# Brooks Brothers Shell Cordovan Straight Tips vs. Cap Toes



## M. Charles (Mar 31, 2007)

I've got some BB store credit built up and am thinking of investing in another pair of BB shell cordovan shoes. So far I've got the Plain Toe Bluchers, Cap Toe Oxfords, and Unlined Penny Loafers. All of these are in the #8 burgundy color.

I'm considering the Cordovan straight tips. My question is, in terms of when I could wear them, how they would differ from the cap toe oxfords. I take this is a less formal shoe, but on what occasions would they be appropriate?

https://www.brooksbrothers.com/IWCatS...wAll=t&sortBy=

Note: I posted this in the fashion forum thinking I was in the trad forum, so I'm reposting now.


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## longwing (Mar 28, 2005)

You would wear the straight tip on the same occasions that you might wear your plain toe blucher. It seems to me that your collection would benefit most from the addition of the tassel loafer, but you presumably have some reason for passing it over?


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## TradTeacher (Aug 25, 2006)

What about the NST in Shell? Does BB even offer it? If not, I'm somewhat inclined to agree with Longwing that the Tassel Loafer is the way to go.

Along the lines of this thread, I've got a bit a money saved up and am looking to purchase my first pair of shell shoes from BB. My question is: Which is a better first shell shoe--the LHS or the Plain Toe Blucher? Keep in mind that I teach middle school and rarely find myself in formal dress situations. That being said, I'm quite drawn to the PTB. Seems like it could be dressed up or down (much like the LHS). Your thoughts are appreciated.

Sorry if I hijacked your thread, M. Charles.

TT:teacha:


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## bd79cc (Dec 20, 2006)

TradTeacher said:


> What about the NST in Shell? Does BB even offer it? If not, I'm somewhat inclined to agree with Longwing that the Tassel Loafer is the way to go.
> 
> Along the lines of this thread, I've got a bit a money saved up and am looking to purchase my first pair of shell shoes from BB. My question is: Which is a better first shell shoe--the LHS or the Plain Toe Blucher? Keep in mind that I teach middle school and rarely find myself in formal dress situations. That being said, I'm quite drawn to the PTB. Seems like it could be dressed up or down (much like the LHS). Your thoughts are appreciated.
> 
> ...


All the male teachers and administrators at my junior high (c. 1969 -71) wore either PTBs or long wings. Some of these guys actually wore them in cordovan! What a great educational tradition to carry on. In your case, I vote for the PTBs, Color #8.


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## M. Charles (Mar 31, 2007)

LongWing said:


> You would wear the straight tip on the same occasions that you might wear your plain toe blucher. It seems to me that your collection would benefit most from the addition of the tassel loafer, but you presumably have some reason for passing it over?


Yeah, I'm not sure I like the Tassel loafer. If BB offered the Norwegian shoe or the suede penny loafer in narrow widths, I'd go with that. But they don't.

If I go with shell, my choices are tassel loafer, full strap penny loafer, and the wing tips (in the BB shape, which is a bit different than the regular Aldens).

Another option would be to go with one of their calf shoes, but they offer only a few of them in narrow widths. At the moment I'm considering some perforated cap toes in brown in the Peal line (these are by C&J???) It would be a bit different than my shell cordovan cap toes. Still not sold on it, though.

https://www.brooksbrothers.com/IWCa...roduct_Id=728929&Parent_Id=522&default_color=


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## mcarthur (Jul 18, 2005)

I would recommend the tassels


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## hbs midwest (Sep 19, 2007)

mcarthur said:


> I would recommend the tassels


+1. :icon_smile:

hbs


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## Taliesin (Sep 24, 2004)

M. Charles said:


> If I go with shell, my choices are tassel loafer, full strap penny loafer, and the wing tips (in the BB shape, which is a bit different than the regular Aldens).


In my opinion, the wing tips would give you the most bang for the buck in that they would look the most different from the shoes you've already got.


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## eagle2250 (Mar 24, 2006)

mcarthur said:


> I would recommend the tassels


+1 and Mac, it is great to see your post! We missed you...welcome back!


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## paper clip (May 15, 2006)

TradTeacher said:


> Along the lines of this thread, I've got a bit a money saved up and am looking to purchase my first pair of shell shoes from BB. My question is: Which is a better first shell shoe--the LHS or the Plain Toe Blucher? Keep in mind that I teach middle school and rarely find myself in formal dress situations. That being said, I'm quite drawn to the PTB. Seems like it could be dressed up or down (much like the LHS). Your thoughts are appreciated.
> 
> Sorry if I hijacked your thread, M. Charles.
> 
> TT:teacha:


I vote PTB. Remember, the BB LHS is unlined. You can wear the #8 PTB with ANYTHING, dressed-up or casual IMO. I have mine on today with a cord sport jacket and tie and moleskins, but often wear them with just an OCBD and Bills.


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## M. Charles (Mar 31, 2007)

paper clip said:


> I vote PTB. Remember, the BB LHS is unlined. You can wear the #8 PTB with ANYTHING, dressed-up or casual IMO. I have mine on today with a cord sport jacket and tie and moleskins, but often wear them with just an OCBD and Bills.


+1. I love the plain toe bluchers. Much more comfortable for a day on your feet than penny loafers, IMHO.


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## mcarthur (Jul 18, 2005)

eagle2250 said:


> +1 and Mac, it is great to see your post! We missed you...welcome back!


^ Thank you


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## longwing (Mar 28, 2005)

I think the BB winged bal is a nice shoe if you wear a suit for business on a regular basis. If like me, you wear a suit only for events, the cordovan perf cap bal that you already own should see you through nicely.


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## M. Charles (Mar 31, 2007)

I think you guys have inclined me to lean towards the shell tassel loafer. Is this on the same last as the penny loafer? I take a 10.5B in it, so would I take a 10.5B in the tassel loafer?


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## bd79cc (Dec 20, 2006)

I vote for tassels. I'm wearing my 563s with crimson grey and navy Brooks argyles, Bills M-2 khaki pants, white LE OCBD, and a maroon lambswool crewneck from Dillard's Department Stores. 

The Brooks tassels in shell Color #8 look just like the Alden 563s, except with the addition of foxing at each heel. They are constructed on what appears to be the Aberdeen last, a longish somewhat narrow last. The fit is close at the ball of the foot, toes, and heel, and ample at the arch. If you're a devotee of the Brooks/Alden PTBs and LHSs, the tassels will feel very different on your feet.

I'm a perfect 10 D in the LHS. Both Brooks and Alden PTBs fit loose but comfortably in the same size, and Brooks and Alden tassels fit close, but not tight, at the toes and heel in that size, too.


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## Lawman (May 31, 2006)

What do you guys think about those metal eyelets on the wingtips? They give me pause.


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## bd79cc (Dec 20, 2006)

Love 'em. Even more so on the Plain Toe Bluchers.


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## well-kept (May 6, 2006)

Lawman said:


> What do you guys think about those metal eyelets on the wingtips? They give me pause.


They don't wear well. The color flakes off, leaving shiny silver metal in glaring contrast to the leather. I had a pair, sent them back to Alden after a while and they replaced the eyelets. And it happened again (of course). I consider those eyelets an ill-considered design choice. They do, however, replicate the BB shoes of early 20th century so for that reason some may appreciate them.


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## longwing (Mar 28, 2005)

well-kept said:


> They don't wear well. The color flakes off, leaving shiny silver metal in glaring contrast to the leather. I had a pair, sent them back to Alden after a while and they replaced the eyelets. And it happened again (of course). I consider those eyelets an ill-considered design choice. They do, however, replicate the BB shoes of early 20th century so for that reason some may appreciate them.


Agreed. To me, this is acceptable on the PTB, but less than desirable on a bal.


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## Tom Rath (May 31, 2005)

well-kept said:


> They don't wear well. The color flakes off, leaving shiny silver metal in glaring contrast to the leather. I had a pair, sent them back to Alden after a while and they replaced the eyelets. And it happened again (of course). I consider those eyelets an ill-considered design choice. They do, however, replicate the BB shoes of early 20th century so for that reason some may appreciate them.


I love the metal eyelets, but then again, like my preference for the unlined BB cordo pennies, I may be in the minority. I like how the metal flakes off over time. Im wearing my BB bal wingtips today, and the metal is nearly worn off several of the eyelets. Makes me feel like I have done battle in the trenches in corporate life, the eyelets worn down to the metal through hard fought conference calls, endless 360 reviews, and trips on the metro-north train in the bar car.


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## mcarthur (Jul 18, 2005)

bd79cc & Phil
Also, I like the look


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## bd79cc (Dec 20, 2006)

Good to have you back, mac.


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## eagle2250 (Mar 24, 2006)

Lawman said:


> What do you guys think about those metal eyelets on the wingtips? They give me pause.


I don't care for the metal eyelets but, there are similiar Alden models offered, without them. We are saved! :icon_smile_wink:


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## mcarthur (Jul 18, 2005)

bd79cc said:


> Good to have you back, mac.


Thank you


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## PittDoc (Feb 24, 2007)

eagle2250 said:


> I don't care for the metal eyelets but, there are similiar Alden models offered, without them. We are saved! :icon_smile_wink:


Put in another vote for no visible metal eyelets. It just looks less refined on a balmoral. I think metal eyelets would actually look good on a blucher.

Bottom line in this debate is fit. The lasts on the shoes under consideration are quite different. Lace ups will be more forgiving.

It may sound crazy but during the last BB sale I ordered 4 pair in different sizes and styles and simply picked the one that fit best. I couldn't be happier, fit trumps style any day. They readily accepted the returns.


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## mcarthur (Jul 18, 2005)

PittDoc said:


> Put in another vote for no visible metal eyelets. It just looks less refined on a balmoral. I think metal eyelets would actually look good on a blucher.
> 
> Bottom line in this debate is fit. The lasts on the shoes under consideration are quite different. Lace ups will be more forgiving.
> 
> It may sound crazy but during the last BB sale I ordered 4 pair in different sizes and styles and simply picked the one that fit best. I couldn't be happier, fit trumps style any day. They readily accepted the returns.


^ which shoe did you select?


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## PittDoc (Feb 24, 2007)

Typically wear 7 1/2 in Hampton and Aberdeen last. Ordered perf captoe (Hampton) size 7 and 7.5. Monkstrap (Aberdeen last) size 7 and 7.5. All color #8. Pleasantly surprised that the monk size 7, fit significantly better than the other 3.


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## R Rackley Adams (Jul 19, 2006)

In my opinion, all men should own #8 tassles. Bought once, worn forever. 

There is no other substitute. Period.


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## Lawman (May 31, 2006)

Guys, what is the last shape for the BB wingtip bals like? Is this a battleship style wingtip or sleeker than that? I suspect the latter, based on photographs.

Does anyone here have the perf toes in shell? They look gorgeous.


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## PittDoc (Feb 24, 2007)

BB wingtip is on the Plaza last with a single sole, which I suspect Alden does specifically for BB, along with the exposed eyelets. Similar to Hampton but longer, with an ever so slightly chiseled toe. So, yes, a sleeker more modern look than the Alden variety with a Tremont last and dbl sole and much sleeker than the blucher, Barrie last, dbl sole "battleship."


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## Lawman (May 31, 2006)

Is it strictly a "suit" balmoral, or something that can be paired with cords, moleskins, wool trousers, etc?


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## Tom Rath (May 31, 2005)

I find the BB wingtips look out of place under anything other than a suit. The single sole, the somewhat chiseled toe all lend themselves to looking best with a suit. Some might argue that the metal eyelets add a bit of casualness. And while that may be true, the overall shape and last outweigh the casualness of the eyelets.


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## mcarthur (Jul 18, 2005)

PittDoc said:


> Typically wear 7 1/2 in Hampton and Aberdeen last. Ordered perf captoe (Hampton) size 7 and 7.5. Monkstrap (Aberdeen last) size 7 and 7.5. All color #8. Pleasantly surprised that the monk size 7, fit significantly better than the other 3.


Enjoy wearing


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## mcarthur (Jul 18, 2005)

BB wing tip bal oxford burgundy shell


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## RTW (Jan 7, 2006)

PittDoc said:


> It may sound crazy but during the last BB sale I ordered 4 pair in different sizes and styles and simply picked the one that fit best. I couldn't be happier, fit trumps style any day. They readily accepted the returns.


I did the same thing during the holiday sale. My local BB doesn't carry "C" widths so I ordered the shoes via the catalog. I ended up keeping two pairs of the perforated captoes (#8, black) and one pair of the wingtip bals (#8). According to Alden, the perf captoes are made on the Snap last. Previously, I've never heard of the Snap last...


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## Lawman (May 31, 2006)

Mac, those wingtips look terrific with those cords and argyles to my eye.


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## Keith T (May 15, 2006)

I'm going to echo PittDoc here and throw in a recommendation for the monks. I got them post-Christmas and could not be more pleased. I did not spring for the Brooks shoe trees, though....just using an off-brand. I had not owned any monks since I was a toddler (literally). Now I look for excuses to wear them. At times they look more brown, other times more of a red, and often times there is an almost purple cast to them. That #8 is remarkable stuff.


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## Tom Rath (May 31, 2005)

Mac- are you certain those are the BB metal eyelet single sole bals? They look to my eye like they have a double leather sole and no metal eyelets. They also dont look like the toe shape of the BB bals. Could just be the lack of resolution on my screen though. 

To clarify my opinion concerning the BB bals, I dont wear single sole bals with anything but a suit. My opinion only however.


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## mcarthur (Jul 18, 2005)

Lawman said:


> Mac, those wingtips look terrific with those cords and argyles to my eye.


Thank you


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## PittDoc (Feb 24, 2007)

RTW said:


> ...According to Alden, the perf captoes are made on the Snap last. Previously, I've never heard of the Snap last...


Well that explains it - the Alden perf captoes are on the Hampton last which fits me well, but the perf-caps I ordered (and returned) from BB didn't; they looked different from my other Hampton last models.



Keith T said:


> ...I did not spring for the Brooks shoe trees, though....more brown, other times more of a red, and often times there is an almost purple cast to them. That #8 is remarkable stuff.


The website was sold out but my local BB had the trees 1/2 price. $14 for trees seemed worth it. I believe they have a spring sale too.



Phil said:


> Mac- are you certain those are the BB metal eyelet single sole bals? They look to my eye like they have a double leather sole and no metal eyelets. They also dont look like the toe shape of the BB bals. Could just be the lack of resolution on my screen though.


Have to agree w/ Phil. But they do look great with cords Mac.


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## mcarthur (Jul 18, 2005)

PD & Phil
I apologize. The wing tip bal that I posted is the Alden 974 which is double leather sole and does not have metal eyelets. I am very comfortable wearing this shoe with either a suit or a business casual attire


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## Tom Rath (May 31, 2005)

Because of the thickness of the sole and overall bulkiness of the 974, I wear them with all manner of clothes as well. The bb bal is much sleeker and to my eye doesnt look right with anything but a suit.


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