# dilemma: naming my child



## gaseousclay (Nov 8, 2009)

I'm not sure how many of you are parents but i'm having a bit of a dilemma with naming my first born son. my wife is due any day now and the naming process has been a bit contentious to say the least. I've thrown around a few first name ideas and my wife feels that she gets naming rights for the middle name. the problem is that every middle name my wife has come up with sounds absolutely horrible (ie. Jean, which is her mom and grandma's middle name and a girl's name). she wants something that connects our son to her family, which I get, but she's unwilling to compromise on the issue. In a sense I feel like I should get naming rights because he's a boy, but I know this isn't going to happen. We also had a first name in mind for the last several months but my wife broke the cardinal rule and told her mom last week what it was going to be, even though we agreed not to tell anyone until the baby was born. she said her mom's response was dead silence on the phone. I couldn't help but feel irked by this because 1) it's our child and we'll name him as we see fit and 2) my wife couldn't keep a secret to save her life. I'm now re-thinking the name we came up with because of her mom's less than enthusiastic response.

How did you decide on names for your children and what would you do if you were in my shoes?


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## eagle2250 (Mar 24, 2006)

Save you and your wife from a lot of future doubts. Stick with your original choice of name. It really is not the purview of a grandparent to presume any right to name your children (and this coming from a grandparent, five times over!). You and your wife have "cleaved" yourselves to one another and not to your respective in-laws. Your first loyalty is to her and her's to you! Stay focused on that and you will have a much happier life! My thoughts and prayers will be with you.


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## CuffDaddy (Feb 26, 2009)

Here are the people who have a legitimate right to control the naming, with their interests in same: you (50%) and your wife (50%). Ignore the wishes of your parents and your inlaws; they had 20+ years to impart their taste to you, now you are the bosses. (Might as well get them adjusted to that now, or they'll be trying to call the shots on how you raise your son from here on out.) You and your wife simply have to come to some mutually-acceptable name choice.

Hint: get out a family tree, and look at both first and _and last_ names going back several generations. If your wife wants a tie to her side of the family (entirely reasonable desire), surely there's a given or surname that will suit. Using surnames as first or middle names is a very common practice in the south, particularly among the upper and upper-middle classes; is it not so in the upper midwest?


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## Mike Petrik (Jul 5, 2005)

Agree with Eagle and Cuff.

But I've always been partial to Linus. Second pope and Bogart's memorable character in "Sabrina." 

Cheers and good luck.


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## Snow Hill Pond (Aug 10, 2011)

gaseousclay said:


> How did you decide on names for your children and what would you do if you were in my shoes?


Firstly, congratulations!

Very personal decision, but what we did in naming our three sons was as follows:

1. Either the Christian or middle name had to be a Biblical name.
2. Our first and last sons were named after influential men from their family tree.
3. Our middle son's Christian name is based on an historical figure in American history.

We did not consult other family members about our choices.

Rare option: I have a friend who has two middle names. A little unusual, but it did not seem to hurt him none.


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## WouldaShoulda (Aug 5, 2009)

Using Mother's maiden name as a middle name is common where I come from. 

At least it used to be.


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## GenteelCountryman (Mar 2, 2013)

Our son's middle name was chosen from our (my wife's and my) family tree. It was a name that was common on both sides of the tree. If I correctly recall, it tied him to 17 of his progenitors.


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## tocqueville (Nov 15, 2009)

Be flexible with regards to your wife's wishes. Ignore everyone else.


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## Semper Jeep (Oct 11, 2011)

tocqueville said:


> Be flexible with regards to your wife's wishes. Ignore everyone else.


This ^

FWIW, my parents had five children and had names picked out for each of us before we were born but ended up choosing something entirely different when we were actually born.

When my wife had our daughter, we couldn't decide on a name until she was about 3 days old. We just had no idea and weren't really enamored with the names we came up with. The day evening before we were set to leave the hospital hospital I was holding my daughter and a name popped into my head from nowhere (we hadn't considered either the first or middle name before) and we both loved it.


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## Canadian (Jan 17, 2008)

My name is Thomas David. My dad's name is David William. His dad's name was William Remington, and his dad's name was Remington (I don't know the middle name). Traditionally the first son in my family has a name from somewhere else in the family, and their middle name is their dad's first name.

I have been told there was a Thomas that predated Remington. My brother, Robert William Douglas is named after an uncle and his grandfathers, William and Douglas. My aunt, Bobbi Joan is named after the same uncle. 

If you wish to have some input into naming the child, make your preferences known before too much time passes. If your wife is set on naming the child, why don't you ask if he/she can have a middle name of your choosing. There is no rule against having two middle names if you want.

Tom


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## rsgordon (Dec 6, 2012)

I am (I would argue regrettably) the first male in my family on both sides for about 5-6 known generations to have a middle name. My mother forced a middle name for me upon my father arguing that I must have some link to her side of the family. I believe that carrying on our family tradition would have been more than enough but it is too late now obviously.

As for your dilemma, I recommend that the most important factor for your 50% vote is that your child will never ever ever ever be put at a disadvantage because of your choice. This means they won't be discriminated against because of some obviously ethnic name or have their gender uncertain in any way. You cannot give them anything by choosing a great name but you can certainly take something away by choosing a poor one.

Don't doubt yourself, this is YOUR baby and will be the light of your life. Congratulations!


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## smmrfld (May 22, 2007)

rsgordon said:


> As for your dilemma, I recommend that the most important factor for your 50% vote is that your child will never ever ever ever be put at a disadvantage because of your choice. This means they won't be discriminated against because of *some obviously ethnic name* or have their gender uncertain in any way. You cannot give them anything by choosing a great name but you can certainly take something away by choosing a poor one.


There are lots of other contenders, but this ranks right up there on the greatest hits list of offensive posts.


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## rsgordon (Dec 6, 2012)

Aww man, maybe you can name your kid without my advice then little buddy.


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## Yodan731 (Jan 23, 2011)

RSGordon is right. He shouldn't be right in 2013 America, but he is. It's an unfortunate truth that both conscious and subconscious bigotry exists, and if you can give your child a name that won't hurt him in life you are doing him a favor. I have a gender neutral first name and Asian last name (despite not being Asian) and both have created issues for me in the past.

I am very proud of my name and heritage, but constantly having to ensure that I am listed as male on insurance records or having to answer questions about where I'm "really from" get old. I've even missed meetings because the person to be meeting me expected an Asian female and not a Caucasian male.

Do your kid a favor by picking names that are non-controversial, easily spelled, and easily pronounced. It will help him immensely.


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## Gurdon (Feb 7, 2005)

I agree with much of what has been said. Especially about ignoring in-laws, grandparents, and anybody else. 

I hope you are able to agree between you and your wife on names. I believe it is essential to collaborate as equals on matters as important and emotion-laden as this.

Despite being unchurched, my wife and I agreed on the tradition from one branch of my family to use an Old Testament name for the first or middle name of our sons. For one son we chose two middle names, in this instance a particular Old Testament name and a name shared by several ancestors from different branches of the family. This gave each of us our first choice for that son's middle name.

Having said to ignore everyone, I should clarify this. Ignore their advice, but try not to knowingly hurt anybody's feelings. In one instance, I checked with an aunt to make sure that the individual from four generations back who's name we were contemplating for one of our sons was well thought of in the family. 

Our son with two middle names has an "ethnic-sounding" first name. We were aware of this and chose to use the name for our own family-related reasons. It has come up a couple of times but is not a problem. In fact, it has been beneficial, I think, in instances where I have been able to respond positively when asked by members of the ethnic group in question whether we were aware of the association. 

Good luck, and thanks for letting us comment. 

Gurdon


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

You and the missus have an equal share in the naming.

Consider
1. the nationality/cultural/mother tongue/religious background of you and your wife
2. do you want to reflect your names in the child's name? 
3. do you want to reflect the names of the child's grandparents?

Those are the 3 areas you seriously need to consider, everything else is optional i.e. old name, modern name, trendy name, biblical name.

HOWEVER, an important thing that lots of parents overlook are negative compounds made from the childs initials. So if your surname is Smith you don't want to call your son *A*ndrew *S*tephen *S*mith.

Also consider how names can be shortened and abused and used against a child, Richard = dick! And pick a name that is easy to spell and pronounce.

Also consider your surname and try to avoid giving your child a famous name, so if your surname is Kennedy don't call the kid John.

My eldest son is Conor (Irish) Jakob (Swedish & Germanic form of my name, James, & my paternal grandfather's name) Francis (Saint's name & also the confirmation name of my father & both my brothers)
My youngest son is Gabriel (Biblical and also common in Sweden) Liam (Irish) Peter (Saint's name & also my second name & my maternal grandfather's name)

I am James (my dad's dad) Peter (my mum's dad) Patrick (Patrick I chose at my confirmation).


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

rsgordon said:


> As for your dilemma, I recommend that the most important factor for your 50% vote is that your child will never ever ever ever be put at a disadvantage because of your choice. This means they won't be discriminated against because of some obviously ethnic name or have their gender uncertain in any way.


Excellent advice.


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

smmrfld said:


> but this ranks right up there on the greatest hits list of offensive posts.


In what normal environment is that offensive? In an ultra-sensitive politically correct environment maybe. But in my world it is sound advice.


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## Snow Hill Pond (Aug 10, 2011)

Earl of Ormonde said:


> In what normal environment is that offensive? In an ultra-sensitive politically correct environment maybe.


Agreed. Whether the advice is sound or not. I did not read any intent to offend from RSG.


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## Mike Petrik (Jul 5, 2005)

Earl of Ormonde said:


> In what normal environment is that offensive? In an ultra-sensitive politically correct environment maybe. But in my world it is sound advice.


smmrfld's world is California.


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## RM Bantista (May 30, 2009)

gaseousclay said:


> I'm not sure how many of you are parents but i'm having a bit of a dilemma with naming my first born son. my wife is due any day now and the naming process has been a bit contentious to say the least. I've thrown around a few first name ideas and my wife feels that she gets naming rights for the middle name.


The male first name is your choice, middle is hers. For a daughter, the reverse.



gaseousclay said:


> the problem is that every middle name my wife has come up with sounds absolutely horrible (ie. Jean, which is her mom and grandma's middle name and a girl's name). /QUOTE]
> Actually, it is not, but Jean is the French for English John and very masculine.
> 
> 
> ...


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## Earl of Ormonde (Sep 5, 2008)

Mike Petrik said:


> smmrfld's world is California.


Ah yes, the capital of everything goes, everything is normal, everything is natural, everyone is equal and woe betide anyone who says otherwise.


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## gaseousclay (Nov 8, 2009)

Yodan731 said:


> RSGordon is right. He shouldn't be right in 2013 America, but he is. It's an unfortunate truth that both conscious and subconscious bigotry exists, and if you can give your child a name that won't hurt him in life you are doing him a favor. I have a gender neutral first name and Asian last name (despite not being Asian) and both have created issues for me in the past. I am very proud of my name and heritage, but constantly having to ensure that I am listed as male on insurance records or having to answer questions about where I'm "really from" get old. I've even missed meetings because the person to be meeting me expected an Asian female and not a Caucasian male. Do your kid a favor by picking names that are non-controversial, easily spelled, and easily pronounced. It will help him immensely.


my last name is Japanese, but I took my mother's last name by choice as I had a falling out with my dad. Now my son has my mom's last name and I have no regrets. We ended up going with Cary as his first name :aportnoy:


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## nateo (Feb 27, 2013)

In Germany, your child's name has to be approved by Child Services. They don't want anyone to ruin a child's life by naming her or him something offensive. I'm sure most Americans would be horrified by that. Many Germans think giving your baby a terrible name amounts to child abuse. 

My family was Dutch. I don't think it's common anymore, but the Dutch system made things really easy on the parents:
"1) The first two sons and first two daughters were usually named after the grandparents of the children. 
2) The first son was most often named after the husband's father. 
3) Often, the first son and daughter were both named after the parents of the husband
4) But in other families, the first daughter took the name of the wife's mother."

It was also common, if one child died, to name the new child using the same scheme. My grandfather's name was Linus, as was his grandfather's. He had an older brother who died, who was also named Linus. "Dead baby Linus" comes up in conversation sometimes. My family has kind of a weird sense of humor.

My middle name is my mother's Dutch surname. I like that system, unless your wife's maiden name is something really odd.


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## WouldaShoulda (Aug 5, 2009)

I suspect they are also trying to avoid a new bunch of new Adolfs running around!!


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## nateo (Feb 27, 2013)

WouldaShoulda said:


> I suspect they are also trying to avoid a new bunch of new Adolfs running around!!


Yeah, I don't think Adolf is a common name anymore. I'm sure the Hitler Familienname is even less popular!

They also require that the name given reflects the sex of the child. If it's a gender-neutral name, you need to give them a middle name that isn't. So like Kelly Ann or Kelly Michael in the US.

I also thought it was interesting that the only time you can change your name in Germany is if you get married, there was a clerical error entering your name, after gender reassignment surgery, or if you're a foreigner, you can choose a Germanized version of your name.


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## suitedmedic (Mar 31, 2013)

Congratulations, I hope all goes well for you and your wife.
My intial thought would be to, as many have stated before me, disregard utterly the thoughts of anyone else other than your wife. I am a medical student in the UK (hence the name) and have spent time on maternity wards, and one of the midwives had a very interesting tid bit for one of the couples.

She said that the best time to decide a babies name, is once the child is born. When you and your wife have returned home, after a day or two of rest, sit down with your child, look at him and simply decide what he looks like, which name you feel he will wear well.

If it is not too presumptuous of me to ask, would you care to let us know the final chosen name of your boy? (first and middle only, of course)


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## nateo (Feb 27, 2013)

suitedmedic said:


> Congratulations, I hope all goes well for you and your wife.
> She said that the best time to decide a babies name, is once the child is born. When you and your wife have returned home, after a day or two of rest, sit down with your child, look at him and simply decide what he looks like, which name you feel he will wear well.


Yeah, I always thought waiting until they're like 5 years old was a good idea. I think they do that in parts of Africa? I don't remember where I heard that.


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## gaseousclay (Nov 8, 2009)

suitedmedic said:


> If it is not too presumptuous of me to ask, would you care to let us know the final chosen name of your boy? (first and middle only, of course)


we decided on the name, Cary. first, it's not very popular which is what we wanted in a name and second, everyone knows Cary Grant :aportnoy:


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## rsgordon (Dec 6, 2012)

Congratulations!


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## suitedmedic (Mar 31, 2013)

Congratulations! And nice choice.


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## AJLP (Oct 12, 2007)

tocqueville said:


> Be flexible with regards to your wife's wishes. Ignore everyone else.


this seems like the best advice I've heard on names year! In my experience, for what it's worth, all grandparents just adore all of our four kids and names essentially became secondary or even inconsequential.

congrats and enjoy the ride!

aj


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