Fading Fast

Connoisseur
I rather like the jacket and vest, but the vest seems to be cut a bit too short. Just saying....;)
Unfortunately, that seems to happen a lot today with the prevailing "skinny/shorter" ethos of tailoring. I think the shirt and tie work well (the shirt in particular) with the outfit, but I'm just not a fan of the matching vest and jacket with contrasting pants look. I have a feeling if I saw a full shot of this outfit, it would feel awkward and "top heavy."
 

TKI67

Elite Member
Unfortunately, that seems to happen a lot today with the prevailing "skinny/shorter" ethos of tailoring. I think the shirt and tie work well (the shirt in particular) with the outfit, but I'm just not a fan of the matching vest and jacket with contrasting pants look. I have a feeling if I saw a full shot of this outfit, it would feel awkward and "top heavy."
I agree with both Fading Fast and Eagle on this one but overall find it one of the better put together outfits for a PRL shoot. It also is curious to me how often our comments are about fit. To me the defining characteristic of TNSIL clothing is comfort. The clothes are cut commodiously and made of comfortable fabrics. There is no pair of trousers more comfortably cut than truly traditional khakis and no shirt more comfortable than a billowy OCBD from Brooks Brothers of pre-1984, Mercer, or a few rare others. A well cut natural shoulder blazer or odd jacket with a 3/2 lapel and a single hook vent does not bind anywhere and brings warmth, comfort, and plenty of pockets in the winter and, in the summer, replaces warmth with fabrics like seersucker, Madras, and chambray. Even the necktie, scorned by so many, is actually comfortable with a four in hand knot on a properly sized shirt that is not professionally starched and laundered but ironed by the wearer. Nothing ever gaps or binds. The fabrics never make you feel you are wrapped in plastic. Even under layers they breathe. The shoes provide sturdiness and protection beneath the foot and comfort on the uppers.

These are the endearing qualities of TNSIL that keep me wearing it. The beauty of the materials, the history of the makers, and the instantly recognizable details that make it iconic with no need for logos are of course wonderful as well, but if it isn't truly comfortable, why would you wear it?

That jacket looks comfortable. That vest looks a tad uncomfortable, not excessively snug but a bit. A Trad would notice that.
 

drpeter

Super Member
I think the origins and history of the Trad or Ivy style is part and parcel of the move away from the stiff, starched style of the late Edwardians. The Duke of Windsor played a strong part in this move toward more comfortable clothing, and if you look at his images (plentiful on the web) you will see that his suits, odd jackets, and flannels are not too different in cut and style and even fabric, from the Ivy Look. The twentieth century saw this general move toward less rigid styles, with softer materials and looser clothing, relaxed cuts -- comfort, in short, as TKI67 points out so eloquently. This comfort is also the reason why Ivy style originated in the colleges and universities of the US. Young men and women would want comfortable clothing to complement a vigorous lifestyle, and this desire informed the selection of material, cut and style in a natural way.

But now, we have carried it all to an unfortunate extreme, with the sweatsuit, hoodies and jeans, etc., taking the lead. Grunge has become the order of the day, at least to the young. I taught for thirty years in a college environment filled with blue denim -- and not just the students, but even a good proportion of the faculty!
 
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TKI67

Elite Member
I think the origins and history of the Trad or Ivy style is part and parcel of the move away from the stiff, starched style of the late Edwardians. The Duke of Windsor played a strong part in this move toward more comfortable clothing, and if you look at his images (plentiful on the web) you will see that his suits, odd jackets, and flannels are not too different in cut and style and even fabric, from the Ivy Look. The twentieth century saw this general move toward less rigid styles, with softer materials and looser clothing, relaxed cuts -- comfort, in short, a TKI67 points out so eloquently. This comfort is also the reason why Ivy style originated in the colleges and universities of the US. Young men and women would want comfortable clothing to complement a vigorous lifestyle, and this desire informed the selection of material, cut and style in a natural way.

But now, we have carried it all to an unfortunate extreme, with the sweatsuit, hoodies and jeans, etc., taking the lead. Grunge has become the order of the day, at least to the young. I taught for thirty years in a college environment filled with blue denim -- and not just the students, but even a good proportion of the faculty!
And the irony is that khakis are far more comfortable than jeans, which typically ride far below the waist and are of a very heavy fabric that sags rather than draping. Sweats can be cozy but only if it is cool, and most sweatpants these days ride low like jeans. However, if we had had them in the mid 1960s, I believe hoodies would have been very popular.
 

eagle2250

Connoisseur/Curmudgeon Emeritus - Moderator
And the irony is that khakis are far more comfortable than jeans, which typically ride far below the waist and are of a very heavy fabric that sags rather than draping. Sweats can be cozy but only if it is cool, and most sweatpants these days ride low like jeans. However, if we had had them in the mid 1960s, I believe hoodies would have been very popular.
Bill's Khaki's offer a Stretch Twill 5-Pocket design that is a hybrid design of classic chinos and bluejeans...perhaps the perfect pair of Trousers? A little lighter, a little dressier and a whole lot lighter in weight. The only downside is they do ride a bit low on the hip and do not provide a good look for we aging gentleman, sporting more matuer figures! LOL. ;)
 

TKI67

Elite Member
Bill's Khaki's offer a Stretch Twill 5-Pocket design that is a hybrid design of classic chinos and bluejeans...perhaps the perfect pair of Trousers? A little lighter, a little dressier and a whole lot lighter in weight. The only downside is they do ride a bit low on the hip and do not provide a good look for we aging gentleman, sporting more matuer figures! LOL. ;)
While I do have two pairs of five pocket non-jeans, I find that the way nice khakis are cut is simply more comfortable. If I am slopping around and do not care how I look a pair of old, unironed O'Connell's khakis with their high water 1 3/4" cuff wins over Levis or any five pocket.
 

drpeter

Super Member
Bill's Khaki's offer a Stretch Twill 5-Pocket design that is a hybrid design of classic chinos and bluejeans...perhaps the perfect pair of Trousers? A little lighter, a little dressier and a whole lot lighter in weight. The only downside is they do ride a bit low on the hip and do not provide a good look for we aging gentleman, sporting more matuer figures! LOL. ;)
You know, Eagle, you are absolutely right! I had a few pairs od Lands' End khakis in the nineties that were exactly like this. They were effectively jeans made of khaki drill, in various tones of beige and khaki. They were terrific, tough pants that wore well, and the ones I wore were much less low-waisted than your standard pair of Levis.

I'm also reminded of white jeans, with white duck or canvas material much thicker than khaki drill. They are like blue jeans, though, in terms of comfort.
 

Fading Fast

Connoisseur
Bill's Khaki's offer a Stretch Twill 5-Pocket design that is a hybrid design of classic chinos and bluejeans...perhaps the perfect pair of Trousers? A little lighter, a little dressier and a whole lot lighter in weight. The only downside is they do ride a bit low on the hip and do not provide a good look for we aging gentleman, sporting more matuer figures! LOL. ;)
You know, Eagle, you are absolutely right! I had a few pairs od Lands' End khakis in the nineties that were exactly like this. They were effectively jeans made of khaki drill, in various tones of beige and khaki. They were terrific, tough pants that wore well, and the ones I wore were much less low-waisted than your standard pair of Levis.

I'm also reminded of white jeans, with white duck or canvas material much thicker than khaki drill. They are like blue jeans, though, in terms of comfort.
I feel like one of my favorite Ivy-era pants, wheat jeans, belongs in this conversation somehow. I've loved them for years as they do kind of bridge the gap between chinos and jeans and they have an Ivy tie in. I believe they were more popular on the west coast, but that's about that extent of my knowledge.
 

TKI67

Elite Member
You know, Eagle, you are absolutely right! I had a few pairs od Lands' End khakis in the nineties that were exactly like this. They were effectively jeans made of khaki drill, in various tones of beige and khaki. They were terrific, tough pants that wore well, and the ones I wore were much less low-waisted than your standard pair of Levis.

I'm also reminded of white jeans, with white duck or canvas material much thicker than khaki drill. They are like blue jeans, though, in terms of comfort.
I miss white Levis. As spring of 1966 rolled around a lot of guys tried to see if they could pass for ducks and get around the dress code. One of the teachers figured that one out quickly.
 

Tweedlover

Active Member with Corp. Privileges
$1500! It is a good looking jacket, but that's a whole lot of money for a cotton safari jacket...way too rich for my tight fisted perspectives on life. LOL. ;)
Yeah, that's the thing about RL pricing. They often come out with great looking clothes but at very high prices beyond the means of most folks.
 
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