or, into high school; why should a jacket cost more than a scroll saw, why do I care about this? But now that I do care, I know who to call for advice (and already have).


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## RSS (Dec 30, 2003)

Bernard, as for the topic of the tread ... there is a book by Michael Flocker ...

T H E M E T R O S E X U A L 
Guide to Style
A Handbook for Modern Man​
That might be of help to you in understanding the term.​
Is it my imagination ... or does one member's overly aggressive aversion to homosexuality attempt a takeover of good number of threads? Is this forum not a place for our opinions ... as opposed to one person's venue for personal disagreement and airing of personal prejudice?


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## RSS (Dec 30, 2003)

Bernard Arnest said:


> I assume that there are not "metrosexuals" over 30, the look is impossible or awkward?


I recall John Kerry being referred to -- rightly or wrongly -- as a metrosexual. He would qualify as over thirty.

EDIT: Just to be politically correct ... Arnold qualifies as over thrity too.


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## Alexander Kabbaz (Jan 9, 2003)

Here we go again ... Interchange bound.


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## Phinn (Apr 18, 2006)

I think of metrosexuality as the mainstreaming of some parts of (male) homosexual culture. 

In other words, you have to look at American cultural history a bit. In the pre-sexual revolution time period (pre-1965-70), homosexual culture was far more insular and hidden than it is today. 

Now that we are at least one generation removed from the sexual revolution of the early 70s, various elements of homosexual culture have been absorbed (i.e., copied) into heterosexual culture -- designer clothing, expensive haircuts, nail treatments and a vast increase in the emphasis on physical beauty, especially physical fitness. 

(There is a lot of overlap between metrosexuality and the more general emphasis toward youth-worship in post-war America, of course.) 

Part of the heterosexual acceptance of homosexual cultural elements is also connected to the derogation (often outright ridicule and demonization) of traditional masculinity.


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## JDC (Dec 2, 2006)

Phinn said:


> Part of the heterosexual acceptance of homosexual cultural elements is also connected to the derogation (often outright ridicule and demonization) of traditional masculinity.


If by "traditional" masculinity you mean the American flavor of it (gun toting/beer drinking/fart in bed/gaping holes in your underwear/keep women in the home etc), I'd say ridicule and demonization were long overdue. :icon_smile_big:


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

FrankDC said:


> If by "traditional" masculinity you mean the American flavor of it (gun toting/beer drinking/fart in bed/gaping holes in your underwear/keep women in the home etc), I'd say ridicule and demonization were long overdue. :icon_smile_big:


You get out of bed to fart?


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## JDC (Dec 2, 2006)

Wayfarer said:


> You get out of bed to fart?


You don't?


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

FrankDC said:


> You don't?


Asked you first.


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## JDC (Dec 2, 2006)

Wayfarer said:


> Asked you first.


On the rare occasions I need to (I'm lucky in that regard), yes I usually do get out of bed. IMO it's a minor courtesy.


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## The Saint (Apr 28, 2007)

FrankDC said:


> If by "traditional" masculinity you mean the American flavor of it (gun toting/beer drinking/fart in bed/gaping holes in your underwear/keep women in the home etc), I'd say ridicule and demonization were long overdue. :icon_smile_big:


This is a pretty naive view of American masculinity. The participation rate of women in the workforce is very high, even for the developed world; beer drinking is a feature of all Northern European and most Asian cultures; farting in bed? yeah, I guess in other parts of the world people don't fart and if they do, I'm sure they get out of bed and go outside to do it; gaping holes in your underwear? hey, at least we wear underwear, in lots of places people can't afford underwear, holes or not.

Maybe you should travel a bit and gain some knowledge of the world before you criticize the US too harshly.


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## Laxplayer (Apr 26, 2006)

FrankDC said:


> If by "traditional" masculinity you mean the American flavor of it (gun toting/beer drinking/fart in bed/gaping holes in your underwear/keep women in the home etc), I'd say ridicule and demonization were long overdue. :icon_smile_big:


What's wrong with beer drinking?

I actually agree with Phinn on this one. Men are portrayed as idiots on almost every televison show, and in other media. I don't know exactly what Phinn was referring to, but I see the decline of masculinity as men being bossed around by their wives so often that they are unable to make any decisions on their own, and the inability to do any physical labor on their own. I know quite a few guys that don't even know how to change a tire. To me, that's pretty pathetic. 
Respect for women, handyman skills, good hygiene, dressing well and physical fitness etc. are basic qualities that all men should have, and these things need to be passed on to their sons.


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

FrankDC said:


> On the rare occasions I need to (I'm lucky in that regard), yes I usually do get out of bed. IMO it's a minor courtesy.


The question breaks down to whether or not the person next to you is snoring.


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## Laxplayer (Apr 26, 2006)

Wayfarer said:


> The question breaks down to whether or not the person next to you is snoring.


Give 'em the Dutch oven! :devil:


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## Wayfarer (Mar 19, 2006)

Phinn said:


> Part of the heterosexual acceptance of homosexual cultural elements is also connected to the derogation (often outright ridicule and demonization) of traditional masculinity.


So true.


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## Phinn (Apr 18, 2006)

> If by "traditional" masculinity you mean the American flavor of it


I believe I said I was referring to American culture, yes.

Your cartoon-view of modern masculinity is exactly what I am talking about.

I wasn't thinking of acting like a Neanderthal, actually. I was referring to something more along the lines of the cultural emphasis on competence and resilience -- i.e., strength in the face of adversity. For example, in _Hatless Jack_, the author wrote that pre-WWII American masculinity eliminated many of the features of male dress and grooming that were designed to deal with minor annoyances -- tie pins and spats, for example. The ideal masculinity (i.e., the imaginary, abstract one) was seen as being capable. Men were supposed to be concerned only with problems that were more serious than that. Men were on the edge, live a life that is at least a little dangerous. Tie pins went away because a real man would just deal with a floppy tie. Being concerned with every little thing, like a little moisture on your shoes, was seen as fussy, i.e., fragile and delicate. "Dressing well" means a lot of different things -- during this period, it meant stripping things down to their essentials, thus showing that you were ready to go out into the world and be prepared for daily struggles.

There's a difference between physical fitness and homoerotic physical beauty. Men used to paste their hair down, as a way of making it essentially uniform among all men, to de-emphasize it. One of the modern features of male hair stylings, taken from homosexual culture, is the opposite -- to use additives that make one's hair stand up, which was once seen as being an appropriate practice only for women and teenagers.


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## JDC (Dec 2, 2006)

My comment was a lame attempt at humor, and actually I couldn't agree more with the points about males being emasculated and converted by our mass media into brainless Neanderthals.

As far as clothing, hair styles etc this topic brings to mind a song from "Hair" in the late 1960's:

I would just like to say that it is my conviction
That longer hair and other flamboyant affectations of appearance
Are nothing more than the male's emergence from his drab camoflage
Into the gaudy plumage which is the birthright of his sex

There is a peculiar notion that elegant plumage and fine feathers
Are not proper for the male
When actually, that is the way things are in most species


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## Phinn (Apr 18, 2006)

> My comment was a lame attempt at humor


Ah. My apologies.


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## RSS (Dec 30, 2003)

Tone is often so difficult to "read." Humor on here is all too often missed. Sadly I've resorted to using the wink, the smiley face, etc. ... in an attempt to get mine across ... and still it can fail.

Well ... now that we are on the interchange ... I'll put back what I took out previously ... especially as someone has asked if I really think Arnold is a metrosexual. Actually, it was not my opinion.

In the book, _The Metrosexual_, on the page opposite the introduction, is a quote as follows ...

_*"I am a major shoe queen."*_
--Arnold Schwarzenegger, _Vanity Fair_, July 2003​


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## vwguy (Jul 23, 2004)

Laxplayer said:


> Respect for women, handyman skills, good hygiene, dressing well and physical fitness etc. are basic qualities that all men should have, and these things need to be passed on to their sons.


Amen!

Brian


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## 16128 (Feb 8, 2005)

Dandyism or even dressing nicely doesn't necessarily imply metrosexual status.

I think it's more about spending as much or more time on one's hair and skin care as a typical woman. For women it's always been okay to be concerned about messing up one's hair, but for men, it indicates, probably unfairly, that someone is excessively vain. 

In the military, there was always at least one guy per flight like this. His nickname was usually "prettyboy" or "Hollywood". No sexual orientation connotation was implied. He is the good-looking guy who knows it, and consumes a lot of hair gel.


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