# Correct way to carry a pen in shirt pocket



## Claybuster (Aug 29, 2007)

Alright, at the risk of sounding silly, is there a correct way to carry a pen in a front shirt pocket? I have heard one should position the pen on the far left side of the pocket near the sleeve and I have also heard the right side near the buttons. Which is correct? Or does it really matter? Thanks in advance.


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## philm (Jun 17, 2007)

Claybuster said:


> Alright, at the risk of sounding silly, is there a correct way to carry a pen in a front shirt pocket? I have heard one should position the pen on the far left side of the pocket near the sleeve and I have also heard the right side near the buttons. Which is correct? Or does it really matter? Thanks in advance.


To each his own, but no pens should be put in the shirt pocket. They should go in the coat pocket. I think that is rule number 1, but you see many carrying the pen in the shirt pocket. Before I read of this rule, and I can't remember where, I used to carry the pen clear over to the left to hide it under my jacket. Of course, when the jacket is off that is not good either.

What do others have to say on this score?

I have just about ruined 2 good ocbd's recently with ink drips on the shirt pocket. One I got our completely after two washings and the other is still being worked on. That hazard is another reason not to carry pens in the shirt pocket, especially if you have an ink roller ball and forget to retract the point before you put it in your pocket. Dumb and dumber old me.


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## smlaz (May 13, 2005)

I'd suggest that you carry your pen(s) to work in your briefbag/attache, and then, while in the office, carry it in your hand.


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## nicksull (Sep 1, 2005)

*mmmm...*

Having ruined a good suit jacket lining or two from leaky fountain pens, i think the best place is in a briefcase or on your desk. 
Im not sure proper shirts should have pockets anyway..... 
Ink is the enemy......


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## Alexander Kabbaz (Jan 9, 2003)

Any way you carry it is fine. The quicker it leaks, the better. :devil:


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

I keep mine in my shirt pocket closest to the button because that's most convenient. I've never had a pen leak on me (something has to be really wrong for a pen to leak, and honestly except on airplanes or when using a pen with a sac, you'll probably never have it leak). I've been using fountain pens exclusively (and extensively) for the past 6 years. That inside the coat pocket is the European way of doing it, I don't particularly care for it. Also, Europeans tend not to post the cap of the pen on the back of it, another European practice I don't particularly care for.


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## Sator (Jan 13, 2006)

Alexander Kabbaz said:


> Any way you carry it is fine. The quicker it leaks, the better. :devil:


:icon_smile_big:

I think Alex is trying to very subtly hint at the fact that shirts shouldn't have pockets!!!!


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## Claybuster (Aug 29, 2007)

Thank you, gentlemen. You have been very helpful.


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## Matt S (Jun 15, 2006)

Because pens have the potential of leaking, they shouldn't be put in a shirt pocket. To protect your shirt there is always the pocket protector, but that doesn't belong in your shirt pocket either. That is mainly because your shirt shouldn't have a pocket, as any proper English shirt doesn't.


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## nicksull (Sep 1, 2005)

marlinspike said:


> Also, Europeans tend not to post the cap of the pen on the back of it, another European practice I don't particularly care for.


On behalf of all pen wielding Europeans I apologise for affronting your delicate sensibilities!


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## TMMKC (Aug 2, 2007)

Hopefully never. I learned early on to put the pen in my briefcase or coat breast pocket...leaking ink ruined many a good BB shirt in my mid-20s!


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

nicksull said:


> On behalf of all pen wielding Europeans I apologise for affronting your delicate sensibilities!


At the same time, all my favorite pens are European (specifically, German, though the Italians make pens that I like the look of and I do have one Italian pen in my regular rotation and another is kept as a backup in my briefcase). Also, while the standard rule is Europeans don't post the cap, it was a German lady who told me to post the cap on the back of my Pelikan M800 and I'll see how wonderfully it balances...so it's all a crap shoot.


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## qasimkhan (Sep 24, 2003)

You're all being far too absolute in your rule. If you are a clerk, you SHOULD carry your pen in a shirt pocket.


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## fullgrain (Jan 5, 2007)

philm said:


> I have just about ruined 2 good ocbd's recently with ink drips on the shirt pocket. One I got our completely after two washings and the other is still being worked on.


Try hairspray. Drench and dab and repeat. It's about the most effective home method for removing ink.


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## Bob Loblaw (Mar 9, 2006)

A bottle of isopropyl alcohol is kept at home for this purpose.


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## Andy (Aug 25, 2002)

Claybuster:

In the Stain Removal Chapter of *The Encyclopedia of Men's Clothes* you'll find:
*INK*
Read the care label! If it says dry-clean only, or the mark is large, rush it to the cleaners. 

Washable? This is often an impossible stain because of the many types of ink. Cold water may do the trick. Otherwise, *pre-treat with pre-wash stain remover*, rubbing alcohol (soak a piece of cotton in alcohol, rub gently), cleaning fluid, or lemon juice.

Test in an inconspicuous area to be sure it's safe for the fabric. Place garment stain side down on paper towels and dab cleaner on stain using a paper or terry cloth towel. Check paper towels underneath and move frequently so there's always a clean area under the stain to absorb ink. Let area dry and check it. If ink remains, treat with pre-wash spray and launder. Before drying, check again. Still visible? Repeat steps.​And from the Dress Shirt Chapter:
13. Pockets* 
*
Original bespoke (custom made) dress shirts had NO breast pocket. Pockets on shirts begin showing up as the waistcoat (vest) went out of style. But a gentleman would not use it, even if one comes with the shirt. Brooks Brothers didn't add a pocket to their button-down shirt until 1965! 

Your pen (and glasses, tickets, calculator, etc.) belong in an inside suit jacket pocket! And now that you know, you won't need that pocket protector anymore.

*If a shirt has two pockets, it is NOT a dress shirt! * ​


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## marlinspike (Jun 4, 2007)

Could someone tell me what exactly is wrong with having a pocket on your shirt...some reason other than "that's not how they used to do it."


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## Andy (Aug 25, 2002)

marlinspike said:


> Could someone tell me what exactly is wrong with having a pocket on your shirt...some reason other than "that's not how they used to do it."


Some do find it a point of interest for balance. But it should serve no purpose.


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## Claybuster (Aug 29, 2007)

Andy said:


> Claybuster:
> *The Encyclopedia of Men's Clothes*


Thanks, Andy. I definitely need to order the above.


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## rip (Jul 13, 2005)

philm said:


> To each his own, but no pens should be put in the shirt pocket. They should go in the coat pocket. I think that is rule number 1, but you see many carrying the pen in the shirt pocket. Before I read of this rule, and I can't remember where, I used to carry the pen clear over to the left to hide it under my jacket. Of course, when the jacket is off that is not good either.
> 
> What do others have to say on this score?
> 
> I have just about ruined 2 good ocbd's recently with ink drips on the shirt pocket. One I got our completely after two washings and the other is still being worked on. That hazard is another reason not to carry pens in the shirt pocket, especially if you have an ink roller ball and forget to retract the point before you put it in your pocket. Dumb and dumber old me.


Had you rather ruin a shirt or a coat? Ink is devilishly hard to remove. Fountain pens, even the very best of them, have been known to leak, usually when you're wearing your most expensive clothes.


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## Rich (Jul 10, 2005)

All my RTW suits have an inside pen pocket - which I don't use for fear of leaks - I've only ever had one, but it cost me a suit. A serious leak is a disaster.

Dress shirts have no pockets because jackets have all the pockets you need, and because a dress shirt should be sleek. A pocket is a functional feature, and so tends to the casual.


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## alaric (May 23, 2005)

Sator said:


> :icon_smile_big:
> 
> I think Alex is trying to very subtly hint at the fact that shirts shouldn't have pockets!!!!


Here, here!

If I carry a pen, I put it in a pen case and carry it in my inside jacket pocket. Fountain pen, that is. My drawing pens, I carry in a messenger bag with my sketch pads.

alaric


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## rsmeyer (May 14, 2006)

Sator said:


> :icon_smile_big:
> 
> I think Alex is trying to very subtly hint at the fact that shirts shouldn't have pockets!!!!


Agreed-dress shirts(shirts to be worn with jacket and tie) should not have pockets.


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## Will (Jun 15, 2004)

I have no pockets on my shirts, but then, I don't carry a pen either. It's easier to take notes on a Blackberry. 

The only time I miss having a pen is when I need to fill out one of those cards to enter a new country, and they'll get automated in the not too distant future. Hard to imagine it's efficient for an immigration officer to search through a warehouse full of entry cards to see if Sator paid duty on his new frock coat in 1904.


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## Mr. Chatterbox (May 1, 2005)

The correct way to carry a pen in one's pocket? Capped, of course! :icon_smile_big:


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## Acct2000 (Sep 24, 2005)

I just put the pen in my shirt pocket when I'm not wearing a coat.

If that makes me a clerk, I'm a clerk.


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## The Gabba Goul (Feb 11, 2005)

marlinspike said:


> Could someone tell me what exactly is wrong with having a pocket on your shirt...some reason other than "that's not how they used to do it."


THat's pretty much the only reason, you're going to get...well, that and maybe...because shirt pockets make prince charles cry...

I actually have started having some of my shirts made with pockets...I find that they are handy for when you need to take your rings off when you wash your hands and dont want to set them down...well...I know I wear alot of rings...but more practically, I find that they are good for when you have small slips of paper that could easily get crumpled up in your pants or fall out of your coat pockets (tickets, directions, instructions, phone numbers [sorry but as far as I'm concerned, it's still sexier for a girl to write her number down on something and hand it to you rather than handing her your blackberry and trying to explain to her how to program it in], etc), the shirt pocket seems to be an excellent place to put them...


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## rip (Jul 13, 2005)

Will said:


> I have no pockets on my shirts, but then, I don't carry a pen either. It's easier to take notes on a Blackberry.


You've not truly felt sadness and despair until your Blackberry leaks.


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## Acct2000 (Sep 24, 2005)

- - - and spews out its contents byte by byte.


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## The Gabba Goul (Feb 11, 2005)

forsbergacct2000 said:


> - - - and spews out its contents byte by byte.


lol reminds me of a joke I heard the other day...

How do you get blue tooth???
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
By eating too many BlackBerrys...

woka woka woka...

I said a joke...I didnt say it was a good joke...


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## Acct2000 (Sep 24, 2005)

but it WAS a noble attempt!!


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## chang (Feb 16, 2006)

Most fountain pens are clipped so that the tip is up. I've never had a problem with it leaking, maybe possible if I were suspended upside down for a long period of time. Or perhaps if got hit hard enough that the pen was somehow damaged. The only problem I ever had with a fountain pen was when it came uncapped while it was in my forearm sleeve pocket. Most clothes don't have a pocket like this anyway. I think if the pen in question had a cap that was threaded on instead of snap on, this wouldn't be an issue at all.


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## Will (Jun 15, 2004)

forsbergacct2000 said:


> - - - and spews out its contents byte by byte.


Sadly, in my experience, when they go bad they keep their contents.


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## Acct2000 (Sep 24, 2005)

But, of course, our esteemed Will would not think of being without a backup!


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## philm (Jun 17, 2007)

nicksull said:


> On behalf of all pen wielding Europeans I apologise for affronting your delicate sensibilities!


Ah--I don't think you should be affronted--we're talking pense not world peace.


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## reubencahn (Mar 28, 2006)

I order nearly all my shirts with a pocket. I keep my office cardkey in it. If I'm walking around the office without a jacket, I may put my reading glasses in it. While driving to work, I put sunglasses or sometimes my Blackberry in the shirt pocket. Does a shirt with a pocket look less sleek than one without? Maybe, if my jacket is off. Do I care? No.


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## a tailor (May 16, 2005)

this tailor and all the others also need that pocket to carry their tailors chalk.
we would be hamstrung without it.


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## GBR (Aug 10, 2005)

a tailor said:


> this tailor and all the others also need that pocket to carry their tailors chalk.
> we would be hamstrung without it.


Which pocket please? This seems to have become detached from its original.


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## Acct2000 (Sep 24, 2005)

The shirt pocket


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## Alexander Kabbaz (Jan 9, 2003)

Sator said:


> :icon_smile_big:
> 
> I think Alex is trying to very subtly hint at the fact that shirts shouldn't have pockets!!!!


 Nope. Shirts can perfectly well have pocket*s*. Shirts should not have pocket. Shirts with pocket*s* are not dress shirts. By simple extrapolation, dress shirts should therefore not have pocket.



marlinspike said:


> Could someone tell me what exactly is wrong with having a pocket on your shirt...some reason other than "that's not how they used to do it."


 Yes. It is asymmetric. _**** sapiens_ are symmetric. Shirts haven't the luxury of padding as do suits. Placing objects in one's shirt pocket weighs down that side of the shirt destroying all of the careful and precise pattern shaping done by your shirtmaker to make the front panels lie flat.


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## Alexander Kabbaz (Jan 9, 2003)

*WTF?*

Who in hell put H0M0 in the bad word filter???


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## jcusey (Apr 19, 2003)

Alexander Kabbaz said:


> Yes. It is asymmetric. _**** sapiens_ are symmetric.


Do you use this same argument when you tell your tailor to leave off the breast pockets on your jackets, or is a foolish consistency the hobgoblin of small minds?



Alexander Kabbaz said:


> Who in hell put H0M0 in the bad word filter???


Are you a Senior Moderator or are you a mouse? Qwitcherbitchin and fix it!


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## DEG (Jan 29, 2005)

I think shirts look best without a pocket and two pockets are pretty ugly. If I have a shirt pocket, and some of mine have pockets, it would be a most unusual day if I ever inserted a pen into it, or anything else for that matter. I dresses any shirt waaaay down. Andy has it right in his post above.


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## smlaz (May 13, 2005)

******

Homosapiens, homontherange, Homor Simpson, should not be blocked. Except for bad spelling and feeble attempts at homor. Er, humour.
Cheers,


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## jlmwrite (Dec 27, 2005)

Dress shirts have pockets? Not in my closet... :icon_smile_big:


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## 14395 (Mar 10, 2004)

Alexander Kabbaz said:


> Any way you carry it is fine. The quicker it leaks, the better. :devil:





Sator said:


> :icon_smile_big:
> 
> I think Alex is trying to very subtly hint at the fact that shirts shouldn't have pockets!!!!


Or the quicker it leaks, the quicker it's time to order a new AK shirt :icon_smile:


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## mpcsb (Jan 1, 2005)

Alexander Kabbaz said:


> Who in hell put H0M0 in the bad word filter???


_Well_....it wasn't me. :icon_smile_wink:


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## KenR (Jun 22, 2005)

I'm going to go against the grain here. Most of my dress shirts have pockets. A few don't but I wish they did. I usually have my suit jacket off when I work and keep my reading glasses and a pen or pencil in there. And I am still a sartorial stud.


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## Albert (Feb 15, 2006)

May I suggest that may best suit your purpose. Very eclectic, to say at the least!


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## jml90 (Dec 7, 2005)

I carry other stuff in my shirt pocket like cufflinks, a tie clasp, or a collar bar, until they make their way to my shirt though.


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## Alexander Kabbaz (Jan 9, 2003)

jcusey said:


> Do you use this same argument when you tell your tailor to leave off the breast pockets on your jackets, or is a foolish consistency the hobgoblin of small minds?


 Jackets have canvas, horsehair, and padding (Except for Manton's which just sort of float miraculously on the ether). Even 25 pens in a jacket breast pocket won't pull down sufficiently on the shoulder to destroy the heavenly symmetry of two well-fitted front panels. 2x2 200 weed fuzz is another proposition entirely. As far as my foolish consistency, was today another one of those boring, conservative days when you wore a matched pair of shoes?



jcusey said:


> Are you a Senior Moderator or are you a mouse? Qwitcherbitchin and fix it!


 Fine. I'll add 'shoe' to the filter while I'm at it for all fora except the interchange. At least that will do away with disgusting dead animal talk on the main boards.



mpcsb said:


> _Well_....it wasn't me. :icon_smile_wink:


And I've got a bridge for sale.


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## jcusey (Apr 19, 2003)

Alexander Kabbaz said:


> Jackets have canvas, horsehair, and padding (Except for Manton's which just sort of float miraculously on the ether). Even 25 pens in a jacket breast pocket won't pull down sufficiently on the shoulder to destroy the heavenly symmetry of two well-fitted front panels. 2x2 200 weed fuzz is another proposition entirely. As far as my foolish consistency, was today another one of those boring, conservative days when you wore a matched pair of shoes?


Ah, so you wouldn't object to pockets on shirts so long as they had nothing sufficiently heavy or bulky to destroy the line? Well, then, maybe I won't have to petition Andy for your banning just yet.



> Fine. I'll add 'shoe' to the filter while I'm at it for all fora except the interchange. At least that will do away with disgusting dead animal talk on the main boards.


Have you given any thought to making the art school year-round?


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## Alexander Kabbaz (Jan 9, 2003)

jcusey said:


> Ah, so you wouldn't object to pockets on shirts so long as they had nothing sufficiently heavy or bulky to destroy the line? Well, then, maybe I won't have to petition Andy for your banning just yet.


Line? *Line? LINE???

* Line:​ *_______*​ *_____*
*___*
*_*
*
Not Line:​ *_______*​ *___X_*
*___*
*_*
*​


jcusey said:


> Have you given any thought to making the art school year-round?


Yes. Our upcoming class will be on the art of shitting foos before fools walk them through fhit.
​


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## jsprowls9 (Jun 24, 2005)

a tailor said:


> this tailor and all the others also need that pocket to carry their tailors chalk. we would be hamstrung without it.


Yes.

What's sad: I usually design with black wax, cut with yellow wax and fit with white wax. So, I do not "dress" for work on the days I'm cutting or designing because I quickly trash my clothes. Black wax never comes out, really.


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## jcusey (Apr 19, 2003)

Alexander Kabbaz said:


> Line? *Line? LINE???
> 
> * Line:​ *_______*​ *_____*
> *___*
> ...


Oh, so your argument about a shirt lacking the padding, canvas, etc. to prevent a breast pocket from being misshapen when heavy objects are stored in it was just a smokescreen? Your real problem with breast pockets is that they ruin symmetry whether or not they have anything in them, so I repeat: do you also get into disagreements with your tailors when you ask them to leave the breast pockets off of your jackets?


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