JLibourel

Honors Member and King Fop
Would you buy a new BMW 5 Series at a corner car lot in a low income part of town? No. That is why high end auto manufacturers require their dealers to spend millions and millions of dollars on the presentation of their dealerships.

Packaging of any product is of the utmost importance.
One of my oldest and best friends did acquire a rather seedy BMW dealership in a very low income part of Greater LA. He used this as a selling point: "We can beat anybody's deal because we're located in the wholesale district." He has sold a helluva lot of cars and made a great deal of money over the years, but he has had to perform a couple of multimillion dollar upgrades during the same period.
 

August West

Active Member with Corp. Privileges
One of my oldest and best friends did acquire a rather seedy BMW dealership in a very low income part of Greater LA. He used this as a selling point: "We can beat anybody's deal because we're located in the wholesale district." He has sold a helluva lot of cars and made a great deal of money over the years, but he has had to perform a couple of multimillion dollar upgrades during the same period.
Not sure what you are saying here. Better deals due to lower overhead "packaging", but millions of dollars then spent to upgrade the "packaging".
 

At Law

Senior Member
Not sure what you are saying here. Better deals due to lower overhead "packaging", but millions of dollars then spent to upgrade the "packaging".
JLibourel was simply referencing my original comparison of an Allen Edmonds shoe box to a new BMW dealership's location and building as well as a reference to LA. I believe this is quite clear.
 

August West

Active Member with Corp. Privileges
Would you buy a new BMW 5 Series at a corner car lot in a low income part of town? No. That is why high end auto manufacturers require their dealers to spend millions and millions of dollars on the presentation of their dealerships.
One of my oldest and best friends did acquire a rather seedy BMW dealership in a very low income part of Greater LA. He used this as a selling point: "We can beat anybody's deal because we're located in the wholesale district." He has sold a helluva lot of cars and made a great deal of money over the years, but he has had to perform a couple of multimillion dollar upgrades during the same period.
This isn't clear to me at all. Seems to initially contradict your point. Then goes in a different direction by saying millions spent renovating the dealership.
 
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JLibourel

Honors Member and King Fop
^My pal spent millions on upgrades only after he had made many millions in the original, run-down location. His dealership is still located in the "wholesale" district. After about 12 years, he moved his dealership into a much finer location no great distance from his old place. More recently, he has had to make costly upgrades to his dealership to bring it up to BMW spec. I suppose some LA area forumites can figure out who my friend is.
 

challer

Active Member with Corp. Privileges
That beautiful packaging is very expensive. One of my clients wanted Apple packaging so we went to the company that makes it. At an MOQ of 25,000 units, we were paying $25/unit. You can do better at container store.
 

drpeter

Senior Member
I agree with @At Law. The reason why packaging is important is that it reflects the mentality behind the manufacturer. Any product worth the price will be packaged in a fitting manner, although once in a while, a fine product may come in a plain package. This is true with all sorts of products, not simply clothes or shoes, as has been pointed out. Consider Apple computers, they come in very nicely designed boxes. Attention paid to the appearance of the package reflects the level of care that went into manufacturing the product.

More generally may I suggest that we do indeed pay attention to appearance in this forum, LOL. After all clothing is the packaging in which humans seem to come -- first impressions and so forth...
 

At Law

Senior Member
I agree with @At Law. The reason why packaging is important is that it reflects the mentality behind the manufacturer. Any product worth the price will be packaged in a fitting manner, although once in a while, a fine product may come in a plain package. This is true with all sorts of products, not simply clothes or shoes, as has been pointed out. Consider Apple computers, they come in very nicely designed boxes. Attention paid to the appearance of the package reflects the level of care that went into manufacturing the product.

More generally may I suggest that we do indeed pay attention to appearance in this forum, LOL. After all clothing is the packaging in which humans seem to come -- first impressions and so forth...
Dr. Peter is a scholar and a fine gentleman. And I'm not just writing that because he agreed with my rambling post regarding marketing and presentation of a product.....Okay, perhaps I am.
 

smmrfld

Super Member
I agree with @At Law. The reason why packaging is important is that it reflects the mentality behind the manufacturer. Any product worth the price will be packaged in a fitting manner, although once in a while, a fine product may come in a plain package. This is true with all sorts of products, not simply clothes or shoes, as has been pointed out. Consider Apple computers, they come in very nicely designed boxes. Attention paid to the appearance of the package reflects the level of care that went into manufacturing the product.

More generally may I suggest that we do indeed pay attention to appearance in this forum, LOL. After all clothing is the packaging in which humans seem to come -- first impressions and so forth...
Apple makes what are widely considered quality products. AE, not so much anymore. Doesn’t really matter what they put their shoes in if the product is inferior.
 

eagle2250

Connoisseur/Curmudgeon Emeritus - Moderator
I will continue enjoying my present inventory of AE designs, sufficient I'm sure to last me the rest of my lifetime! ;)
 

JLibourel

Honors Member and King Fop
^Pretty much my situation as well. Nearly all the A-Es I acquired date from the John Stollenwerk era or immediately thereafter.

I have bought some newer A-Es for my stepson. The leather on some of them doesn't seem quite equal to my older A-Es, but the shoes don't seem to be anywhere nearly as poorly made as many in this forum complain. But maybe we've just been lucky!
 

At Law

Senior Member
I believe most AE's in calf are worth around $200 or so. However, they are not worth the $395 or so most of them M.S.R.P. at.
 

triklops55

Super Member
Apple makes what are widely considered quality products. AE, not so much anymore. Doesn’t really matter what they put their shoes in if the product is inferior.
I guess it depends what you mean by "quality products" in regards to Apple. If you mean easy-to-use, simple devices, then yes, they do. If you mean of quality materials and long lasting? Well, not so much.
I would say that Apple's marketing is brilliant enough to make its customers feel they are getting a superior product. And the packaging is part of that marketing.
 

drpeter

Senior Member
Apple makes what are widely considered quality products. AE, not so much anymore. Doesn’t really matter what they put their shoes in if the product is inferior.
I daresay a number of people on this forum would agree with you. I haven't bought AE shoes in donkey's years, even though they are a Wisconsin company. The three or four pairs of AEs I possess are all still lovely and remain quite serviceable, although that may be because I do have quite a few pairs of shoes in my closet! I must admit, though, that with American shoes, I much prefer Aldens, again acquired ten to twelve years ago, to AEs. I hope I am not treading on anyone's toes here!

I also don't buy new things very often, they're mostly vintage items. I much prefer to repair and maintain the really good items I bought, even though they are old.

A bit of a digression here: I think there's something very traditional (and may I say sincere and affectionate) in altering and reusing one's father's clothes handed down to one? My Dad retired from work in Colonial Malaya and went back to India in the early sixties. He had excellent taste and taught me about clothes and materials. He had lovely old tropical worsted suits, silk ties, white dinner jackets and outstanding leather shoes, all tailor-made or hand-made by good craftsmen, in the styles of the nineteen-forties and -fifties. But he put these all away and only wore Indian clothes once he was back home. My brother and I were given permission to do whatever we wished with these items. We had our tailor alter many items to fit us (not much change was needed anyway), and the work was done carefully, so we ended up with beautiful trousers and jackets that were both an honour and a pleasure to wear. It's probably very obvious that my Dad, now long gone, was my friend and my hero. Nothing new, no matter how fancy and expensive, can take the place of those old clothes for me. Years later, I read a rather wistful piece by Bruce Boyer wherein he echoed almost identical sentiments regarding old clothes, and felt quietly vindicated in my beliefs. So now, Mr Boyer is one of my heroes too!
 

overseer07

Starting Member
I believe most AE's in calf are worth around $200 or so. However, they are not worth the $395 or so most of them M.S.R.P. at.
Their current strategy of listing high prices but running constant sales really gives away the quality you should expect from AE. Their shoes aren't $450 quality anymore; they are $225 quality, and the product and QC certainly reflect that price.
 
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