# Winter trousers.



## IvanD (Jan 5, 2012)

Gentlemen, winter approaches.
As I have conveyed before, my main reason for frequenting the forum is to improve my appreciation and collection of good casual clothes.
I now feel I could benefit from more choice in my winter trousers.
At the moment, almost all of my winter trousers are heavier weight chinos, namely these:

https://www.gant.co.uk/mens-chinos/brown-classic-chinos/9779

Don't get me wrong, these are excellent for the colder weather, but it would be nice to have an alternative.
I am not a fan of cords, so they are definitely out.
I have been looking at moleskin trousers, but to be honest, I know absolutely nothing about them.
Would it be possible for you good gents to educate me as to their warmth, wearability, etc?
Also, any brand recommendations would be much appreciated.

Thank you in advance.


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## momsdoc (Sep 19, 2013)

Flannel, tweed, especially Donegal as it doesn't fight the tweed's pattern. Gabardine can work but IMHO is less optimal.


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## Hitch (Apr 25, 2012)

You're in the Land of Moleskins, Hoggs ,Peter Christian,Scotweb just for a start


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

You cannot go wrong with Peter Christian moleskins. The cut is perfect, proper rise and a decent roomy fit. It's a fine quality nap on the material and the price is very reasonable. They will keep out the winter chill and no mistake, they are extremely soft and comfortable, they improve with age, plus they are very, _very_ durable indeed.

Cords are an acquired taste for some, but consider a finer whale and a more modern cut if you wish to avoid fuddy-duddy folk music associations. Have a look at Tyhrwitts offerings - they have dark chocolate coloured classic fit cords in their sale for around £30 at the moment. These are a heavy weight trouser (so require a chunky full brogue to compliment) and they don't half keep the cold out.


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## Spex (Nov 25, 2012)

Shaver, those moleskins look great and the price is reasonable. I'd take a chance but the shipping and possibly duty charges may make the price less attractive. Do any of my fellow Canadians have any tips on where to get a similar product at a similar price?


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

Orvis carries a quality moleskin but their prices are high enough that importing Peter Christian from the UK (at least south of The Parallel) is economically sound. I have pair of Orvis and I'm eagerly awaiting my PC's. Until the latter arrive I won't be able to do a comparison but as soon as I can . . . 

It started raining this morning. That means in SoCal it's cool enough for tweed. So since I have to go to MyTailor and pick up my post-alterations new jacket, it's into the tweed and moleskin for me. Ah, autumn . . .

And Spex, remember that the website price from Peter Christian includes VAT which neither you nor I have to pay. It about takes care of the shipping/import duty.


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## alkydrinker (Apr 24, 2012)

I was recently wondering about possibly buying old fashioned wool hunting pants for casual everyday wear. They are typically cut and styled like a chino, but made of wool. I was wondering if they might make a good substitute for chinos in the cold weather.

Any hunters/outdoorsmen have any input on this being good/bad idea? Would this type of pant look odd or be too hot indoors?


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

When hunting the arctic, I use mil surplus wool pants. They definitely work but are, as you suggested, too warm for indoors--unless you work in a meat locker! 

Wool hunting pants from Woolrich or Filson come in different weights. You'd have to choose your material carefully depending on how cold it gets in Baltimore. As to their styling, they take a crease when pressed but do have a pretty 'woodsy' look to them. If you're wearing them out clubbing or the like, prepare for snide comments. However, for walking the Lab or watching field hockey, they're the bee's knees.


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## Kingstonian (Dec 23, 2007)

Shaver said:


> You cannot go wrong with Peter Christian moleskins. The cut is perfect, proper rise and a decent roomy fit. It's a fine quality nap on the material and the price is very reasonable. They will keep out the winter chill and no mistake, they are extremely soft and comfortable, they improve with age, plus they are very, _very_ durable indeed.


Agreed. PC country cords are on the roomy size in terms of cut but the flat front moleskins are spot on..


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## alkydrinker (Apr 24, 2012)

Oldsarge said:


> When hunting the arctic, I use mil surplus wool pants. They definitely work but are, as you suggested, too warm for indoors--unless you work in a meat locker!
> 
> Wool hunting pants from Woolrich or Filson come in different weights. You'd have to choose your material carefully depending on how cold it gets in Baltimore. As to their styling, they take a crease when pressed but do have a pretty 'woodsy' look to them. If you're wearing them out clubbing or the like, prepare for snide comments. However, for walking the Lab or watching field hockey, they're the bee's knees.


Good info, thanks for the response. (Given your signature line, I figured you might have something to say on this.)

Maybe not clubbing, but pants like this might actually be admired in many bar scene environs nowadays with this whole americana/work wear/lumber jack trend with the hipsters.

My main memories of seeing such pants worn in real life were on my boy scout leaders when I was young.


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## Spex (Nov 25, 2012)

Oldsarge said:


> And Spex, remember that the website price from Peter Christian includes VAT which neither you nor I have to pay. It about takes care of the shipping/import duty.


Right, I keep forgetting about this! Also makes those Equus belts all the most tempting as well...


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

Shaver said:


> You cannot go wrong with Peter Christian moleskins. The cut is perfect, proper rise and a decent roomy fit. It's a fine quality nap on the material and the price is very reasonable. They will keep out the winter chill and no mistake, they are extremely soft and comfortable, they improve with age, plus they are very, _very_ durable indeed.
> 
> Cords are an acquired taste for some, but consider a finer whale and a more modern cut if you wish to avoid fuddy-duddy folk music associations. Have a look at Tyhrwitts offerings - they have dark chocolate coloured classic fit cords in their sale for around £30 at the moment. These are a heavy weight trouser (so require a chunky full brogue to compliment) and they don't half keep the cold out.


I hate to be the geek that asks this, but do you know where the Peter Christian moleskins are made? I'm looking at them and thinking about pulling the trigger on a pair in red or eggplant, which just look beautiful.


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## MTJim (Dec 20, 2012)

Dang looks like Peter Christian moleskins stop at 34" inseam. What is a tall man to do?


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

I'm afraid, Jim, that you're going to have to go MTM. Fortunately, Holland and Sherry sells moleskin fabric to tailors and you should be able to get some made up fairly easily. I know that MyTailor carries H&S moleskin and corduroy and I'm sure others do, too.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

L-feld said:


> I hate to be the geek that asks this, but do you know where the Peter Christian moleskins are made? I'm looking at them and thinking about pulling the trigger on a pair in red or eggplant, which just look beautiful.


Not certain as to the origin of the trousers, I'll check out mine when I get home later and let you know.

Beware of the fox red moleskins - they are a much brighter shade of red in real life than they appear in the photo. I sent a pair back because of this.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

Spex said:


> Right, I keep forgetting about this! Also makes those Equus belts all the most tempting as well...


Give in to the Equus temptation. You will not regret it, I guarantee you.


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## MTJim (Dec 20, 2012)

Thanks Oldsarge, MyTailors price of almost $400 is out of my range. I'm looking into Luxire as they run about $150, but haven't found many reviews on their pants.


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## momsdoc (Sep 19, 2013)

Oldsarge said:


> Orvis carries a quality moleskin but their prices are high enough that importing Peter Christian from the UK (at least south of The Parallel) is economically sound. I have pair of Orvis and I'm eagerly awaiting my PC's. Until the latter arrive I won't be able to do a comparison but as soon as I can .
> 
> And Spex, remember that the website price from Peter Christian includes VAT which neither you nor I have to pay. It about takes care of the shipping/import duty.


Thanks for the tip on the VAT it saved 20%, more than enough to cover shipping. I'm waiting on 2 pair from PC and one pair from Orvis that I ordered 2 days ago before reading this thread Orvis is twice the price. I'll have to see how they compare when they arrive and let you know if Orvis is worth the price. Somehow if Shaver likes PC, I doubt Orvis will stand up to them.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

momsdoc said:


> Thanks for the tip on the VAT it saved 20%, more than enough to cover shipping. I'm waiting on 2 pair from PC and one pair from Orvis that I ordered 2 days ago before reading this thread Orvis is twice the price. I'll have to see how they compare when they arrive and let you know if Orvis is worth the price. Somehow if Shaver likes PC, I doubt Orvis will stand up to them.


Land's End mole-skins are quite acceptable, especially as beaters. They take a few washes to really bring out the nap, and the cut is a touch sub-optimal, but they are value for money when their discount codes are applied.


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

Shaver said:


> Land's End mole-skins are quite acceptable, especially as beaters. They take a few washes to really bring out the nap, and the cut is a touch sub-optimal, but they are value for money when their discount codes are applied.


Unfortunately this year LE isn't listing moleskins in their lineup. I'm a bit put out by that given numerous favorable comments about them here. Ah well, LE's loss is PC's gain.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

Oldsarge said:


> Unfortunately this year LE isn't listing moleskins in their lineup. I'm a bit put out by that given numerous favorable comments about them here. Ah well, LE's loss is PC's gain.


They are available in the UK. In fact I ordered two pairs today, straight cut though - they will be going back if this does not meet with my approval.

One thing I find rather admirable about Land's End is that they take the trouble to offer budget versions of many of the more arcane cloths and weaves that we folk here at AAAC admire so.


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

Shaver said:


> They are available in the UK. In fact I ordered two pairs today, straight cut though - they will be going back if this does not meet with my approval.
> 
> One thing I find rather admirable about Land's End is that they take the trouble to offer budget versions of many of the more arcane cloths and weaves that we folk here at AAAC admire so.


Really? Would that be Landsend.uk.co? If the price differential is sufficient I might order a pair from them, too.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

^ That's the one Sarge. 

I am concerned as to what exactly the 'straight' cut may actually be. It is slightly below the waist for certain but I can tolerate that, especially in more casual trousers - however if the fit is even approaching 'slim' then they are no good to me. I'll update the thread with details when the postman has delivered and I have gained opportunity to try them on.


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## jeffreyc (Apr 8, 2010)

One practical problem I have had with dark moleskins is their uncanny ability to pick up fluff. I think they look great but I am constantly reaching for the sellotape on a roll tool and shouting at the dogs to stay away. A pair of Levi's dockers went in the bin during one episode !
Is this just a burden to carry with these trousers ???


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

jeffreyc said:


> One practical problem I have had with dark moleskins is their uncanny ability to pick up fluff. I think they look great but I am constantly reaching for the sellotape on a roll tool and shouting at the dogs to stay away. A pair of Levi's dockers went in the bin during one episode !
> Is this just a burden to carry with these trousers ???


Never use sellotape on cloth! :icon_pale:


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## momsdoc (Sep 19, 2013)

What do you use to remove lint? And what is the problem with those sticky lint rollers? Do they leave some sort of degrading residue behind? I have never noticed a problem.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

The sticky residue of sellotape actually encourages lint to collect on the material, it also traps dirt and grime. In short, using sellotape exacerbates the problem. A decent bristle clothes brush is the only solution.


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## momsdoc (Sep 19, 2013)

What do you use to remove lint? I have used the lint rollers and never noticed a problem. Do they leave a degrading residue behind?


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## Bjorn (May 2, 2010)

momsdoc said:


> What do you use to remove lint? I have used the lint rollers and never noticed a problem. Do they leave a degrading residue behind?


Yes, it builds up. The best is a good quality brush, from for example Kent brushes.

I'm not sure the residue is degrading, but it is a thin layer of glue. I'm not putting that on my clothes voluntarily.


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## MaxBuck (Apr 4, 2013)

I've never experienced any transfer of adhesive using the 3M or similar roller-tape products. I have no criticism of those who prefer to use a bristle brush, but I personally will continue to use the rollers.


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## momsdoc (Sep 19, 2013)

Shaver said:


> ^ That's the one Sarge.
> 
> I am concerned as to what exactly the 'straight' cut may actually be. It is slightly below the waist for certain but I can tolerate that, especially in more casual trousers - however if the fit is even approaching 'slim' then they are no good to me. I'll update the thread with details when the postman has delivered and I have gained opportunity to try them on.


Please let us know how the LE moleskins are. I have never worn them and as I am awaiting the PC and Orvis ones, I would like your opinion on LE before I decide to keep the others. I too am concerned about the straight cut.

Does anyone have experience in the US with LE UK as far as returns? Can they be shipped back here, taken to Sears, or do you have to pay to return them overseas?


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

L-feld said:


> I hate to be the geek that asks this, but do you know where the Peter Christian moleskins are made? I'm looking at them and thinking about pulling the trigger on a pair in red or eggplant, which just look beautiful.


I have checked and cannot find a country of origin tab anywhere on the trousers...... a mystery.


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## L-feld (Dec 3, 2011)

Shaver said:


> I have checked and cannot find a country of origin tab anywhere on the trousers...... a mystery.


Thank you sir. I've done a little sleuthing myself and my most informed guess is that they are made in Portugal, which I can live with.

Now if I could only convince my credit card company to allow international charges to go through...:banghead:

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

momsdoc said:


> Please let us know how the LE moleskins are. I have never worn them and as I am awaiting the PC and Orvis ones, I would like your opinion on LE before I decide to keep the others. I too am concerned about the straight cut.
> 
> Does anyone have experience in the US with LE UK as far as returns? Can they be shipped back here, taken to Sears, or do you have to pay to return them overseas?


The 'straight' cut are, as I feared, what I would consider 'skinny' cut. Straight back into the Returns department they must go. Pity, I really liked the colours......


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

I was afraid of that. I finally found them on the US LE website and they look to be cut like jeans even though they are described as chinos. Pity.


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## mrfixit (Dec 30, 2012)

traditional and straight fit available from LE US.

https://www.landsend.com/shop/search?Ntt=moleskin


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

My Peter Christian's just arrived*. My. My goodness me. Shaver, you are a bad, bad influence. Worse yet, they sent a catalog that's just full of all kinds of delightful countryside stuff. Moleskin and wool waistcoats for much better prices than any here in the States? I can see that this is going to be trouble!










*and just in time for my elk hunt, too . . .


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## Tilton (Nov 27, 2011)

I found three Orvis moleskin chinos in a thrift on Saturday. Took home one pair, left a pair of a hole in the seat and a pair that was a brilliant canary yellow.


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## Youthful Repp-robate (Sep 26, 2011)

I'm wearing the LE moleskins in their traditional fit today. They're fine. I can't get them to keep a perfect crease, and I'd gladly buy the tailored fit if it dropped to the jaw dropping price I picked these up at, because the thighs are a touch wide, but they're comfortable and quite warm.


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## Tempest (Aug 16, 2012)

Shaver said:


> ^ That's the one Sarge.
> 
> I am concerned as to what exactly the 'straight' cut may actually be. It is slightly below the waist for certain but I can tolerate that, especially in more casual trousers - however if the fit is even approaching 'slim' then they are no good to me. I'll update the thread with details when the postman has delivered and I have gained opportunity to try them on.


Assuming this is something similar to the American tailored and traditional fits, the tailored is just shy of being too snug while the traditional is a bit too baggy for even remotely modern tastes. 
The ones I have one now have Black Stewart pocket lining and are a good deal. Last I checked, there was some odd cadet blue moleskin in clearance at an absurdly low price.


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## Youthful Repp-robate (Sep 26, 2011)

^^
I have the odd cadet blue ones. My tastes are only intermittently modern.


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## Tempest (Aug 16, 2012)

Those look less pastel than on the website. LE seems to love hiding clearance items from searches, but if you're a 30 or 31, stock up!


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## Spex (Nov 25, 2012)

I think I'm technically a 31 now and could use some blue pants. Hmmmmm....

I was also considering cords. These should work. Bittersweet or bordeaux?


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## Tempest (Aug 16, 2012)

Spex said:


> Bittersweet or bordeaux?


Despite having a pair of ancient pinky-red cords, I'd say the bittersweet is a more practical and less eyebrow-raising color. I'd be a bit scared of what the purply red bordeaux might fade into, but then if you're more daring...


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## momsdoc (Sep 19, 2013)

Spex said:


> I think I'm technically a 31 now and could use some blue pants. Hmmmmm....
> 
> I was also considering cords. These should work. Bittersweet or bordeaux?


I recieved both the bittersweet and the bordeaux. Sent back the bordeaux, they are much redder and brighter than on the website. The bittersweet are sweet.


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## catside (Oct 7, 2010)

Oldsarge said:


> My Peter Christian's just arrived*. My. My goodness me. Shaver, you are a bad, bad influence. Worse yet, they sent a catalog that's just full of all kinds of delightful countryside stuff. Moleskin and wool waistcoats for much better prices than any here in the States? I can see that this is going to be trouble!
> 
> *and just in time for my elk hunt, too . . .


Sarge, would you kindly measure the waist and compare it to size. I think I will go for both mole skins and cavalry twill on the site but these days I need some vanity sizing.


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

They're 'comfort waist' so there is 'room to expand' I guess. The size says 38/30 and the length is perfect but when I measure fly closure to fly closure I get 40". And I'm glad about that. Most comfortable.


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## Spex (Nov 25, 2012)

How I miss living in the US. What should have been less than $30 trousers (the corduroy) would now be $47 with shipping, tax and duty to Canada. Not that it's really that expensive even at that price, but still...


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## catside (Oct 7, 2010)

Oldsarge said:


> They're 'comfort waist' so there is 'room to expand' I guess. The size says 38/30 and the length is perfect but when I measure fly closure to fly closure I get 40". And I'm glad about that. Most comfortable.


Many thanks.


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## Youthful Repp-robate (Sep 26, 2011)

Spex said:


> I think I'm technically a 31 now and could use some blue pants. Hmmmmm....


Do it. We could be twinsies.


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## Spex (Nov 25, 2012)

What makes these pants "traditional fit"? Is it me or do they look fairly trim? Not that I have a problem with that as I'm a skinny guy, but the photo doesn't seem to match my idea of that term.


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## Youthful Repp-robate (Sep 26, 2011)

They're cut like BB Madisons, maybe a touch wider through the thigh than BB Clarks.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

Oldsarge said:


> My Peter Christian's just arrived*. My. My goodness me. Shaver, you are a bad, bad influence. Worse yet, they sent a catalog that's just full of all kinds of delightful countryside stuff. Moleskin and wool waistcoats for much better prices than any here in the States? I can see that this is going to be trouble!
> 
> *and just in time for my elk hunt, too . . .


A bad influence? Moi? :redface:

I have just ordered myself another three pairs of PC's moleskins, having given up on finding a suitable alternate supplier of similar quality but who offer a wider range of earthy colours. I'll be wearing 'mulberry' by the weekend - perhaps it will serve me well to expand my comfort zone of dull coloured trousers!

You may not have noticed my comment elsewhere on the fora commending Charles Tyrwhitt's wool/cotton mix country check shirts but I encourage you to take a look, the coarser matte texture is highly complimentary to moleskin and corduroy fabrics.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

catside said:


> Sarge, would you kindly measure the waist and compare it to size. I think I will go for both mole skins and cavalry twill on the site but these days I need some vanity sizing.


One thing to be aware of is that the cavalry twills , although excellent value for money and a very decent and sturdy cloth, are unlined.

The comfort waist system is just that, comfortable. I am a slim guy but still find benefit in that little bit of give.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

Youthful Repp-robate said:


> I'm wearing the LE moleskins in their traditional fit today. They're fine. I can't get them to keep a perfect crease, and I'd gladly buy the tailored fit if it dropped to the jaw dropping price I picked these up at, because the thighs are a touch wide, but they're comfortable and quite warm.


LE traditional fit are fine by me, maybe even a touch on the skinny side if anything.

Pro-tip for crease: Always first iron moleskins inside out. Then through a tea-towel right way round for the creases. For extra hold turn the trousers inside out again and run the edge of a bar of soap down the crease, then right way out again and re-iron the crease through the tea towl once more.


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## Langham (Nov 7, 2012)

Shaver said:


> Pro-tip for crease: Always first iron moleskins inside out. Then through a tea-towel right way round for the creases. For extra hold turn the trousers inside out again and run the edge of a bar of soap down the crease, then right way out again and re-iron the crease through the tea towl once more.


With respect, that sounds like OCD overkill. Moleskins don't have to have a razor-sharp crease, in fact they don't really need a crease at all - just iron them flat from side to side (and inside out, as you suggest). I found in the past that if they are sharply creased, the colour tends to fade from the crease line. Also wash them inside out, which seems to impede the colour fading.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

^ Y/R did express an interest in the perfect crease.....

As I recall you disdain a crease on all your cotton trews. With respect, that is simply scruffy. :icon_smile_wink:


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## Langham (Nov 7, 2012)

Shaver said:


> ^ Y/R did express an interest in the perfect crease.....
> 
> As I recall you disdain a crease on all your cotton trews. With respect, that is simply scruffy. :icon_smile_wink:


Did he? He may benefit from my advice in that case. I do consider a crease unnecessary in fustian trousers - even, in the case of corduroy, a quite futile endeavour. Drill trousers may look better with a crease, but normally I reserve creases for formal trousers - suits and the like. But each to their own, if you prefer your moleskins with a razor sharp crease, I tip my hat to you.


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## Toto (Oct 27, 2009)

Have any of our UK members had experience with these trouser makers?
https://www.spencers-trousers.com/index.php

Or OTR moleskin trousers from Oliver Brown?

I remember UK company Glengarnock being recommended as a source for well made moleskin trousers but they seem to have completely disappeared. 
Pakeman and Cordings are unfortunately not an option for me because I need a size 44.


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## momsdoc (Sep 19, 2013)

Shaver said:


> A bad influence? Moi? :redface:
> 
> I have just ordered myself another three pairs of PC's moleskins, having given up on finding a suitable alternate supplier of similar quality but who offer a wider range of earthy colours. I'll be wearing 'mulberry' by the weekend - perhaps it will serve me well to expand my comfort zone of dull coloured trousers!
> 
> You may not have noticed my comment elsewhere on the fora commending Charles Tyrwhitt's wool/cotton mix country check shirts but I encourage you to take a look, the coarser matte texture is highly complimentary to moleskin and corduroy fabrics.


Yes a bad influence, and wrecking my bank account.

My first ever moleskins just arrived from Orvis. i can't believe the weight and hand of the material. They were perfectly hemmed and fit like a glove, with a nice traditional rise. How have I gotten thru the winters without this item? Now I am eagerly awaiting 2 pair of Peter Christian moleskins to round out my winter trouser ensemble. It will be interesting to compare them as the PCs were much less than Orvis. I'll let you now how they compare.

I better throw out the catalogue before gazing inside and getting hypnotized like Sarge.


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## Langham (Nov 7, 2012)

Toto said:


> Have any of our UK members had experience with these trouser makers?
> https://www.spencers-trousers.com/index.php
> 
> Or OTR moleskin trousers from Oliver Brown?
> ...


I'm wearing my navy Oliver Brown moleskins right now. They are super quality - very thick moleskin, flat-fronted. They are perhaps slightly the opposite of a fuller-cut, but are not skinny.


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## Youthful Repp-robate (Sep 26, 2011)

I'd tried pressing them with a cloth, but ironing the reverse (as I do on cords) first. Thanks for the tip.


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## momsdoc (Sep 19, 2013)

I just received my Peter Christian Moleskins, so I can compare them to Orvis which arrived the other day. 
Both are comparable in weight and hand. Both have a regular rise and similar leg dimensions. Both are unlined, with comparable inner stitching. PCs have a zippered welt rear pocket, Orvis a buttoned welt rear pocket. I like the fit and look of both equally, but prefer the hidden zippered welt pocket on the PCs.

The major difference: Orvis $139 per pair plus $9.99 shipping for 1 pair.
PCs £37.95 per pair plus £15 shipping for 2 pair.
Guess who gets returned tomorrow?

Thanks Shaver for the tip.


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## sskim3 (Jul 2, 2013)

momsdoc said:


> I just received my Peter Christian Moleskins, so I can compare them to Orvis which arrived the other day.
> Both are comparable in weight and hand. Both have a regular rise and similar leg dimensions. Both are unlined, with comparable inner stitching. PCs have a zippered welt rear pocket, Orvis a buttoned welt rear pocket. I like the fit and look of both equally, but prefer the hidden zippered welt pocket on the PCs.
> 
> The major difference: Orvis $139 per pair plus $9.99 shipping for 1 pair.
> ...


Forgive my ignorance as I have been keeping up with this thread. Truth be told, I know nothing about moleskin. So would the fabric be more inline to khakis, flannel wool pants, corduroy? I work in an environment where khakis are frowned upon. So looking to see if moleskin is worth the investment for me.


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## momsdoc (Sep 19, 2013)

Until 2 days ago I had never seen them outside of cyberspace, nor felt them in reality. Imagine a dense, heavyweight, stiff velvet that has been shorn so the nap is not visible but can be felt. The material will show the shadowing of the nap being brushed in different directions, but you don't' see the raised fibers. On closer inspection you know they are there, but otherwise from a few feet away in passing, they could be confused with Khakis, unless you were familiar with moleskin. Therefore they might not be appropriate in your office if khakis are frowned upon. They kick-ass with a Tweed jacket.


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## sskim3 (Jul 2, 2013)

momsdoc said:


> Until 2 days ago I had never seen them outside of cyberspace, nor felt them in reality. Imagine a dense, heavyweight, stiff velvet that has been shorn so the nap is not visible but can be felt. The material will show the shadowing of the nap being brushed in different directions, but you don't' see the raised fibers. On closer inspection you know they are there, but otherwise from a few feet away in passing, they could be confused with Khakis, unless you were familiar with moleskin. Therefore they might not be appropriate in your office if khakis are frowned upon. They kick-ass with a Tweed jacket.


You make them sound like mythical pants! Hmmm... maybe if I can swing a pair in a dark charcoal, I may be able to get away with it on Fridays...... I wonder why moleskin isn't as main stream. With all the rave reviews from this thread, its disappointing that its not as common as it should be.


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## Youthful Repp-robate (Sep 26, 2011)

sskim3 said:


> You make them sound like mythical pants! Hmmm... maybe if I can swing a pair in a dark charcoal, I may be able to get away with it on Fridays...... I wonder why moleskin isn't as main stream. With all the rave reviews from this thread, its disappointing that its not as common as it should be.


They're too hot to wear in an overheated office, and they're not as popular as corduroy.

If charcoal moleskins exist, I don't want them in my life. They're country trousers, and should come in country colors -- khaki, dark brown, olive green, burgundy.

If you want charcoal trousers, fine wale cord could be a nice option (not sure why I divide fine cords from moleskin, but I do).


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## Tilton (Nov 27, 2011)

Feel- and look-wise, moleskins are somewhere between a nappy wool flannel and a corduroy (if corduroy didn't have the lines; moleskin is very similar to the raised lines in corduroy, but all over).


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## Langham (Nov 7, 2012)

At one time, at least in this country, it was possible to send off real mole skins, to have them made up into a garment of one's choice. I had a great uncle, a keen gardener, who had a real mole skin waistcoat, a garment of some repute locally. I suppose he was killing two birds with one stone. I'm not sure how the two materials compare, for instance how well mole skins will hold a crease compared to moleskin. Moleskin, I understand, was originally worn by navvies and foundry workers - it's real blue collar stuff.


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## Toto (Oct 27, 2009)

Langham said:


> I'm wearing my navy Oliver Brown moleskins right now. They are super quality - very thick moleskin, flat-fronted. They are perhaps slightly the opposite of a fuller-cut, but are not skinny.


Thank you Langham. Very useful information.
I'm tempted to order a pair for the next winter down here in Australia.

Also curious about the moleskins offered by James Meade.

I've sent an email inquiring if they're made of Brisbane Moss fabric and whether the waistband closure is hook & loop or button. I prefer button myself.
There are so many options available online from the UK, but it's hard to know which are well made from good fabric, split waistband etc, and which are more a cookie cutter outdoor chore trouser.
The pocketing material is another consideration as that's where they usually wear out.
Otherwise a good pair will last for many years.


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## Tempest (Aug 16, 2012)

Langham said:


> At one time, at least in this country, it was possible to send off real mole skins, to have them made up into a garment of one's choice.


Are you saying that the skin of moles was make into clothing?


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## Langham (Nov 7, 2012)

Tempest said:


> Are you saying that the skin of moles was make into clothing?


Yes. They're rather inconveniently sized for the purpose, but apparently very hard-wearing.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

momsdoc said:


> Until 2 days ago I had never seen them outside of cyberspace, nor felt them in reality. *Imagine a dense, heavyweight, stiff velvet that has been shorn so the nap is not visible but can be felt. The material will show the shadowing of the nap being brushed in different directions, but you don't' see the raised fibers. On closer inspection you know they are there, but otherwise from a few feet away in passing, they could be confused with Khakis, unless you were familiar with moleskin. *Therefore they might not be appropriate in your office if khakis are frowned upon. *They kick-ass with a Tweed jacket*.


The perfect description. :icon_smile:


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

momsdoc said:


> I just received my Peter Christian Moleskins, so I can compare them to Orvis which arrived the other day.
> Both are comparable in weight and hand. Both have a regular rise and similar leg dimensions. Both are unlined, with comparable inner stitching. PCs have a zippered welt rear pocket, Orvis a buttoned welt rear pocket. I like the fit and look of both equally, but prefer the hidden zippered welt pocket on the PCs.
> 
> The major difference: Orvis $139 per pair plus $9.99 shipping for 1 pair.
> ...


Always a pleasure to assist.

It is perhaps worth my mentioning also that my first pair from PC (on a recommendation from Kingstonian) have been to Hell and back, up hill and down dale, dragged through gorse, covered in mud, and they still look wonderful straight out of the washing machine and pressed. PC's moleskins are a very well made and durable trouser indeed.


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

Now that I am back from the field, sadly without elk, the afotementioned moleskins need washing. Eashing inside out I understand. But do they go in the dryer or hang?


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## Mmichael (Jul 12, 2005)

IvanD said:


> Gentlemen, winter approaches.
> As I have conveyed before, my main reason for frequenting the forum is to improve my appreciation and collection of good casual clothes.
> I now feel I could benefit from more choice in my winter trousers ....


I haven't worn moleskins but can definitely recommend wool corduroy. Tested to -30 Celsius, and they hold a crease exceedingly well.


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## Langham (Nov 7, 2012)

Mmichael said:


> I haven't worn moleskins but can definitely recommend wool corduroy. Tested to -30 Celsius, and they hold a crease exceedingly well.


I'm not sure whether it's the same stuff, but Bedford cord is good for winter trousers - it's 70% wool, 30% cotton and very warm and durable. It only comes in a few colours, being mainly used for riding breeches.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

Oldsarge said:


> Now that I am back from the field, sadly without elk, the afotementioned moleskins need washing. Eashing inside out I understand. But do they go in the dryer or hang?


Tumble dryers are the work of Satan and his minions. The volumes of fluff that clog up the filter, that was once part of the clothing - tumble dryers abrade and the drier the cloth becomes the more abrasive that tumbling action. I would not put *any* item of clothing I cared about in a dryer, and definitely not moleskins.


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## Checkerboard 13 (Oct 6, 2009)

Shaver said:


> Tumble dryers are the work of Satan and his minions. The volumes of fluff that clog up the filter, that was once part of the clothing - tumble dryers abrade and the drier the cloth becomes the more abrasive that tumbling action. I would not put *any* item of clothing I cared about in a dryer, and definitely not moleskins.


You'd best pay heed, Sarge.

(If any mere mortal were to have firsthand knowledge of the workings of Satan [and/or his minions] I trust it would be Shaver.)


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

Checkerboard 13 said:


> You'd best pay heed, Sarge.
> 
> (If any mere mortal were to have firsthand knowledge of the workings of Satan [and/or his minions] I trust it would be Shaver.)


Book of Revelation Chapter 12 verses 7-9


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

Ah, most satisfactory. That's exactly what I needed to know.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

My own three new pairs of PC moleskins have arrived. Imperial, Mulberry and Pine. I'll be honest the pine is far too deep a shade of olive for me - it has the appearance of washed out black cloth (which I despise) so they will be going back. The other two colours are a welcome relief from my normally conservative (i.e.. drab) trouser choice of fawn, khaki, stone, mid grey flannel. Thus I shall feel rather daring in my dotage. :redface:

.
.
.
.
.


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

I'm contemplating the mulberry and the imperial myself, as well as the gunmetal. The loden is bit light for me, too likely to show mud. And my pair in pine I thought just the ticket. A bit darker than forest but 'washed out black'? Ah well, color sense is all relative after all.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

Oldsarge said:


> I'm contemplating the mulberry and the imperial myself, as well as the gunmetal. The loden is bit light for me, too likely to show mud. And my pair in pine I thought just the ticket. A bit darker than forest but 'washed out black'? Ah well, color sense is all relative after all.


Honestly I believe the loden to be *the* quintessential moleskin colour, definitely my absolute favourite. The mulberry and imperial are ideal to compliment my new Tyrwhitt country check shirts, although as I say pushing my boundaries for usual trouser colour. The gunmetal was too dark a grey for my taste but if you appreciate the pine then you may well be satisfied Sarge.


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## momsdoc (Sep 19, 2013)

Shaver said:


> My own three new pairs of PC moleskins have arrived. Imperial, Mulberry and Pine. I'll be honest the pine is far too deep a shade of olive for me - it has the appearance of washed out black cloth (which I despise) so they will be going back. The other two colours are a welcome relief from my normally conservative (i.e.. drab) trouser choice of fawn, khaki, stone, mid grey flannel. Thus I shall feel rather daring in my dotage. :redface:
> 
> Washed out black??? I have the Pine, and with all respect, where do you find black in that forest of green?:confused2:


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

momsdoc said:


> Shaver said:
> 
> 
> > My own three new pairs of PC moleskins have arrived. Imperial, Mulberry and Pine. I'll be honest the pine is far too deep a shade of olive for me - it has the appearance of washed out black cloth (which I despise) so they will be going back. The other two colours are a welcome relief from my normally conservative (i.e.. drab) trouser choice of fawn, khaki, stone, mid grey flannel. Thus I shall feel rather daring in my dotage. :redface:
> ...


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## momsdoc (Sep 19, 2013)

To each, his own


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

momsdoc said:


> To each, his own


Of course.

_Except _for........... insert usual Shaver diatribe here. :redface:

Seriously though, I have very limited tastes in casual trousers. What can I say? I am a boring fellow.


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

Well, if one is to compare with those startling trousers with the wildlife all over them or the even more startling tartan trews, then perhaps there is much to be said for boredom. I should hate to wear trousers that were so outre' that the ladies were more entranced by them than by my scintillating conversation! :icon_smile_big:


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## momsdoc (Sep 19, 2013)

Boring in Mulberry? I think not.


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## Tim Correll (Jul 18, 2005)

Shaver said:


> My own three new pairs of PC moleskins have arrived. Imperial, Mulberry and Pine. I'll be honest the pine is far too deep a shade of olive for me - it has the appearance of washed out black cloth (which I despise) so they will be going back. The other two colours are a welcome relief from my normally conservative (i.e.. drab) trouser choice of fawn, khaki, stone, mid grey flannel. Thus I shall feel rather daring in my dotage. :redface:
> 
> .
> .
> ...


Forgive my ignorance, but what color family is "Imperial" in? And, mulberry is in the purple family, right?


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

Audi S5 TC said:


> Forgive my ignorance, but what color family is "Imperial" in? And, mulberry is in the purple family, right?


 Top to bottom - Imperial, Indigo, Mulberry, Gunmetal, Fox, Loden, Pine. Caveat, the colours are darker in real life than in this photo.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

momsdoc said:


> Washed out black??? I have the Pine, and with all respect, where do you find black in that forest of green?:confused2:


momsdoc please accept my sincere apologies - I am an utter twit. :redface:

I was examining the pine moleskins in artificial light last night (it being dark early in England with the application of daylight saving time). I have looked at them again this morning but in natural light and they are a lovely shade of deep green.


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## Tim Correll (Jul 18, 2005)

Shaver said:


> Top to bottom - Imperial, Indigo, Mulberry, Gunmetal, Fox, Loden, Pine. Caveat, the colours are darker in real life than in this photo.


Thank you dearly, Shaver! 

The indigo looks more like dark navy in that picture. And, since the pants are darker in real life than in the photos, the indigo must look more like midnight blue in real life.


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## momsdoc (Sep 19, 2013)

Shaver said:


> momsdoc please accept my sincere apologies - I am an utter twit. :redface:
> 
> I was examining the pine moleskins in artificial light last night (it being dark early in England with the application of daylight saving time). I have looked at them again this morning but in natural light and they are a lovely shade of deep green.


No apology necessary, but are you keeping them now? In the light of day as they say.


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## arnaudr (Oct 30, 2011)

Moleskin by Dugdale for $149.99

Corduroys from $89.99

Cavalry Twill $179.99

Huddersfield made 14Oz Flannel 179.99

Minnis Flannel $299.99

...and many more winter options for pants available at Luxire.com


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## IvanD (Jan 5, 2012)

After starting this thread, I have followed it with great interest.
So much so, that I have just placed an order with PC for 2 pairs of moleskins.
My choice of colours were the Loden and the Pine.
(not particularly adventurous, but should go well with my existing wardrobe)
I now await delivery with great anticipation.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

momsdoc said:


> No apology necessary, but are you keeping them now? In the light of day as they say.


Despite their being a lovely green they are still too dark for most my more casual shoe collection, so unfortunately I will not be keeping them.



IvanD said:


> After starting this thread, I have followed it with great interest.
> So much so, that I have just placed an order with PC for 2 pairs of moleskins.
> My choice of colours were the Loden and the Pine.
> (not particularly adventurous, but should go well with my existing wardrobe)
> I now await delivery with great anticipation.


This has been a charming thread, so thank you for starting it Ivan. A genuinely 'community' feel has been exhibited here.

And lest anyone believe that moleskins are merely winter trousers, they are wonderful at keeping one cool in the summer too. I have a cream pair which see plenty of wear in the brighter months, which were in gloriously abundant excess across England this year.


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## Langham (Nov 7, 2012)

Shaver said:


> Top to bottom - Imperial, Indigo, Mulberry, Gunmetal, Fox, Loden, Pine. Caveat, the colours are darker in real life than in this photo.


Are Peter Christian paying you a commission for all this? I'm quite tempted to get a couple of pairs myself now, despite my present focus on other matters.


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

Langham said:


> Are Peter Christian paying you a commission for all this? I'm quite tempted to get a couple of pairs myself now, despite my present focus on other matters.


Ah Langham, old chap, I'm not really interested in money. Just spreading the love.









I'd be interested in your opinion, should you decide to get a pair. I am convinced that the fabric is at least equal to Brisbane Moss.


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

Shaver said:


> This has been a charming thread, so thank you for starting it Ivan. A genuinely 'community' feel has been exhibited here.
> 
> And lest anyone believe that moleskins are merely winter trousers, they are wonderful at keeping one cool in the summer too. I have a cream pair which see plenty of wear in the brighter months, which were in gloriously abundant excess across England this year.


Obviously we have differing definitions of 'summer', old chap. I'm staying put so long as my mother (91) lives but this whole 85 in November crap is getting on my last nerve. I flee, _flee _I say, summer where the only thing worth wearing is a monokini and hat full of ice cubes. Portland, here I come . . . eventually.


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## Langham (Nov 7, 2012)

Shaver said:


> Ah Langham, old chap, I'm not really interested in money. Just spreading the love.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


My choice would be the fox and loden colours, but I don't really need any more trousers at present, tempting as this offer is. The loden, as I think you may have said earlier, is a sort of archetypal moleskin trouser, ideally suited, I think, to the English outdoors. I'm pleased that there has been this opportunity to expound on moleskin as trousering - another English invention for which the world has been insufficiently grateful.


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## Tim Correll (Jul 18, 2005)

Oldsarge said:


> Obviously we have differing definitions of 'summer', old chap. I'm staying put so long as my mother (91) lives but this whole 85 in November crap is getting on my last nerve. I flee, _flee _I say, summer where the only thing worth wearing is a monokini and hat full of ice cubes. Portland, here I come . . . eventually.


Would that be Portland, Maine or Portland, Oregon, Old Sarge? FWIW, by far, in November, I would rather have 80 degrees F and higher than 49 degrees F and lower with any kind of frozen precipitation!


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## Oldsarge (Feb 20, 2011)

Oregon! Oregon! There are limits to my tolerance for cold and anywhere in Maine exceeds them. :icon_smile_big:


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## Checkerboard 13 (Oct 6, 2009)

Oldsarge said:


> Oregon! Oregon! There are limits to my tolerance for cold and anywhere in Maine exceeds them. :icon_smile_big:


Seven months of winter followed by nine months of rain just might send you back south at a fair clip!


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## Shaver (May 2, 2012)

Now gentlemen, I have not the time (nor patience) to read the entire thread back through. However, Sarge & momsdoc did either of you state that you had purchased Mulberry or Imperial PC moleskins? The reason I ask is that I have a few pairs of brand new tagged H J Hall socks in red and in purple going spare - and which are very decent compliments to these two trouser colours. PM me your address if you would like me to post you any.

EDIT - a pair of each are now taken. I have a few more if anyone is interested - free of charge of course.


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