# Fedora or a Porkpie hat?



## Strategery (Jan 12, 2010)

Which would you prefer of the two? Do you know anything about wearing these kinds of hats? I'm wanting to invest in one or the other, maybe both. But I don't know much about how to wear them.


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## eagle2250 (Mar 24, 2006)

While I've assembled a modest collection of brimmed hats to include; three Stetson Temples (grey, brown and straw!) and a couple of Tilley Endurables (one for winter and one for summer weather), I cannot say that I am a fan of the Pork-pie design. My choice is to go with the fedora!


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## Mad Hatter (Jul 13, 2008)

Like most, I've got my own preferences not just on hat style, but how they're worn. I like a fedora best with a 2B or DB suit. I like a pork pie with a 3/2 or 3B suit-but with the front brim snapped-down.


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## Mr. Rider (Jan 5, 2009)

I much prefer a fedora with a brim greater than 2" and an absence of taper. If you are not familiar with the Akubra Federation, please check it out. I highly recommend Akubra.


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## mjc (Nov 11, 2009)

Hmm. Anyone have photos of a porkpie ensemble that works? I'd wear one if I was a midshipman, but I can't think of any other plausible scenario...

- Mike


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## PJC in NoVa (Jan 23, 2005)

My own hunch is that a fedora with a moderate brim (the Stetson Temple being a good example) is more likely to be flattering to most men than a stubby-brimmed porkpie hat would be.

(Full disclosure: I own two Stetson Temples.)


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## Wildblue (Oct 11, 2009)

I personally STRONGLY prefer the Fedora. The Pork Pie, to me, just looks too..... goober-like.


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## StephenRG (Apr 7, 2005)

Definitely the pork pie - if you're planning to spend the afternoon at a racetrack.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Anyone can wear a feodra, but the porkpie needs a bit of attitude to carry it off!


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## CuffDaddy (Feb 26, 2009)

I think people are getting confused about the definition of a pork pie hat. The size of the brim has _nothing _to do with whether a hat is a pork pie or not. A hat could have a 3" brim and be a porkpie, or a 1" brim and be a fedora.

A pork pie's defining feature is its crown. The crown is telecoped, with a single furrow/crimp running just inside the circumfrence of the crown, and no indentations of the side of the crown. To wit:

Some ignorant retailers have started calling stingy/small brimmed fedoras "porkpie" hats, but they are just ignorant. (Never buy a hat from anyone that doesn't know enough about hats to know the name of what they're selling.)

Now, to your question: Wearing real hats, particularly in a non-musician/artist setting, is regarded as slightly eccentric. And porkpie wearers are a special niche _within _an already eccentric group (hat wearers). If this will be your first real hat, get a fedora.

As for which one to get, you just have to try them on. Back in the heyday of hats, hat manufacturers made a huge profusion of crown heights, brim widths, crown shapes, etc., in part for simple variety's sake, but also because different men look good in different hats. Small changes in the hat's dimensions can make a hat look right or wrong on you. While I love, in the abstract, a broad brim, anything over 2.5" looks cartoonish on me, and 2.25" really looks substantially better than a 2.5"

One other piece of advice: with hats, there's definitely a degree of "you get what you pay for." I've got 4 felt hats. Two of them are Borsalinos, and two are not. The latter two only get worn as foul-weather protection.


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## PJC in NoVa (Jan 23, 2005)

You know, with the wider brim (as pictured) the porkpie crown doesn't bother me as much, but I still prefer the fedora.

And yet I have to admit, my ownership of a Sam Snead-style coconut-straw golf hat may, if this vendor is correct, put me into the porkpie-owners' club:

https://www.hatsandcaps.co.uk/Scala-Sam-Snead-Pork-Pie-Hat-P126120/


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## WouldaShoulda (Aug 5, 2009)

If I were a 300lb+ saxaphone player, I'd get me a felt porkpie!!


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## CuffDaddy (Feb 26, 2009)

Yup, that's a straw hat with a porkpie crown - which, you correctly note, Sam Snead wore constantly. 

FWIW, my preference is a teardrop-crowned fedora, which sort of splits the difference between a fedora and a porkpie hat. It still has the dents at the front, but the rear of the crown telescopes, which makes it sit just a little lower... easier to wear, IMO, in a time where hats are a rarity.


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## CuffDaddy (Feb 26, 2009)

WouldaShoulda said:


> If I were a 300lb+ saxaphone player, I'd get me a felt porkpie!!


I don't think Lester Young was 3 bills, and yet he did not say "goodbye, pork pie hat!" (pic of Mr. Young in a porkpie in linK: )

Bonus points for anyone who gets the joke.


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## Cardcaptor Charlie (Jul 7, 2008)

Fedora. Porkpie has the air of a bounder about it.


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## PJC in NoVa (Jan 23, 2005)

CuffDaddy said:


> I don't think Lester Young was 3 bills, and yet he did not say "goodbye, pork pie hat!" (pic of Mr. Young in a porkpie in linK: )
> 
> Bonus points for anyone who gets the joke.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goodbye_Pork_Pie_Hat

One of my favorite albums in college was "Wired," which contains Jeff Beck's 1976 cover of this tune.

Here's the Beckster noodling away at it a few years ago at a London gig:


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## WouldaShoulda (Aug 5, 2009)

CuffDaddy said:


> I don't think Lester Young was 3 bills, and yet he did not say "goodbye, pork pie hat!"


Neither was Buster Keaton, but they ain't me!!


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## CuffDaddy (Feb 26, 2009)

Jeff Beck's recent live album also has a version of GBPPH. Great album, IMO.


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## Flanderian (Apr 30, 2008)

Either style can be handsome. The fedora is arguably more formal/dressy than the porkpie. The fedora can be suitable for wear with anything from the more formal end of suit and tie to a leather jacket depending on its style and how it is worn. I would say the range of the porkpie would fall somewhere in between.

As a boy porkpie hats were most common, and that is what I wore. Never liked them as I thought them unflattering for me, and still don't care for them for that reason. It has been a long time since I wore a proper fur felt fedora. Was going to acquire one this departing season, but got sidetracked. Proper hats for wear with suits should be made from fur felt. 

Research here and elsewhere suggested that the Akubra brand offered some of the finest quality and value, though many of their styles fall on the more casual end of the spectrum. A perusal of the Internet suggests that this vendor may have the largest selection of Akubra hats here in the U.S.

https://www.davidmorgan.com/index.php?cPath=2


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## Wildblue (Oct 11, 2009)

Wildblue said:


> I personally STRONGLY prefer the Fedora. The Pork Pie, to me, just looks too..... goober-like.


To clarify, I think SOME men can pull off the Pork Pie well. (I think Stallone wore a Pork Pie sometime) But I generally think men look too "goober-like" in them.

Fedoras, on the other hand, look good on many more men.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

CuffDaddy said:


> A pork pie's defining feature is its crown. The crown is telecoped, with a single furrow/crimp running just inside the circumfrence of the crown, and no indentations of the side of the crown. To wit:


Exactly, well said. Some people incorrectly call some trilbys porkpie hats because of the narrowness of the brim.


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## amplifiedheat (Jun 9, 2008)

CuffDaddy said:


> Bonus points for anyone who gets the joke.


I've had _Mingus Ah Um_ and _Wired _since I was in high school.:aportnoy:

As to the original question, this guide is helpful:
https://artofmanliness.com/2008/05/28/the-perfect-hat-for-your-ugly-mug/
The porkpie's narrower brim is especially recommended for men with a receding chin, and discouraged for men with prominent ears.


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## PJC in NoVa (Jan 23, 2005)

Wildblue said:


> To clarify, I think SOME men can pull off the Pork Pie well. (I think Stallone wore a Pork Pie sometime) .












"Yo, Adrian!"

NB: I don't think that's a porkpie, though he certainly does look like a goober of sorts.


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## Peak and Pine (Sep 12, 2007)

I think the porkpie might come in handy if you were reinacting the Zoot Suit Riots.​


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## Sator (Jan 13, 2006)

I think Frank Sinatra sometimes wore a pork pie:










Of all soft hats, it tends to look most affected today simply because they are even less in fashion than fedoras.

I would also recommend the Akubra Federation. This model is made as a custom order for Hatsdirect, and is only available from them:

https://www.hatsdirect.com/federation/index.html

Akubra are one of the very last family own traditional RTW hatmakers still in operation around the world. I believe the following original ad came from the 1930s or 40s:


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## CuffDaddy (Feb 26, 2009)

amplifiedheat said:


> I've had _Mingus Ah Um_ and _Wired _since I was in high school.:aportnoy:


Now there's a man who knew that you better get in your soul! 

OP, sorry for the threadjack.


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## Flanderian (Apr 30, 2008)

Sator said:


> I think Frank Sinatra sometimes wore a pork pie:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Great illustration for Akubra hats! Thank you.


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## Mad Hatter (Jul 13, 2008)

Sator said:


> I think Frank Sinatra sometimes wore a pork pie:


Good picture-that's the exact way I wear mine.


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## SartoNYC (Feb 22, 2005)

*Book learnin' time*

The Fedora and the Porkie are very different hats.

I would recommend undertaking a study of the levels of formality and history of these two as well as the other obvious models before your purchase to ensure you get what you REALLY want, and what you NEED.

Otherwise ... you are just buying a hat.


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## Flanderian (Apr 30, 2008)

Porkpie done right! I believe Will of A Suitable Wardrobe fame had Art Fawcett of VS Hats make one for him similar to that depicted below.

https://www.vintagesilhouettes.com/images/hats/client_hats/100307_2.JPG

From what I know from my limited knowledge about fur felt hats, both fedoras and porkpies start life as an open crown hat, and this hat can be creased into either style. Art Fawcett makes some very stylish hats.


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## sowilson (Jul 27, 2009)

CuffDaddy said:


> Now there's a man who knew that you better get in your soul!
> 
> OP, sorry for the threadjack.


Well you needn't have said that for an epitaph !


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## Mad Hatter (Jul 13, 2008)

Flanderian said:


> Porkpie done right! I believe Will of A Suitable Wardrobe fame had Art Fawcett of VS Hats make one for him similar to that depicted below.
> 
> https://www.vintagesilhouettes.com/images/hats/client_hats/100307_2.JPG
> 
> From what I know from my limited knowledge about fur felt hats, both fedoras and porkpies start life as an open crown hat, and this hat can be creased into either style. Art Fawcett makes some very stylish hats.


He does, indeed-I have a couple of his hats. In fact, he made my porkpie and it's otherwise identical to the linked pic other than color-mine is Mojave. Not for everyone, but definitely not a "goober" hat.:icon_smile_big:


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## comrade (May 26, 2005)

Mad Hatter said:


> Good picture-that's the exact way I wear mine.


Frank Sinatra, a male anorectic with mob connections.
Not an example that I would cite.

Now Cary Grant is different: an iconic actor and a great
dresser. He he is in the classic " His Girl Friday" in a
porkpie:

https://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x49/heidilenffer/His-Girl-Friday.gif


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## Strategery (Jan 12, 2010)

What are some good places to shop for a quality hat such as these?


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## mjc (Nov 11, 2009)

Strategery said:


> What are some good places to shop for a quality hat such as these?


https://www.villagehatshop.com/ worked well for me. If you mean an online shop...

- Mike


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## CuffDaddy (Feb 26, 2009)

Strategery said:


> What are some good places to shop for a quality hat such as these?


Hat buying, at least for the inexperienced purchaser, really needs to be done in person. Once you've learned how various brands fit and are proportioned, what brim and crown dimensions look best on your face, etc., you can shop online; until you know those things, though, you are quite likely to make some expensive mistakes with online shopping.

The number of high-quality hat shops in the US is quite small these days. I am a fan of JJ Hat Center in New York. But you're closer to Optimo Hats in Chicago, which makes custom hats for customers. They won't be inexpensive, but you'd be going to the hat equivalent of a Saville Row tailor. https://www.optimohats.com/ Paul Stuart, also in Chicago, usually has a smaller, but still varied, selection of OTR hats.


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## twe_Ed (Jan 26, 2010)

*A bounder eh?*



Cardcaptor Charlie said:


> Fedora. Porkpie has the air of a bounder about it.


Is it just me or does getting "the air of a bounder" about one appeal? :aportnoy:


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