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TweedyDon

Connoisseur
PLEASE NOTE THAT AT THE INSTRUCTION OF THE MODERATORS I WON'T BE LISTING MORE THAN FOUR ITEMS A MONTH ON THE EXCHANGE.

(This also applies to everyone else on the Exchange, so take note!)

I'm sure you all know where to go for more! ;
)​
 
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katch

Active Member with Corp. Privileges
That is really unfortunate. Will be checking your site frequently. Thanks for all you do, Tweedy!

PLEASE NOTE THAT AT THE INSTRUCTION OF THE MODERATORS I WON'T BE LISTING MORE THAN FOUR ITEMS A MONTH ON THE EXCHANGE.

(This also applies to everyone else on the Exchange, so take note!)

I'm sure you all know where to go for more! ;
)​
 

TweedyDon

Connoisseur
Thank you! I don't have any problem with complying with this new (?) policy, even though I think it's rather odd in light of the last discussion about the future of the Exchange. Indeed, I think that asking people not to advertise our blogs or sales pages is fair enough--and I (and others) were occasionally doing that. I suspect that we all saw them as being complementary to AAAT, rather than competing, but I can see the opposite point of view here and think it's reasonable.

I do think it's strange to limit the number of sales posts so drastically (unless, of course, people were complaining!) especially since this will de facto kill the Exchange. But I also firmly believe that the owners of Fora like this can run them as they please--and the benefits of Ask Andy are still clearly considerable! :)
 

Reddington

Super Member
PLEASE NOTE THAT AT THE INSTRUCTION OF THE MODERATORS I WON'T BE LISTING MORE THAN FOUR ITEMS A MONTH ON THE EXCHANGE.

(This also applies to everyone else on the Exchange, so take note!)

I'm sure you all know where to go for more! ;
)​
Wow, what a shame. I just returned to AAAT after being gone for a while specifically to shop the Exchange. Tweedy, you’ve always offered quality stuff for great prices. Hopefully the policy will be modified.
 

mikel

Partner / Administrator
Staff member
@TweedyDon @katch @Reddington @Pentheos

We're trying to find a balance between hobby sellers, and those that would be considered semi-professional (commercial) sellers.

Any entity that has an eBay, Facebook, Etsy, or website store is one that we'd consider to be more of a professional seller.

If we allow every professional seller/reseller to post unlimited items in our forums and link to their online store, our forum simply becomes a free lead-gen link farm. This really only benefits the seller, and not us or the community.

Additionally, it's becoming harder for us to distinguish between hobby & professional sellers.

In most all cases, only paid advertisers are allowed to promote their products, per Rule #1.

We very much appreciate @TweedyDon's contributions to the forum, as well as the other similar members.

We're trying to figure out how to clearly define what should/shouldn't be allowed, while still offering the convenience of helping AAAC members find great deals on clothing/accessories they may want to buy.

We don't yet have a definitive plan, but we're trying to come up with something that is fair, practical, simple to administer, yet enforceable.

Hope that makes sense, and that you understand the challenge we're trying to work though.
 

FiscalDean

Super Member
@TweedyDon @katch @Reddington @Pentheos

We're trying to find a balance between hobby sellers, and those that would be considered semi-professional (commercial) sellers.

Any entity that has an eBay, Facebook, Etsy, or website store is one that we'd consider to be more of a professional seller.

If we allow every professional seller/reseller to post unlimited items in our forums and link to their online store, our forum simply becomes a free lead-gen link farm. This really only benefits the seller, and not us or the community.

Additionally, it's becoming harder for us to distinguish between hobby & professional sellers.

In most all cases, only paid advertisers are allowed to promote their products, per Rule #1.

We very much appreciate @TweedyDon's contributions to the forum, as well as the other similar members.

We're trying to figure out how to clearly define what should/shouldn't be allowed, while still offering the convenience of helping AAAC members find great deals on clothing/accessories they may want to buy.

We don't yet have a definitive plan, but we're trying to come up with something that is fair, practical, simple to administer, yet enforceable.

Hope that makes sense, and that you understand the challenge we're trying to work though.

Why not just "grandfather in" long standing members of the community?
 

Clintotron

Senior Member
Why not just "grandfather in" long standing members of the community?
I can see that getting a bit messy in the future.

My recommendation is that AAAC set up a locked thread with links to and concise descriptions of MEMBERS’ storefronts and have admins add/remove as requested by said members and new members wishing to follow a similar business model. No commenting (read: fighting, bickering, slandering, etc), just a resource for finding fantastic deals while supporting our friends.
Others may wish to expound on this and are welcome to do so.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 

Fading Fast

Connoisseur
I am openly admitting that I have not thought through the issues, so I am not advocating for a particular position.

I am, though, unsolicited, noting that my dealings with TweedyDon have been incredible.

Beyond offering outstanding value of honestly described clothes, he's a pleasure to buy from.

Again, I'll leave it to AAAC (and support its decision) to create the parameters it feels is best for all, but if TweedyDon can't post as he has in the past, I'll miss him and feel bad for him.
 

mikel

Partner / Administrator
Staff member
@Clintotron - that's a solid and thoughtful suggestion. Appreciate it.

There are many factors that we have to consider, including how we avoid being a link-farm (i.e. store/website links in every post), who we allow to post, how often, etc.

Membership status and contribution is definitely part of the equation.

But, if a particular member is spending 90% of the time on the forum posting listings, and 10% actually participating, then their primary activity is being a seller, and not contributing to the community discussions.

@TweedyDon is definitely a respected member, and we value his contributions.

But, we'd also like to create one set of rules that is fair to everyone (new, existing, and legacy members) equally.

Also, by creating a SOP, it will be easier for current and future moderators, as well as the community, to administer.
 

Titus_A

Super Member
This is the kind of comment that can get you bounced from a forum, but this is the second time this Mikel character has come in here and tried to throttle the exchange, and it really grinds my gears. The explanations have been, in both cases, been the sort of overwrought busybody nonsense only spouted by people who don't know what it means to leave well enough alone.

It's also, in this instance, dishonest, since it is claimed on the one hand that TweedyDon is an active, valued contributor and not merely a hawker, but then insisted, on the other, that he has to abide by a policy implemented (we are told) to weed out noncontributing hawkers.

Anyways, it's other folks' forum, so it's their rules, but I don't think either of the recent efforts at micromanaging this thread have contributed to the forum's health or the enjoyment of members, and I don't like them.
 

TweedyDon

Connoisseur
I feel rather bad about the center of this ruckus!

(Although I do very much appreciate everyone's *very* kind words!)

UPDATE BELOW!

I should note that all of my exchanges with Mikel have been very cordial, and I do think that he's in the right (and I in the wrong) when it comes to off-forum sales sites in the body of posts. I also think we should all remember that he listened to the membership the last time questions were asked about the Exchange, and he then followed the wishes of those of us who frequent it. But I also see his desire for more guidance in how the Exchange is run so that its existence is fair both to the membership and the paid commercial advertisers who support the site.

A) I think that Mikel is quite right to be concerned about directions to off-site sales fora in the body of posts; I think this should be against the rules. I also think that Clint's suggestion of a "locked" thread for member's store-fronts--added or removed by the Mods--is excellent!

B) I think that there's also a legitimate concern that commercial sellers might usurp the Exchange. I also think that it would be hard to distinguish between commercial re-sellers and people who re-sell items as a hobby/service to the community. Mere volume of sales won't help here, as it's possible for someone to sell a fair amount without expecting to turn a profit. (Full disclosure: I fall into this category; a jacket that sells for $25 - $45 shipped, for example, is likely to have cost $15 - $20, plus c. $14 for shipping, plus gas, plus time...! But they're fun to find, and it's good to get them new homes and research the history of their makers or the stores that sold them, and that are now long gone.) So, here are some suggestions:

1) Limit the number of posts per member, with any exceptions only approved by Mods. (Someone might be selling off a wardrobe at retirement, for example.) This is the approach already suggested by Mikel, with a limit of 4 items a month. I think that's too low, but perhaps no more than 5 a week would be reasonable.... including "bumps" of old posts. This would be easy to monitor, and to aid this members wouldn't be allowed to "save up" posts and then post 20 things in one go at the end of a month.

2) Place a price restriction on items that can be sold--say, nothing more than $50 shipped. Given the economics of re-selling (briefly outlined above) this would effectively preclude anyone trying to make a commercial profit. And if someone occasionally has something more valuable this could be posted at the discretion of the Mods, with an 'mod approval" note added by the seller to state this. This would allow people passing on things that they bought for themselves to re-sell them here at or below cost.

3) A combination of (1) and (2)--a certain number of items per week, and nothing over (e.g) $50.

4) A restriction on total asking amounts per week, or per month, with this being divisible any way a seller wants. This might be rather cumbersome, though, and wouldn't be as easily checked as (1) - (3). For this reason I'd advise against this.
 
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mikel

Partner / Administrator
Staff member
@TweedyDon thanks for your support. Look forward to your thoughts and suggestions!

@Titus_A - let me see if I understand what you're suggesting. Your recommendation is that Andy and I, the owners of this site, do nothing about a business problem we've identified?? Great advice. Also, how about you PM me with your phone number so we can jump on a call. Would love to chat directly and have you explain to me how I was being dishonest or disingenuous. Looking forward to your PM.
 

TimF

Active Member with Corp. Privileges
It appears to me what distinguishes a commercial seller from a frequent thrifter offloading a portion of his "finds" is whether he routinely turns a profit. I do not pretend to know the thrift business, so I do not know if TweedyDon is correct that he usually sells his finds at cost. I do understand running this magnificent forum has costs, hence the advertisers, and that it makes good business sense to apply one set of rules to anyone seeking to benefit financially from exposure on this forum.

But if TweedyDon is correct in his profit assessment, there does not exist an equitable profit share for the forum operator when there is little to no profit to be had! Kind of the proverbial "blood from a stone" situation.
 
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mikel

Partner / Administrator
Staff member
@TimF thanks for your thoughts!

@TweedyDon your suggestions are very well thought out, and along with the ideas from @Clintotron, have definitely given me some ideas on how to setup some SOPs that will be beneficial to all!

Andy and I will work toward a solution, and formalize the new/updated Rules.

Thanks again!
 
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mikel

Partner / Administrator
Staff member
We've made great progress on coming up with some new SOPs, that should greatly improve the overall experience with selling/buying on AAAC.

This Informal Trad Thrift Store Exchange thread (a very long 32k posts) is going to be replaced and become its very own Forum!! It will have lots of great features that will make the selling and buying experience even easier -- while allowing us to eliminate some of the operational challenges we've identified.

More to come in the following days.

A huge thanks to @TweedyDon for sharing some great thoughts and ideas behind the scenes.

Also many thanks to @Andy @Clintotron @TimF and @Fading Fast for providing additional input that will be incorporated into the new Trad Thrift Store Exchange forum.
 

mikel

Partner / Administrator
Staff member
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Deals/Steals