# Looking for long-term Review -- Barbour Classic Beaufort



## seanm440 (Feb 28, 2008)

Hello everyone,

I am just about ready to purchase my first (and likely only) Barbour jacket. My preference is for a Beaufort. I anticipate wearing it quite frequently, but my "justification" is being able to wear it as a relatively lightweight overcoat when wearing a sport coat to work (I am a high school teacher). In reality, I anticipate that it will also become the jacket that I wear most often during the fall and spring - when it is not too cold.

Yesterday I spent some time at O'Connell's comparing the two currently available Beaufort models - the "original" Beaufort (sage) and the "classic" Beaufort (with the Sylkoil finish) in olive. At the store, my opinion was that the classic was the more appealing jacket. I liked the color, the finish, and the lining more than that of the original. In particular, I found the wax finish of the original to be too shiny for my taste.

Since I need to go back to O'Connell's next week to pick up a sport coat, I decided to put off my purchase for a bit so that I could do some research. I've been reading through the various threads on the subject. The majority of the discussions comparing these topics (at least the ones that I found) took place a few years ago. At that time, the consensus seemed to be that the "classic" finish was more attractive initially, but that the "original" wax finish would, in time, develop a more attractive patina than the classic. I recall reading somewhere that, in time, the "Classic" jacket would develop a more "country-like" look, versus the original, which would remain more appropriate for the city.

I am curious to hear from any long-term owners of the classic Beaufort model who would be willing to give a long-term review of their jacket. I trust that both the original and classic versions will hold-up well mechanically. My main concerns are aesthetic. Specifically, are folks who have owned classic Beauforts happy with the way that the classic finish has worn over time?

If possible, I would love to see some pictures!

Thanks for your help.

Sean



> *ASK ANDY UPDATE:* After reading all the great information below, be sure to check out our Barbour Beaufort Classic vs. Original: Here Are The Differences article!


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## FLMike (Sep 17, 2008)

I love my Classic Beaufort in Olive. I've had it for about 12 years and have added a zip-in polarquilt liner and a snap-on hood over that time. I think I've sent it in for rewaxing a couple of times. I live in Florida so it doesn't get a ton of wear. I used to travel a lot to NYC for work and would wear it over my suit as the weather dictated. Now it gets used mainly on hunting trips and on the occassional wet and cool day here. Not much more to say about it. It's held up great and looks as good as ever.


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

I've had mine for 10 years and it's my go to fall and/or cool weather jacket. 

I have it re-waxed every two seasons and it breaks in nicely. The wonderful thing about Barbour is the patina and in individuality they gain with wear, sort of like raw denim if that's your thing.

I've had no complaints and consider it a very smart investment. I have both the Beaufort and the Bedale (shorter) and am very satisfied with them.


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## FLMike (Sep 17, 2008)

SG: I think the question was around classic vs original. Assuming yours is classic?


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

I got mine back in '93 when the only thing you could get was the waxed 'classic'. My wife dislikes the smell. I disagree. I love the way it has mellowed with time even given the few times a year when it's either cool or wet enough to wear here. But then, I live in the suburbs and vastly prefer 'country' to 'city' in looks.


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## fishertw (Jan 27, 2006)

I've had both waxed and sylkoil and think that for the wear you describe, the sylkoil would be preferable. While the original can be rewaxed as needed, as Oldsarge says, it does have an odor when new or freshly waxed which some folks find offensive. I currently have an olive Beaufort and a navy one as well, both in sylkoil and a really old beat up waxed Bedale which is my go-to work jacket for outdoor chores. They all take on unique patinas which you will come to love whatever you choose.
Good luck with your decision.


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## Chouan (Nov 11, 2009)

I assume that my Beaufort is a "classic", as my wife bought it for me just after we were married 29 years ago. It is about to go back to Barbour for repairs and reproofing (for the first time).


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## seanm440 (Feb 28, 2008)

Thanks for all of your comments. Just for reference, here are the jackets I am considering:

Classic Beaufort

Original Beaufort in sage:


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

Mine more closely resembles the 'Original' model. I wish it would get cold and wet enough this year to make wearing it worthwhile.


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## hardline_42 (Jan 20, 2010)

Just to help clarify, the "classic" is actually the new sylkoil finish and the "original" is the classic thorn proof wax finish. I have both in my closet and prefer the original. But since my original Beaufort and Bedale are from '88 and '93 respectively, it's probably not fair to compare the patina with a two year old sylkoil Bedale.


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

For clarification:

1) My Bedale is sylkoil

2) My Beaufort is wax


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## tocqueville (Nov 15, 2009)

SG_67 said:


> I've had mine for 10 years and it's my go to fall and/or cool weather jacket.
> 
> I have it re-waxed every two seasons and it breaks in nicely. The wonderful thing about Barbour is the patina and in individuality they gain with wear, sort of like raw denim if that's your thing.
> 
> I've had no complaints and consider it a very smart investment. I have both the Beaufort and the Bedale (shorter) and am very satisfied with them.


SG, what do you wear when it's too cold for the Beaufort?


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## tocqueville (Nov 15, 2009)

I bought a "classic" last year, a NWT version off of Ebay, which I recommend. Put some thought into sizing. I am 5'7" and a 42s; I first bought a size 42, and it was gigantic. I flipped it on Ebay and bought a 40, and found it was just right: still big enough to fit over a sportcoat, even with the liner, but not tent-like.

I think it's a fantastic jacket, even if only for the pockets. I've learned that I can put a full sippy cup in the side pocket and it stays upright. Priceless. THere's room for my gloves and hat and all the crap that I end up carrying for my kids. Oh, plus my phone, wallet, etc. etc. And it's smart looking. My only problem with it is that in the parts of Washington, DC I frequent, these things are nearly ubiquitous. Every fourth person has a Barbour, and most of those are Beaufort's or Bedales. So I feel silly sometimes. To me, the answer to that is getting a color other than the standard sage/olive/whatever it's called. The rust, perhaps. But that's me being silly: the fact remains that it's an awesome jacket.


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

tocqueville said:


> SG, what do you wear when it's too cold for the Beaufort?


I have winter coats, but honestly, unless I'm going to be out for a long time, a sweater layered under the Beaufort, with scarf and gloves keep me comfortable down to the mid-20's.


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

SG_67 said:


> I have winter coats, but honestly, unless I'm going to be out for a long time, a sweater layered under the Beaufort, with scarf and gloves keep me comfortable down to the mid-20's.


Add a set of long underwear and that's what I wear when hunting the Arctic. Barbours are warmer than you might think.


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

Oldsarge said:


> Add a set of long underwear and that's what I wear when hunting the Arctic. Barbours are warmer than you might think.


A pair of warm socks are essential to keeping warm. If one's feet are wet and/or cold , then one will feel cold all over the body and to the bones. I've spent a lot of time in cold and wet weather conditions and therefore I strongly recommend socks such as SmartWool : https://www.smartwool.com/socks.html?gender=9914

I've also found that layering is less of an issue if my feet are warm. This is beneficial in activities such as cold weather hiking where layering means extra weight. Try it - you will be amazed.

https://www.llbean.com/llb/shop/80875


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

seanm440 said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> I am just about ready to purchase my first (and likely only) Barbour jacket. My preference is for a Beaufort. I anticipate wearing it quite frequently, but my "justification" is being able to wear it as a relatively lightweight overcoat when wearing a sport coat to work (I am a high school teacher). In reality, I anticipate that it will also become the jacket that I wear most often during the fall and spring - when it is not too cold.
> 
> ...


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

^

There is one no-nonsence photograph of a Barbour for every dozen or so of a hipster/fashionista sporting one, so you have to browse through the blog in order to find the better photographs:


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

Brio1 said:


> ^
> 
> There is one no-nonsence photograph of a Barbour for every dozen or so of a hipster/fashionista sporting one, so you have to browse through the blog in order to find the better photographs:


Now that's Barbour the way God intended it!


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

tocqueville said:


> I bought a "classic" last year, a NWT version off of Ebay, which I recommend. Put some thought into sizing. I am 5'7" and a 42s; I first bought a size 42, and it was gigantic. I flipped it on Ebay and bought a 40, and found it was just right: still big enough to fit over a sportcoat, even with the liner, but not tent-like.
> 
> I think it's a fantastic jacket, even if only for the pockets. I've learned that I can put a full sippy cup in the side pocket and it stays upright. Priceless. THere's room for my gloves and hat and all the crap that I end up carrying for my kids. Oh, plus my phone, wallet, etc. etc. And it's smart looking. My only problem with it is that in the parts of Washington, DC I frequent, these things are nearly ubiquitous. Every fourth person has a Barbour, and most of those are Beaufort's or Bedales. So I feel silly sometimes. To me, the answer to that is getting a color other than the standard sage/olive/whatever it's called. The rust, perhaps. But that's me being silly: the fact remains that it's an awesome jacket.


I rarely see anyone wearing a Barbour jacket while in the District, but then again, I usually find myself in the more bohemian quarters or the circle these days. (I will be in the circle tomorrow.) I'm in Georgetown on occasion, but I don't notice the presence of Barbour jackets, even around the store on M. Which area do you frequent, tocqueville? :icon_study:


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

SG_67 said:


> Now that's Barbour the way God intended it!


Rather, a Barbour Beaufort the way Dame Barbour designed it ! :biggrin:


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## seanm440 (Feb 28, 2008)

Brio1 said:


> The obvious solution is to buy both as I did. :biggrin: This was made much easier with a discount on both jackets. I'm partial to the Beaufort in sage and the lady of the house claims that the blueish/greenish color looks better against my complexion and hair than the olive. However, I like to wear the Classic in olive while at the cabin in the Shenandoah Valley. The sage has more of a sporty and urban air about it, while the olive more of a rustic look.
> 
> Perhaps the photographs on a few blogs will give you and idea : https://thornproof.tumblr.com/
> 
> ...


Buying both (at least right now) is way beyond the realm of possibility. I am stretching myself to buy one right now (I've already picked up a tweed sport coat at O'Connell's and a pair of AE Long Branch boots).

I appreciate the links to the blogs. I wish those folks on the thornproof tumblr would label what they are wearing. It sure would help me to figure out what I like!

Brio - your comment about the sage Beaufort being a bit more sporty and urban than the classic in olive is interesting. I think that I like the way that the classic olive looks new more than the sage. Looking through photos, I find that the Beauforts that are a faded green in color are the most appealing. Are the faded green jackets that ones that are now labeled sage? What does a faded olive classic Beaufort look like?


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## FLMike (Sep 17, 2008)

seanm440 said:


> What does a faded olive classic Beaufort look like?


Mine looks about the same as it did new, 12 years ago.


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## tocqueville (Nov 15, 2009)

Brio1 said:


> I rarely see anyone wearing a Barbour jacket while in the District, but then again, I usually find myself in the more bohemian quarters or the circle these days. (I will be in the circle tomorrow.) I'm in Georgetown on occasion, but I don't notice the presence of Barbour jackets, even around the store on M. Which area do you frequent, tocqueville? :icon_study:


Kalorama, Dupont, and, less frequently, Georgetown. I regularly see Barbours on the Metro, the Red Line. There's a guy on my street (Adams Morgan) who, like me wears a Beaufort and carries a Filson briefcase. A coworker, who lives in Georgetown, also wears a Beaufort. At least four of the fathers I see dropping of kids at my sons' school wear Barbours. Three wear Beaufort/Bedales, while one wears an International. It's a public school, by the way, not St. Albans or Sidwell, where I bet the per capita Barbour ownership is even higher.

Actually, I see women wearing Barbour more often than men, including my next door neighbor. Beauforts, Bedales, and various models with lots of little brass snaps. Lots of women in quilted jackets.

Last spring at the playground I spied a father wearing a Skyfall jacket. By the way, I tried one of those on. Thankfully it fit me very poorly...I don't need more temptations like that in my life.


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## tocqueville (Nov 15, 2009)

tdecast said:


> DC also here. I see Barbours everywhere now that they've been trendy for the past couple years. Agree with tocqueville, I sometimes feel silly wearing my green bedale (which I'll smugly note that I got in college during a trip to the UK). When I moved to DC a few years later and saw that it had gotten trendy, I started to dislike the ubiquitous look, especially because I also bought a filson briefcase right before I moved and now see filson/barbour combos all the time.
> 
> Ive thought about getting a navy beaufort to have something to fit over my sportcoats this winter and potentially selling my bedale to ease the cost.


Yeah, I'd be happy to swap mine for a different color...but still, one can't get around the fact that it's an awesome coat. Oh, and I love my Filson 257. In tan of course.


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

I was in Georgetown, Dupont, Adams Morgan, and Chevy Chase, but I did not spot a single Barbour jacket other than on a mannequin inside the Barbour store yesterday. However, it was 80 degrees... :biggrin:

And why is the Liddesdale made in Vietnam now? I'm not sure if I could pay $180 for a Barbour made in Southeast Asia. Would anyone care to comment on the quality of the Liddesdale, please?


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## seanm440 (Feb 28, 2008)

Wanted to thank everyone who commented on this thread. Yesterday I went to O'Connell's and purchased a "classic" Beaufort - the one with the sylkoil finish. I am very excited. 

I wore the coat for the first time yesterday evening to run an errand. When I walked in the door I asked my wife how she liked me new coat. She looked my up and down and said, "it looks kind of old manish." Ah, the trials of married life!


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## David J. Cooper (Apr 26, 2010)

I love my Vietnam built Liddesdale, of course I have nothing to compare it to.

i am also condidering a Beaufort. So excuse my ignorance. Is the sykoil forever or does it need to be redone? Is that what my wife's Bednale is finished with?


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## FLMike (Sep 17, 2008)

seanm440 said:


> Wanted to thank everyone who commented on this thread. Yesterday I went to O'Connell's and purchased a "classic" Beaufort - the one with the sylkoil finish. I am very excited.
> 
> I wore the coat for the first time yesterday evening to run an errand. When I walked in the door I asked my wife how she liked me new coat. She looked my up and down and said, "it looks kind of old manish." Ah, the trials of married life!


Congrats! Wear it in good health and enjoy it for a lifetime.


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

seanm440 said:


> Wanted to thank everyone who commented on this thread. Yesterday I went to O'Connell's and purchased a "classic" Beaufort - the one with the sylkoil finish. I am very excited.
> 
> I wore the coat for the first time yesterday evening to run an errand. When I walked in the door I asked my wife how she liked me new coat. She looked my up and down and said, "it looks kind of old manish." Ah, the trials of married life!


You're most welcome , seanm440. I'm wearing my Classic Beaufort while in the Shenandoah Valley today and it is the perfect weather for said jacket - cool autumn weather and light rain. I hope that you enjoy wearing your jacket.


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

David J. Cooper said:


> I love my Vietnam built Liddesdale, of course I have nothing to compare it to.
> 
> i am also condidering a Beaufort. So excuse my ignorance. Is the sykoil forever or does it need to be redone? Is that what my wife's Bednale is finished with?


I want to acquire a Liddesdale, albeit at a discount in the near future. The Beaufort is too hot for wearing inside a heated building. I walked through a shopping mall on my way to L.L. Bean the other day and I started to perspire once I arrived inside the store. It is also a bit heavy to carry around. The Liddesdale will come in handy...


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## Flairball (Dec 9, 2012)

I like all my Barbour coats, but pretty much use them for their intended purposes. Because of this, I even rewax them myself. As to the Vietnam issue, one will be hard pressed to find a "made in England" label in any Barbour product these days. I was at Barbour yesterday and didn't see a single one.


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## Delmarco (Jun 1, 2008)

Flairball said:


> I like all my Barbour coats, but pretty much use them for their intended purposes. Because of this, I even rewax them myself. As to the Vietnam issue, one will be hard pressed to find a "made in England" label in any Barbour product these days. I was at Barbour yesterday and didn't see a single one.


True about the *not made in England *anymore. It's really sad.
You could find older stock online that may be England made.

I have been wearing Beaufort jackets since 1998 and highly recommend them. Size down if you want a slim fit since the newer made Barbour Jackets tend to fit super big.

For instance I'm 5"8" 155 lbs today I wear a C36 Classic Tartan Beaufort.

In 2008 I was 5'8" 140lbs and wore a C38 Ancient Tartan Beaufort. I

n 1998 I was 5'7" and about 130 - 135lbs and my parents got me a C40 Dress Gordon Tartan Beaufort.

Over the years the Beaufort jackets have increased in cut and size. So even though I've grown up and gotten fatter my Beaufort Jackets that I have purchased have been sized smaller and smaller.

Below are three pictures of me taken back in 2008 wearing my then 10 year old C40 Dress Gordon Beaufort (from 1998).

I never rewaxed it once since the older Dress Gordon green color Barbour jackets can look rather nice and aged after the 
glossy wax sheen has been dried out over the years. You won't get that with the newer Sylkoil Barbours. The Dress Gordon Tartans were some of my favourite Barbour jackets. The sage green color was brighter and always seem to age well.




























In 2011 my size C36 Classic Beaufort fit me the same way (perhaps even bigger). That a testament to how enlarged these jackets have become over the years.

Over all great jackets. For the $399 price tag it is still a really great bargain for what you get!


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

^ Just a quick note about Barbour and country of origin: The classics are still UK made. 

The seasonal models are farmed out to other countries be it Eastern Europe of Asia.


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## Delmarco (Jun 1, 2008)

SG_67 said:


> ^ Just a quick note about Barbour and country of origin: The classics are still UK made.
> 
> The seasonal models are farmed out to other countries be it Eastern Europe of Asia.


As of recent that is no longer guaranteed. Over at the _Trad Forum_ a gentleman posted pictures of a *Classic* *Beaufort Jacket *he recently purchased.
Below are his pictures. To everyone's dismay the jacket was made in Lithuania. To everyone's disgust Barbour went to great extremes
of hiding away the* MADE IN LITHUANIA *tag deep inside the pockets behind the sizing tag. Read his story below.

https://askandyaboutclothes.com/com...otton-Jackets-No-Longer-Made-in-England/page2


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## Gurdon (Feb 7, 2005)

Barbour jacket, Filson tan briefcase, my goodness! Perhaps we should have an Ask Andy wear your Barbour bring your Filson get together. 

It is necessary to rewax Barbour and Filson jackets to maintain their durability. Over the years I have accumulated several Barbours, including a Dunham, which I bought in 1995, for a family trip to the UK.* An issue that is more salient with that coat, because of its lightweight construction, is accellerated fabric wear, which happens if you don't rewax regularly. Thin spots, which eventually wear through, appear where the jackets crease, at cuffs and along raised seams. The necessary repairs and patches add to the charm of the jacket.

There have been discussions of this topic in the past, including detailed descriptions of how to wax your jacket. It is, along with shoe polishing and cleaning guns, one of life's minor contemplative pleasures. 

Regards,
Gurdon
_________

* We drove a rented Land Rover, an accessory to the Barbour.


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

Flairball said:


> I like all my Barbour coats, but pretty much use them for their intended purposes. Because of this, I even rewax them myself. As to the Vietnam issue, one will be hard pressed to find a "made in England" label in any Barbour product these days. I was at Barbour yesterday and didn't see a single one.


Do you happen to own a Liddesdale , Flairball ? What is your opinion of the current made in Vietnam Liddesdale @ $ 180 ?

And do you recall the foul weather gear that we wore in the Coast Guard ? It was so unbreathable that in its place a waxed Barbour would have been more comfortable... :cool2:


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## alecgold (Jul 16, 2009)

I've got an old barbour jacket, beaufort model. Reproof it myself every year and when it gets cold I dress up with wool. Basically still much the same as the vikings did and I prefer it a lot to modern fibers.
The jacket slowly is getting a nice patina. You need to keep it well waxed, otherwise it will just look like on of these modern jeans that has a "pre-worn" look to show you do have a life.


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

Gurdon said:


> Barbour jacket, Filson tan briefcase, my goodness! Perhaps we should have an Ask Andy wear your Barbour bring your Filson get together.
> 
> It is necessary to rewax Barbour and Filson jackets to maintain their durability. Over the years I have accumulated several Barbours, including a Dunham, which I bought in 1995, for a family trip to the UK.* An issue that is more salient with that coat, because of its lightweight construction, is accellerated fabric wear, which happens if you don't rewax regularly. Thin spots, which eventually wear through, appear where the jackets crease, at cuffs and along raised seams. The necessary repairs and patches add to the charm of the jacket.
> 
> ...


Did you find that the country folk disapproved of your wearing a Barbour while riding in a Ranger Rover as Mr. Chesterfield relates in this article? :tongue2:

https://www.mensflair.com/shopping-guide/the-old-favourite-the-barbour.php

And I imagine that you have heard of this by now : https://www.cnn.com/2014/10/28/us/jose-canseco-shooting-accident/


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## Delmarco (Jun 1, 2008)

Gurdon said:


> Barbour jacket, Filson tan briefcase, my goodness! Perhaps we should have an Ask Andy wear your Barbour bring your Filson get together.


In NYC you rarely see the Filson/Barbour combo but you do see enough of both especially on recent Ivy league imports. I used to wear a tan Filson 256 but I've found it gets heavy with the slightest of contents and the tan was always dirty. I long since got rid of it for a lighter Tumi Houston brief (USA Made) and Coach pebbled leather Thompson Messenger bag (goes with my shoes and belt). Since 256 now comes in black, chocolate brown and navy and waxed cloth finishes I may consider getting another one.

*A final word to the OP:*

From my observation most younger folks, females and men under 6'0" tend to wear Bedale Jackets. As a results Beauforts are rare when you see them. If you want to go down the less traveled path then a Beaufort is your cup of tea. Just try one on before you order online and keep in mind that the older Beauforts will fit slimmer than the newer ones. If you order online make sure to ask if the item was UK-Made or not. Always get a UK-Made Beaufort if you can

Over all I still find Barbour Jackets to be exclusive items worn by a select few.



Brio1 said:


> Do you happen to own a Liddesdale , Flairball ? What is your opinion of the current made in Vietnam Liddesdale @ $ 180 ?
> 
> And do you recall the foul weather gear that we wore in the Coast Guard ? It was so unbreathable that in its place a waxed Barbour would have been more comfortable... :cool2:


The Vietnamese Liddesdales (and other quilts ) is really cheap! I tried one on at a J Crew Shop in NYC and it was literally the cheapest thing with a Barbour logo I've ever seen. The sleeves were large and disproportioned for the size and threads were already coming loose on the quilts.

Don't recommend them at all.



alecgold said:


> I've got an old barbour jacket, beaufort model. Reproof it myself every year and when it gets cold I dress up with wool. Basically still much the same as the vikings did and I prefer it a lot to modern fibers.
> The jacket slowly is getting a nice patina. You need to keep it well waxed, otherwise it will just look like on of these modern jeans that has a "pre-worn" look to show you do have a life.


The older A100/A150 Sage Barbours took rewaxing treatments well. I don't find the same to be true with newer Ancient Tartan (Sage) Barbour Bedale/Beaufort. To me they have a factory precision wax finish that seems synthetic. That said, I never kept one of the Ancient Tartans long enough to find out. I didn't like them at all compared to the original A100/A150 Dress Gordons.


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## alecgold (Jul 16, 2009)

I needed take a look, but mine says "Made in England" on the big warranted by the Queen etc. label. That's nice


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## 32rollandrock (May 1, 2008)

I once had both a Beaufort and a Bedale and peddled the latter because having both wasn't justifiable, in terms of cost and closet space. They last so long that I can't envision needing to replace one for at least a decade, and that's with daily wear between October and April. My Beaufort, acquired about five years ago, is Sylkoil. I also have an International that I use for motorcycling. The prior owner said it was issued to him during the Falklands War, and it's still in remarkable condition, with a bit of insignificant fraying at the cuffs the only issue. It's traditional finish. If I had to choose between original and Sykloil today, I would honestly flip a coin.


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## Delmarco (Jun 1, 2008)

alecgold said:


> I needed take a look, but mine says "Made in England" on the big warranted by the Queen etc. label. That's nice


If you are shopping for a Classic Beaufort and Bedale this 2014/2015 holiday season you may start to see that some will come with the new MADE IN XXXXXXX tags hidden inside one of the pockets.

While some of last year stock or old new stock from before will still have MADE IN ENGLAND on the BARBOUR crest logo label.

Starting next year and the future ALL Barbour Jackets will likely be made outside the UK.

There was an article a few years back in Vanity Fair magazine on this.

From what I have seen with the butchered _Vietnamese-Made/J Crew _Liddesdale quilts looking like "Theo Huxtable shirt" I fear the quality on any Classic Barbour Wax Jacket made outside England will not be the same.

However the _Eastern European-Made _*BarbourDept. (B)* wax jackets _(The $600+ Cassells jacket come to mind)_ seem to look and fit pretty good so there could be some bit of quality salvaged with the move to factory made jackets abroad.


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

How to Kill a Barbour Jacket : https://www.muffyaldrich.com/2014/08/how-to-kill-barbour-jacket.html


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## Flairball (Dec 9, 2012)

Brio1 said:


> Do you happen to own a Liddesdale , Flairball ? What is your opinion of the current made in Vietnam Liddesdale @ $ 180 ?
> 
> And do you recall the foul weather gear that we wore in the Coast Guard ? It was so unbreathable that in its place a waxed Barbour would have been more comfortable... :cool2:


I don't own a Liddesdale, but in addition to the Beaufort pictured I own a Burghley, and a Berwick tweed shooting coat.

Unfortunately (or maybe fortunately) I don't remember the old foul weather gear. As a QM I didn't really have too much opportunity to need foul weather gear.


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## Gurdon (Feb 7, 2005)

Brio1 said:


> Did you find that the country folk disapproved of your wearing a Barbour while riding in a Ranger Rover as Mr. Chesterfield relates in this article? :tongue2:
> https://www.mensflair.com/shopping-guide/the-old-favourite-the-barbour.php
> 
> It was a Land Rover 110 station wagon, not a Range Rover, so nobody was offended on that account.
> ...


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## alric (Aug 29, 2012)

I got a Bedale in the spring (waxed, not sylkoil) right before spending two months in the UK, and am still not sure what I think about it. Made in England, from Orvis' clearance section.

Most of my outerwear is wool. When it's warm out, it breathes. When it's cold, it keeps me warm. When it rains, it stays pretty dry. Wool is great.

My Barbour makes me sweat when the temperate rises over 70, but the waxed cotton doesn't keep me very warm when it's cooler; sometimes I wonder if it lets the cold in faster than if I weren't wearing the jacket. When it rains, it keeps me dry for the first ten minutes, after which I'm soaked, and the jacket takes days to dry (this was especially inconvenient while camping in Kent; I swear it took a week to dry in the damp). The worst is when it soaks outside-in from rain and inside-out from sweat at the same time, as happened during a particularly hard downpour in Oxford. It does, however, keep the wind out really well.

It looks great though, and the shiny wax finish has already worn in to a more subtle appearance which promises to become gorgeous in the next few years. The stickiness wore off in the first week. It remains one of the less practical garments I own, but I do enjoy wearing it. My feelings are very strongly conflicted.


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

Delmarco said:


> If you are shopping for a Classic Beaufort and Bedale this 2014/2015 holiday season you may start to see that some will come with the new MADE IN XXXXXXX tags hidden inside one of the pockets.
> 
> While some of last year stock or old new stock from before will still have MADE IN ENGLAND on the BARBOUR crest logo label.
> 
> ...


Has Barbour actually confirmed that all waxed jackets such as the Beaufort and Bedale will be made outside the UK now ? Or have you time- traveled to the future and confirmed this for yourself, sir ? Do tell ! :biggrin:


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## Chouan (Nov 11, 2009)

Brio1 said:


> Has Barbour actually confirmed that all waxed jackets such as the Beaufort and Bedale will be made outside the UK now ? Or have you time- traveled to the future and confirmed this for yourself, sir ? Do tell ! :biggrin:


I've asked them the crucial question. I'll let you know when I get a reply.


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## Flairball (Dec 9, 2012)

Brio1 said:


> Has Barbour actually confirmed that all waxed jackets such as the Beaufort and Bedale will be made outside the UK now ? Or have you time- traveled to the future and confirmed this for yourself, sir ? Do tell ! :biggrin:


Earlier this year I had a conversation with an employee at a Barbour shop who, when I enquired about the made in England issue, told me most of their stuff was now made elsewhere. Last week I stopped into a Barbour shop, and while browsing looked inside a few of the "classics"; not made in England. Don't know why some of their "classic" coats would be made in England, and others not. Anyway, this seems like enough evidence to me, and should I decide I need more I could head down to the shop and check labels again.


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## 32rollandrock (May 1, 2008)

What I find ironic is Barbour's ongoing battle against counterfeits. They would not be having this problem if they had not off-shored production.

It never fails. Iconic clothing company starts getting stuff made in China or wherever, then finds itself dealing with mountains of fakes on eBay and most everyplace else, then whines about counterfeiting and thinks that law enforcement has an obligation to address a problem that the company created itself by trying to cut costs. Not true of all companies, of course--Hermes, for example, never off-shored anything so far as I know. But companies that do invite fakes because it's so darn easy to simply continue the production run past the point stipulated in contract with iconic clothing company, then sell the extra run on the Internet.


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## tocqueville (Nov 15, 2009)

Flairball said:


> Earlier this year I had a conversation with an employee at a Barbour shop who, when I enquired about the made in England issue, told me most of their stuff was now made elsewhere. Last week I stopped into a Barbour shop, and while browsing looked inside a few of the "classics"; not made in England. Don't know why some of their "classic" coats would be made in England, and others not. Anyway, this seems like enough evidence to me, and should I decide I need more I could head down to the shop and check labels again.


My two year old Beaufort is UK-made.


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## Flairball (Dec 9, 2012)

tocqueville said:


> My two year old Beaufort is UK-made.


I have no idea when they stopped making their stuff in England, so.....

It's also possible your two year old Beaufort isn't two years old, rather it sat in storage somewhere and then you bought it two years ago.

Doesn't change the fact that Barbour is now outsourcing.


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

Flairball said:


> Earlier this year I had a conversation with an employee at a Barbour shop who, when I enquired about the made in England issue, told me most of their stuff was now made elsewhere. Last week I stopped into a Barbour shop, and while browsing looked inside a few of the "classics"; not made in England. *Don't know why some of their "classic" coats would be made in England, and others not*. Anyway, this seems like enough evidence to me, and should I decide I need more I could head down to the shop and check labels again.


This is not unique to Barbour as I've seen it with other what I call "transitional" luxury goods.

I use this term to describe luxury goods that have gone from having a niche, or perhaps at one point exclusive, following to becoming ubiquitous. Barbour is one such and up to now, I always noticed that their classics were UK made where as the more seasonal or trendy items were made elsewhere. I guess that's even gone by the wayside.

I noticed the same thing some time ago with Lacoste. If you look even now, some of their stuff will say "Made in France" while along side on the same rack you'll find made in ..... (insert 3rd world country). Prada is like this too.

As the popularity of Barbour has taken off and the demand with it, the manufacturing has to keep pace. In all honesty, I've yet to see any of the classics made anywhere but the UK, but I'm sure that will start to change.


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

Chouan said:


> I've asked them the crucial question. I'll let you know when I get a reply.


Thanks, I'm looking forward to a definitive answer from them . Can you arrange a date with an English rose to accompany me on the arm while wearing the jacket ? Thanks again in advance ...


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

Flairball said:


> I have no idea when they stopped making their stuff in England, so.....
> 
> It's also possible your two year old Beaufort isn't two years old, rather it sat in storage somewhere and then you bought it two years ago.
> 
> Doesn't change the fact that Barbour is now outsourcing.


The lady of the house talked me into buying two jackets spread over a couple of years (Olive & Sage) for this reason , albeit at a discount. (I wear one in the country and the other in town.) I don't feel so guilty now that it appears that they will not be making them in the UK anymore. :icon_pale:

Thanks for your investigative work , Flairball. :thumbs-up:


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## 32rollandrock (May 1, 2008)

SG_67 said:


> This is not unique to Barbour as I've seen it with other what I call "transitional" luxury goods.
> 
> I use this term to describe luxury goods that have gone from having a niche, or perhaps at one point exclusive, following to becoming ubiquitous. Barbour is one such and up to now, I always noticed that their classics were UK made where as the more seasonal or trendy items were made elsewhere. I guess that's even gone by the wayside.
> 
> ...


I haven't seen anything by Lacoste that was made in France for a very long time, unless the French conquered Peru while I wasn't looking.


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

^
Peruvian cotton is renowned for it softness ...


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## Delmarco (Jun 1, 2008)

Brio1 said:


> Has Barbour actually confirmed that all waxed jackets such as the Beaufort and Bedale will be made outside the UK now ? Or have you time- traveled to the future and confirmed this for yourself, sir ? Do tell ! :biggrin:


No time travel, just plain old fashioned reading...

It was in an article in Vanity Fair published back in 2010 or before. In it they interviewed the daughters and board members who had recently taken oven and revised the image and branding of the company.

It was more of a boring business article discussing boardroom and management details rather than fashion but the thing that stuck with me was the fact that Barbour planned to slowly move production away from England while keeping quality the same.

There was also lots of discussion about the Heritage brand and upcoming collaborations with other designers such as Liberty at the time.

It was the new Mission Statement: To compete in a world of where low end dollar store brands like Forever21, Old Navy, Joe Boxer, Uniqlo, The Gap and H&M now sat on 5th Ave next to Cartier, Louis Vitton, Hermes, Orvis, Hickey Freeman, Faconnable, Feragamo, Dunhill, Tiffany's, Gucci, Prada....

Basically Barbour's goal is to make more types of product to appeal to a younger urban worldwide demographic at a lesser cost to the company while keeping quality the same.

While the traditional country wax jackets and wool items have remained untouched in price and quality all I've seen from Barbour since reading that article is more and more items (hundreds of low quality products & jackets each season, more collaboration mash ups, more places to buy a Barbour product (J CREW, CLUB MONACO, and many low to mid tier department stores) increase in retail price (dept. B), and a dramatic decrease in quality for some items that used to be iconic when made in the UK (I beg you go try on one of the new Liddesdale quilts)

It's sad but it is what it is.


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

Thank you , Mr. Delmarco. I will search for the Vanity Fair article. And you're talking me out of the Liddesdale.

Have you read _Deluxe : How Luxury Lost Its Luster _by Dana Thomas ? I think that you would find it an enlightening book.

https://www.danathomas.com/


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## hardline_42 (Jan 20, 2010)

All this talk of the Liddesdale being off-shored reminded me of an alternative that I've long-since had bookmarked but never ordered. The Campbell Cooper Newmarket:

https://www.campbellcooper.com/shop/4561913949/Diamond-Quilted-British-Riding-Jacket/1401430

I always figured it was a cheap copy, but at least it was made in England. Now that the Liddesdale is made off-shore and the quality is dropping (not that a quilted jacket is very complicated to begin with) I'm seriously considering picking one up as a good spring/fall knock-around jacket.


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

I can't necessarily agree that because something is off-shored that the quality has to drop. I imagine Barbour, like any company, has quality controls in place and can't see how it would differ. If their construction standards and materials changed then I could see a drop in quality, but otherwise I don't see why the quality would go down.


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## hardline_42 (Jan 20, 2010)

SG_67 said:


> I can't necessarily agree that because something is off-shored that the quality has to drop. I imagine Barbour, like any company, has quality controls in place and can't see how it would differ. If their construction standards and materials changed then I could see a drop in quality, but otherwise I don't see why the quality would go down.


I agree with that in general. I was basing my comments on Delmarco's first hand experience with the Liddesdale quoted below:



Delmarco said:


> The Vietnamese Liddesdales (and other quilts ) is really cheap! I tried one on at a J Crew Shop in NYC and it was literally the cheapest thing with a Barbour logo I've ever seen. The sleeves were large and disproportioned for the size and threads were already coming loose on the quilts.
> 
> Don't recommend them at all.


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

hardline_42 said:


> I agree with that in general. I was basing my comments on Delmarco's first hand experience with the Liddesdale quoted below:


Thanks for the clarification.

I agree with the Barbour quilts. There's really nothing special about them and seems to be an attempt to introduce high margin merchandise. I can't blame them, but at the same time I cannot recommend it.


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## Delmarco (Jun 1, 2008)

hardline_42 said:


> I agree with that in general. I was basing my comments on Delmarco's first hand experience with the Liddesdale quoted below:


Seriously go to your local Mall and go into any J Crew or Macy's and try on the Liddesdale quilts. It is not even funny how bad they are tailored. 
If something like that gets past quality control then the phrase "quality control" needs to be redefined.

I will admit some of the offshore-made Dept. B wax products are really nice and well tailored but extremely pricey.



Brio1 said:


> Thank you , Mr. Delmarco. I will search for the Vanity Fair article. And you're talking me out of the Liddesdale.
> 
> Have you read _Deluxe : How Luxury Lost Its Luster _by Dana Thomas ? I think that you would find it an enlightening book.
> 
> https://www.danathomas.com/


I will check that out thanks very much.


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## Delmarco (Jun 1, 2008)

SG_67 said:


> I can't necessarily agree that because something is off-shored that the quality has to drop. I imagine Barbour, like any company, has quality controls in place and can't see how it would differ. If their construction standards and materials changed then I could see a drop in quality, but otherwise I don't see why the quality would go down.


Depressingly, I work at a corporate law firm and I see lots of contracts regarding restructuring and offshore ventures. I've never seen a company move offshore whether to sell, merge or manufacture to improve quality. It is usually to improve profits and increase quantity of goods-whether to sell or production.

100% of the time Companies move production offshore to save money, increase profits, and/or avoid local labour rules and expenses. In the history of all companies moving production off shore I've never witness a case where it was to improve quality.

At best Barbour has promised no decrease it quality so we can take them on their word or not.



tocqueville said:


> Kalorama, Dupont, and, less frequently, Georgetown. I regularly see Barbours on the Metro, the Red Line. There's a guy on my street (Adams Morgan) who, like me wears a Beaufort and carries a Filson briefcase. A coworker, who lives in Georgetown, also wears a Beaufort. At least four of the fathers I see dropping of kids at my sons' school wear Barbours. Three wear Beaufort/Bedales, while one wears an International. It's a public school, by the way, not St. Albans or Sidwell, where I bet the per capita Barbour ownership is even higher.
> 
> Actually, I see women wearing Barbour more often than men, including my next door neighbor. Beauforts, Bedales, and various models with lots of little brass snaps. Lots of women in quilted jackets.
> 
> Last spring at the playground I spied a father wearing a Skyfall jacket. By the way, I tried one of those on. Thankfully it fit me very poorly...I don't need more temptations like that in my life.


I take back what I said earlier. This week was the first chilly weather we had in NYC. I walked from 59th Street today at 5pm after work down to 34th and 8th ave. 
For every 5 pedestrians I passed at least 1 has some type of Barbour coat on. Then I passed by the Orvis store on 5th ave and 42nd and at least 4 older men are in line buying Barbour Wax Jackets with 10 to 15 people in the store looking at the wax jackets.

The Classic Tartan Bedale is still the most popular Barbour from what I saw and most likely what you will ever see in a North American city. Lots of women were wearing fitted Classic Tartan Utilities and heritage Quilts. I rarely saw Beauforts and if I did it was on an older feller (above 50 yrs old) who was big and tall. Those Beauforts also looked well worn as well.

So it pains me to admit that Barbour coats are too damn popular among the average NYC commuter. But the Beaufort has the slight edge when it comes to not a lot of folks have those.


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## Chouan (Nov 11, 2009)

Here is their reply to my question.

*Dear Peter,

Many thanks for your enquiry.

At Barbour, we take great pride in our heritage and the quality of the merchandise we produce.

We carry the Royal Warrants proudly, as these are awarded to businesses that have supplied a service or product to a member of the Royal Family for a period of 5 years or more. We were awarded these warrants for supplying 'waterproof and protective clothing' to the Royal Family and they were received from HM Queen Elizabeth II in 1974, HRH The Duke of Edinburgh in 1982, and HRH The Prince of Wales in 1987.

We are extremely proud of our products and as a British brand striving to supply the best quality products to our customers, we realise that the production of some of our products has to be obtained from outside of the UK, I can advise the all products manufactured outside of the UK are produced and examined under strict Quality Control to ensure consistency and customer satisfaction.

Like many other international brands, we manufacture around the globe to ensure we get the best quality and value. We ensure all manufacturing sites meet Barbour's very high standards of quality.

I can confirm we produce a selection of our current Autumn/Winter 2014 collection in the United Kingdom. This includes our collection of classic waxed jackets which are manufactured in our factory in South Shields, as well as accessories across our mens, womens and childrenswear collections.

We openly share with our customers, when asked, the origin of manufacture to allow customers to base the decision of their purchase on facts.

I hope the information I have provided is of help to you. If you require any further assistance please do not hesitate to contact me.

Kind regards

Michaela
Barbour
Customer Care Team
0800 917 3000

https://www.barbour.com

Celebrating 120 years:

| Watch the Video *

This suggests to me that the "proper" waxed cotton Barbours, the Beaufort, for example, is still made in S.Shields, but that, as has been suggested already, the rest of their stuff is made elsewhere.
Happy to be of service .....


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## FLMike (Sep 17, 2008)

"I can confirm we produce a selection of our current Autumn/Winter 2014 collection in the United Kingdom. This includes our collection of classic waxed jackets which are manufactured in our factory in South Shields, as well as accessories across our mens, womens and childrenswear collections."

So, that would include the Sylkoil Classic Beauforts and Bedales.


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## tocqueville (Nov 15, 2009)

FLCracka said:


> "I can confirm we produce a selection of our current Autumn/Winter 2014 collection in the United Kingdom. This includes our collection of classic waxed jackets which are manufactured in our factory in South Shields, as well as accessories across our mens, womens and childrenswear collections."
> 
> So, that would include the Sylkoil Classic Beauforts and Bedales.


Given the way they market those, I would be very surprised if those were moved offshore. They might be the last items Barbour makes in the UK, but they'll stay. Sort of like Bean and the Bean boots.


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## tocqueville (Nov 15, 2009)

Delmarco said:


> I will admit some of the offshore-made Dept. B wax products are really nice and well tailored but extremely pricey.


I like a lot of the Dept B stuff, but I choke on the combination of crazy prices and offshore provenance. It's a winning combination for Barbour if they can coax people into buying that stuff, but I have a hard time regarding such things as a fair value.

I did try a Skyfall jacket recently. It was freaking awesome. But man, the price! Fortunately, it fit me very poorly, thus removing any temptation. For that kind of dough, it should fit me as well as it did Daniel Craig.


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## tocqueville (Nov 15, 2009)

Delmarco said:


> I take back what I said earlier. This week was the first chilly weather we had in NYC. I walked from 59th Street today at 5pm after work down to 34th and 8th ave.
> For every 5 persons I pass at least 1 has some type of Barbour coat on. Then I past by the Orvis store on 5th ave and 42nd and at least 4 older men are in line buying Barbour Wax Jackets with 10 to 15
> people in the store looking at the wax jackets.
> 
> ...


It got cold, and more and more Barbours are appearing. I'm trying to focus on the quality of mine and its practicality, but if I were to do it again, I might look elsewhere just so as not to be dressed like everyone else. Similarly, the beaufort is a bit of an old man's look...I went out with my kids on Halloween wearing my Beaufort, a tweed cap from Ireland, and my PC cavalry twills. My neighbor joked that I was dressed up as Prince Charles.


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## 32rollandrock (May 1, 2008)

Don't see many Barbours around here, but even if I did, I would still have one. I don't give a blessed nickel about the appearance. It's the durability and practicality that appeals to me.


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## mjo_1 (Oct 2, 2007)

Interesting. My regular (non-"classic") Beaufort was ordered from Orvis last December and was made in England.


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## hardline_42 (Jan 20, 2010)

mjo_1 said:


> Interesting. My regular (non-"classic") Beaufort was ordered from Orvis last December and was made in England.


I think the classic jackets in this context don't specifically refer to the "classic" sylkoil ones, but the traditional waxed cotton line in both sylkoil and thornproof: Bedale, Beaufort, and Border. Other well-known styles like the Gamefair and Northumbria may or may not be UK-made.


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## Brio1 (May 13, 2010)

Chouan said:


> Here is their reply to my question.
> 
> *Dear Peter,
> 
> ...


Thank you , Peter. Very kind of you to conduct the inquiry , sir.

I'm looking forward to wearing my Beaufort in the Shenandoah Valley again this weekend.


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## Chouan (Nov 11, 2009)

I very nearly wore mine on Sunday. I picked it up and walked towards the front door, and my wife said "I'm not going out with you in that! You'll look like a vagrant!" It is in urgent need of reproofing and repair....


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## Delmarco (Jun 1, 2008)

Chouan said:


> I very nearly wore mine on Sunday. I picked it up and walked towards the front door, and my wife said "I'm not going out with you in that! You'll look like a vagrant!" It is in urgent need of reproofing and repair....


LOL! Love it.


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## Gurdon (Feb 7, 2005)

Chouan said:


> I very nearly wore mine on Sunday. I picked it up and walked towards the front door, and my wife said "I'm not going out with you in that! You'll look like a vagrant!" It is in urgent need of reproofing and repair....


I just brought my tattered Boarder in from the car in order to send it in for repair and reproofing. My wife has given up trying to get me to discard the tattered and torn, and puts up with my entirely mistaken notion that well-used clothing has character.

Gurdon


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## Involuntary Soul (Oct 17, 2015)

Just brought a brand new classic beaufort. The tag says AW15 and made in england. Maybe they moved manufacturing back after all the complaints?


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## FLMike (Sep 17, 2008)

Involuntary Soul said:


> Just brought a brand new classic beaufort. The tag says AW15 and made in england. Maybe they moved manufacturing back after all the complaints?


The Classic Beaufort model has always been made in England. Congrats on your purchase. May you wear it in good health. And, welcome to the Forum!


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## SG_67 (Mar 22, 2014)

I always assumed, and my experience has confirmed, that the classics are made in England.


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