# JLC Watches



## mannaman (Aug 26, 2005)

Hi,

it's about time for me to think about a new watch.

I already own a IWC Mark XII, my first better watch and a Rolex Sub. 
Since I bought the IWC back in 1996 or 1997, I fell in love with a JLC Master Reveil, the perfect mixture of elegance and manliness. I think it has a diameter of close to 40mm (no idea about the inches) and is more than 12mm thick.

I found out that JLC discontinued the model and the successor watches are Master Compressor Memovox and stuff like that. They are too modern in my eyes, I want a watch that still looks cool in 20 yrs, like a sub or a Mark. 

So I am close to buying a Master (not compressor) geographic. Any thoughts about other options?

It should combine a certain amount of lumpiness (e.g. being thick and wide) with elegance and class.

Arrrggghhh. That sucks. 

Oh forgot to mention: I think €6000 is the limit. More or less...


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## manicturncoat (Oct 4, 2004)

I think the master reveil is now the master memovox. I have a memovox and, although I am no expert, it seems identical to the reveil. The compressor is a waterprroof sports version, I think.


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## Cantabrigian (Aug 29, 2005)

mannaman said:


> It should combine a certain amount of lumpiness (e.g. being thick and wide) with elegance and class.


IWC Portugese - my personal favorite is the 5001 07, 8-Day power reserve in stainless with white face.

I'd say look at Ulysse Nardin but those may also be a bit to futuristic for you.


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## amemovox (Jun 26, 2005)

*Reviel vs. Memovox*



mannaman said:


> Hi,
> 
> it's about time for me to think about a new watch.
> 
> ...


For those of you who may have noticed, my screen name was derived from
my favorite watch. You can deduce my bias. Some years back, the Master Reviel (alarm watch) incorporated an automatic movement whereas the Memovox's movement was a manual wind. Both have been discontinued
although they can be had on the secondary market.

JLC's reputation for quality is unsurpassed. Some of their newer models are
fitted with movements that contain ceramic jewels to reduce wear and extend service intervals. Enough of the technical talk. The Geographic (sp) is a world class accomplishment and if you frequently travel and need the
ability to tell the time in different parts of the world, its a solid choice.


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## chobochobo (May 5, 2006)

I have a 1950s vintage JLC and I love it. If I get another dress watch it'd most probably be another JLC, possibly a PP


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## Pickwick (Dec 24, 2005)

I agree, the Master Grande Reveil is one of the most beautiful watches I've ever seen.

Does it have to another JLC? As to other options, have you considered a Lange & Sohne? After all these years, the Lange 1 is still by far my favorite watch to wear.


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## mannaman (Aug 26, 2005)

Actually I was already that far to take IWC into consideration. What holds me back is the fact that JLC has a real manufacturerers clockwork, everything is built and assembled in the plant. 

And I already own an IWC, but you're right, it is a perfect looking watch.

What I really love is that it is 41mm wide and 12.4mm thick, it's a big guy's watch without looking too sporty or non-elegant.

I think a compressor is something that in 20 yrs simply looks ridiculous. Like these 1970's watches you see today and you think "oh wow, that is ugly".


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## kash (Jun 5, 2005)

*Have you considered....*

.....Blancpain, Zenith, Panerai? Each is in a different league - the Blancpain and Zenith IMHO in a superior category based on the quality of the movements (although I recently bought a Panerai Luminor Marina). The PAMs are 44mm in diameter whereas the JLC models you are considering are 40mm. But if I were you I would not eliminate the PAMs based purely on the size - I have a 7 in. wrist and the PAM sits quite well. Furthermore, since you already own two of the classic sports watches (Mark XII and Rolex Sub.), you may want to consider a bolder (for lack of a better word) brand such as Panerai. Despite the fact that no other brand polarises opinion as much as Panerai, the simplicity of the design, in particular the dial, of most of their watches makes it futureproof.

Good luck with your purchase!

Kind regards, Kash.


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## mannaman (Aug 26, 2005)

Well, the Panerai is actually not what I think a classic watch should look like. It's just not my taste. I'd rather go for the more conservative brand such as JLC, IWC, PP and so on. But the Pateks look a little to feminin in my eyes.

I would buy a Panerai if I am a serious collector, because of course it's great quality and unique, but I am more a once in a while buyer. So every step (or purchase) needs lots of thinking before.


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## Cantabrigian (Aug 29, 2005)

kash said:


> .....Blancpain, Zenith, Panerai? Each is in a different league - the Blancpain and Zenith IMHO in a superior category based on the quality of the movements (although I recently bought a Panerai Luminor Marina). The PAMs are 44mm in diameter whereas the JLC models you are considering are 40mm. But if I were you I would not eliminate the PAMs based purely on the size - I have a 7 in. wrist and the PAM sits quite well.


All excellent recommendations, Kash.

I would just also follow up that many of the watches in the 'Contemporary' collection also come in 40mm.


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## Mute (Apr 3, 2005)

JLC offers some of the best value in high end watches.


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## bigCat (Jun 10, 2005)

What are opinions on their "Reverso" line?

In particular, this:

https://www.prestigetime.com/item.php?item_id=3559


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## xarope (Apr 26, 2006)

I own a Master Compressor Memovox, and have received numerous favourable comments on it, from both female and male (including my tailor and fitter) alike.

Otherwise the reversos are of classic design and (mainly) proportion, perhaps one of the Grandsport? The only thing preventing me from making the reverso a daily beater is lack of an alarm.


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## gregp (Aug 11, 2005)

hreljan said:


> What are opinions on their "Reverso" line?
> 
> In particular, this:
> 
> https://www.prestigetime.com/item.php?item_id=3559


Reverso is a classic line. You really can't go wrong there. However, I must say that is not my favorite example. Of course, a matter of taste, but here's one I find particularly compelling:

https://forums.timezone.com/index.php?t=tree&goto=2135530&rid=0


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## Tomasso (Aug 17, 2005)

xarope said:


> Otherwise the reversos are of classic design and (mainly) proportion, perhaps one of the Grandsport?


I like the Reversos with a blank side which can be engraved or painted. I've been contemplating the design for my Gransport for three years now.:icon_pale:


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## harrybee (Jul 17, 2006)

I find the reverso too feminine and indeed it was primarily designed for women in the 20s.


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## gregp (Aug 11, 2005)

harrybee said:


> I find the reverso too feminine and indeed it was primarily designed for women in the 20s.


The reverso was designed in the 30s for british officers based in India, who wanted a watch that could be turned backward so that it would not have its face smashed in a polo match. As masculine an origin as a diver or pilot watch, I would think.


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## Tomasso (Aug 17, 2005)

gregp said:


> The reverso was designed in the 30s for british officers based in India, who wanted a watch that could be turned backward so that it would not have its face smashed in a polo match. As masculine an origin as a diver or pilot watch, I would think.


The first "Sport" watch?


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## Joe Frances (Sep 1, 2004)

hreljan said:


> What are opinions on their "Reverso" line?
> 
> In particular, this:
> 
> https://www.prestigetime.com/item.php?item_id=3559





harrybee said:


> I find the reverso too feminine and indeed it was primarily designed for women in the 20s.


The "classic" reverso is a bit small, but I don't think it is feminine, nor is its history based upon a ladies watch. But the Gran'Sport which is my eveyday watch is big enough, and a nice blend of classic and a little chunky. The question is: is chunky a long-term "classic" look. I am of the opinion that the slim more uncomplicated watch is the more enduring style.

That being said, this tread was not intended to address these issues. All JLC watches are at the summit of the craft of Swiss watchmaking, and you should proceed with buying the one YOU like without hesitation.

Joe


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## nonnon (Dec 6, 2004)

JLC reverso is an amazing watch. I have a grande date reverso, which i love. I do want the sun and moon but we shall see what my next watch purchase will be.


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## Vik (Mar 18, 2005)

I bought a JLC Gran Reverso Chronograph in '99...a great watch and looking as good today as it did back then!


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## kash (Jun 5, 2005)

Cantabrigian, you are absolutely right about most PAMs in the Contemporary collection available in 40 mm. However, IMHO the appeal of a Panerai lies in the 44 mm dial, which was part of the attraction in my case. If I were buying a 40 mm, I am not sure if it would be a Panerai since I believe there are a lot of other "nicer / more appealing" watches to choose from.

Kind regards.


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## lee_44106 (Apr 10, 2006)

I like my Reverso, but find the hand-winding requirement tedious. I've really only worn it about 3 times since making the purchase back in 2000. It really is a classic watch, not feminine at all.


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## The Other Andy (Jan 9, 2008)

I have a JLC Master Compressor Geographic which I wear almost every day. It is a pretty big watch.

If I want something "dressier" I wear a Chronoswiss Regulateur. That watch gets more comments from people than just about any watch I've ever owned.


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## The_Consultant (Jan 13, 2008)

I have a Master Geo as well - great watch. When I want something a bit "different" that few people recognize but which is a true "manufacture" watch, I wear the watch below:



With discounts, I *think* you could find one near your price point.


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## acidicboy (Feb 17, 2006)

Yeah, I noticed that JLC only kept the Grand Reveil:










which is too busy for a dress watch, imo.

The Master Geo, on the other hand... me likey.










...and word is going around that JLC is planning to bring out a limited number of Polaris re-issues soon, too, for those interested.


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## Dolle Dolf (Feb 7, 2006)

Perhaps a silly question but how solid are these watches? I know that some Rolex owners rave about the ruggedness of their watches. Not that I am the kind to go bob sleighing or X-gaming any time soon, but I would hate the watch to get ruined from relatively mainstream activities such as a hike in the woods or a sojourn on a boat or summat like that. 

Thx


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## cbird (Oct 27, 2006)

Another lumpy option would be the Vacheron Overseas watches. They're on the sporty side, though. The Master Geographic is fantastic, and more elegant than the Overseas, I think. I recommend one of the black dial ones (no longer in production) - it has an interesting effect of the subdials sort of receding into the background, so that the watch has the elegance of a more simple watch, yet very significant complications. I think it is the most elegant world timer watch out there, but less so with the current version, which has the entire world cities ring exposed.


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## jcriswel (Sep 16, 2006)

*do not worry*



Dolle Dolf said:


> Perhaps a silly question but how solid are these watches? I know that some Rolex owners rave about the ruggedness of their watches. Not that I am the kind to go bob sleighing or X-gaming any time soon, but I would hate the watch to get ruined from relatively mainstream activities such as a hike in the woods or a sojourn on a boat or summat like that.
> 
> Thx


I own a JLC Reverso Grande Reserve:

As you can see I have it in a stainless steel case and band. This watch is HEAVY, durable, and sturdy. It is built like an heavy duty machine that will withstand whatever is thrown at it. It also sleek and elegant. I believe a good analogy would be that the Rolex is like a high end SUV (think Cadillac Escalade) and the JLC is like a Ferrari. Go for the JLC. It is a fantastic watch.


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## Eustace Tilley (Sep 23, 2007)

I recently bought the Master Geographic - fantastic watch and I am very happy with my purchase.



Check out Glashutte in your price range as well.


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## Sator (Jan 13, 2006)

acidicboy said:


> Yeah, I noticed that JLC only kept the Grand Reveil
> which is too busy for a dress watch, imo.


The really sad thing about Jaeger LeCoultre is that they have joined the growing club of high end companies who no longer offer even a single proper dress watch. Shame on them!


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## medwards (Feb 6, 2005)

Sator said:


> The really sad thing about Jaeger LeCoultre is that they have joined the growing club of high end companies who no longer offer even a single proper dress watch. Shame on them!


https://imageshack.us


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## Eustace Tilley (Sep 23, 2007)

Sator said:


> The really sad thing about Jaeger LeCoultre is that they have joined the growing club of high end companies who no longer offer even a single proper dress watch. Shame on them!


I love ya Sator but


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## Sator (Jan 13, 2006)

I do like the fact that the Master Ultrathin is only 1.85 mm thin. However, it has arabic numerals on the face. For me that disqualifies it outright. It is like a punch cap patent leather dress Oxford.


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## Concordia (Sep 30, 2004)

Sator said:


> I do like the fact that the Master Ultrathin is only 1.85 mm thin. However, it has arabic numerals on the face. For me that disqualifies it outright. It is like a punch cap patent leather dress Oxford.


If you drink enough at breakfast, the numerals are hardly legible.


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## kolecho (Nov 15, 2004)

Sator said:


> I do like the fact that the Master Ultrathin is only 1.85 mm thin. However, it has arabic numerals on the face. For me that disqualifies it outright. It is like a punch cap patent leather dress Oxford.


You are quite anal.


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## Sator (Jan 13, 2006)

Concordia said:


> If you drink enough at breakfast, the numerals are hardly legible.


And if you drink just a little bit extra the plastic watch from the $2 shop will look like a Patek.


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## Sator (Jan 13, 2006)

kolecho said:


> You are quite anal.


Thank you.

Most of the chaps here are even more anal than I when it comes to shoes. Why on earth do all the rules go out the window and we get a message board full of Cruiser types when it comes to watches?


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## smlaz (May 13, 2005)

That Parmigiani Fleurier is gorgeous! I love that make. Interesting how the OP owns an IWC, is looking at a JLC, and mentioned the Lange. They are all owned by the same Swiss investor, Richemont. Seems like all the major (and minor) Swiss watch makes are no longer independent. Rolex, PP, GP, AP, and Chopard are among the few methinks. JLC and Lange are both manufactures, and many of the other high-end makers are funded so well now that they've been able to design and manufacture their own movements. So, ultimately, it comes down to style.
Cheers,
Steve


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## Avers (Feb 28, 2006)

This is my favorite JLC model - Master Calendar:










40.5 mm case, JLC in-house movement.

Functions: Hours, Minutes, Seconds, Moon-phases, Power-Reserve, Date, Day, Month

Avers


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## The Other Andy (Jan 9, 2008)

That is a heck of a nice watch as well.

By the way, I agree with Sator - I always thought the roman numbers on the ultrathin looked a little cheesy for some reason. I think the font bothers me more than the fact that they are there in the first place. How's that for anal?

Here is a dress watch with a font I'm more fond of


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## Concordia (Sep 30, 2004)

Sator said:


> Thank you.
> 
> Most of the chaps here are even more anal than I when it comes to shoes. Why on earth do all the rules go out the window and we get a message board full of Cruiser types when it comes to watches?


We all got banned from Ask Andy About Watches.


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## RSS (Dec 30, 2003)

It's rather disappointing they don't make the Gentilhomme anymore ... The last JLC catalogue I have which shows this watch dates from the early 1990s.

I recently posted its photograph in another thread ... but one more look can't hurt.

https://imageshack.us


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## Sator (Jan 13, 2006)

The Other Andy said:


> I always thought the roman numbers on the ultrathin looked a little cheesy for some reason. I think the font bothers me more than the fact that they are there in the first place. How's that for anal?
> 
> Here is a dress watch with a font I'm more fond of


Actually, to think about it, I don't in principle mind a dress watch with Arabic numerals at the 3,6,9 & 12 O'clock positions and plain indices for the rest. But, you are right, there is something about the font and overall design of the Ultrathin that just looks too casual. That's why on seeing the Ultrathin, the thought that this might somehow be intended as a dress watch never once crossed my mind.

Traditionally, just as Edward Green offers several different cap toe Oxfords, one might have expected a traditional watchmaker to have offered a few different classical Ultrathin dress watches - one with Roman numerals, another with plain indices, another with Arabic numerals etc. Why is there only one amid a sea of sport and more casual watches???

I've also seen other vintage classical Jaeger LeCoultre dress watches which were very elegant indeed. It just seems too obvious to me that classical elegance is something fewer and fewer watchmakers strive for. Instead chunky, ostentatious sports watches and wedding cake (both in their aesthetics as well as proportions) models with every imaginable complication seem to dominate the catalogues. The Reverso is, of course, a classical sports model which pre-dates the modern fad for oversized gaudy designs.


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## Eustace Tilley (Sep 23, 2007)

smlaz said:


> That Parmigiani Fleurier is gorgeous! I love that make. Interesting how the OP owns an IWC, is looking at a JLC, and mentioned the Lange. They are all owned by the same Swiss investor, Richemont. Seems like all the major (and minor) Swiss watch makes are no longer independent. Rolex, PP, GP, AP, and Chopard are among the few methinks. JLC and Lange are both manufactures, and many of the other high-end makers are funded so well now that they've been able to design and manufacture their own movements. So, ultimately, it comes down to style.
> Cheers,
> Steve


I like Parmigiani as well - the case size is waaayyy too big for me though.


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## The Other Andy (Jan 9, 2008)

smlaz said:


> Interesting how the OP owns an IWC, is looking at a JLC, and mentioned the Lange. They are all owned by the same Swiss investor, Richemont. Seems like all the major (and minor) Swiss watch makes are no longer independent. Rolex, PP, GP, AP, and Chopard are among the few methinks. JLC and Lange are both manufactures, and many of the other high-end makers are funded so well now that they've been able to design and manufacture their own movements. So, ultimately, it comes down to style.
> Cheers,
> Steve


Don't forget Chronoswiss - still independent as far as I know


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## iammatt (Sep 17, 2005)

My daily watch, which I consider unfailingly classic. 36mm case.


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## avalon05 (Jan 26, 2005)

I love my 1968 JLC Asprey automatic, but it can be tricky finding parts for watches like these (you won't have this problem with Omega Constellations from the same period). I had to go all the way to Switzerland to find a replacement crown for this one:

https://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii291/avalonJLC/JLC002.jpg


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## Sator (Jan 13, 2006)

iammatt said:


> My daily watch, which I consider unfailingly classic. 36mm case.


Superb, absolutely superb!


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## Avers (Feb 28, 2006)

That Vacheron looks similar to my daily watch - Zenith Elite Port Royal:


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## fritzl (Jun 5, 2006)

Sator said:


> Superb, absolutely superb!


I don't get you.

Matt, I like your watch.


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## Eustace Tilley (Sep 23, 2007)

Avers said:


> That Vacheron looks similar to my daily watch - Zenith Elite Port Royal:


Uhhh, they don't look anything alike


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## iammatt (Sep 17, 2005)

Eustace Tilley said:


> Uhhh, they don't look anything alike


+1000


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## RSS (Dec 30, 2003)

Of iammatt's post featuring the Vacheron Constantin Malte Grande Classique ...


Sator said:


> Superb, absolutely superb!


I agree.

How appropriate that this post is in a thread about Jaeger LeCoultre.

While the Malte Grand Classique houses a manufacture movement -- Vacheron's Calibre 1400 as I recall -- Vacheron has traditionally relied upon Jaeger LeCoultre and a few other quality manufacturers to provide ebauche movements.

A few years back, I was at a dinner with one of the founders of TimeZone. He complimented a Vacheron Constantin I was wearing. As is the custom, I took my watch off and handed it to him to allow for a closer look. He put it to his ear and gently shook it. From just the sound made by the rotor of the automatic movement, he was able to determine the presence of a JLC movement.

Of course, I suppose some of us can spot an Anderson & Sheppard across a crowded room.


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## Eustace Tilley (Sep 23, 2007)

Great story. I believe JLC still supplies the movements for Cartier's Collection Privee.


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## medwards (Feb 6, 2005)

Some, but not all. The mechanical movement in my Collection Privee Cartier Paris Tank Louis Cartier, however, is the Piaget based, manually wound, Cartier Caliber 9701 MC. 

As for JLC, I am a longstanding admirer of the firm and happen to be wearing my Reverso Duo today. However, in response to an earlier inquiry in this thread, I am afraid despite being a "sports" watch from its inception, it really isn't as robust as my Rolex.


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## Simon Myerson (Nov 8, 2007)

Completely agree about JLC and the over-ruggedness of many of today's offerings from other manufactures. It is the equivalent to driving a 4x4 on the school run. 

The Ultrathin looks better in white gold/steel/platinum. But the best place to buy a dress watch is on ebay - great Girrard models, some good JLC and some good Omegas from the days when Omegas were almost up there with the greats.


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## RSS (Dec 30, 2003)

As for the Reverso ... just remember the era when it was produced. It was not so much a "sports watch" as a watch which could be worn while playing sports. This, of course, is due to the reversing function ... allowing the more delicate face to be turned under for protection.

There is -- or was -- a Reverso Gran Sport ... a new version of the Reverso with a very different look ... much more the sports watch. However, I don't see it in the 2006-07 catalogue. I've included a photograph below taken from the web.

https://imageshack.us

I tend to prefer the more classic version of one of the current models. The one pictured below has a "face" on both sides ... while other models have a face and exhibition back ... others still have a face and a solid back more per the original. Of course, the solid back can be left plain, engraved, or even decorated in another way.

https://imageshack.us


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## Montesquieu (Dec 3, 2007)

To my eye, there are two wonderful benefits of Reversos with timepieces on both faces. The first is true of all Reversos: a straight line that parallels a shirt cuff when exposed. I love that look, especially when the Reverso has an off-center complication or two peaking out from the cuff. The second is that the two faces provide two different personalities - often one silver, one black - with two different functionalities. On my JLC, the Grande GMT, I get a reversed full-faced watch with alternate time zone. As a frequent traveller, I love GMTs, and I prefer the full-faced functionality of a Reverso to other watches that cram the second time zone into a tiny complication.

Many JLC designs of late also appeal to me. Whereas 10 years ago they struck me as sterile, JLC's designs now incorporate useful complications with lovely aesthetics. The combo of a uniquely pleasing design and manufacturing excellence represents, for me, the pinnacle of a Swiss watchmaker.

JLC women's watches can also be lovely. My wife didn't mind her JLC quartz movement when she saw diamonds hiding it.


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## RSS (Dec 30, 2003)

Montesquieu said:


> Many JLC designs of late also appeal to me. Whereas 10 years ago they struck me as sterile, JLC's designs now incorporate useful complications with lovely aesthetics. The combo of a uniquely pleasing design and manufacturing excellence represents, for me, the pinnacle of a Swiss watchmaker.


Here is an example of one I partilarly like. It hasn't two faces ... but when I don't need or care to know the time ... I keep the exhibition back "up."

https://imageshack.us


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## iammatt (Sep 17, 2005)

^^^ One of the truly beautiful watches made.


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## kolecho (Nov 15, 2004)

iammatt said:


> +1000


Infinity...


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## Eustace Tilley (Sep 23, 2007)

I have always wanted to love the Reverso's, but they just don't seem to suit my wrist. The regular sized ones are too small, and the Grande sits in an unwieldly fashion on my wrist, resembling more a brick rather than a watch. Oh well...


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## acidicboy (Feb 17, 2006)

Now that we're talking about different JLC models, wonder what your reactions are to their new dive watches...


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## RSS (Dec 30, 2003)

Not being a diver ... I hesitate to comment ... as I have no idea how suitably they perform. 

From a design standpoint, they seem a true departure from JLC's past.


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## Eustace Tilley (Sep 23, 2007)

RSS said:


> Not being a diver ... I hesitate to comment ... as I have no idea how suitably they perform.
> 
> From a design standpoint, they seem a true departure from JLC's past.


I agree - all the WIS love this new JLC but I don't care for it. Its like they're trying to become like Breitling.


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## The Other Andy (Jan 9, 2008)

Here are some Roman numerals I like as well . . . . Patek Travel Time

BTW I hate the band on this watch but it is too valuable to remove. More "bling" than I like which is why I don't wear the watch too much


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## dopey (Jan 17, 2005)

The Other Andy said:


> Here are some Roman numerals I like as well . . . . Patek Travel Time
> 
> BTW I hate the band on this watch but it is too valuable to remove. More "bling" than I like which is why I don't wear the watch too much


Those are Arabic numerals, not Roman.
BTW, as valuable as the band may be, can't you just remove it and put it in a drawer? And if you don't like it, why did you buy it?


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## The Other Andy (Jan 9, 2008)

I didnt buy it - I inherited it, and i don't typically wear gold watches at all so changing the strap doesn't make much sense. The better question might be: why don't I sell it? Come to think of it, I think I will . . . .


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## dopey (Jan 17, 2005)

I would have a hard time selling it if it were inherited, but I suppose it depends on whom from.


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## smlaz (May 13, 2005)

You could trade it in for a new Porsche methinks...
Oh, and Vacheron is another Richemont property, although I think JLC supplied movements to VC years prior to Richemont's involvement. JLC provided movements to Patek for that matter.


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## RSS (Dec 30, 2003)

smlaz said:


> JLC provided movements to Patek for that matter.


True.

Now I am a great fan of Patek Philippe. Along with JLC and a very few others, I see PP as one of the great houses of watchmaking. The fact that PP has used JLC movements, however, does not detract from my opinion of PP ... in fact, it does more to bolster my opinion of JLC which is already at the top. But with that comment ... we're in the watch world as viewed by one person, yours truly, and that may mean little to others. Sure ... it's nice to get our opinions -- obviously I love to offer mine -- but it may not be the best idea to allow our opinions to be the deciding factor.

A watch purchase can be a very expensive one. If you can't afford a mistake ... there are some steps that might help you avoid one. To anyone who truly wants to learn about watches and/or the history of watches/watchmaking ... I recommending turning to those truly in the know ... such as can be found on _TimeZone_ (website) ... or in _WatchTime _(magazine). Of course, these two sources are by no means the only quality ones. Moreover, when learning about watches or watchmaking ... always remember ... don't believe everything you read or hear. Advertising had done one heckova job on consumers ... all too often leaving them to easily infer an inherent quality that may well not be present. Certainly don't be afraid to doubt and question ... it can serve you well. That is especially true these days ... as Fact Checkers seem to be a vanishing breed.

A few years ago, one of the major financial magazines -- Business Week I think it was -- ran a feature that included a short article about Patek Philippe. The article stated that Patek Philippe movements had always been produced in-house. I wrote the author a short e-mail informing her of her error. In return, I received a rather officious response indicating she preferred to defer to her more informed sources. She listed as her sources, the New York offices of Patek Phillippe and Antiquorum.

I called her sources, and got a very different story. Both were aware that JLC had supplied movements to PP. Moreover, neither firm recalled being questioned by anyone from the financial press ... and the fact they had been offered as sources for erroneous information was of concern.

The moral of the story: When one wants or needs good information about a particular interest ... it's not the best idea to turn to those whose expertise is in another field.

Likewise, the next time anyone sees a "Best List" about watches ... unless that list is in a magazine devoted to matters horological ... don't believe the results are anything more than superficial perception.

*If one really wants solid information about watches, *
*turn to a source that will supply you with solid information.*​


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## The Other Andy (Jan 9, 2008)

acidicboy said:


> Now that we're talking about different JLC models, wonder what your reactions are to their new dive watches...


The enormous button on the first watch is apparently to activate a depth gauge. I'm not sure why you'd need such a thing, given that most divers have a dive computer that gives a constant depth reading, but it at least explains the odd shape on the left hand side of the watch


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## Bertie Wooster (Feb 11, 2006)

RSS said:


> The moral of the story: When one wants or needs good information about a particular interest ... it's not the best idea to turn to those whose expertise is in another field.


Hear, hear.


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## Beresford (Mar 30, 2006)

The Other Andy said:


> The enormous button on the first watch is apparently to activate a depth gauge. I'm not sure why you'd need such a thing, given that most divers have a dive computer that gives a constant depth reading, but it at least explains the odd shape on the left hand side of the watch


Reminds me of my favorite watch ad on the radio in the Seventies or perhaps early Eighties:

"The Seiko Diver is water resistant to 660 feet! Although if you're ever down that deep you probably won't _care_ what time it is any more."


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## acidicboy (Feb 17, 2006)

The Other Andy said:


> The enormous button on the first watch is apparently to activate a depth gauge. I'm not sure why you'd need such a thing, given that most divers have a dive computer that gives a constant depth reading, but it at least explains the odd shape on the left hand side of the watch


Yes, it is a mechanical depth gauge. And yes, its true that even the most simple Suunto dive watch has this feature for a small percentage of what they sell here. Then again, I don't think anyone is serious enough to buy this JLC for its intended purpose.


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## avalon05 (Jan 26, 2005)

*Seiko watches*



Beresford said:


> Reminds me of my favorite watch ad on the radio in the Seventies or perhaps early Eighties:
> 
> "The Seiko Diver is water resistant to 660 feet! Although if you're ever down that deep you probably won't _care_ what time it is any more."


I bought my first Grand Seiko the other day -- these remarkable watches don't get the recognition they deserve outside Japan -- perhaps one reason for this is that Seiko doesn't spend huge amounts on advertising like many of the Swiss firms do:

https://www.pmwf.com/Watches/GrandSeikoTable.htm

https://www.monoclemag.com/sections/edits/Magazine-Articles/Timing-is-everything---Shizukuishia/


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